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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 6:37 pm
by hsb
I don't care if players show up to these events as organizers make money but the athletes don't. Patriotism doesn't really put food on the table.

At the same time, team Canada may have had a really good chance of winning the World Cup. So that's too bad.

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 6:38 pm
by hsb
RaptorPride wrote:We can still make the Olympics?

Yes, there's one more tournament next year.

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 8:48 pm
by Mirotic12
Gday_eh wrote:For all the Canadian fans out there complaining about the NBA stars we didn't have (Admittedly Kelly was sorely missed) one just has to look at Argentina knocking off favorite Serbia with only one X-NBA player in FIBA legend Scola . Real Madrid's Campazzo (who is probably the best guard in Euroleague right now) and Deck helped but it was a great team effort against a team featuring current NBA stars Jokic and Bogdanovic.

It's not just about the star players it's about a team that can play together and in a system..


I love Campazzo's game, he's easily one of my favorite players, but let's not get carried away. He's not the best guard in EuroLeague.

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 8:58 pm
by Mirotic12
mojo13 wrote:
juli_rc wrote:
Mattd97 wrote:
He usually says stuff like how team X is the best in the world even though they havent won anything and team Y sucks even though they won the tournament. So not sure results factor in to his fancy


Is that guy Mirotic12?


Yeah - but he has constantly preached that Greece has been pretty dog $#it with Giannis. That Giannis is very (VERY!) poorly suited to FIBA and Greece doesn't have the pieces to surround Giannis effectively. He has told us Greece is better off without Giannis as they can play the style that has historically made them pretty good. Hard to argue after seeing this (once again).

Serbia though? I'd like to hear his take on why they failed. To me it sure seemed like the coach has no clue what makes Jokic so good. Seems like there were bad chemistry issues as well with allot of dirty laundry being aired in the Serbian media.


I you remember, I actually was here for a long time telling you guys you really overrated Serbia. You were saying they were the 2nd or 3rd best team in the world and the best European team, and I kept telling you they were not.

Like I said, Serbia has very little depth in their program. Their national league is horribly bad, and they only produce a small amount of good players. They probably only have for instance, less than half the amount of good players that countries like Spain and Greece have. Even Lithuania, as small as the country is, has noticeably more depth of good players.

Serbia only has maybe 12-15 players in total available that can help their team that much in reality. Several of them are average level EuroLeague players or worse, they often have EuroCup level players having key roles. So if they miss just a couple players, their team consists of about half of their guys being average role players for EuroLeague (at best). I'm not talking about these are guys even at Pangos' level, clearly worse than that.

Their coach is also a quite lacking coach for a team that wants to win tournaments like this. Sasha Djordjevic was a great player, but he's very lacking as a basketball coach. He's not good enough IMO for any EuroLeague team to even be interested in him as a coach.

Against Spain, he got out coached by Scariolo, and I am sure this board will come at me hard for this also, but try to understand, Sergio Scariolo is one of the worst coaches Spanish national team has ever had, and he totally out coached Serbia coach.

Bottom line is, Serbia has been very overrated just because they made the finals of two world tournaments, through mainly total luck by how the brackets played out. Half of their key players are guys that no top EuroLeague team would want.

If you go back and look if you can find it, I kept telling you guys they were nowhere near as good as people here thought, and I remember no one agreeing with me. Fact is, they were never the best European team, and I guarantee that 100%.

With that being said, I think they should be able to beat this USA team, we will see how both teams react after bad losses.

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:42 pm
by TrueNorth31
The impact of Gobert in the game shouldn't be understated.

"The loss is embarrassing for the U.S., but it’s not a surprise. France took the World Cup seriously, as four of its NBA players, including reigning two-time NBA defensive player of year Rudy Gobert, were in the starting lineup. During the 34 minutes that Gobert — who finished with the game with 21 points, 16 rebounds, and 3 blocked shots — was on the court, France outscored the U.S. by 26 points. That’s incredible."

https://time.com/5674186/usa-france-basketball/?utm_campaign=socialflow&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter&xid=time_socialflow_twitter

Having a star player matters - even though he's won the NBA defensive player of the year award twice I had no idea he was this good.

