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If you're a Siakam Fan then post here!

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Steelo Green
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#61 » by Steelo Green » Thu Dec 17, 2020 7:53 pm

Danny1616 wrote:
Steelo Green wrote:
Danny1616 wrote:
Don't give them the stats man.

These same guys were praying a few years ago that we would tank for Wiggins and were still hoping we would traded for Wiggins 2-3 years ago.

Conjecture is always fun.

Also it doesn’t matter where you were picked but what you were paid. Kawhi got picked 15th, should we expect him to not be a superstar because of that. How about Manu? Tony Parker? Gilbert Arenas? Giannis?

Your contract dictates what your role is, not where you’re drafted. He was great value but now he’s paid as one of the leagues best.

People literally just make things up and high five one another about it because of what exactly?


Okay, so let's go to your argument.

Pascal's contract kicks in this year, so he has 4 years to prove himself. You don't judge a contract on a few months or 1 year, you judge it on the entire contract.

Right now let's look at the players with the biggest contracts and whether they deserve it over Pascal.

Curry - Injured for an entire year, zero contribution. We have to see whether he earns 45m+ a year.

Westbrook - Overpaid, underperformed multiple times in the playoffs.

Chris Paul - Good leader, not worth 45m+ a year.

John Wall - Hurt for most of his contract, has done nothing noteworthy in the playoffs. Makes 45m+

James Harden - Deserved his contract during regular season but underperformed in the playoffs. Makes 45m+

Lebron James - Has lived up to his contract so far.

Durant - Have to wait and see...injured his entire first year so zero production.

Griffin - Past his prime, makes 38m+ plus a year. Injury prone, could not lead his team to the playoffs.

George - Underperformed in the playoffs multiple seasons now and injury prone.

Mike Conley - Underperformed in the playoffs before, didn't have a great year last season.

Kemba Walker - Decent year last season, knee issues, underperformed in the playoffs.

Tobias Harris - Way overpaid.

Joel Embiid - Injury prone, underperformed in the playoffs multiple times.

Kevin Love - Underperformed, stat padder on terrible team.

Andrew Wiggins - Sucks.


All those players make more than Pascal this season. Except for Lebron, Pascal has done more than every other player on that list last year.

Ridiculous argument by you, but that's expected as usual.

lol

Well no, you’re judged by the contract you signed. We signed him to be a max player. His contract kicking in is irrelevant. Or was this year we judge him not for the contract he signed.

I mean had he not signed it then sure - but he signed a max level deal so we should expect max level production.

Had he maintained the play first half I would be content, however he deteriorated more and more as the year went on, and had an all time (yes all time) worst performance in playoff history with a top 5 lowest TS in the history of the playoffs for a player of his usage. Or sorry - you guys don’t deal in actual numbers - just the surface level jargon.

I mean Demar is a 4 time all star right - we should all say what a fantastic resume and player you want to build around? No see - I look at playoff performances and an all time horrendous one - numbers wise that is, well that sticks out to me. But hey ridiculous argument that is backed by statistical evidence right :wink:

Curry - Really? Are you really going to discuss a player who has won three titles and two MVPs? Last year he wasn’t even injured. He broke his hand and took it off to tank for his team after 4 straight finals. I shouldn’t even respond to the rest of this - this in and of itself is such a ludicrous take but sure let’s humour..

Westbrook - Yeah, bad deal there too. Still a former MVP but yeah that money for him. You’re trying to argue other bad contracts to justify Pascals bad one lol

Chris Paul - I would take CP at that money still over Pascal. Pascal being on a team that won a title doesn’t mean he’s somehow better or more valuable than a player like Paul. Are you saying OKC makes the playoffs last year with Pascal? This notion of Pascal = second option needs to die as well. Scoring and taking the second amount of shots is not a second option - Kyle scored less, hell Fred did too but were more important than Pascal during the run and finals. Pascals the same guy who was also not found until the finals. Or shall I bring up the laughable numbers against Philly and Milwaukee?

