Team Canada Basketball Thread

[Bobby Plump]

Lavar is the "best coach" and he would put the national program in the spotlight it deserves, but assuming Lavar is tied up, Steve Nash for substitute coach, anyone?

[mojo13]

Stefan Jankovic signs with Crvena Zvedza. Serbian powerhouse, Adriatic League and EuroLeague. Shows the power of having local passport and not counting as an import as I am not sure he is good enough for the EL. Maybe viewed as a young, Serb prospect for development rather than an immediate impact. I doubt he ever plays for Canada and try's for Serbia instead.



Kyle Wiltjer supposedly has an offer from Baskonia (EL/ACB).

[TheFutureMM]

Not that a ton of us are following it (I caught a quarter of the semi-final and a quarter of the bronze game) but Canada's U19 girls just captured third place at the worlds for the first time.

I know we crap on Canada management (mostly boys side) but as a whole, this has to be the best summer for our youth level programs collectively.

U16 FIBA America Boys - 2nd
U16 FIBA America Girls - 2nd
U19 FIBA Worlds Boys - 1st
U19 FIBA Worlds Girls - 3rd

Good stuff all around. I would be buying stock for basketball in Canada if it was possible.

[aminiaturebuddha]

Not that a ton of us are following it (I caught a quarter of the semi-final and a quarter of the bronze game) but Canada's U19 girls just captured third place at the worlds for the first time.

Thanks Future, I was just going to mention this. And more good news for the future - two of Canada's best players were 17-year-old Alyssa Jerome, the team's captain, and 16-year-old (!) Laeticia Amihere, who saw some time with the senior women's team earlier this year, and is known for dunking in a high school game as a 15-year-old this past season. Both would still be eligible in two years for the next U19 championship to see if Canada could even move up a spot or two on the podium.

Things are definitely looking up! Now we just need the senior teams to start putting things together.

[aminiaturebuddha]

So we're now less than a month away from the FIBA Americup tournament. Some other countries have started to release preliminary lists of players, including Mexico, Puerto Rico and Brazil (including the Raptors own Bruno Caboclo). Canada Basketball always seems a little late with these kinds of things, but you'd have to think they'd need to have a camp invite list soon, in order to start a camp at least 10 days to 2 weeks before the tournament.

[mojo13]

http://www.basketballinsiders.com/orlando-magic-team-salary/

Khem Birch
Year 1: $815,615 (only 25K guaranteed until Game 1, then $407,808 guaranteed until 1/10/18)
Year 2: $1,378,242 (non-guaranteed until 6/28/18)
Year 3: $1,818,520 (qualifying offer)

Considering walked away from 600k Euros net after tax he seems fairly desperate to be in the NBA. I hope it works out.

[frumble]

So we're now less than a month away from the FIBA Americup tournament. Some other countries have started to release preliminary lists of players, including Mexico, Puerto Rico and Brazil (including the Raptors own Bruno Caboclo). Canada Basketball always seems a little late with these kinds of things, but you'd have to think they'd need to have a camp invite list soon, in order to start a camp at least 10 days to 2 weeks before the tournament.

Tryouts and training to be in "mid-August". Wouldn't surprise me if we don't hear anything about who is in camp until it is (well) underway.

[TheFutureMM]

Not that a ton of us are following it (I caught a quarter of the semi-final and a quarter of the bronze game) but Canada's U19 girls just captured third place at the worlds for the first time.

Thanks Future, I was just going to mention this. And more good news for the future - two of Canada's best players were 17-year-old Alyssa Jerome, the team's captain, and 16-year-old (!) Laeticia Amihere, who saw some time with the senior women's team earlier this year, and is known for dunking in a high school game as a 15-year-old this past season. Both would still be eligible in two years for the next U19 championship to see if Canada could even move up a spot or two on the podium.

Things are definitely looking up! Now we just need the senior teams to start putting things together.

Interesting facts regarding the girls - didn't know how hyped Laeticia Amihere was. Before ESPN's girls recruiting section went down, I saw that Laeticia was ranked second in her class. Pretty wild.

Speaking of ESPN rankings, it has been updated with the recent RJ Barrett move to the class of 2018. As well, pretty under the radar, but Andrew Nembhard also chose to reclassify as of last Friday.

http://thespun.com/college-hoops/andrew-nembhard-reclassify-2018-schools

Canadians in the Top 100 via ESPN for 2018...

