Bleacher Report on DeMar: "the fact he's earning All-Star berths...is utterly ridiculous"

[Rapcity_11]

but Lou is getting paid millions while Zach Lowe is getting paid to follow such players. You can look at it from many angles.

Lou is getting paid $0 to analyze basketball. Lowe is getting paid (insert ESPN salary) to analyze basketball.

the point is when you're the athelete and the guy who is judging you doesn't even play can't fully understand the game.

You don’t have to play the game to analyze it. It helps, sure. But it sure as hell isn’t a requirement.

[ciueli]

That's not a typo.

DeMar DeRozan really has a negative TPA score in his career, thanks in large part to his consistently woeful play on the preventing end. In his defense, that's at least trending in a positive direction, as he's now posted plus scores in three of his last four seasons: 40.4 in 2013-14, 81.4 in 2015-16 and 46.5 in 2016-17.

It really shows his agenda when he mentions career numbers to make his argument look better. Career numbers are irrelevant in an era where one and done players come into the league as unfinished products and mostly don't become good, productive players until their second contracts.

Having said that, here are the list of guards with better TPA scores than DeMar last season:

Russell Westbrook (All-Star)
James Harden (All-Star)
Stephen Curry (All-Star)
Chris Paul
Kyle Lowry (All-Star)
Isaiah Thomas (All-Star)
Mike Conley
John Wall (All-Star)
Damian Lillard
Kemba Walker (All-Star)
Eric Bledsoe
Goran Dragic
Kyrie Irving (All-Star)
Bradley Beal
George Hill
Jeff Teague
Patrick Beverley
Danny Green
Jrue Holiday
C.J. McCollum
Robert Covington
Tyler Johnson
Gary Harris
Seth Curry
Manu Ginobili

Of that list, the only East guards that weren't All-Stars that he presumably believes were more deserving of an All-Star spot than DeMar are Goran Dragic, Bradley Beal, Jeff Teague, Robert Covington and Tyler Johnson.

Dragic, Covington and Johnson were all playing for losing teams when All-Star voting occurred, and their basic stat lines are much less impressive than DeMar's. Teague wasn't exactly lighting the world on fire (15.2 PPG) while playing for a team that was constantly slipping in and out of the playoff picture. He probably wasn't even the Pacer's second best player so it's hard to argue he should be an All-Star above DeMar.

So it essentially comes down to DeMar or Bradley Beal (or leaving off one of Lowry/Thomas/Wall/Walker/Irving). And you can definitely make a case that Beal is better than DeMar, which means Walker probably should have been left off because the Hornets didn't make the playoffs, but let's not pretend that it's some kind of ridiculous thing that DeMar was an All-Star when there was only really one other possible candidate for All-Star who missed out.

[dukes_wild]

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This is a really stupid quote by a really stupid person.

[VinBaker6]

Lou is getting paid $0 to analyze basketball. Lowe is getting paid (insert ESPN salary) to analyze basketball.

I would also say basketball IQ pertains to the decisions made by players ON the court, not off.

Ok, what's the point?

The point is it's silly to say Zach Lowe has more basketball IQ than Lou Williams.

[VinBaker6]

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This is a really stupid quote by a really stupid person.

It's hilarious how many ppl get butthurt over that tweet. Lou is a smart guy.

[Rapcity_11]

I would also say basketball IQ pertains to the decisions made by players ON the court, not off.

Ok, what's the point?

The point is it's silly to say Zach Lowe has more basketball IQ than Lou Williams.

I don't know what exactly you mean by IQ, but Lowe is undoubtedly a far, far, far superior basketball analyst.

[omar36]

classic example of people looking at stats rather then watching games. no need to even care about what they say lol.

should only get firnge all star love what a joke

[Patman]

I would also say basketball IQ pertains to the decisions made by players ON the court, not off.

Ok, what's the point?

The point is it's silly to say Zach Lowe has more basketball IQ than Lou Williams.

The fact that someone has not been physically gifted enough to play basketball at a high level does not preclude them from having a high basketball IQ. For sure, on-court awareness is part of it, but it's not the be-all and end-all. In many fields, there are people who are better at explaining than doing, and vice-versa.