Kyle was the second leading scorer that series against Milwaukee so, so much for consistent second option, and Pascal had a 468 TS which is almost ten points below league average (oddly enough something he did this year against Boston too).

Pascal had again below average TS against Philly with his 19PPG where everyone was basically terrible and Kawhi scored the third most points in a series all time to carry us to the W (and then we aren’t talking about any Fred heroics or Pascal good finals).

Pascals playoffs are more reminiscing of Demar offensively. He can play D, which is his saving grace, but this Pascal can be consistently relied on for O is not a good take.

John Wall - everyone said it was a terrible contract. So what we are in agreement? The Wizards handed out a terrible contract injury or not?

Durant - Agreed with wait and see but he is a two time finals MVP and MVP so he does have something to go by

Griffin - terrible contract then. Not sure why you’re reinforcing my point with showing other bad contracts handed out. And Blake was a multiple all star and all nba at that point so he did have more pedigree than Pascal.

You keep listing all these players who were handed all these bad contracts and then are saying what they shouldn’t have gotten it compared to Pascal? Yeah. They shouldn’t have and neither should have Pascal. The irony is hilarious.

“Hey here’s these also bad contracts that didn’t work out, which actually reinforces your point about Pascal, when actually these guys had more pedigree than Pascal if you look at it...”

You posted Wiggins like I am saying they gave a good contract. No, that was bad, probably worse than Pascal, but a 7/10 versus a 10/10 on the bad scale is just different degrees of bad.

You proved my point with your post and then had the hubris to say it was a ridiculous argument by me as expected. Touché.
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#62 » by bluerap23 » Thu Dec 17, 2020 7:55 pm

Steelo Green wrote:
Danny1616 wrote:
OakleyDokely wrote:MIP.
All-NBA 2nd team.
2nd most win shares from his draft class.
2nd highest usage on a championship team.

...by the age of 26, from the 27th pick in the draft.


Don't give them the stats man.

These same guys were praying a few years ago that we would tank for Wiggins and were still hoping we would traded for Wiggins 2-3 years ago.

Conjecture is always fun.

Also it doesn’t matter where you were picked but what you were paid. Kawhi got picked 15th, should we expect him to not be a superstar because of that. How about Manu? Tony Parker? Gilbert Arenas? Giannis?

Your contract dictates what your role is, not where you’re drafted. He was great value but now he’s paid as one of the leagues best.

People literally just make things up and high five one another about it because of what exactly?


This is a thread for Siakam fans. Take your negativity to another thread.
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#63 » by mihaic » Thu Dec 17, 2020 7:58 pm

I am a siakam fan and so I am posting here.

My 2cents:
- Siakam exceeded my expectation throughout the years
- as all-star level I would take him over some of the other all-stars (Demar or Drummond types) because he plays stellar defense when needed. We are not in the Boston games without him and OG.
- I think retaining him still puts us in the position to get a Kawhi or a Harden and contend for the title. It worked once. It can work again if Pascal is not doubled. (the double team would be on the other guy). Pascal is quick enough to not let the double team recover.
- I don't think Pascal is a TOP 10 overall but you win titles with lockdown defense. Defense will not give you MVP or top 10 as it is not measurable
- it is key for pascal to improve his 3-pt shooting.
- We need another (better) scoring threat near Pascal

[Off topic - I am more worried about whether FVV can improve to get close to Lowry level. I want to see how Fred plays combined with Flynn before I make my mind up. I am sure we will see it throughout the season]
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#64 » by Steelo Green » Thu Dec 17, 2020 7:59 pm

Lukeem wrote:
Steelo Green wrote:
Danny1616 wrote:
Don't give them the stats man.

These same guys were praying a few years ago that we would tank for Wiggins and were still hoping we would traded for Wiggins 2-3 years ago.

Conjecture is always fun.

