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Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic.

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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#61 » by wtcantfw » Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:31 pm

ATLTimekeeper wrote:
Raps in 4 wrote:Literally every team skipped him, including the Nuggets with their higher picks.


To be fair, the Nuggets promised him they'd take him in the 2nd round and that's the only reason he chose to stay in the draft. They were literally the only team interested in him, and so there was no need to take him with a higher pick (both very good choices in Nurkic and Harris).

I remember Denver trading Nurkic and thinking they chose the wrong Centre. Boy, was I wrong.
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#62 » by Danny1616 » Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:43 pm

Lesson today:

If you are a GM and don't have a crystal ball into the future where you can find late draft pick gems every year then you are a terrible GM who probably couldn't even run a convenience store for that matter.

Every GM in the NBA should be able to find potential all-stars in the 2nd round or else they are terrible.
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#63 » by StopitLeo » Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:58 pm

Everyone drafting earlier made the same mistake...
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#64 » by UcanUwill » Tue Sep 15, 2020 2:07 pm

It was really impossible to project he would be this good, i mean just look at him, if he went undrafted and played in Europe right now, I bet if I or some other poster brought him up, EVERYONE would just look at 10 seconds of film and say ROFL Europe competition and how unathletic he is - would be unplayable in the NBA. So beside even the fact he was almost unknown, but its just amazing he is dominating NBA the way he does. I mean even Luka, the most accomplished NBA draft prospect of all time, was selected after Marvin bagley, because you know, ''slow''.
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#65 » by ATLTimekeeper » Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:07 pm

WRX_STi wrote:I can say that drafting Bruno was one of Masai's biggest blunders. Jakob at the time was also a poor choice. Better guys like Sabonis (all-star), Dejounte Murray, Malik Beasley, Caris LeVert were available.


Only Sabonis was under consideration in the lottery. For what we got in return for Poeltl, I think it was a fine pick. He didn't bust and was a contributor, retaining value to be used in an upgrade. The other way to look at it is that 8/9 picks following Poeltl were nonentities or equivalent.
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#66 » by douggood » Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:13 pm

wtcantfw wrote:
ATLTimekeeper wrote:
Raps in 4 wrote:Literally every team skipped him, including the Nuggets with their higher picks.


To be fair, the Nuggets promised him they'd take him in the 2nd round and that's the only reason he chose to stay in the draft. They were literally the only team interested in him, and so there was no need to take him with a higher pick (both very good choices in Nurkic and Harris).

I remember Denver trading Nurkic and thinking they chose the wrong Centre. Boy, was I wrong.

they actually traded Nurkic and a 1st for plumplee, beacuse they saw plumlee as an upgrade at center over nurkic and jokic.

so in hindsight they chose the wrong center twice.
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#67 » by ItsDanger » Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:17 pm

Watched some pre draft video of him to see why people passed over him. He looked a little slow but the finesse skills were very obvious. Considering this was 2014, I can't believe people didn't take a chance on him. If it was 2016, then maybe I would have understood given how the Warriors influenced style.
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#68 » by Rebel INS » Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:25 pm

Pooh_Jeter wrote:
Danny1616 wrote:
Pooh_Jeter wrote:
Depends on your definition of great. Masai is somewhere in the 8-12 range of executives in this league. I'd say he is more above average than anything.


8-12 range.

Okay so name me 8 GM's that have done more than Masai over the past 7 years. I want you to list all their accomplishments and compare side by side to Masai.


Lmao, if I don't get it to you by Friday at 4PM will my final mark be withheld?

Ainge, Riley, Nelson, Myers, Buford, Marks, take your pick of Nuggets executives, Morey, Horst, Presti and Olshey. The first 5 are absolutely better than him and it's not an argument. I'd probably have Masai 9th or 10th.


