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2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2

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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1301 » by The Duke » Fri Oct 30, 2020 3:39 am

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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1302 » by OAKLEY_2 » Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:48 am

PhilBlackson wrote:An expiring Powell (who's just a rotation player) contract gets the #6 pick and we're getting Harden without giving up Pascal or OG lol yall need to stop.


Norm is a starting two on our team but because Fred is a great defender, shooter who protects the ball Norm is 6th man with Ibaka. Norm is not just a rotation player.
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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1303 » by fbalmeida » Fri Oct 30, 2020 11:04 am

Gasol is probably retiring and Ibaka most likely won't be affordable past 2021 if we re-sign Fred and allocate our 2021 max slot for Giannis.

We need at least one good big with an affordable <10 M per year contract that runs past 2021.

One option is the Giles/Hernangomez/Len route via free agency, moving Norm to move up in the draft for Thaledon.

But another option would be packaging Norm for Maxi Kleber.

Powell and Boucher (sign-and-trade 6-7 Mil on 3 years) + picks if needed.

The Mavs get their starting SG and a much-needed upgrade at backcourt defense.

Doncic
Norman Powell
Finney-Smith
Dwight Powell
Porzingis / Boucher

We go with a 2020 team of

Lowry
Fred / Watson / Thomas
OG / Brissett
Siakam / Dewan
Kleber/Ibaka

And a 2021 team of

Fred / Lowry
Watson / Thomas
OG / Brissett
Siakam / Dewan
Giannis / Kleber
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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1304 » by bape_lovers » Fri Oct 30, 2020 1:29 pm

if that happens, I'll go dance in Yonge and Dundas, won't give two **** about Covid lol

PhilBlackson wrote:An expiring Powell (who's just a rotation player) contract gets the #6 pick and we're getting Harden without giving up Pascal or OG lol yall need to stop.
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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1305 » by PhilBlackson » Fri Oct 30, 2020 2:28 pm

fbalmeida wrote:Gasol is probably retiring and Ibaka most likely won't be affordable past 2021 if we re-sign Fred and allocate our 2021 max slot for Giannis.

We need at least one good big with an affordable <10 M per year contract that runs past 2021.

One option is the Giles/Hernangomez/Len route via free agency, moving Norm to move up in the draft for Thaledon.

But another option would be packaging Norm for Maxi Kleber.

Powell and Boucher (sign-and-trade 6-7 Mil on 3 years) + picks if needed.

The Mavs get their starting SG and a much-needed upgrade at backcourt defense.

Doncic
Norman Powell
Finney-Smith
Dwight Powell
Porzingis / Boucher

We go with a 2020 team of

Lowry
Fred / Watson / Thomas
OG / Brissett
Siakam / Dewan
Kleber/Ibaka

And a 2021 team of

Fred / Lowry
Watson / Thomas
OG / Brissett
Siakam / Dewan
Giannis / Kleber


"Picks if needed"....for Kleber?!??

Are you high?? lol I'd rather have Powell + Boucher nevermind giving them draft picks as our team that will likely take a step back next year and potentially further n further as Lowry fades and/or losing players during FA so that pick(s) only increase in value. This is also not mentioning what an excellent job we do drafting with players of the caliber or better than Klieber and would think would only find better players as we move up in the draft. For what?? Kleiber to reduce the amount we step back?! Ridiculous idea.
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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1306 » by fbalmeida » Fri Oct 30, 2020 2:57 pm

I think Norm for Kleber is the opposite of ridiculous.

Our development is amazing and has us well stocked with young talent at every position except Center.

If we don't land a good big on a 10 M per year contract (give or take) that goes past the 2021 season prior to 2021 free agency, our rotations bigs for 2021 will either be Boucher and Dewan, or perhaps whoever we can tie up to a MLE.

I think it would be wise to get the guy that we know would fit the program, in exchange for the tradable assets we've got, rather than settling for a guy from a pool of misfits. Norm is gone if we don't deal him and 2020-21 is a pivot year.
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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1307 » by OAKLEY_2 » Fri Oct 30, 2020 3:25 pm

fbalmeida wrote:I think Norm for Kleber is the opposite of ridiculous.

Our development is amazing and has us well stocked with young talent at every position except Center.

If we don't land a good big on a 10 M per year contract (give or take) that goes past the 2021 season prior to 2021 free agency, our rotations bigs for 2021 will either be Boucher and Dewan, or perhaps whoever we can tie up to a MLE.

