I really worry about some of these players in the playoffs

[ThatClockWork]

I wonder if some of you guys have watched this team in the playoffs the last 4 years and saw all the pundits
and media across the league dawg Lowry?

One would have to be a homer of epic proportions to deny Lowry sucks in the playoffs

And one would need to be a most casual fan to focus on only raw box score output as a measure of performance. This entire conversation is ridiculous to me.

It's comical watching some of you fan boys try to debate Lowry doesn't suck in the playoffs it's like someone trying to debate
that Vince Carter isn't a good dunker or something...

Does horrible shot selection and blown defensive assignments show up in the box score? What about getting
schooled by a rookie PG?

Lowry himself has owned up to poor play and admitted he hasn't played well if he says it then you shouldn't deny it...

There is a reason why he was "decompressing" and shooting jumpers at the ACC till midnight after games...

Go ask the fans across the league on the general board or social media what they think of Lowry in the playoffs I dare you...

Maybe you're the casual fan or your delusions are ridiculous...

Stay Woke

Oh miss me with that nonsense.

The narrative created around the league was if you score a lot of points you are automatically labeled as good. This is why I am laughing at you and them for your conclusions about Lowry. He was still getting his teammates involved and was a positive on the defensive end during that period. I guess that counts for nothing, just like what you just wrote smh.

[Scott Hall]

And one would need to be a most casual fan to focus on only raw box score output as a measure of performance. This entire conversation is ridiculous to me.

It's comical watching some of you fan boys try to debate Lowry doesn't suck in the playoffs it's like someone trying to debate
that Vince Carter isn't a good dunker or something...

Does horrible shot selection and blown defensive assignments show up in the box score? What about getting
schooled by a rookie PG?

Lowry himself has owned up to poor play and admitted he hasn't played well if he says it then you shouldn't deny it...

There is a reason why he was "decompressing" and shooting jumpers at the ACC till midnight after games...

Go ask the fans across the league on the general board or social media what they think of Lowry in the playoffs I dare you...

Maybe you're the casual fan or your delusions are ridiculous...

Stay Woke

Oh miss me with that nonsense.

The narrative created around the league was if you score a lot of points you are automatically labeled as good. This is why I am laughing at you and them for your conclusions about Lowry. He was still getting his teammates involved and was a positive on the defensive end during that period. I guess that counts for nothing, just like what you just wrote smh.

The fact that you think this is just about scoring is alarming...

Did you watch the Lowry vs. Malcom Brogdon match up at all?

You're buddy

[Steelo Green]

I keep saying this, calm your roll. The Raptors are not world beaters, they'll lose to **** teams here and there. Not much has changed since last year and the offensive adjustment will take time to get ingrained into these players.

Except most if not all teams have mulligans to mediocre teams.

It was a back to back on the road after a long win streak, why we blow our losses out of proportion as though we are the precedent of disappointment beats me.

Remember when we beat the Jordan Bulls, you know one of the best if not the best team ever?

[ThatClockWork]

It's comical watching some of you fan boys try to debate Lowry doesn't suck in the playoffs it's like someone trying to debate
that Vince Carter isn't a good dunker or something...

Does horrible shot selection and blown defensive assignments show up in the box score? What about getting
schooled by a rookie PG?

Lowry himself has owned up to poor play and admitted he hasn't played well if he says it then you shouldn't deny it...

There is a reason why he was "decompressing" and shooting jumpers at the ACC till midnight after games...

Go ask the fans across the league on the general board or social media what they think of Lowry in the playoffs I dare you...

Maybe you're the casual fan or your delusions are ridiculous...

Stay Woke

Oh miss me with that nonsense.

The narrative created around the league was if you score a lot of points you are automatically labeled as good. This is why I am laughing at you and them for your conclusions about Lowry. He was still getting his teammates involved and was a positive on the defensive end during that period. I guess that counts for nothing, just like what you just wrote smh.

The fact that you think this is just about scoring is alarming...

Did you watch the Lowry vs. Malcom Brogdon match up at all?

You're buddy

We watched the same footage and drew different conclusions about what actually happened there. A bias just may exist here .. just saying.

[Scott Hall]

Oh miss me with that nonsense.

The narrative created around the league was if you score a lot of points you are automatically labeled as good. This is why I am laughing at you and them for your conclusions about Lowry. He was still getting his teammates involved and was a positive on the defensive end during that period. I guess that counts for nothing, just like what you just wrote smh.

The fact that you think this is just about scoring is alarming...

Did you watch the Lowry vs. Malcom Brogdon match up at all?