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:45 pm
by gundysmullet
hsb wrote:I don't care if players show up to these events as organizers make money but the athletes don't. Patriotism doesn't really put food on the table.

At the same time, team Canada may have had a really good chance of winning the World Cup. So that's too bad.

They are multi millionaire 1%r’s, they will have plenty of food on their tables for the rest of their lives. It is about the honor and privilege of representing your country. Sadly the vast majority of the Canadian NBA players didn’t think that it was an honor or a privilege.

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:54 pm
by TrueNorth31
Blake Murphy with a very well reasoned article on the state of the national program. Glad to hear MLSE is helping out with some of Canada Basketball's cash flow issues.

"If that MLSE partnership continues or expands, it could help the situation tremendously. There is probably a line MLSE won’t cross in terms of absolute control, given the potential conflicts that could arise, but according to a source, that relationship has already gone beyond Nurse and the use of OVO Athletic Centre and has become financial. (MLSE had previously donated plenty of money as part of the OVO Welcome Toronto partnership with Drake’s group. MLSE also helped Canada Basketball service a sizeable amount of debt, per the source. According to another source, Drake’s OVO brand previously reached out to Canada Basketball about an expanded relationship in the past, as well, but it’s unclear what power dynamics would have been at play in that scenario.) MLSE’s financial support might not even be necessary if they’re able to land their infrastructure across facilities, marketing and sponsorship."

https://theathletic.com/1200604/2019/09/11/from-world-cup-disappointment-to-olympic-hopefuls-what-comes-next-for-canada-basketball/

Really for spending the equivalent of 3 coffees a month you get pretty good value in having a subscription to the Athletic. Something to read while you sip your brew.....

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 12:40 am
by TrueNorth31
Story on Bennett making it back to the NBA. We'll see , he quietly had a pretty good year in the G League last season. He seems like a nice enough kid - hopefully it works out.

https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/news/can-former-no-1-overall-pick-anthony-bennett-make-it-back-to-the-nba-185011336.html?soc_src=social-sh&soc_trk=tw

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:18 am
by juli_rc
Mirotic12 wrote:
mojo13 wrote:
juli_rc wrote:
Is that guy Mirotic12?


Yeah - but he has constantly preached that Greece has been pretty dog $#it with Giannis. That Giannis is very (VERY!) poorly suited to FIBA and Greece doesn't have the pieces to surround Giannis effectively. He has told us Greece is better off without Giannis as they can play the style that has historically made them pretty good. Hard to argue after seeing this (once again).

Serbia though? I'd like to hear his take on why they failed. To me it sure seemed like the coach has no clue what makes Jokic so good. Seems like there were bad chemistry issues as well with allot of dirty laundry being aired in the Serbian media.


I you remember, I actually was here for a long time telling you guys you really overrated Serbia. You were saying they were the 2nd or 3rd best team in the world and the best European team, and I kept telling you they were not.

Like I said, Serbia has very little depth in their program. Their national league is horribly bad, and they only produce a small amount of good players. They probably only have for instance, less than half the amount of good players that countries like Spain and Greece have. Even Lithuania, as small as the country is, has noticeably more depth of good players.

Serbia only has maybe 12-15 players in total available that can help their team that much in reality. Several of them are average level EuroLeague players or worse, they often have EuroCup level players having key roles. So if they miss just a couple players, their team consists of about half of their guys being average role players for EuroLeague (at best). I'm not talking about these are guys even at Pangos' level, clearly worse than that.

Their coach is also a quite lacking coach for a team that wants to win tournaments like this. Sasha Djordjevic was a great player, but he's very lacking as a basketball coach. He's not good enough IMO for any EuroLeague team to even be interested in him as a coach.

Against Spain, he got out coached by Scariolo, and I am sure this board will come at me hard for this also, but try to understand, Sergio Scariolo is one of the worst coaches Spanish national team has ever had, and he totally out coached Serbia coach.