Also it doesn’t matter where you were picked but what you were paid. Kawhi got picked 15th, should we expect him to not be a superstar because of that. How about Manu? Tony Parker? Gilbert Arenas? Giannis?

Your contract dictates what your role is, not where you’re drafted. He was great value but now he’s paid as one of the leagues best.

People literally just make things up and high five one another about it because of what exactly?


21 st highest paid player in the nba this year and by the last year of his contract will be much lower

was (according to voting from top analysts) last year 10th best player, 2 of which were younger than him 1 same age 6 older

hes improved more than anyone in last 3 years, and you're assuming he has platueaed, which if it is the case he'd still be being paid fair value.

Which analysts had Pascal top 10 :lol:

You guys are ridiculous.


Guys, Kyle is the team and when he’s gone just wait and see the fallout.

You guys high five nonsense and think and1s from other homer’s means you’re right. Pascal wasn’t a top 10 guy. His all-NBA doesn’t mean a thing. Demar was all NBA, was he a top 15 player? When the playoffs came did Pascal look like a top 20 player? Kyle was third team all nba to Pascals all second, does that make Pascal better?

The stats and the eye test back up that Pascal is a limited player who had a high and now that he’s been figured out looks like a top 30 guy at best.
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#65 » by Danny1616 » Thu Dec 17, 2020 8:01 pm

Steelo Green wrote:
Danny1616 wrote:
Steelo Green wrote:Conjecture is always fun.

Also it doesn’t matter where you were picked but what you were paid. Kawhi got picked 15th, should we expect him to not be a superstar because of that. How about Manu? Tony Parker? Gilbert Arenas? Giannis?

Your contract dictates what your role is, not where you’re drafted. He was great value but now he’s paid as one of the leagues best.

People literally just make things up and high five one another about it because of what exactly?


Okay, so let's go to your argument.

Pascal's contract kicks in this year, so he has 4 years to prove himself. You don't judge a contract on a few months or 1 year, you judge it on the entire contract.

Right now let's look at the players with the biggest contracts and whether they deserve it over Pascal.

Curry - Injured for an entire year, zero contribution. We have to see whether he earns 45m+ a year.

Westbrook - Overpaid, underperformed multiple times in the playoffs.

Chris Paul - Good leader, not worth 45m+ a year.

John Wall - Hurt for most of his contract, has done nothing noteworthy in the playoffs. Makes 45m+

James Harden - Deserved his contract during regular season but underperformed in the playoffs. Makes 45m+

Lebron James - Has lived up to his contract so far.

Durant - Have to wait and see...injured his entire first year so zero production.

Griffin - Past his prime, makes 38m+ plus a year. Injury prone, could not lead his team to the playoffs.

George - Underperformed in the playoffs multiple seasons now and injury prone.

Mike Conley - Underperformed in the playoffs before, didn't have a great year last season.

Kemba Walker - Decent year last season, knee issues, underperformed in the playoffs.

Tobias Harris - Way overpaid.

Joel Embiid - Injury prone, underperformed in the playoffs multiple times.

Kevin Love - Underperformed, stat padder on terrible team.

Andrew Wiggins - Sucks.


All those players make more than Pascal this season. Except for Lebron, Pascal has done more than every other player on that list last year.

Ridiculous argument by you, but that's expected as usual.

lol

Well no, you’re judged by the contract you signed. We signed him to be a max player. His contract kicking in is irrelevant. Or was this year we judge him not for the contract he signed.

I mean had he not signed it then sure - but he signed a max level deal so we should expect max level production.

Had he maintained the play first half I would be content, however he deteriorated more and more as the year went on, and had an all time (yes all time) worst performance in playoff history with a top 5 lowest TS in the history of the playoffs for a player of his usage. Or sorry - you guys don’t deal in actual numbers - just the surface level jargon.