You're buddy

We watched the same footage and drew different conclusions about what actually happened there. A bias just may exist here .. just saying.

Bias?

You're in the extreme minority in this "debate"

Do you remember when DeRozan get's blizted, trapped, double teamed and even triple teamed at times?
That's a result of our 2nd best scorer going down the drain.

[ThatClockWork]

The fact that you think this is just about scoring is alarming...

Did you watch the Lowry vs. Malcom Brogdon match up at all?

You're buddy

We watched the same footage and drew different conclusions about what actually happened there. A bias just may exist here .. just saying.

Bias?

You're in the extreme minority in this "debate"

Do you remember when DeRozan get's blizted, trapped, double teamed and even triple teamed at times?
That's a result of our 2nd best scorer going down the drain.

That is a result of a good scorer making bad decisions with the basketball. He admitted that with himself after the Cavs sweep. Everyone knew he wasn't going to pass at that point. Derozan's decision making is not the responsibility of Kyle Lowry lol

[slothrop8]

After a regular season where Brogdon had a positive net rating and position ON/OFF split, he had a negative net rating and negative ON/OFF split in the playoff series and saw his TS% plummet by over 60 points down to a poor .491 and saw his scoring and AST% and Stl% drop vs the regular season and his TOV% skyrocket. The Raptors meanwhile were +4.7 with Lowry on the floor and -14.9 with him off, for nearly a full 20 pt/100 swing with Lowry on the floor and he posted a respectable .547 TS which while well below his regular season levels was solid enough and posted better points, ast%, stl%, blk%, and tov% than Brogdon for the series - some by relatively wide margins.

Lowry has had many miserable playoff series, but he quite convincingly outplayed Brogdon last year.


Edited to correct ON/OFF splits.

[Rapcity_11]

We watched the same footage and drew different conclusions about what actually happened there. A bias just may exist here .. just saying.

Bias?

You're in the extreme minority in this "debate"

Do you remember when DeRozan get's blizted, trapped, double teamed and even triple teamed at times?
That's a result of our 2nd best scorer going down the drain.

That is a result of a good scorer making bad decisions with the basketball. He admitted that with himself after the Cavs sweep. Everyone knew he wasn't going to pass at that point. Derozan's decision making is not the responsibility of Kyle Lowry lol

Against Milwaukee:

Lowry ON: +4.7 Lowry OFF: -14.9
DeRozan ON: -1.2 DeRozan OFF: +7.3

Mostly due to the MASSIVE difference in defensive performance.

[Rapcity_11]

After a regular season where Brogdon had a positive net rating and position ON/OFF split, he had a negative net rating and negative ON/OFF split in the playoff series and saw his TS% plummet by over 60 points down to a poor .491 and saw his scoring and AST% and Stl% drop vs the regular season and his TOV% skyrocket. The Raptors meanwhile were +18.4 with Lowry on the floor and -1.2 with him off, for nearly a full 20 pt/100 swing with Lowry on the floor and he posted a respectable .547 TS which while well below his regular season levels was solid enough and posted better points, ast%, stl%, blk%, and tov% than Brogdon for the series - some by relatively wide margins.

Lowry has had many miserable playoff series, but he quite convincingly outplayed Brogdon last year.

Absolutely. All while coming off wrist surgery to his shooting arm, which doesn't get discussed enough.

(Your Lowry +/- numbers are off btw)

[Scott Hall]

We watched the same footage and drew different conclusions about what actually happened there. A bias just may exist here .. just saying.

Bias?

You're in the extreme minority in this "debate"

Do you remember when DeRozan get's blizted, trapped, double teamed and even triple teamed at times?
That's a result of our 2nd best scorer going down the drain.

That is a result of a good scorer making bad decisions with the basketball. He admitted that with himself after the Cavs sweep. Everyone knew he wasn't going to pass at that point. Derozan's decision making is not the responsibility of Kyle Lowry lol

There was talk on this board the last few years that Lowry could use a sports psychologist like Roy Halladay did
when he was younger. Shaq, Barkley and the TNT guys have called him out for 2 years in a row...

When Lowry struggles and gets rattled he starts making horrible decisions that affect other parts of his game. He starts
taking and forcing horrible shots, he has bad TO's and he struggles defensively.

In a playoff series when your supposed best player an All-Star struggles with George freakin' Hill and a rookie Brogdon
no wonder the Raptors struggle in the playoffs.

The Raptors need a top 15 player where Lowry's offense is reduced and he can concentrate on other things and
have less pressure on him.