Bottom line is, Serbia has been very overrated just because they made the finals of two world tournaments, through mainly total luck by how the brackets played out. Half of their key players are guys that no top EuroLeague team would want.

If you go back and look if you can find it, I kept telling you guys they were nowhere near as good as people here thought, and I remember no one agreeing with me. Fact is, they were never the best European team, and I guarantee that 100%.

With that being said, I think they should be able to beat this USA team, we will see how both teams react after bad losses.


So Serbia produce a small amount of talent? In the last 20 years, I mean in the last 20 tournaments (olympics, wc or euro), how many time Greece positioning ahead of Serbia?

And, another thing, you can't put Spain and Greece in the same sentence.

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:24 pm
by Mattd97
gundysmullet wrote:
hsb wrote:I don't care if players show up to these events as organizers make money but the athletes don't. Patriotism doesn't really put food on the table.

At the same time, team Canada may have had a really good chance of winning the World Cup. So that's too bad.

They are multi millionaire 1%r’s, they will have plenty of food on their tables for the rest of their lives. It is about the honor and privilege of representing your country. Sadly the vast majority of the Canadian NBA players didn’t think that it was an honor or a privilege.


I'm a patriotic Canadian, so I spell it honour

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:08 pm
by OakleyDokely
Send these Gasol quotes to the Canadians

"June 19th to the 26th. That was my week off, and then I had to get ready for this," said Gasol. "It’s not easy, it’s not ideal, but we are one game away from a final game, so it’s all worth it."


Spain’s victory came on the same Shanghai Oriental Sports Center court that only a night early had seen Canada’s World Cup campaign end with a loss to Germany in the classification round. Canada, which boasts the second-most players in the NBA behind the U.S., had just two of its 17 NBAers on the invitation list in China in Cory Joseph and Khem Birch.

"Yeah, that’s surprising," Gasol said.

"It is a sacrifice," he added. "It’s not easy to give up your off-season when you want to work on stuff, when you want to work on your body, heal your body after a really tough long season. All of a sudden you’re joining the national team and you’re committed for 10 weeks out of the summer.

"It’s definitely not ideal. But it’s totally worth it, because you only get to do this for so long."


https://www.sportsnet.ca/basketball/nba/gasol-didnt-think-twice-playing-spain-long-raptors-season/

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:22 pm
by gundysmullet
Mattd97 wrote:
gundysmullet wrote:
hsb wrote:I don't care if players show up to these events as organizers make money but the athletes don't. Patriotism doesn't really put food on the table.

At the same time, team Canada may have had a really good chance of winning the World Cup. So that's too bad.

They are multi millionaire 1%r’s, they will have plenty of food on their tables for the rest of their lives. It is about the honor and privilege of representing your country. Sadly the vast majority of the Canadian NBA players didn’t think that it was an honor or a privilege.


I'm a patriotic Canadian, so I spell it honour

I’m extremely lazy and voice text everything And that’s how they spell it when I dictate it.

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:09 pm
by gundysmullet
Colangelo calls out Americans who bailed on the team. Wish someone had the stone to do that for Canada.

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/27600706/colangelo-forget-us-world-cup-pullouts

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 12:05 am
by Calinks
If a player is motivated to play, they need to tell their agents and teams to eff off. So many people in their ears telling them its not worth it. If they don;t care then fine but if they feel some kind of way about their teams losing like the US and Canada did here, they need to do something about it.

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 2:36 am
by gundysmullet
Calinks wrote:If a player is motivated to play, they need to tell their agents and teams to eff off. So many people in their ears telling them its not worth it. If they don;t care then fine but if they feel some kind of way about their teams losing like the US and Canada did here, they need to do something about it.

I agree 100%. There’s too much peer pressure and groupthink to not play. Khem Burch is a non-conformist and said no one was going to tell him not to play. I respect the crap out of him for that.

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 12:33 am
by Mirotic12
juli_rc wrote:So Serbia produce a small amount of talent? In the last 20 years, I mean in the last 20 tournaments (olympics, wc or euro), how many time Greece positioning ahead of Serbia?