I mean Demar is a 4 time all star right - we should all say what a fantastic resume and player you want to build around? No see - I look at playoff performances and an all time horrendous one - numbers wise that is, well that sticks out to me. But hey ridiculous argument that is backed by statistical evidence right :wink:

Curry - Really? Are you really going to discuss a player who has won three titles and two MVPs? Last year he wasn’t even injured. He broke his hand and took it off to tank for his team after 4 straight finals. I shouldn’t even respond to the rest of this - this in and of itself is such a ludicrous take but sure let’s humour..

Westbrook - Yeah, bad deal there too. Still a former MVP but yeah that money for him. You’re trying to argue other bad contracts to justify Pascals bad one lol

Chris Paul - I would take CP at that money still over Pascal. Pascal being on a team that won a title doesn’t mean he’s somehow better or more valuable than a player like Paul. Are you saying OKC makes the playoffs last year with Pascal? This notion of Pascal = second option needs to die as well. Scoring and taking the second amount of shots is not a second option - Kyle scored less, hell Fred did too but were more important than Pascal during the run and finals. Pascals the same guy who was also not found until the finals. Or shall I bring up the laughable numbers against Philly and Milwaukee?

Kyle was the second leading scorer that series against Milwaukee so, so much for consistent second option, and Pascal had a 468 TS which is almost ten points below league average (oddly enough something he did this year against Boston too).

Pascal had again below average TS against Philly with his 19PPG where everyone was basically terrible and Kawhi scored the third most points in a series all time to carry us to the W (and then we aren’t talking about any Fred heroics or Pascal good finals).

Pascals playoffs are more reminiscing of Demar offensively. He can play D, which is his saving grace, but this Pascal can be consistently relied on for O is not a good take.

John Wall - everyone said it was a terrible contract. So what we are in agreement? The Wizards handed out a terrible contract injury or not?

Durant - Agreed with wait and see but he is a two time finals MVP and MVP so he does have something to go by

Griffin - terrible contract then. Not sure why you’re reinforcing my point with showing other bad contracts handed out. And Blake was a multiple all star and all nba at that point so he did have more pedigree than Pascal.

You keep listing all these players who were handed all these bad contracts and then are saying what they shouldn’t have gotten it compared to Pascal? Yeah. They shouldn’t have and neither should have Pascal. The irony is hilarious.

“Hey here’s these also bad contracts that didn’t work out, which actually reinforces your point about Pascal, when actually these guys had more pedigree than Pascal if you look at it...”

You posted Wiggins like I am saying they gave a good contract. No, that was bad, probably worse than Pascal, but a 7/10 versus a 10/10 on the bad scale is just different degrees of bad.

You proved my point with your post and then had the hubris to say it was a ridiculous argument by me as expected. Touché.


So your best arguments are that some players on that list performed well before they signed their current contract? Also majority of those players are over 30 when Pascal is only 26 with room to grow.

Pascal already showed that he could be a 2nd option and 2nd highest usage player on a championship level team. He's played incredible at the highest level on the biggest stage.

He's only had two playoff appearances where he's been a starter.

Maybe wait for a bigger sample size. Most people wouldn't judge a player's entire career over their 1st 4 years in the league when they weren't even expected to be a star, especially when they already showed up in the playoffs and contributed to a championship.

If Pascal continues to disappoint for another 2-3 years then you have will have a better argument, until then I stand by the conclusion that your argument is flat out ridiculous.

Jesus **** christ dude.
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#66 » by howlin mad axer » Thu Dec 17, 2020 8:05 pm

I like Siakam but last season's Playoff Pascal was depressing.
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#67 » by Johnny Bball » Thu Dec 17, 2020 8:09 pm

Comparing Siakam and Derozan to who... management's fault? how obtuse is it to think a team can't have a number one option because they don't have a star? Who was filling the gap back then? Patterson? Carroll? Who else would it be now? Powell... of course that's what he thinks, but that's a joke. It's like if you don't have a star then the best option is instantly a failure because he's not a superstar... and has to be mocked at all times ...wtf kind of logic is that.

Some people just act like spoiled children here.