If only this franchise had Bob Myers or a Sean Marks at the helm. We would have signed free agent Kevin Durant and had multiple championships if it wasn't for Masai holding us back
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#69 » by Pooh_Jeter » Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:45 pm

Rebel INS wrote:
Pooh_Jeter wrote:
Danny1616 wrote:
8-12 range.

Okay so name me 8 GM's that have done more than Masai over the past 7 years. I want you to list all their accomplishments and compare side by side to Masai.


Lmao, if I don't get it to you by Friday at 4PM will my final mark be withheld?

Ainge, Riley, Nelson, Myers, Buford, Marks, take your pick of Nuggets executives, Morey, Horst, Presti and Olshey. The first 5 are absolutely better than him and it's not an argument. I'd probably have Masai 9th or 10th.


If only this franchise had Bob Myers or a Sean Marks at the helm. We would have signed free agent Kevin Durant and had multiple championships if it wasn't for Masai holding us back


If Masai didn't have Bobby Webster and his relationship with the Spurs AGM, Masai would be seen as a gigantic failure.
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#70 » by ATLTimekeeper » Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:52 pm

douggood wrote:
wtcantfw wrote:
ATLTimekeeper wrote:
To be fair, the Nuggets promised him they'd take him in the 2nd round and that's the only reason he chose to stay in the draft. They were literally the only team interested in him, and so there was no need to take him with a higher pick (both very good choices in Nurkic and Harris).

I remember Denver trading Nurkic and thinking they chose the wrong Centre. Boy, was I wrong.

they actually traded Nurkic and a 1st for plumplee, beacuse they saw plumlee as an upgrade at center over nurkic and jokic.

so in hindsight they chose the wrong center twice.


I remember reading an article that seems like it may have been scrubbed because I can't find it, but Mike Malone wasn't a believer in Jokic because of his defense. I'm pretty sure management made the choice to force Malone's hand. I don't think it was actually that they valued Plumlee ahead of Nurkic, but just that Nurkic would never be happy coming off the bench and they had to make a choice.

I watched Jokic's pre-draft videos and thought he looked interesting. And then the first time I knew he was going to be good was his rookie year and he was just giving it to JV.
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#71 » by Danny1616 » Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:52 pm

Pooh_Jeter wrote:
Rebel INS wrote:
Pooh_Jeter wrote:
Lmao, if I don't get it to you by Friday at 4PM will my final mark be withheld?

Ainge, Riley, Nelson, Myers, Buford, Marks, take your pick of Nuggets executives, Morey, Horst, Presti and Olshey. The first 5 are absolutely better than him and it's not an argument. I'd probably have Masai 9th or 10th.


If only this franchise had Bob Myers or a Sean Marks at the helm. We would have signed free agent Kevin Durant and had multiple championships if it wasn't for Masai holding us back


If Masai didn't have Bobby Webster and his relationship with the Spurs AGM, Masai would be seen as a gigantic failure.


Dude you literally said Horst is a better GM than Masai. What has Horst done over the past 7 years? Milwaukee made the ECF and just got destroyed in the 2nd round. You literally claimed "Horst" is absolutely better than Masai.

You claimed that Olshey is a better GM than Masai. What has Olshey accomplished? Portland barely made the playoffs this year and their core is maxed out. They don't have any great young pieces on their time either.

What has Morey accomplished? Harden still hasn't even reached the finals and they don't have any cap room to work with.

How is Marks more accomplished than Masai? Brooklyn has been pretty bad the last few years. No one knows yet how Kyrie and KD will work. Personally, I don't see Kyrie and KD being that good of a fit whatsoever. KD will be able to make them a very good team, but I just don't see them advancing to the finals.

Masai is easily a top 5 GM in the NBA and it's not a debate. Further, Masai, since arriving in Toronto as GM/President has accomplished more than anyone you listed other than Myers.