[slothrop8]

After a regular season where Brogdon had a positive net rating and position ON/OFF split, he had a negative net rating and negative ON/OFF split in the playoff series and saw his TS% plummet by over 60 points down to a poor .491 and saw his scoring and AST% and Stl% drop vs the regular season and his TOV% skyrocket. The Raptors meanwhile were +18.4 with Lowry on the floor and -1.2 with him off, for nearly a full 20 pt/100 swing with Lowry on the floor and he posted a respectable .547 TS which while well below his regular season levels was solid enough and posted better points, ast%, stl%, blk%, and tov% than Brogdon for the series - some by relatively wide margins.

Lowry has had many miserable playoff series, but he quite convincingly outplayed Brogdon last year.

Absolutely. All while coming off wrist surgery to his shooting arm, which doesn't get discussed enough.

(Your Lowry +/- numbers are off btw)

Maybe you're looking at full playoffs? Just for the Bucks series I think they are right?
http://stats.nba.com/team/1610612761/onoffcourt-summary/?Season=2016-17&SeasonType=Playoffs&OpponentTeamID=1610612749

[Rapcity_11]

After a regular season where Brogdon had a positive net rating and position ON/OFF split, he had a negative net rating and negative ON/OFF split in the playoff series and saw his TS% plummet by over 60 points down to a poor .491 and saw his scoring and AST% and Stl% drop vs the regular season and his TOV% skyrocket. The Raptors meanwhile were +18.4 with Lowry on the floor and -1.2 with him off, for nearly a full 20 pt/100 swing with Lowry on the floor and he posted a respectable .547 TS which while well below his regular season levels was solid enough and posted better points, ast%, stl%, blk%, and tov% than Brogdon for the series - some by relatively wide margins.

Lowry has had many miserable playoff series, but he quite convincingly outplayed Brogdon last year.

Absolutely. All while coming off wrist surgery to his shooting arm, which doesn't get discussed enough.

(Your Lowry +/- numbers are off btw)

Maybe you're looking at full playoffs? Just for the Bucks series I think they are right?
http://stats.nba.com/team/1610612761/onoffcourt-summary/?Season=2016-17&SeasonType=Playoffs&OpponentTeamID=1610612749

You're reading it wrong. +18.4 is the difference in Ortg with Lowry on vs. off. And then -1.2 is the Drtg difference. You're correct about the ~20 point swing though.

They were +4.7 net rating with Lowry on and -14.9 with Lowry off.

[StatLine]

Watching Lowry do what he does in the regular season, all I can think about is "teams won't let him do this in the playoffs." Then you know he'll inevitably either pumpfake or drive to the basket to draw a foul with no intent to score whatsoever.

He's alright, but he's not real.

[slothrop8]

Absolutely. All while coming off wrist surgery to his shooting arm, which doesn't get discussed enough.

(Your Lowry +/- numbers are off btw)

Maybe you're looking at full playoffs? Just for the Bucks series I think they are right?
http://stats.nba.com/team/1610612761/onoffcourt-summary/?Season=2016-17&SeasonType=Playoffs&OpponentTeamID=1610612749

You're reading it wrong. +18.4 is the difference in Ortg with Lowry on vs. off. And then -1.2 is the Drtg difference. You're correct about the ~20 point swing though.

They were +4.7 net rating with Lowry on and -14.9 with Lowry off.

Yes, just realized it - this is what I get for posting at work while distracted. Stupid job, interfering with RealGM. Thank you for pointing out my misread. Given that those splits are literally my favorite stat in all of basketball and I go on about them all the time - I do know how to read them properly - I swear!

[Mack11]

the question is what is it that you're expecting? i know for a fact we're gonna struggle in the playoffs. We have two known playoff chokers surrounded by young guys with little to no playoff exp. We're gonna get cooked lol.

it'd be nice if they exceed expectations but realistically speaking, im looking at a second round exit, best case scenario

[LiSTWithLani]

We lost to the Bucks in game 3 by a score of 104 to 77. Casey was dead to me after that game.

Nothing in the Nets, Wizards, Indiana or Miami series did anything for you eh?

Literally spat my water out all over my keyboard and monitor. Praying for no water damage @Mikistan! lol

[Mr.Raptorsingh]

OG 'bout to airball some 3s.

[RaptorsLife]

Lowry gonna struggle in playoffs.

The injuries excuses
The he is tired excuses

He is gonna struggle forreal

[YogurtProducer]

Lowry gonna struggle in playoffs.

The injuries excuses
The he is tired excuses

He is gonna struggle forreal

What the **** are you rambling about

[SalamiNcheese]

Op with the over reaction thread again. Same old stuff lol.

Back to back on road late at night with jet lag... we just missed shots. Let it go.