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Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat

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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#181 » by Wo1verine » Wed Sep 16, 2020 3:07 pm

The source is crap but I’m sure it was part of it.
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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#182 » by OakleyDokely » Wed Sep 16, 2020 3:09 pm

Offseason trade idea for clippers:

Lowry, VV, Norm, Ibaka, Gasol, Siakam for PG, Shamet, Harrell, Lou, Zubac, Beverely.

Kawhi a lock for another title!
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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#183 » by Rust_Cohle » Wed Sep 16, 2020 3:23 pm

Danny1616 wrote:For all the criticism Siakim got for his offensive performance, George is a 9 year veteran who has had some big playoff moments and played alongside an MVP caliber player in Kawhi as the 2nd option, and still stank it up.


His highs in these playoffs were still
Significantly better than siakim’s though. Not even close
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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#184 » by whoknows » Wed Sep 16, 2020 3:24 pm

missionman wrote:
whoknows wrote:He remains the best Raptor leader in our franchise history and he deserves respect, since without him we'd had no chance to win a championship. He wanted to go back home to LA, cannot blame him.

I wish him well!

The team I cheer for now to win it all, it is Denver!


Fans respect his talent and his desire to go home.

But your post still gives him too much credit - something I am completely weary of in regards to kawhi.

Kyle Lowry was the best leader of this franchise.
Kawhi was the most individually dominant player the raptors have ever had. But he is a selfish guy. I can't see it any other way. All of kawhi's post game interviews with the raptors - he was always patting himself on the back because of all of his hard work.

Listen to Lowry on his interviews: always commending his teammates. He has sacrificed for the better or his team, and has come up big when the team needed him. Lowry is the bettwr teammate and leader and its not even close.

So I am not shooting down your post - but really it's you who should really be showing Lowry respect.


let's be realistic, Lowry is a good guy and player, but a proven leader he is not (more like a fair weather leader).
He is a bit better than DD, Bosch, VC, etc. but a proven leader must step up so his team wins in playoffs late stages.

Only other proven leader in Raps history we had was Oak, hence the best other time in Raptors winning history when he pushed VC to be the best he ever was.

A true real leader is the one that steps up under pressure at all times, he makes everybody better around him and most important he is a proven winner. Teammates follow and feed from his attitude towards hardship, it is not the words that make a leader, it is his actions and proven results.

As proven again these playoffs, the regular season (fair weather) means nothing when it comes to winning in NBA.
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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#185 » by Fairview4Life » Wed Sep 16, 2020 3:27 pm

Imagine saying Kyle Lowry isn't a leader lol.
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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#186 » by Mr Funk » Wed Sep 16, 2020 4:12 pm

Rust_Cohle wrote:Spot on, without him, raps are perennial second round exit. Kawhi has won titles before the Raps and changed the franchise forever bringing that title to Toronto as most of the supporting cast didn’t show up until the ecf. He also hit the most legendary shot in raptors history.


Not only did the DeRozan-led Raptors take Cleveland to six games in the 2016 Eastern Conference Finals, but Kawhi was hobbling on one leg during last year's Eastern Conference Finals against Milwaukee, a series in which the team really stepped up, in particular Norm and Fred.

Stop trolling.
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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#187 » by wtcantfw » Wed Sep 16, 2020 4:22 pm

whoknows wrote:
missionman wrote:
whoknows wrote:He remains the best Raptor leader in our franchise history and he deserves respect, since without him we'd had no chance to win a championship. He wanted to go back home to LA, cannot blame him.

I wish him well!

The team I cheer for now to win it all, it is Denver!


Fans respect his talent and his desire to go home.

But your post still gives him too much credit - something I am completely weary of in regards to kawhi.

Kyle Lowry was the best leader of this franchise.
Kawhi was the most individually dominant player the raptors have ever had. But he is a selfish guy. I can't see it any other way. All of kawhi's post game interviews with the raptors - he was always patting himself on the back because of all of his hard work.

Listen to Lowry on his interviews: always commending his teammates. He has sacrificed for the better or his team, and has come up big when the team needed him. Lowry is the bettwr teammate and leader and its not even close.

So I am not shooting down your post - but really it's you who should really be showing Lowry respect.


let's be realistic, Lowry is a good guy and player, but a proven leader he is not (more like a fair weather leader).
He is a bit better than DD, Bosch, VC, etc. but a proven leader must step up so his team wins in playoffs late stages.

Only other proven leader in Raps history we had was Oak, hence the best other time in Raptors winning history when he pushed VC to be the best he ever was.