I think it would be wise to get the guy that we know would fit the program, in exchange for the tradable assets we've got, rather than settling for a guy from a pool of misfits. Norm is gone if we don't deal him and 2020-21 is a pivot year.


With Davis II busted I think all talk of moving Norm will have to stop for the forseeable future. Our depth just took a potential direct hit. I mean it would look like Davis 2 and Norm were replaced by Kleber if we made that move. If we grabbed Isaiah Joe the the TD II blow would be softened but Davis in my mind was trending in a direction to be better than TRoss. Not bad for an undrafted pick up. I suspect if these charges are as serious as they sound TDII is the casualty not Norm...
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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1308 » by OAKLEY_2 » Fri Oct 30, 2020 3:29 pm

If Lowry leaves in 2021 there is zero pressure to deal Norm. Talking Lowry leaving is sacrilidge but... Going to Philly or Miami would return assets.
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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1309 » by fbalmeida » Fri Oct 30, 2020 3:53 pm

I agree that TD2 stupidity requires us to re-assess the Norm, TD2, Thomas, dynamic at SG. I had TD2 pencilled as our starting SG in 2021. Nevertheless, I think Watson can shift to SG and potentially be even better than TD.

We could theoretically start in 2021 with Fred, Norm, OG, Siakam, and Giannis, If Norm re-signs for a 15-ish contract, but it's uncertain that Norm would opt out to re-sign for such a modest pay-raise. Assuming he does, that would leave us without a solid big and no space to land one.
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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1310 » by oldncreaky » Fri Oct 30, 2020 4:48 pm

I disagree with the idea of trading players for picks just before the draft because, every year, we see the same fluctuations in value. Patience unlocks value.

Prior to the draft, picks are over-valued, and established players are undervalued

During the season, picks are under-valued, and established players are over valued.

In particular, for Norm with his PO next season, his value will go up as the trade deadline approaches. Trade him now, and you get at most 75 cents on the dollar; trade him before the deadline, and you probably get 1.25 for the dollar.

I would wait on trading players for picks, particularly if the are on a contract like Norm's
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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1311 » by tecumseh18 » Fri Oct 30, 2020 5:05 pm

fbalmeida wrote:I think Watson can shift to SG and potentially be even better than TD.


Uh, potentially. But let's not go crazy here. Watson was decent in the G-League - the league that Boucher was MVP and DPOY of - and seemed like a decent catch and shoot guy in the late (i.e. meaningless) bubble games.

Meanwhile, Davis had many amazing games for the big club last season, starting in the first pre-season game against the Rockets when the Houston commentators were comparing him to Westbrook. I just don't want anyone downplaying what a freaking disaster his incident could be for the team going forward. Davis has shown the star power that the Raps desperately need - both to win games and to attract FAs in 2021. Giannis isn't going to come here for Paul freakin' Watson.

OTOH, Giannis has seen a lot of Matt unloading in the Bucks' faces. Hopefully by the end of this upcoming season, that will be sufficient.
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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1312 » by Raptors_128 » Fri Oct 30, 2020 5:12 pm

If Fred wants his money (as he should) and we can’t afford him, what about a sign-and-trade deal for PG?

Fred sign-and-trade + TD + (2021 1st?) for Paul George (include TD in a separate deal for nothing but filler salary to make it work)

Lowry/PG/OG/Siakam/Gasol

We would be right back at the top of the East and a true contender imo. I don’t want to waste whatever is left of Kyle’s prime years.

Also, we’ll have a back-up plan if Giannis doesn’t come here in 2021.
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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1313 » by fbalmeida » Fri Oct 30, 2020 5:16 pm

oldncreaky wrote:I disagree with the idea of trading players for picks just before the draft because, every year, we see the same fluctuations in value. Patience unlocks value.

Prior to the draft, picks are over-valued, and established players are undervalued

During the season, picks are under-valued, and established players are over valued.

In particular, for Norm with his PO next season, his value will go up as the trade deadline approaches. Trade him now, and you get at most 75 cents on the dollar; trade him before the deadline, and you probably get 1.25 for the dollar.

I would wait on trading players for picks, particularly if the are on a contract like Norm's

I wouldn't mind waiting closer to the trade deadline to trade Norm, but there is the risk of him being injured at the wrong time. Right now we'd be selling high.
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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1314 » by douggood » Fri Oct 30, 2020 5:26 pm

Raptors_128 wrote:If Fred wants his money (as he should) and we can’t afford him, what about a sign-and-trade deal for PG?