Badonkadonk wrote:Mans puts his heart and soul into the team and his craft and gets crucified for not having an elite offensive game.

Yes, I'm a fan, but I'm also a fan that understands his strengths and weaknesses. In the current CBA, the former comfortably make him a max player, but for some reason there's a contingent of fans that also expect him to bring a KD-like fluidity to his offensive game. That'll never happen, but that doesn't make him not valuable or unlikeable.

How do you NOT like a guy like Siakam, given his story and attitude?


This.
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#68 » by Steelo Green » Thu Dec 17, 2020 8:19 pm

Danny1616 wrote:
Steelo Green wrote:
Danny1616 wrote:
Okay, so let's go to your argument.

Pascal's contract kicks in this year, so he has 4 years to prove himself. You don't judge a contract on a few months or 1 year, you judge it on the entire contract.

Right now let's look at the players with the biggest contracts and whether they deserve it over Pascal.

Curry - Injured for an entire year, zero contribution. We have to see whether he earns 45m+ a year.

Westbrook - Overpaid, underperformed multiple times in the playoffs.

Chris Paul - Good leader, not worth 45m+ a year.

John Wall - Hurt for most of his contract, has done nothing noteworthy in the playoffs. Makes 45m+

James Harden - Deserved his contract during regular season but underperformed in the playoffs. Makes 45m+

Lebron James - Has lived up to his contract so far.

Durant - Have to wait and see...injured his entire first year so zero production.

Griffin - Past his prime, makes 38m+ plus a year. Injury prone, could not lead his team to the playoffs.

George - Underperformed in the playoffs multiple seasons now and injury prone.

Mike Conley - Underperformed in the playoffs before, didn't have a great year last season.

Kemba Walker - Decent year last season, knee issues, underperformed in the playoffs.

Tobias Harris - Way overpaid.

Joel Embiid - Injury prone, underperformed in the playoffs multiple times.

Kevin Love - Underperformed, stat padder on terrible team.

Andrew Wiggins - Sucks.


All those players make more than Pascal this season. Except for Lebron, Pascal has done more than every other player on that list last year.

Ridiculous argument by you, but that's expected as usual.

lol

Well no, you’re judged by the contract you signed. We signed him to be a max player. His contract kicking in is irrelevant. Or was this year we judge him not for the contract he signed.

I mean had he not signed it then sure - but he signed a max level deal so we should expect max level production.

Had he maintained the play first half I would be content, however he deteriorated more and more as the year went on, and had an all time (yes all time) worst performance in playoff history with a top 5 lowest TS in the history of the playoffs for a player of his usage. Or sorry - you guys don’t deal in actual numbers - just the surface level jargon.

I mean Demar is a 4 time all star right - we should all say what a fantastic resume and player you want to build around? No see - I look at playoff performances and an all time horrendous one - numbers wise that is, well that sticks out to me. But hey ridiculous argument that is backed by statistical evidence right :wink:

Curry - Really? Are you really going to discuss a player who has won three titles and two MVPs? Last year he wasn’t even injured. He broke his hand and took it off to tank for his team after 4 straight finals. I shouldn’t even respond to the rest of this - this in and of itself is such a ludicrous take but sure let’s humour..

Westbrook - Yeah, bad deal there too. Still a former MVP but yeah that money for him. You’re trying to argue other bad contracts to justify Pascals bad one lol

Chris Paul - I would take CP at that money still over Pascal. Pascal being on a team that won a title doesn’t mean he’s somehow better or more valuable than a player like Paul. Are you saying OKC makes the playoffs last year with Pascal? This notion of Pascal = second option needs to die as well. Scoring and taking the second amount of shots is not a second option - Kyle scored less, hell Fred did too but were more important than Pascal during the run and finals. Pascals the same guy who was also not found until the finals. Or shall I bring up the laughable numbers against Philly and Milwaukee?

Kyle was the second leading scorer that series against Milwaukee so, so much for consistent second option, and Pascal had a 468 TS which is almost ten points below league average (oddly enough something he did this year against Boston too).