A true real leader is the one that steps up under pressure at all times, he makes everybody better around him and most important he is a proven winner. Teammates follow and feed from his attitude towards hardship, it is not the words that make a leader, it is his actions and proven results.

As proven again these playoffs, the regular season (fair weather) means nothing when it comes to winning in NBA.

The bolded part is 100% Lowry. I don't know what you're smoking. He may not be a closer, but he is absolutely a proven leader.
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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#188 » by Rust_Cohle » Wed Sep 16, 2020 4:23 pm

Mr Funk wrote:
Rust_Cohle wrote:Spot on, without him, raps are perennial second round exit. Kawhi has won titles before the Raps and changed the franchise forever bringing that title to Toronto as most of the supporting cast didn’t show up until the ecf. He also hit the most legendary shot in raptors history.


Not only did the DeRozan-led Raptors take Cleveland to six games in the 2016 Eastern Conference Finals, but Kawhi was hobbling on one leg during last year's Eastern Conference Finals against Milwaukee, a series in which the team really stepped up, in particular Norm and Fred.

Stop trolling.


Not trolling at all, facts are facts. Kawhi carried that team to the ECF when the support cast was woeful. DeRozan was getting benched in fourth quarters of playoff games a season later. Kawhi changed the franchise forever. This year Siakim was having a historically all time 3 point percentage low in the Celtics series. Barely anyone stepped up for Toronto this year come playoff time. Nearly everyone struggled in game 7.
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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#189 » by dagger » Wed Sep 16, 2020 4:24 pm

Kawhi is a great player but a bad judge of talent and character. In essence, you love him as a player but never let him be general manager. His insistence on getting Paul George failed to recognize George now is an unreliable star, having failed to carry good Indiana and OKC teams very far, and that the teams that have traded him did well - whether it was Indiana getting Oladipo and Sabonis for him, or OKC getting a king's ransom for him. He also failed to appreciate the talent he had around him in Toronto, and especially the strength of character of many of his teammates like Kyle, Serge, Fred, etc etc He may have liked them as people, but as a fairly closed off personality himself, he may not have seen their strength. I mean, who chooses the talented but mercurial and reckless Pat Beverly over the focussed, intense, reliable Kyle and Fred?

Another thing GM Kawhi failed to appreciate is the defence wins championships and the reason the Raps won the title was defence, of which he was certainly part, but which failed him utterly in LA. I mean, Lou Williams is nice at all as a scoring regular season piece, but depending on his D - and that of the other Clipper rotation guys - was a major downgrade from what he had in Toronto in the playoffs. And its the fourth quarter which consistently told the tale against Denver, and it's precisely when the Raptors D tightened to win close games in last year's playoffs.

GM Kawhi also was a terrible judge of young talent, because he should have seen what Masai, Bobby and Nick saw in OG. An OG/Kawhi pair on the wing would have been defensive dynamite- then add in Pascal, Kyle/Fred and a good defensive team might have been one of the GOAT.

In the end GM Kawhi has an aging roster in LAC that might lose a key piece or two in free agency - Harrel is going to get paid - and LAC has neither cap space nor picks to use to bolster the roster. And frankly, Doc Rivers is a nice players' coach but he's a poor tactician in my book compared to Nick.

All in all, Kawhi is still one of the best players in the league, but no team should ever be foolish enough to let him be its general manager.
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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#190 » by Tha Cynic » Wed Sep 16, 2020 4:30 pm

That's why Kawhi is a player and Masai is the GM. He clearly has no clue how chemistry and team defense works. This team would have been legit favourites to repeat. The East would have been a cakewalk.
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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#191 » by Birth of the Cool » Wed Sep 16, 2020 4:37 pm

whoknows wrote:
missionman wrote:
whoknows wrote:He remains the best Raptor leader in our franchise history and he deserves respect, since without him we'd had no chance to win a championship. He wanted to go back home to LA, cannot blame him.

I wish him well!

The team I cheer for now to win it all, it is Denver!


Fans respect his talent and his desire to go home.

But your post still gives him too much credit - something I am completely weary of in regards to kawhi.

Kyle Lowry was the best leader of this franchise.
Kawhi was the most individually dominant player the raptors have ever had. But he is a selfish guy. I can't see it any other way. All of kawhi's post game interviews with the raptors - he was always patting himself on the back because of all of his hard work.

Listen to Lowry on his interviews: always commending his teammates. He has sacrificed for the better or his team, and has come up big when the team needed him. Lowry is the bettwr teammate and leader and its not even close.

So I am not shooting down your post - but really it's you who should really be showing Lowry respect.


let's be realistic, Lowry is a good guy and player, but a proven leader he is not (more like a fair weather leader).
He is a bit better than DD, Bosch, VC, etc. but a proven leader must step up so his team wins in playoffs late stages.