3 - R.J. Barrett
10 - Simi Shissu
25 - Luguentz Dort
70 - Andrew Nembhard

[aminiaturebuddha]

Speaking of ESPN rankings, it has been updated with the recent RJ Barrett move to the class of 2018. As well, pretty under the radar, but Andrew Nembhard also chose to reclassify as of last Friday.

http://thespun.com/college-hoops/andrew-nembhard-reclassify-2018-schools

Canadians in the Top 100 via ESPN for 2018...

3 - R.J. Barrett
10 - Simi Shissu
25 - Luguentz Dort
70 - Andrew Nembhard

I had heard rumours that Nembhard was going to re-classify, but didn't realize he had made it official. That really makes that class of 2018 extremely strong for Canadian prospects. It also means that as of right now we might not have a top 100 prospect in the 2019 class, but that hardly matters. There's a bunch of talent coming down the pipe for 2020 anyway with guys like McNeilly, Patterson, Hemmings, Rathan-Mayes, etc.

[Mirotic12]

Stefan Jankovic signs with Crvena Zvedza. Serbian powerhouse, Adriatic League and EuroLeague. Shows the power of having local passport and not counting as an import as I am not sure he is good enough for the EL. Maybe viewed as a young, Serb prospect for development rather than an immediate impact. I doubt he ever plays for Canada and try's for Serbia instead.

Jankovic is definitely good enough for a club like Red Star. You have to understand that Red Star isn't really a real EuroLeague level team. The only reason they are in EuroLeague is because the Adriatic League would have gone nuts if none of their teams were in EuroLeague. They have to have at least one team from the former Yugoslavia, so Red Star is there.

But they really aren't EuroLeague level. Their budget for this year was supposedly raised by a million euros, to €7.5 million euros. But that's not a EuroLeague level budget. Most EuroCup teams have bigger budgets, and even a lot of the Champions League teams have bigger budgets.

To give you an idea how low that budget is for EuroLeague, the next lowest budget in EuroLeague is Zalgiris, at €13.5 million euros.

So, Jankovic is definitely good enough to play in Red Star.

[frumble]

Speaking of ESPN rankings, it has been updated with the recent RJ Barrett move to the class of 2018. As well, pretty under the radar, but Andrew Nembhard also chose to reclassify as of last Friday.

http://thespun.com/college-hoops/andrew-nembhard-reclassify-2018-schools

Canadians in the Top 100 via ESPN for 2018...

3 - R.J. Barrett
10 - Simi Shissu
25 - Luguentz Dort
70 - Andrew Nembhard

I had heard rumours that Nembhard was going to re-classify, but didn't realize he had made it official. That really makes that class of 2018 extremely strong for Canadian prospects. It also means that as of right now we might not have a top 100 prospect in the 2019 class, but that hardly matters. There's a bunch of talent coming down the pipe for 2020 anyway with guys like McNeilly, Patterson, Hemmings, Rathan-Mayes, etc.

I too did not realize Nembhard had made it official.

247 has their new rankings out - taking into account Barrett's reclassification, but not Nembhard's. Nearly identical to ESPN:
Barrett 3
Shi-ttu 9
Dort 26
Brazdeikis 46
Llewellyn 118
Kirkwood 186

http://247sports.com/Season/2018-Basketball/RecruitRankings?InstitutionGroup=highschool

[frumble]

And I see Rivals has updated as well:

https://n.rivals.com/prospect_rankings/rivals150/2018

Barrett 2
Shi-ttu 10
Nembhard 25
Dort 40
Llewellyn 143

Once Bagley re-classifies to 2017, Barrett should be #1 for class of 2018 for most services.

And if Shi-ttu stays top 10, we will have 2 top 10s in the same class for the first time.

Going by RSCI (composite of multiple ranking services), we were close in 2010 (Thompson 9th and C. Joseph 13th) and 2011 (Birch 11th and Kabongo 13th).

[aminiaturebuddha]

Going by RSCI (composite of multiple ranking services), we were close in 2010 (Thompson 9th and C. Joseph 13th) and 2011 (Birch 11th and Kabongo 13th).