Pascal had again below average TS against Philly with his 19PPG where everyone was basically terrible and Kawhi scored the third most points in a series all time to carry us to the W (and then we aren’t talking about any Fred heroics or Pascal good finals).

Pascals playoffs are more reminiscing of Demar offensively. He can play D, which is his saving grace, but this Pascal can be consistently relied on for O is not a good take.

John Wall - everyone said it was a terrible contract. So what we are in agreement? The Wizards handed out a terrible contract injury or not?

Durant - Agreed with wait and see but he is a two time finals MVP and MVP so he does have something to go by

Griffin - terrible contract then. Not sure why you’re reinforcing my point with showing other bad contracts handed out. And Blake was a multiple all star and all nba at that point so he did have more pedigree than Pascal.

You keep listing all these players who were handed all these bad contracts and then are saying what they shouldn’t have gotten it compared to Pascal? Yeah. They shouldn’t have and neither should have Pascal. The irony is hilarious.

“Hey here’s these also bad contracts that didn’t work out, which actually reinforces your point about Pascal, when actually these guys had more pedigree than Pascal if you look at it...”

You posted Wiggins like I am saying they gave a good contract. No, that was bad, probably worse than Pascal, but a 7/10 versus a 10/10 on the bad scale is just different degrees of bad.

You proved my point with your post and then had the hubris to say it was a ridiculous argument by me as expected. Touché.


So your best arguments are that some players on that list performed well before they signed their current contract? Also majority of those players are over 30 when Pascal is only 26 with room to grow.

Pascal already showed that he could be a 2nd option and 2nd highest usage player on a championship level team. He's played incredible at the highest level on the biggest stage.

He's only had two playoff appearances where he's been a starter.

Maybe wait for a bigger sample size. Most people wouldn't judge a player's entire career over their 1st 4 years in the league when they weren't even expected to be a star, especially when they already showed up in the playoffs and contributed to a championship.

If Pascal continues to disappoint for another 2-3 years then you have will have a better argument, until then I stand by the conclusion that your argument is flat out ridiculous.

Jesus **** christ dude.

Ah the bait and switch to shift goalposts is always fun.

Look - you were the one who listed a bunch of bad contracts and said they were bad, only for me to say I agree that they are bad just like Pascals. Why else would you post it? You’re getting lost in the plot here.

Those players who signed at the time were in their 20s... You’re jumping around with your posts now. Wiggins, Griffin, Wall... were all in their mid 20s too. And again - in some of their cases had more pedigree than Pascal.

Pascal has shown he can be good and also be pretty bad. He’s now had 4/5 last playoff series of playing very bad or bad at best. Or does his 503 TS against Brooklyn not look bad to you?

I look at the entire picture. Pascal didn’t even get the Finals MVP vote for this great second option everyone makes him out to be - Fred did.

Pascal scoring more doesn’t mean he’s the second option lol. Eric Gordon scored more than Chris Paul, who was their second option?

One finals can’t exonerate Pascal. I’m seeing 4/5 bad series now that he’s been treated as a major piece. And this whole “he has only had two years” is also just giving him too much leeway. Just like you’re saying omg look at his finals, well I see more pattern of bad Pascal in the playoffs than good.

Again - back with this expectations nonsense. He signed a max contract. Back to my post that Kawhi wasn’t expected to be a superstar but he’s paid like one so because he was the 15th pick, we should give him slack? Everyone gets so offended with valid criticism backed up by stats and backed up by storyline and then just labels it hater.

Pascal showed up in ONE series in the last two years. It happened to be the finals and kudos to that of course but then he had two very poor performances this year.

You know a lot of players have been mediocre but had good finals? Cedric Maxwell and Iggy, good players but just elite role players even have finals MVPs.

Had Ray Allen not hit that shot, Danny Green may have one too.