Only other proven leader in Raps history we had was Oak, hence the best other time in Raptors winning history when he pushed VC to be the best he ever was.

A true real leader is the one that steps up under pressure at all times, he makes everybody better around him and most important he is a proven winner. Teammates follow and feed from his attitude towards hardship, it is not the words that make a leader, it is his actions and proven results.

As proven again these playoffs, the regular season (fair weather) means nothing when it comes to winning in NBA.


LOL at Kawhi being the best leader in Raptors history. Best player sure.
Also you say a proven leader must step up so his team wins in playoffs late stages then next sentence mention Oak as the only other proven leader...Oak was a mediocre player with the Raptors and his leadership is overstated. Antonio Davis, Dee Brown, Doug Christie were all better leaders. T-Mac specifically mentions Christie as mentoring him and Oakley bullying him. Oak let management issues with his contract bother him, he let personal bets owed to him effect him.

I'm sure just like most fans, Kawhi was probably just as surprised to win it all with the Raps lol and didn't believe the cards would fall in Raps favour again this year and wanted to be home with Family and that's fine but a great leader he's not. On Court leader yes, but a true leader is on court, between the lines, and outside the lines, in the locker room, etc and that's what Lowry brought to the table and maybe Kawhi didn't understand or appreciate what that meant for him.
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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#192 » by True North » Wed Sep 16, 2020 5:11 pm

:D :D Here’s picture of Kawhi this morning :D :D

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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#193 » by Danny1616 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 5:37 pm

dagger wrote:Kawhi is a great player but a bad judge of talent and character. In essence, you love him as a player but never let him be general manager. His insistence on getting Paul George failed to recognize George now is an unreliable star, having failed to carry good Indiana and OKC teams very far, and that the teams that have traded him did well - whether it was Indiana getting Oladipo and Sabonis for him, or OKC getting a king's ransom for him. He also failed to appreciate the talent he had around him in Toronto, and especially the strength of character of many of his teammates like Kyle, Serge, Fred, etc etc He may have liked them as people, but as a fairly closed off personality himself, he may not have seen their strength. I mean, who chooses the talented but mercurial and reckless Pat Beverly over the focussed, intense, reliable Kyle and Fred?

Another thing GM Kawhi failed to appreciate is the defence wins championships and the reason the Raps won the title was defence, of which he was certainly part, but which failed him utterly in LA. I mean, Lou Williams is nice at all as a scoring regular season piece, but depending on his D - and that of the other Clipper rotation guys - was a major downgrade from what he had in Toronto in the playoffs. And its the fourth quarter which consistently told the tale against Denver, and it's precisely when the Raptors D tightened to win close games in last year's playoffs.

GM Kawhi also was a terrible judge of young talent, because he should have seen what Masai, Bobby and Nick saw in OG. An OG/Kawhi pair on the wing would have been defensive dynamite- then add in Pascal, Kyle/Fred and a good defensive team might have been one of the GOAT.

In the end GM Kawhi has an aging roster in LAC that might lose a key piece or two in free agency - Harrel is going to get paid - and LAC has neither cap space nor picks to use to bolster the roster. And frankly, Doc Rivers is a nice players' coach but he's a poor tactician in my book compared to Nick.

All in all, Kawhi is still one of the best players in the league, but no team should ever be foolish enough to let him be its general manager.


Exactly this.
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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#194 » by Danny1616 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 5:39 pm

Tha Cynic wrote:That's why Kawhi is a player and Masai is the GM. He clearly has no clue how chemistry and team defense works. This team would have been legit favourites to repeat. The East would have been a cakewalk.


He's been spoiled by playing for two elite organizations that already had a great veteran core and winning culture in the Spurs and Raptors.

This is the first time he's gone to a team that doesn't have that winning culture/player development/longevity.
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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#195 » by ImaBeatDatAzz » Wed Sep 16, 2020 5:54 pm

OAKLEY_2 wrote:
ImaBeatDatAzz wrote:If clippers were gonna win the chip, it would’ve been this year only. Lmao they blew it hard. Next season there’s gonna be Nets, Lakers, an improved and experienced Celtics & heat, bucks, etc.