[LBJKB24MJ23]

its a weak Eastern conference. there is a possibility that he wouldn't be an all-star if the Raptors were in the West. focus on the word "possibility"

that being said, he's totally deserving in the East.

[VinBaker6]

Ok, what's the point?

The point is it's silly to say Zach Lowe has more basketball IQ than Lou Williams.

I don't know what exactly you mean by IQ, but Lowe is undoubtedly a far, far, far superior basketball analyst.

I defined it in my previous post. There's a difference between what basketball analysts do and basketball IQ, which pertains to the decisions players make on the court.

Of course I'd agree that Lowe is a better basketball analyst. Don't need to be a player for that.

[LBJKB24MJ23]

classic example of people looking at stats rather then watching games. no need to even care about what they say lol.

should only get firnge all star love what a joke

watching the games: raptors play like **** while Derozan is on the floor.
watching the games: raptors play better when Derozan is on the bench.

and yes, stats back this up.

Now that being said, Derozan is still the most 'talented' player on the team despite his ISO-centric game outside of Lowry. Raptors are an unorthodox team and win despite the discrepancy of the above.

[VinBaker6]

Ok, what's the point?

The point is it's silly to say Zach Lowe has more basketball IQ than Lou Williams.

The fact that someone has not been physically gifted enough to play basketball at a high level does not preclude them from having a high basketball IQ. For sure, on-court awareness is part of it, but it's not the be-all and end-all. In many fields, there are people who are better at explaining than doing, and vice-versa.

I guess I see it differently, I define it purely an on court thing. Can you make the right decision at game speed?

This is basketball IQ to me:

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[ruckus]

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This is a really stupid quote by a really stupid person.

It's hilarious how many ppl get butthurt over that tweet. Lou is a smart guy.

I guess it hits a little too close to home for some.

The truth is that you don't have to be good at something to know the intricacies of the subject. There's the saying that "those that can, do and those that can't, teach". It's the same premise.

That being said, while the author of the article uses some harsh language re: Demar and the other players in the article, I think the analysis is fairly correct. Up until recently, Demar has been a net negative. He proved his mettle when Lowry was out when he carried the team offensively but, his defense still hurts the team. There's no denying that.

[Rapcity_11]

The point is it's silly to say Zach Lowe has more basketball IQ than Lou Williams.

I don't know what exactly you mean by IQ, but Lowe is undoubtedly a far, far, far superior basketball analyst.

I defined it in my previous post. There's a difference between what basketball analysts do and basketball IQ, which pertains to the decisions players make on the court.

Of course I'd agree that Lowe is a better basketball analyst. Don't need to be a player for that.

What previous post?

Lou's tweet was about opinions and analysis. Why even bring up basketball IQ?

[Dalek]

You know it is summer when people are reaching for stories like this. Becoming an All-Star is less about advanced states and more about players who win and will put on a show.

Fans vote for guys who score points, dunk the basketball or shoot threes.

Coaches may look at it like who is a real leader of a winning program. Toronto is almost always a top team up to the All-Star break. Demar is a very consistent scorer for a winning team. I don't think analytics factor into any debate for the All-Star game one bit.

All-NBA teams are a different story. Writers and broadcasters vote for those, so you have to win over more analytically inclined folks. The fact that both Demar and Kyle made it to the All NBA Third team in consecutive years shows an appreciation for what they do.

Kyle is one of the best two-way players in the NBA and a fringe MVP candidate at times each year (similar to John Wall), while Derozan really led his team during a tough period when Kyle was out while being the primary scoring and playmaking option.

I still argue that the true hate comes from the fact Toronto plays in the Atlantic Division. To many people it is the weakest division in pro sports. Toronto has definitely taken advantage of it, but they have played well in their conferences and against the West over the years.

[vascular]

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2725604-metrics-101-nbas-most-overhyped-players-over-last-50-years

Years Played: 2009-present

Career Per-Game Stats: 19.3 points, 4.1 rebounds, 2.8 assists, 1.0 steals, 0.3 blocks

Career Advanced Metrics: 17.3 PER, 53.3 TS%, 0.105 WS/48, minus-414.5 TPA

Career Accolades: Three-time All-Star, All-NBA

That's not a typo.