This whole he has time sounds again a lot like Demar. It isn’t I want to see him fail, but the pattern of playoff failure is actually more consistent than his success (one series) and he doesn’t have a key ability like shooting or play making either as a key factor to his offense.

But yeah, Jesus Christ right :lol:
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#69 » by bon » Thu Dec 17, 2020 8:20 pm

Can't even have one Siakam appreciation thread without his haters coming out in full force

It's unhealthy at this point
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#70 » by Steelo Green » Thu Dec 17, 2020 8:21 pm

bon wrote:Can't even have one Siakam appreciation thread without his haters come out in full force

It's unhealthy at this point

Really? It’s unhealthy to speak your mind.

I didn’t realize we had armchair psychotherapists on realgm.

:lol:

The irony of this mental health approach to opinion is hilarious.

My life is terrible man. Really. It’s just so bad. I can’t even wake up in the morning. You can extrapolate a lot from someone’s opinion.
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#71 » by lebron stopper » Thu Dec 17, 2020 8:26 pm

tecumseh18 wrote:Am I fan of a Raptors player who started the last ASB and is second team All-NBA? Yes indeed.

Sure Pascal had a slump in the bubble, but I blame Nurse for not making adjustments. Why keep dumping the ball into Siakam on iso plays? I've said this many times, but it's hard to believe Nick was coaching to win in the fourth quarter of Game 7 against the Celtics. Even Casey would bench DeMar in that circumstance.


What else was Nurse supposed to do? The majority of that team stunk it up during the Celtics series.

It's not the first time he put his trust in his players even when they were struggling badly. Remember VanVleet in the 2019 postseason?

For better or worse, this team lives and dies by how Lowry and Siakam play. Lowry gave whatever he could, but Siakam played like utter garbage, period. If one of your best players is playing like trash, you're simply not going very far.

pr0gr4m wrote:He is going to regress this year from what I've seen so far. His game has been figured out. I would hope Masai can sell high on him after next summer


He's an average shooter who fell in love with the three-pointer, he's not a threat from mid-range, his handle is still pretty loose, he still makes up his mind when trying to make plays for others (ie. easily telegraphs his next move), and the spin move is his only move in the post. That's it. No other post moves, no counters.

It's easy to see why he got shut down in the playoffs entirely. He's just a very limited player on offense. He needs to diversify his post game significantly - he has a lot of work cut out for him in that regard. He's not a lost cause yet, but he doesn't have much time to drastically turn it around.

Badonkadonk wrote:Mans puts his heart and soul into the team and his craft and gets crucified for not having an elite offensive game.


Apparently, Siakam not touching a basketball once for 4 straight months (by his own admission) means he's putting his heart and soul into the team and his craft, tbh.

TheDunc wrote:The problem is peoples unfair expectations of him.


Apparently, expecting your team's best players to show up in the playoffs and not piss away 4 valuable months is unfair, too.
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#72 » by Jef » Thu Dec 17, 2020 8:27 pm

Steelo is that dude at the party that is never invited but always shows up anyway.
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#73 » by Lukeem » Thu Dec 17, 2020 8:29 pm

Steelo Green wrote:
Lukeem wrote:
Steelo Green wrote:Conjecture is always fun.

Also it doesn’t matter where you were picked but what you were paid. Kawhi got picked 15th, should we expect him to not be a superstar because of that. How about Manu? Tony Parker? Gilbert Arenas? Giannis?

Your contract dictates what your role is, not where you’re drafted. He was great value but now he’s paid as one of the leagues best.

People literally just make things up and high five one another about it because of what exactly?


21 st highest paid player in the nba this year and by the last year of his contract will be much lower

was (according to voting from top analysts) last year 10th best player, 2 of which were younger than him 1 same age 6 older

hes improved more than anyone in last 3 years, and you're assuming he has platueaed, which if it is the case he'd still be being paid fair value.

Which analysts had Pascal top 10 :lol:

You guys are ridiculous.


Guys, Kyle is the team and when he’s gone just wait and see the fallout.