Without their NBA and EuroLeague players, Serbia barely even made it through the World Cup qualifiers, playing against other teams that also didn't have NBA or EuroLeague players. They barely even qualified. They have hardly any depth at all.

Also, Serbia's history in basketball began in 2007. They only have 12 years of results, not 20.

On another note, Barca signed Malcolm Delaney, and specifically stated he would be their main point guard. So Pangos won't be their main point guard. They also said that Thomas Heurtel might be back for the second half of the season - so if he can come back healthy, Pangos might fall out of their rotation. I doubt that Heurtel can do much though coming off a knee surgery mid season.

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 5:13 am
by Gday_eh
Sick of the hate on Pangos, M12.

Made the sacrifice to play for Canada rather than spend time with his heavily pregnant wife, some others walked away with lame excuses.

Sure having SGA or JM would have pushed him to the bench, but it wasn't guard play that hurt Canada, it was the lack of wing/forward talent that was more crucial. Kevin played very well for the team and quite often was the best player on the floor (1st game in Perth.) He had one poor game in a month (perhaps all the court minutes caught up to him). IMHO the team actually played more smoothly with him running it than Cory.

Nurse was pretty impressed as well, rather take Nick's impression of KP than yours anyday.

Don't be surprised if he has a better year at Barca, he and Brandon play well together.

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:42 pm
by Mirotic12
You guys have been speculating about the four 2020 FIBA World Olympics Qualifiers......

European media is reporting that it will cost national federations €5.3 million euros to host a tournament. So far, both Lithuania and Greece have filed their applications to host.

Also, Greek media has been saying that Giannis won't play for Greece next summer.

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 5:15 pm
by mojo13
Mirotic12 wrote:You guys have been speculating about the four 2020 FIBA World Olympics Qualifiers......

European media is reporting that it will cost national federations €5.3 million euros to host a tournament. So far, both Lithuania and Greece have filed their applications to host.

Also, Greek media has been saying that Giannis won't play for Greece next summer.


I didn't see anything about either of those countries filing to host. Both announced they have interest in hosting - but now we are hearing the expected costs that FIBA is trying to bleed out of federations. It seems the cost may be too much for either federation. Lithuania doesn't have that deep pockets according to their fan base. Greece doesn't magically have that money either and they will need big time government support.

Actual application deadline is sometime in November. My guess is they extend that...

Read on Twitter
?s=20

Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Posted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 5:39 pm
by TrueNorth31
mojo13 wrote:
Mirotic12 wrote:You guys have been speculating about the four 2020 FIBA World Olympics Qualifiers......

European media is reporting that it will cost national federations €5.3 million euros to host a tournament. So far, both Lithuania and Greece have filed their applications to host.

Also, Greek media has been saying that Giannis won't play for Greece next summer.


I didn't see anything about either of those countries filing to host. Both announced they have interest in hosting - but now we are hearing the expected costs that FIBA is trying to bleed out of federations. It seems the cost may be too much for either federation. Lithuania doesn't have that deep pockets according to their fan base. Greece doesn't magically have that money either and they will need big time government support.

Actual application deadline is sometime in November. My guess is they extend that...

Read on Twitter
?s=20


So it's actually 3 million total according to Urbonas to host one of these qualifiers ( I think you made an honest mistake Mirotic and added the two figures together ).

Canada basketball would require MLSE/ OVO ( Drake) / and the Federal government to back a qualifier bid. The big question do you get sponsorship or TV rights for the $ 3 million from Fiba. I suppose if you did this in the GTA and you had a team with a large Canadian expatriate fan base , the Philippines , China or Greece you may do alright at the box office selling tickets . Still given our history I doubt we can pull this off - hopefully somebody proves me wrong.

As for Giannis he can sign a super max deal early in July 2020 ( $ 247 million/ 5 years ) so I can see his hesitation about playing for Greece and perhaps blowing his golden financial ticket.

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/bucks-gm-says-giannis-antetokounmpo-will-get-supermax-offer-i-think-hell-be-a-buck-for-a-long-time/