Exposing League's Weakest Defenders by position (East owns 4/5)

[NirvanaFC]

Lou Williams can't defend. He's a Harden style players - score no defend.

Actually Harden has gotten pretty good at switching and defending bigs

[LBJKB24MJ23]

Why isin't JV on that list....?

Contrary to popular belief by JV Haters, JV was never really THAT bad defensively, on paper, or even visually.

yes, JV isn't THAT bad.

he's still mediocre. opposing teams that let JV stay in the paint on defense are not being coached well. decent rim protection and 1 on 1 defender if a player posts him up.

if you put JV in PnR, it's over.

[OakleyDokely]

How much of our great defense was a result of Kawhi?... how much do we digress as a result?

Kawhi is a great defender when he wants to be, but what made the Raps so great was that their entire rotation was made up of 3+D players. They didn't have a weak link defensively. There was no player the opposing team could attack or exploit defensively. Lowry/Green/Kawhi/Siakam/Gasol/VV/Powell/Ibaka range from above average to great defenders and most of those guys could switch to different positions.

[bluerap23]

How much of our great defense was a result of Kawhi?... how much do we digress as a result?

Kawhi is a great defender when he wants to be, but what made the Raps so great was that their entire rotation was made up of 3+D players. They didn't have a weak link defensively. There was no player the opposing team could attack or exploit defensively. Lowry/Green/Kawhi/Siakam/Gasol/VV/Powell/Ibaka range from above average to great defenders and most of those guys could switch to different positions.

Casey’s wet dream

[gerrit4]

Why isin't JV on that list....?

Contrary to popular belief by JV Haters, JV was never really THAT bad defensively, on paper, or even visually.

yes, JV isn't THAT bad.

he's still mediocre. opposing teams that let JV stay in the paint on defense are not being coached well. decent rim protection and 1 on 1 defender if a player posts him up.

if you put JV in PnR, it's over.

Yeah, this. To my eyes JV was never such a bad defender, but he has a weakness (getting owned in the P&R) that could be exploited whenever the other team desperately needed a bucket. Teams are less likely to run the same play over and over again all game, but this is what hurt him in the fourth quarter and playoffs, even though he's clearly a very good player.

I'm still shocked that Gasol didn't get abused defensively in the playoffs, because I always thought JVs problem was slow feet. Marc's no faster, but just did such a great job of anticipating the play. I thought Marc was going to get owned against the Bucks, but somehow he was instrumental in shutting down Giannis.

[LBJKB24MJ23]

Contrary to popular belief by JV Haters, JV was never really THAT bad defensively, on paper, or even visually.

yes, JV isn't THAT bad.

he's still mediocre. opposing teams that let JV stay in the paint on defense are not being coached well. decent rim protection and 1 on 1 defender if a player posts him up.

if you put JV in PnR, it's over.

Yeah, this. To my eyes JV was never such a bad defender, but he has a weakness (getting owned in the P&R) that could be exploited whenever the other team desperately needed a bucket. Teams are less likely to run the same play over and over again all game, but this is what hurt him in the fourth quarter and playoffs, even though he's clearly a very good player.

I'm still shocked that Gasol didn't get abused defensively in the playoffs, because I always thought JVs problem was slow feet. Marc's no faster, but just did such a great job of anticipating the play. I thought Marc was going to get owned against the Bucks, but somehow he was instrumental in shutting down Giannis.

the difference between Gasol and JV is basketball IQ and spatial awareness/anticipation

[ReggieSlater]

What happened to PatPat? I'll admit I was one of his defenders, even when his shooting dipped. He was a good two way player, that could hit the open shot. Seemed like a good 5th man in a strong starting lineup that could space the floor and defend (albeit wasn't a strong rebounder), but he seemed to just crater once he left the team.

I'm willing to admit I might have been wrong about him.

[Johnny Bball]

What happened to PatPat? I'll admit I was one of his defenders, even when his shooting dipped. He was a good two way player, that could hit the open shot. Seemed like a good 5th man in a strong starting lineup that could space the floor and defend (albeit wasn't a strong rebounder), but he seemed to just crater once he left the team.

I'm willing to admit I might have been wrong about him.

Patterson was the guy we had playing 4th quarter PNR defence out of necessity. Patterson as small-ball centre was good for us, Patterson as a PF defender, not so much when the PF position got way better. And he got older.

[YogurtProducer]

Contrary to popular belief by JV Haters, JV was never really THAT bad defensively, on paper, or even visually.

Just cause someone isn’t all time bad doesn’t mean they’re great.

Plus, slow footed centres get exposed in the post season but generally are fine during the RS when things don’t matter.