And RAPZ.

meeeeeeeh, we are kinda screwed now tbh. if pascal does not play like how he did during september-december of 2019, we are probably going to be 4th or 5th in the conference. we are treadmilling right now. if there are no substantial trades this off-season and our team stays put with the exception of gasol (he is 100% gone, masai has seen enough), i dont see us being in the top 3, the top 3 is easily nets, bucks, celtics. then its a battle between us, heat, sixers, and indiana. my guess would be 1. Nets, 2. Bucks, 3. Celtics, 4. Raps, 5. Heat, 6. Sixers, 7. Indiana, 8. Orlando. According to this assumption, we would face heat in round 1 which will be tough to win, then if we get past them we will have to go through durant and irving. ye i dont see it happening. not with this roster:

Lowry/davis/fvv
fvv/norm/thomas
OG/norm
Siakam/RHJ
Ibaka/Boucher
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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#196 » by Kingsway_fan » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:01 pm

If Kawhi bolts, those years of first round picks could rival the Boston steal of nets.....wow!!!
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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#197 » by Mr Funk » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:09 pm

Rust_Cohle wrote:Not trolling at all, facts are facts. Kawhi carried that team to the ECF when the support cast was woeful. DeRozan was getting benched in fourth quarters of playoff games a season later. Kawhi changed the franchise forever. This year Siakim was having a historically all time 3 point percentage low in the Celtics series. Barely anyone stepped up for Toronto this year come playoff time. Nearly everyone struggled in game 7.


It doesn't matter how many times you regurgitate your b.s. it's still b.s.

Obnoxious trolling.
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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#198 » by KrazyP » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:17 pm

Rust_Cohle wrote:Bizarre how people are laughing at Kawhi when Siakim was terrible and cost the raptors the series far worse than Kawhi did the clippers in theirs


Rust_Cohle wrote:Not trolling at all, facts are facts. Kawhi carried that team to the ECF when the support cast was woeful. DeRozan was getting benched in fourth quarters of playoff games a season later. Kawhi changed the franchise forever. This year Siakim was having a historically all time 3 point percentage low in the Celtics series. Barely anyone stepped up for Toronto this year come playoff time. Nearly everyone struggled in game 7.


SIakam played like crap and the Raps still took a strong Celtics team with 3 all-star level talents (Kemba,Tatum,Brown) to the last minute of game 7. This after losing Kawhi for NOTHING. What does that tell you?
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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#199 » by JN » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:17 pm

Kawhi beleived he was a better GM than Masai/Bobby Webster and whatever tamperers the Clippers had. He forced the teams into making a rushed trade for George with no leverage at all. Imagine how much cheaper either the Raptors or Clippers could have acquired another star if he just had trust that professionals might be better at their job than he is.

The Clips could have traded for George in August and September for much less, then had the flexibility still to re-tool this year. But not anymore since the cupboard is bare.
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Re: Kawhi didn't believe Toronto would repeat 

Post#200 » by wow09 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:20 pm

dagger wrote:Kawhi is a great player but a bad judge of talent and character. In essence, you love him as a player but never let him be general manager. His insistence on getting Paul George failed to recognize George now is an unreliable star, having failed to carry good Indiana and OKC teams very far, and that the teams that have traded him did well - whether it was Indiana getting Oladipo and Sabonis for him, or OKC getting a king's ransom for him. He also failed to appreciate the talent he had around him in Toronto, and especially the strength of character of many of his teammates like Kyle, Serge, Fred, etc etc He may have liked them as people, but as a fairly closed off personality himself, he may not have seen their strength. I mean, who chooses the talented but mercurial and reckless Pat Beverly over the focussed, intense, reliable Kyle and Fred?

Another thing GM Kawhi failed to appreciate is the defence wins championships and the reason the Raps won the title was defence, of which he was certainly part, but which failed him utterly in LA. I mean, Lou Williams is nice at all as a scoring regular season piece, but depending on his D - and that of the other Clipper rotation guys - was a major downgrade from what he had in Toronto in the playoffs. And its the fourth quarter which consistently told the tale against Denver, and it's precisely when the Raptors D tightened to win close games in last year's playoffs.

GM Kawhi also was a terrible judge of young talent, because he should have seen what Masai, Bobby and Nick saw in OG. An OG/Kawhi pair on the wing would have been defensive dynamite- then add in Pascal, Kyle/Fred and a good defensive team might have been one of the GOAT.

In the end GM Kawhi has an aging roster in LAC that might lose a key piece or two in free agency - Harrel is going to get paid - and LAC has neither cap space nor picks to use to bolster the roster. And frankly, Doc Rivers is a nice players' coach but he's a poor tactician in my book compared to Nick.

All in all, Kawhi is still one of the best players in the league, but no team should ever be foolish enough to let him be its general manager.


You nailed it!

The hilarious thing about the Clippers defense is the media was crowning them the best defensive team of all time before the season started when Lou Williams is an integral part of their rotation.

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