My rankings for the 2010s would be:

1) Myers
2) Buford
3) Masai
4) Ainge
5) Morey

That's in terms of accomplishments, drafting, player development, consistency etc.
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#72 » by Pooh_Jeter » Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:56 pm

Danny1616 wrote:
Pooh_Jeter wrote:
Rebel INS wrote:
If only this franchise had Bob Myers or a Sean Marks at the helm. We would have signed free agent Kevin Durant and had multiple championships if it wasn't for Masai holding us back


If Masai didn't have Bobby Webster and his relationship with the Spurs AGM, Masai would be seen as a gigantic failure.


Dude you literally said Horst is a better GM than Masai. What has Horst done over the past 7 years? Milwaukee made the ECF and just got destroyed in the 2nd round. You literally claimed "Horst" is absolutely better than Masai.

You claimed that Olshey is a better GM than Masai. What has Olshey accomplished? Portland barely made the playoffs this year and their core is maxed out. They don't have any great young pieces on their time either.

What has Morey accomplished? Harden still hasn't even reached the finals and they don't have any cap room to work with.


You need to take some reading comprehension classes. I said Ainge, Riley, Nelson, Myers, and Buford are definitively better. Everyone else listed I said could be debatable, but personally I have them above Masai for the most part.

If the Bucks ownership wasn't cheap and kept Brogdon the Bucks are in the ECF. Portland was literally just in the WCF last year and barely made the playoffs this year because of injuries. Morey assembled the team that gave the super powered Warriors their biggest test.
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#73 » by Danny1616 » Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:59 pm

Pooh_Jeter wrote:
Danny1616 wrote:
Pooh_Jeter wrote:
If Masai didn't have Bobby Webster and his relationship with the Spurs AGM, Masai would be seen as a gigantic failure.


Dude you literally said Horst is a better GM than Masai. What has Horst done over the past 7 years? Milwaukee made the ECF and just got destroyed in the 2nd round. You literally claimed "Horst" is absolutely better than Masai.

You claimed that Olshey is a better GM than Masai. What has Olshey accomplished? Portland barely made the playoffs this year and their core is maxed out. They don't have any great young pieces on their time either.

What has Morey accomplished? Harden still hasn't even reached the finals and they don't have any cap room to work with.


You need to take some reading comprehension classes. I said Ainge, Riley, Nelson, Myers, and Buford are definitively better. Everyone else listed I said could be debatable, but personally I have them above Masai for the most part.

If the Bucks ownership wasn't cheap and kept Brogdon the Bucks are in the ECF. Portland was literally just in the WCF last year and barely made the playoffs this year because of injuries. Morey assembled the team that gave the super powered Warriors their biggest test.


So you are literally speaking in idiotic hypotheticals.

Bucks management made a terrible mistake overpaying Bledsoe. Why don't you acknowledge that colossal error? Their entire team are literally reliant on Giannis. Yes, the Bucks struck gold with him but they havn't exactly built a great core around him.

Portland has been a widely inconsistent team. In 2017 they only won 41 games and got knocked in the first round. In 2018 they had the 3rd seed and got swept by a mediocore Pelicans team that was missing Cousins. I mean how ridiculous are you to say that Portland's management is better than Masai. Injuries are part of the game. We had a ton of injuries this year, but had a very balanced and deep team that was still on pace for 60 wins.

Morey's team last year blew a 2-0 lead to the Warriors EVEN WITH KD BEING HURT.

You said that Masai is in the 9th or 10th best GM with ZERO justification.

You are pathetic.

Facts are facts:

Raptors have the best record in the NBA since 2016.

Raptors have the most 50+ win seasons since 2015.

Raptors have made the playoffs 7 straight seasons.

Raptors have a championship, an ECF appearance, and 4 semi-finals appearances.

Please justify the GMs that you listed above Masai have had a better resume of the past 7 seasons.
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#74 » by Pooh_Jeter » Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:05 pm

Danny1616 wrote:
Pooh_Jeter wrote:
Danny1616 wrote:
Dude you literally said Horst is a better GM than Masai. What has Horst done over the past 7 years? Milwaukee made the ECF and just got destroyed in the 2nd round. You literally claimed "Horst" is absolutely better than Masai.