It really is amazing how far Kabongo has fallen, from McDonald's All American and highly ranked prospect to playing in the Mexican league at 25. I really wonder how much that suspension at the start of his college career and having to deal with the bad program at that time at Texas affected his development. Or maybe he just never had the right mindset and was doomed from the start.

It just goes to show the benefit of quantity as well as quality of prospects, because at least a few are inevitably going to flame out. With Barrett and Nembhard reclassifying, the next two classes for Canadian prospects in 2017 and 2018 will have more top 150 ranked players than any two-year period ever, and maybe more than any 5-year period.

That depth is going to do wonders for the national program, especially with the change in qualifying. Having NBA prospects like Wiggins, Murray, Barrett, and Simi is great, but it's almost going to be as important to have those next level solid players, often guys ranked in the 75-150 range, that will help keep the program humming along year to year.

[frumble]

Going by RSCI (composite of multiple ranking services), we were close in 2010 (Thompson 9th and C. Joseph 13th) and 2011 (Birch 11th and Kabongo 13th).

It really is amazing how far Kabongo has fallen, from McDonald's All American and highly ranked prospect to playing in the Mexican league at 25. I really wonder how much that suspension at the start of his college career and having to deal with the bad program at that time at Texas affected his development. Or maybe he just never had the right mindset and was doomed from the start.

He's still young enough that I think there is some chance he ends up sticking in a high-level foreign league, but the trend is certainly not promising.

Ryan Wright, Theo Davis, and Junior Cadougan were also highly touted high school players who haven't done much professionally, but they were ranked in the 30-50 range out of high school. And Wright and Cadougan had better pro careers than Kabongo (so far).

Other than Kabongo, every Canadian top 30 (Dalembert, Famutimi, Thompson, C Joseph, Birch, Wiltjer, Bennett, T Ennis, and Lyles) made the NBA and/or had a long career in high level European leagues.

So, yeah, I think he has fallen the most out of any highly-touted Canadian over the past 20 years or so.

Where would Kabongo rank in terms of PG depth for 2019 World Cup? Assuming we make it, and everyone is available and willing to play, I think it would go something like:

C. Joseph
T. Ennis
Pangos
P. Scrubb
Hanlan
Cadougan
XRM
Kabongo

(I am counting Murray as a 2 and assuming Dylan Ennis is not eligible to play for Canada).

So Kabongo is around 8th? And, depending on how things go next couple seasons, a chance that Wigginton, Blair, Washington or Nembhard develops enough to move ahead of him by summer 2019?

[mojo13]

Just to point out that Pangos, Scrubb and Hanlan are all playing primarily as SGs with their Euro clubs. More combo guards if you'd like. Secondary ball handlers, with some time as back-up lead PGs. Murray is sort of the same for Denver and might be taking over as the primary PG this year. Stuaskas even has some stints as a lead PG for Philly and obviously CoJo can play some SG as well. I suppose you'd need to be careful of who is on the floor with who, but you sort of need to look at the total ball handling group of guards. Dylan Ennis is a combo guard as well. But yes....this pushes Kabongo further down the list.
I don't think Kabongo has improved much as shooter and might be his primary handicap in FIBA style basketball.



PS: We keep overlooking Jermaine Anderson. I'd assume if we are taking Kabongo or Caduogan we should be taking the Rock. Last year with Chalon Reims of the French top division, obviously a higher level than Kabongo or Caduogan.

[aminiaturebuddha]

So it looks like there will probably be 11 Canadians in the NBA this year, assuming Nicholson is out and now that Wiljter is signing in Europe.

Interestingly, those 11 would form a fairly complete team with all positions covered if they were put together. I've played around a little with positions. Murray, for example, will likely play most of his time at PG this year in Denver. Still, it's amazing how well they would fit together.

C - Kelly Olynyk
F - Tristan Thompson
F - Andrew Wiggins
G - Jamal Murray
G - Cory Joseph
C - Khem Birch
F - Dwight Powell
F - Dillon Brooks
G - Nik Stauskas
G - Tyler Ennis
F - Trey Lyles

Add in someone like RJ Barrett or Kevin Pangos, and possibly substitute Justin Jackson for Brooks depending on how they develop over the next couple of years, and that would make for a hell of a team for the 2019 World Cup if we can qualify.

