TorontoRapsFan wrote: Rust_Cohle wrote:
Why are you using a fantasy points website to show me player stats. Don't just say among C's he fares poorly in x ranking. The stats I'm talking about is a basic DefRTG stat off NBA.com. The few comments I've made on Gasol in this thread were about his defensive contributions. You want to argue against that, then please provide some relevant stats. You can look at his stats in depth if you want off NBA.com.
FYI his pick and roll defense stats is he has defended the roll man 0.7 times per game. And he hasn't defended the ball handler. I don't see how that stat matters at all.
You had a baseless assumption that Gasol was a solid part of the Lakers being #1 defense in the league. The fantasy stats are still based on actual stats. Not fantasy points.
I already provided you plenty of stats but here’s some more:https://www.nba.com/stats/team/1610612747/lineups-advanced/?sort=DEF_RATING&Season=2020-21&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&GroupQuantity=5&CF=MIN*G*25&dir=-1
In the top 9 five man defensive laker combinations Gasol only shows up...3 times, with two of those lineups including lebron, AD, and Caldwell Pope who are fantastic defenders (and better at their position) in their own right. A much bigger part as to why Lakers have an elite defense as oppose to Gasol.
He’s washed up at this point, was painfully mediocre in the Denver game. You are just assuming he’s a big part of the Lakers having great defense when they were elite the year before Gasol joined as well. If anything I expect them to find another Center before the trade deadline to help them out or have Harrell take his spot who has been MUCH better than Gasol.
He plays in a lineup with LeBron, Davis and Caldwell Pope who are all much better defenders than he is for their position. If anything, him being so poor across the board despite having some of the best teammates he’s ever had in LeBron and AD says it all. You just saw a Gasol stat and had an assumption he was doing great, but if you actually watch the Laker games you’ll see that couldn’t be further from the truth.
Wtf is wrong with you. Don't accuse someone of "saw a Gasol stat and had an assumption" when you can't even bother to see past your own eyelids. The stats you yourself have cited with the lineups, is a bunch of lineups that average about 40minutes while the one that stands at close to 5X of each of those lineups is 246 minutes. And that 246 minutes lineup has the second highest netrtg with a defensive rating of 102. All you're doing is pulling some menu and then look at the rank and that's it. Don't accuse someone of inability to actually read statistics when you yourself so clearly have blinders on. I never argued how great Gasol is or whether Raptors made a mistake or anything along those lines. But I'm not stupid enough to look at a major piece to the number 1 defensive team in the league and say oh well that guy is obviously garbage cause he doesn't get points and rebounds.
Sorry but you literally said:
Gasol's got to have something to do
Ibaka 25.6mpg, -1.6bpm
Gasol 19.7mpg, +0.7bpm
with Lakers being #1 defensive team in the league so far.
So you weren’t even sure, you made it sound like an assumption. And literally made that comment after seeing a single stat in a vacuum. He’s “got to have” absolutely screams “I assume this could be the reason” without being completely sure. So yeah, your sentence is absolutely worded like an assumption. Yet when looking closer at the stats we can see that no, his impact is not nearly as much as his teammates. And now you’ve gone on and called him a “major piece” which is absolutely laughable. He is by no means a major piece, has mediocre numbers, and is protected by being surrounded by genuinely elite defenders. He is washed up at this point. You are in a very small minority (I imagine there are dozens of you out there) that think Gasol is a big reason for them being #1 defensively but again, we literally looked closer into it and no, he’s a part of the team with minor defensive contributions on a team stacked with plenty of good defenders. Using weird filters like “oh, no point in comparing him to defenders at other positions” and comparing with other centres (the weakest least depth position in the entire league right now) doesn’t really say much. He’s surrounded by elite defenders who are helping him far more than he helps them.
So yeah, on top of all of this, when you actually watch the Laker games, it is clear as day he’s having his worst season ever. The only thing he has done well is his passing, but he’s a terrible rebounder, slow on rotations and can barely get 20 minutes a game. He’s not even significant enough for their best defensive lineups. I mentioned his other stats as being down across the board to show his overall decline, you were silly enough to take one stat a user posted and try to make a narrative out of it with “Gasol has GOT to have something to do with it” and now backpedaling on your assumption based on a single stat.
I have nothing against Gasol, an amazing player in his day but there’s a reason Lakers will be looking for additional big man help, and don’t be surprised that he may eventually lose his starting spot. His defensive numbers are absolutely bumped up by being surrounded by far better defenders than he is at this stage of his career. He’s old, no one defeats Father Time. He’s been on a bad downward slope since being literally one of the worst players in the entire playoffs last season. It is what it is.