DeMar DeRozan really has a negative TPA score in his career, thanks in large part to his consistently woeful play on the preventing end. In his defense, that's at least trending in a positive direction, as he's now posted plus scores in three of his last four seasons: 40.4 in 2013-14, 81.4 in 2015-16 and 46.5 in 2016-17.

But still, the fact he's earning All-Star berths—and even an All-NBA nod this past go-round—is utterly ridiculous.

DeRozan is a good secondary or tertiary player. He can put up points in bunches and score against even the tightest defensive coverage because his strength allows him to fight through contact when he shoots from his favored mid-range zones. But his points often fall into the LaMarcus Aldridge category: fairly empty, thanks to the inability to connect from downtown and tally a high number of points per possession.

During the 2016-17 campaign, 55 qualified players produced at least 15 points per game. Among that group, DeRozan's points per field-goal attempt ranked 31st—a bad finish for a one-way player who takes plenty of shots during his average appearance.

And it gets worse, because his commandeering style of play takes his teammates out of the half-court action. He can become so intent on finding a mid-range look that he dribbles down the shot clock and forces the Toronto Raptors into running nothing more than an ill-advised isolation attempt.

This is just another part of the reason Toronto has been worse with him on the floor for each of the last five seasons. In fact, 2016-17 was the first time since 2013-14 that the Raptors even scored more points per 100 possessions when he played, and it wasn't enough of a margin to offset the defensive drop.

DeRozan is a valuable player. He deserves to earn fringe All-Star love.

He should not, however, be the leader of a team. Nor should he be earning much All-NBA consideration, even at the league's weakest position.

I hope DeRozan comes back and shuts all these fools up
Although, the paragraph where they mentioned about dribbling down the shot clock and forcing his shot is true. That does not equal to what he was able to accomplish where KL was out and he was the only player out there giving it his all. This is really disrespectful.
DD has improved every year and without a doubt he will do the same this year.

[SFour]

You guys need to stop giving Bleacher Report clicks on their website..some of these "journalists" know that Raptors RealGM is easily triggered so they'll keep posting trash articles on Demar or the Raptors

[Duffman100]

The point is it's silly to say Zach Lowe has more basketball IQ than Lou Williams.

The fact that someone has not been physically gifted enough to play basketball at a high level does not preclude them from having a high basketball IQ. For sure, on-court awareness is part of it, but it's not the be-all and end-all. In many fields, there are people who are better at explaining than doing, and vice-versa.

I guess I see it differently, I define it purely an on court thing. Can you make the right decision at game speed?

This is basketball IQ to me:

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What I'm confused about is in the first iteration of that play. Either JR or Lebron **** up. JR, instead of staying in the corner, set a back screen for Lebron. Lebron didn't follow that back screen. So Irving didn't have the choice of making that pass to the corner when Curry helped.

So either JR wasn't suppose to set that back-screen or Lebron was suppose to follow it.

[VinBaker6]

I don't know what exactly you mean by IQ, but Lowe is undoubtedly a far, far, far superior basketball analyst.

I defined it in my previous post. There's a difference between what basketball analysts do and basketball IQ, which pertains to the decisions players make on the court.

Of course I'd agree that Lowe is a better basketball analyst. Don't need to be a player for that.

What previous post?

Lou's tweet was about opinions and analysis. Why even bring up basketball IQ?

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These nerds (Zach Lowe for example) have more basketball IQ than Lou will ever have.

[Patman]

The point is it's silly to say Zach Lowe has more basketball IQ than Lou Williams.

The fact that someone has not been physically gifted enough to play basketball at a high level does not preclude them from having a high basketball IQ. For sure, on-court awareness is part of it, but it's not the be-all and end-all. In many fields, there are people who are better at explaining than doing, and vice-versa.

I guess I see it differently, I define it purely an on court thing. Can you make the right decision at game speed?

Fair enough. You have a different term for what a guy like Popovich can do in breaking down the game?