Fred sign-and-trade + TD + (2021 1st?) for Paul George (include TD in a separate deal for nothing but filler salary to make it work)

Lowry/PG/OG/Siakam/Gasol

We would be right back at the top of the East and a true contender imo. I don’t want to waste whatever is left of Kyle’s prime years.

Also, we’ll have a back-up plan if Giannis doesn’t come here in 2021.

we already have the true playoff P

plus i dont want another season of hearing about a player wanting to go back to california.

plus i am not sure clippers will want the ridicule of trading george after the truckload they gave up for him.
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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1315 » by fbalmeida » Fri Oct 30, 2020 5:40 pm

tecumseh18 wrote:
fbalmeida wrote:I think Watson can shift to SG and potentially be even better than TD.


Uh, potentially. But let's not go crazy here. Watson was decent in the G-League - the league that Boucher was MVP and DPOY of - and seemed like a decent catch and shoot guy in the late (i.e. meaningless) bubble games.

Meanwhile, Davis had many amazing games for the big club last season, starting in the first pre-season game against the Rockets when the Houston commentators were comparing him to Westbrook. I just don't want anyone downplaying what a freaking disaster his incident could be for the team going forward. Davis has shown the star power that the Raps desperately need - both to win games and to attract FAs in 2021. Giannis isn't going to come here for Paul freakin' Watson.

OTOH, Giannis has seen a lot of Matt unloading in the Bucks' faces. Hopefully by the end of this upcoming season, that will be sufficient.


I agree that it's fairly easy to have imagined Davis as the starting SG in 2021, providing some halfcourt playmaking that we seemed to lack this year. His current predicament definitely has a cascading impact on our roster.

Assuming Norm remains our most tradable asset, Thomas and Watson are the natural next men up. I think Watson brings a better overall package to his game than Thomas. He appears to be more level-headed than Davis, and has earned praise for being very coachable and having made strides with his 3pt shot in the G-league. Boucher was absolutely dazzling in the g-league but Watson has been pretty good in his own right. His shooting stats were amazing. He earned some playing time in the bubble while Brissett was benched. I think there is a pretty good chance he establishes himself this year as a rotation guard.

Obviously, If Giannis becomes a Raptor, it's not because of Watson. it'll be because of Masai, our winning tradition, the chance of being the crown jewel of a championship winning core of elite 2-way players: Siakam, Fred, and OG, because of Nurse, our organization's commitment to excellence, our city, and our fans.
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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1316 » by jimmy keys » Fri Oct 30, 2020 8:17 pm

They should be able to bring back Van Vleet and Powell pretty easily if that's the direction they want to go in.

Van Vleet
Powell
Anunoby
Siakam
Max


Becomes even easier if they just waive TD II.

One of Lowry, van Vleet or Powell needs to get traded in the next 6 months though.
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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1317 » by fbalmeida » Fri Oct 30, 2020 11:30 pm

That is indeed one possibility: committing to Powell at SG, but it will leave us with zero cap space for quality bigs.

I'd prefer moving Powell for the best reasonably affordable big we can entice.
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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1318 » by bballsparkin » Sat Oct 31, 2020 5:22 am

fbalmeida wrote:I wouldn't mind waiting closer to the trade deadline to trade Norm, but there is the risk of him being injured at the wrong time. Right now we'd be selling high.


This is true. Norm be like that. Reading about TD starting or Watson makes me appreciate Norm all the more. If the goal is to win I say hold onto him. If a team wants him it better be a good offer. That seems more likely near the deadline. If he's not inured lol
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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1319 » by nabbs » Sat Oct 31, 2020 5:43 am

TD is likely a goner. Our guard rotation assuming Fred is back:

Lowry/Mccaw
Fred/Norm/Thomas


Real small, thin and lacking of secondary creation outside of Fred. It has to be addressed
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Re: 2019-20 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1320 » by LoveMyRaps » Sat Oct 31, 2020 6:32 am

nabbs wrote:TD is likely a goner. Our guard rotation assuming Fred is back:

Lowry/Mccaw
Fred/Norm/Thomas


Real small, thin and lacking of secondary creation outside of Fred. It has to be addressed


Unless we're signing FVV for under 20mil AAV, we'll have to ship out Norm if we want to maintain a max slot for next summer. We either trade Norm now or during the season.

So really... we're just looking at:
Lowry/McCaw
Fred/Thomas

That backcourt depth is painful to look at. Masai will most definitely be addressing that.
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