You claimed that Olshey is a better GM than Masai. What has Olshey accomplished? Portland barely made the playoffs this year and their core is maxed out. They don't have any great young pieces on their time either.

What has Morey accomplished? Harden still hasn't even reached the finals and they don't have any cap room to work with.


You need to take some reading comprehension classes. I said Ainge, Riley, Nelson, Myers, and Buford are definitively better. Everyone else listed I said could be debatable, but personally I have them above Masai for the most part.

If the Bucks ownership wasn't cheap and kept Brogdon the Bucks are in the ECF. Portland was literally just in the WCF last year and barely made the playoffs this year because of injuries. Morey assembled the team that gave the super powered Warriors their biggest test.


So you are literally speaking in idiotic hypotheticals.

Bucks management made a terrible mistake overpaying Bledsoe. Why don't you acknowledge that colossal error? Their entire team are literally reliant on Giannis. Yes, the Bucks struck gold with him but they havn't exactly built a great core around him.

Portland has been a widely inconsistent team. In 2017 they only won 41 games and got knocked in the first round. In 2018 they had the 3rd seed and got swept by a mediocore Pelicans team that was missing Cousins. I mean how ridiculous are you to say that Portland's management is better than Masai. Injuries are part of the game. We had a ton of injuries this year, but had a very balanced and deep team that was still on pace for 60 wins.

Morey's team last year blew a 2-0 lead to the Warriors EVEN WITH KD BEING HURT.

You said that Masai is in the 9th or 10th best GM with ZERO justification.

You are pathetic.


I'm pathetic because you don't like a subjective list of best GM's in the league? Bro, take a chill pill.

Portland has a top 10 guy in Lillard and one of the most talented centres in the league. The Warriors are a juggernaut and Morey has been outstanding trying to find ways to beat them despite having a cheap owner who wouldn't pay the tax.

You're too busy licking Masai's boots to actually be objective.
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#75 » by Danny1616 » Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:07 pm

Pooh_Jeter wrote:
Danny1616 wrote:
Pooh_Jeter wrote:
You need to take some reading comprehension classes. I said Ainge, Riley, Nelson, Myers, and Buford are definitively better. Everyone else listed I said could be debatable, but personally I have them above Masai for the most part.

If the Bucks ownership wasn't cheap and kept Brogdon the Bucks are in the ECF. Portland was literally just in the WCF last year and barely made the playoffs this year because of injuries. Morey assembled the team that gave the super powered Warriors their biggest test.


So you are literally speaking in idiotic hypotheticals.

Bucks management made a terrible mistake overpaying Bledsoe. Why don't you acknowledge that colossal error? Their entire team are literally reliant on Giannis. Yes, the Bucks struck gold with him but they havn't exactly built a great core around him.

Portland has been a widely inconsistent team. In 2017 they only won 41 games and got knocked in the first round. In 2018 they had the 3rd seed and got swept by a mediocore Pelicans team that was missing Cousins. I mean how ridiculous are you to say that Portland's management is better than Masai. Injuries are part of the game. We had a ton of injuries this year, but had a very balanced and deep team that was still on pace for 60 wins.

Morey's team last year blew a 2-0 lead to the Warriors EVEN WITH KD BEING HURT.

You said that Masai is in the 9th or 10th best GM with ZERO justification.

You are pathetic.


I'm pathetic because you don't like a subjective list of best GM's in the league? Bro, take a chill pill.

Portland has a top 10 guy in Lillard and one of the most talented centres in the league. The Warriors are a juggernaut and Morey has been outstanding trying to find ways to beat them despite having a cheap owner who wouldn't pay the tax.

You're too busy licking Masai's boots to actually be objective.