Why are JV fans like this?

Except nobody said JV was great. That was you putting words in someone's mouth and/or creating a strawman to argue with.

Why are JV haters like this?

I’m not a JV hater, I’m simply not oblivious to his faults.

Let me rephrase: just because isn’t bottom 5 bad doesn’t mean he isn’t good or even average. He’s a poor defender who gets exposed although he is a really good offensive player and rebounder. He has his faults and his strengths.

[YogurtProducer]

What happened to PatPat? I'll admit I was one of his defenders, even when his shooting dipped. He was a good two way player, that could hit the open shot. Seemed like a good 5th man in a strong starting lineup that could space the floor and defend (albeit wasn't a strong rebounder), but he seemed to just crater once he left the team.

I'm willing to admit I might have been wrong about him.

Patterson was the guy we had playing 4th quarter PNR defence out of necessity. Patterson as small-ball centre was good for us, Patterson as a PF defender, not so much when the PF position got way better. And he got older.

He got hurt that one year and was never the same. Our lacklustre PF rotation for years also propped him up higher than he was as well.

He was a really good rotation big when he was healthy, which he hasn’t been since like early 2016-17 maybe even late 2015-16

[mieshpal]

Pat pat!! i thought pat pat did so many things well realgmers?

He does things u dont see in the boxscore eh

[T0R0NT0_RAPT0RS]

This is why I'm not sold on Atlanta's young core. I think we all understand Trae Young's strength is on the offence side, but John Collins is not someone I value as a prospect. He screams Marquese Chriss to me.

And don't get me started on the Bobby Portis hype...

I need my prospects to be sound on both ends. Maybe we're spoiled cuz of our young guns.

[YogurtProducer]

This is why I'm not sold on Atlanta's young core. I think we all understand Trae Young's strength is on the offence side, but John Collins is not someone I value as a prospect. He screams Marquese Chriss to me.

And don't get me started on the Bobby Portis hype...

I need my prospects to be sound on both ends. Maybe we're spoiled cuz of our young guns.

Comparing John Collins to marqueise Chriss is just... wow bad

[Arman_tanzarian]

Why isin't JV on that list....?

He's a decent post defender.

[HiMyNameIsTrey]

Pat pat!! i thought pat pat did so many things well realgmers?

He does things u dont see in the boxscore eh

I still got love for 2Pat. At his peak here he was a very solid big that could stretch the floor. I don't know how he fell off so hard. Guy couldn't even hit wide open shots anymore. That Brooklyn steal and game-winner is an all-time Raptors play.

[mdenny]

How much of our great defense was a result of Kawhi?... how much do we digress as a result?

Our defence regresses A LOT because of losing both Kawhi and Green. They were our best 2 defenders.

[ruckus]

How much of our great defense was a result of Kawhi?... how much do we digress as a result?

Our defence regresses A LOT because of losing both Kawhi and Green. They were our best 2 defenders.

I'm not so sure about that. While they really helped lock down the perimeter, Gasol really made a difference for us in the second half of the season and in the playoffs. Not to mention Siakam is no slouch on D either. But Gasol was really the difference maker down the stretch.

Not to mention, the players that are supposed to replace them, Powell and Anunoby, are plus defenders as well.

I'm not all that worried about our defence. I'm trying to figure out what our offence will look like.

[mdenny]

How much of our great defense was a result of Kawhi?... how much do we digress as a result?

Our defence regresses A LOT because of losing both Kawhi and Green. They were our best 2 defenders.

I'm not so sure about that. While they really helped lock down the perimeter, Gasol really made a difference for us in the second half of the season and in the playoffs. Not to mention Siakam is no slouch on D either. But Gasol was really the difference maker down the stretch.

Not to mention, the players that are supposed to replace them, Powell and Anunoby, are plus defenders as well.

I'm not all that worried about our defence. I'm trying to figure out what our offence will look like.

I think we're still above average compared to the rest of the league on D but we're no longer elite. Green's defence in particular is underrated. Siakum is good one-on-one but his team defence is still around average imo. I agree on Gasol however. It's just that with him, Danny and Kawhi we had 3 elite IQ orientated defenders. Now we have one. Kyle and Pascal are good defenders but not the same in terms of IQ.

[Mikistan]

Why isin't JV on that list....?

Contrary to popular belief by JV Haters, JV was never really THAT bad defensively, on paper, or even visually.

yes, JV isn't THAT bad.

he's still mediocre. opposing teams that let JV stay in the paint on defense are not being coached well. decent rim protection and 1 on 1 defender if a player posts him up.

if you put JV in PnR, it's over.

Only if your pnr initiator can shoot off the dribble