[frumble]

Just to point out that Pangos, Scrubb and Hanlan are all playing primarily as SGs with their Euro clubs. More combo guards if you'd like. Secondary ball handlers, with some time as back-up lead PGs. Murray is sort of the same for Denver and might be taking over as the primary PG this year. Stuaskas even has some stints as a lead PG for Philly and obviously CoJo can play some SG as well. I suppose you'd need to be careful of who is on the floor with who, but you sort of need to look at the total ball handling group of guards. Dylan Ennis is a combo guard as well. But yes....this pushes Kabongo further down the list.
I don't think Kabongo has improved much as shooter and might be his primary handicap in FIBA style basketball.



PS: We keep overlooking Jermaine Anderson. I'd assume if we are taking Kabongo or Caduogan we should be taking the Rock. Last year with Chalon Reims of the French top division, obviously a higher level than Kabongo or Caduogan.

I didn't realize Scrubb and Pangos were playing more SG than PG. I thought I read that Hanlan was playing primarily PG, but maybe that was in reference to Spurs plans for him rather than what he was actually playing.

Re Anderson, yeah, I'd put him ahead of Cadougan, XRM or Kabongo now. But by 2019 World Cup he will be 36 and I assume unlikely to be ahead of them, if even still active.

[super_balls]

Going by RSCI (composite of multiple ranking services), we were close in 2010 (Thompson 9th and C. Joseph 13th) and 2011 (Birch 11th and Kabongo 13th).

It really is amazing how far Kabongo has fallen, from McDonald's All American and highly ranked prospect to playing in the Mexican league at 25. I really wonder how much that suspension at the start of his college career and having to deal with the bad program at that time at Texas affected his development. Or maybe he just never had the right mindset and was doomed from the start.

He's still young enough that I think there is some chance he ends up sticking in a high-level foreign league, but the trend is certainly not promising.

Ryan Wright, Theo Davis, and Junior Cadougan were also highly touted high school players who haven't done much professionally, but they were ranked in the 30-50 range out of high school. And Wright and Cadougan had better pro careers than Kabongo (so far).

Other than Kabongo, every Canadian top 30 (Dalembert, Famutimi, Thompson, C Joseph, Birch, Wiltjer, Bennett, T Ennis, and Lyles) made the NBA and/or had a long career in high level European leagues.

So, yeah, I think he has fallen the most out of any highly-touted Canadian over the past 20 years or so.

Where would Kabongo rank in terms of PG depth for 2019 World Cup? Assuming we make it, and everyone is available and willing to play, I think it would go something like:

C. Joseph
T. Ennis
Pangos
P. Scrubb
Hanlan
Cadougan
XRM
Kabongo

(I am counting Murray as a 2 and assuming Dylan Ennis is not eligible to play for Canada).

So Kabongo is around 8th? And, depending on how things go next couple seasons, a chance that Wigginton, Blair, Washington or Nembhard develops enough to move ahead of him by summer 2019?

You have XRM counted as a PG and not Murray? lol. Plus Kabongo ranked lower than him? lol.

[Mirotic12]

I didn't realize Scrubb and Pangos were playing more SG than PG. I thought I read that Hanlan was playing primarily PG, but maybe that was in reference to Spurs plans for him rather than what he was actually playing.

They all play as shooting guards in Europe. Although, in the little bit I saw Scrubb play before he got injured, he looked like more of a point guard to me.

[mojo13]

You have XRM counted as a PG and not Murray? lol. Plus Kabongo ranked lower than him? lol.

XRM has been the primary PG for FSU the last two years. He was a primary PG in the Knicks summer league team. He has been invited to the Knicks training camp as a PG prospect. He may even have a good shot at making the Knicks.
If XRM is not a better pure PG than Kabongo right now, he soon will be. He is a better prospect for sure. You ask XRM what he is and he will say PG.

He stated why he did't include Murray who mostly played SG last year in Denver. We all agree Murray can play PG and might be our best PG sometime soon. But considering our depth at PG he may be used best as a SG. It is certainly open for discussion and why I mentioned we should look at all capable ball handlers in the same bucket - as well as consideration for who'd be on the floor together For example I could see two combo types - Pangos, Hanlan, Scrubb, Murray - on the floor together much better than a combo with a more pure SG like Heslip or Stuaskas, which seem like not enough ball handling and creation. We'd also hopefully avoid combining two guards that can't shoot - which is a quick path to death in FIBA.