Lillard was phenomenal in the bubble, but do you forget that Lillard was god awful against the Warriors last year and was god awful against the Pelicans when they got swept in the first round in 2018.

Lillard and CJ aren't winning you a chip. Portland has zero cap room flexibility and don't have upcoming young talent.

When did I say Masai was better than Myers?

I said that Masai is clearly a top 5 GM in the NBA during his 7 year stint with the Raptors. I had Myers ahead of him in case you didn't notice.

So yes, you are pathetic. You sound like an 8 year old kid who only started watching basketball this year.

I've asked you multiple times. Please justify and compare the GMs you listed above Masai and explain to me in detail why they are better GMs. Apart from Myers and Buford, not one GM you listed has actually accomplished more than Masai since 2014.
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#76 » by Pooh_Jeter » Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:10 pm

Danny1616 wrote:
Pooh_Jeter wrote:
Danny1616 wrote:
So you are literally speaking in idiotic hypotheticals.

Bucks management made a terrible mistake overpaying Bledsoe. Why don't you acknowledge that colossal error? Their entire team are literally reliant on Giannis. Yes, the Bucks struck gold with him but they havn't exactly built a great core around him.

Portland has been a widely inconsistent team. In 2017 they only won 41 games and got knocked in the first round. In 2018 they had the 3rd seed and got swept by a mediocore Pelicans team that was missing Cousins. I mean how ridiculous are you to say that Portland's management is better than Masai. Injuries are part of the game. We had a ton of injuries this year, but had a very balanced and deep team that was still on pace for 60 wins.

Morey's team last year blew a 2-0 lead to the Warriors EVEN WITH KD BEING HURT.

You said that Masai is in the 9th or 10th best GM with ZERO justification.

You are pathetic.


I'm pathetic because you don't like a subjective list of best GM's in the league? Bro, take a chill pill.

Portland has a top 10 guy in Lillard and one of the most talented centres in the league. The Warriors are a juggernaut and Morey has been outstanding trying to find ways to beat them despite having a cheap owner who wouldn't pay the tax.

You're too busy licking Masai's boots to actually be objective.


Lillard was phenomenal in the bubble, but do you forget that Lillard was god awful against the Warriors last year and was god awful against the Pelicans when they got swept in the first round in 2018.

Lillard and CJ aren't winning you a chip. Portland has zero cap room flexibility and don't have upcoming young talent.

When did I say Masai was better than Myers?

I said that Masai is clearly a top 5 GM in the NBA during his 7 year stint with the Raptors. I had Myers ahead of him in case you didn't notice.

So yes, you are pathetic. You sound like an 8 year old kid who only started watching basketball this year.

I've asked you multiple times. Please justify and compare the GMs you listed above Masai and explain to me in detail why they are better GMs. Apart from Myers and Buford, not one GM you listed has actually accomplished more than Masai since 2014.


So the guy who is calling me pathetic over a subjective list thinks I'm a little kid? I think the internet is a little too high pressure for you. Maybe find a new hobby.
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#77 » by Danny1616 » Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:10 pm

Pooh_Jeter wrote:
Danny1616 wrote:
Pooh_Jeter wrote:
I'm pathetic because you don't like a subjective list of best GM's in the league? Bro, take a chill pill.

Portland has a top 10 guy in Lillard and one of the most talented centres in the league. The Warriors are a juggernaut and Morey has been outstanding trying to find ways to beat them despite having a cheap owner who wouldn't pay the tax.

You're too busy licking Masai's boots to actually be objective.


Lillard was phenomenal in the bubble, but do you forget that Lillard was god awful against the Warriors last year and was god awful against the Pelicans when they got swept in the first round in 2018.

Lillard and CJ aren't winning you a chip. Portland has zero cap room flexibility and don't have upcoming young talent.

When did I say Masai was better than Myers?

I said that Masai is clearly a top 5 GM in the NBA during his 7 year stint with the Raptors. I had Myers ahead of him in case you didn't notice.

So yes, you are pathetic. You sound like an 8 year old kid who only started watching basketball this year.

I've asked you multiple times. Please justify and compare the GMs you listed above Masai and explain to me in detail why they are better GMs. Apart from Myers and Buford, not one GM you listed has actually accomplished more than Masai since 2014.


So the guy who is calling me pathetic over a subjective list thinks I'm a little kid? I think the internet is a little too high pressure for you. Maybe find a new hobby.


Again, you can't answer my question.

Please compare and justify the GMs you listed above Masai and explain to me what they have accomplished over the past 7 seasons that exceeds Masai's accomplishments. From what I told you, I would agree that Myers and Buford are the only GMs that can rival Masai's accomplishments since 2014. But please explain to me the other 6 GMs you had in front of Masai.

It's a very simple question, but strangely you can't answer it.
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#78 » by Pooh_Jeter » Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:14 pm

Danny1616 wrote:
Pooh_Jeter wrote:
Danny1616 wrote:
Lillard was phenomenal in the bubble, but do you forget that Lillard was god awful against the Warriors last year and was god awful against the Pelicans when they got swept in the first round in 2018.

Lillard and CJ aren't winning you a chip. Portland has zero cap room flexibility and don't have upcoming young talent.

When did I say Masai was better than Myers?

I said that Masai is clearly a top 5 GM in the NBA during his 7 year stint with the Raptors. I had Myers ahead of him in case you didn't notice.

So yes, you are pathetic. You sound like an 8 year old kid who only started watching basketball this year.

I've asked you multiple times. Please justify and compare the GMs you listed above Masai and explain to me in detail why they are better GMs. Apart from Myers and Buford, not one GM you listed has actually accomplished more than Masai since 2014.


So the guy who is calling me pathetic over a subjective list thinks I'm a little kid? I think the internet is a little too high pressure for you. Maybe find a new hobby.


Again, you can't answer my question.

Please compare and justify the GMs you listed above Masai and explain to me what they have accomplished over the past 7 seasons that exceeds Masai's accomplishments. From what I told you, I would agree that Myers and Buford are the only GMs that can rival Masai's accomplishments since 2014. But please explain to me the other 6 GMs you had in front of Masai.

It's a very simple question, but strangely you can't answer it.


I've done it multiple times in this thread and in other threads. You don't actually read the content of my posts and that's on you. You are such an angry person you just see red and spout some vitriol.
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#79 » by Danny1616 » Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:15 pm

Pooh_Jeter wrote:
Danny1616 wrote:
Pooh_Jeter wrote:
So the guy who is calling me pathetic over a subjective list thinks I'm a little kid? I think the internet is a little too high pressure for you. Maybe find a new hobby.


Again, you can't answer my question.

Please compare and justify the GMs you listed above Masai and explain to me what they have accomplished over the past 7 seasons that exceeds Masai's accomplishments. From what I told you, I would agree that Myers and Buford are the only GMs that can rival Masai's accomplishments since 2014. But please explain to me the other 6 GMs you had in front of Masai.

It's a very simple question, but strangely you can't answer it.


I've done it multiple times in this thread and in other threads. You don't actually read the content of my posts and that's on you. You are such an angry person you just see red and spout some vitriol.


You havn't done it once.

I've refuted everything you've said.

You literally tried telling me that Portland had better management than the Raptors despite being significantly less successful compared to the Raptors over the last 7 seasons. Further, you tried arguing that Portland had a better future despite having the exact same core with no cap flexibility and no young assets.

I agreed that the Warriors have arguably the best management in the league, but I never argued that Masai was better than Myers.

You literally lost the argument multiple times.

Sad.
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Re: Raptors really picked Bruno and Daniels over Jokic. 

Post#80 » by MFS » Tue Jun 8, 2021 11:41 pm

Never forget!

You win some you lose some
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