You guys high five nonsense and think and1s from other homer’s means you’re right. Pascal wasn’t a top 10 guy. His all-NBA doesn’t mean a thing. Demar was all NBA, was he a top 15 player? When the playoffs came did Pascal look like a top 20 player? Kyle was third team all nba to Pascals all second, does that make Pascal better?

The stats and the eye test back up that Pascal is a limited player who had a high and now that he’s been figured out looks like a top 30 guy at best.


The 130 that are trusted with all nba voting :lol: but yes sure you know more than all of them and everyone that has any optimistic thoughts

Demar was close to top 15 often Siakams elite defence makes him a much more legitimate top 15


He didn’t look like it in the bubble at all. You take a small sample size and base everything on that. I’ll consider the majority of the season under regular circumstances and the entire previous season and championship run.

Your assumption is the league has figured out pascal and he can no longer improve or add counters to his game and wonder why you’re a laughing stock on this forum. There are reasons to question and doubt Siakam. You assuming that everyone else is dumb because they think one of the hardest workers in the game is going to improve as he enters his prime, is what makes your posts completely worthless other than an entertaining conversation. I’d be genuinely curious why your posts are constantly void of any hope of it wasn’t so transparent you just want to troll, whine or just being contrary.
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#74 » by Badonkadonk » Thu Dec 17, 2020 8:31 pm

Steelo Green wrote:
Danny1616 wrote:
Steelo Green wrote:Conjecture is always fun.

Also it doesn’t matter where you were picked but what you were paid. Kawhi got picked 15th, should we expect him to not be a superstar because of that. How about Manu? Tony Parker? Gilbert Arenas? Giannis?

Your contract dictates what your role is, not where you’re drafted. He was great value but now he’s paid as one of the leagues best.

People literally just make things up and high five one another about it because of what exactly?


Okay, so let's go to your argument.

Pascal's contract kicks in this year, so he has 4 years to prove himself. You don't judge a contract on a few months or 1 year, you judge it on the entire contract.

Right now let's look at the players with the biggest contracts and whether they deserve it over Pascal.

Curry - Injured for an entire year, zero contribution. We have to see whether he earns 45m+ a year.

Westbrook - Overpaid, underperformed multiple times in the playoffs.

Chris Paul - Good leader, not worth 45m+ a year.

John Wall - Hurt for most of his contract, has done nothing noteworthy in the playoffs. Makes 45m+

James Harden - Deserved his contract during regular season but underperformed in the playoffs. Makes 45m+

Lebron James - Has lived up to his contract so far.

Durant - Have to wait and see...injured his entire first year so zero production.

Griffin - Past his prime, makes 38m+ plus a year. Injury prone, could not lead his team to the playoffs.

George - Underperformed in the playoffs multiple seasons now and injury prone.

Mike Conley - Underperformed in the playoffs before, didn't have a great year last season.

Kemba Walker - Decent year last season, knee issues, underperformed in the playoffs.

Tobias Harris - Way overpaid.

Joel Embiid - Injury prone, underperformed in the playoffs multiple times.

Kevin Love - Underperformed, stat padder on terrible team.

Andrew Wiggins - Sucks.


All those players make more than Pascal this season. Except for Lebron, Pascal has done more than every other player on that list last year.

Ridiculous argument by you, but that's expected as usual.

lol

Well no, you’re judged by the contract you signed. We signed him to be a max player. His contract kicking in is irrelevant. Or was this year we judge him not for the contract he signed.

I mean had he not signed it then sure - but he signed a max level deal so we should expect max level production.

The fatal flaw to your argument is your definition of max level production.

There is a huge range of quality above the max, from Lebron at the top down to more flawed stars who command "max" money allowable under the CBA.

Siakam would easily command the contract he secured on the open market (i.e. starting in the mid-20s and escalating as allowed). That's not really up for debate.

So if you're trying to argue that he's "not as good" as a Kawhi or a KD or a Lebron or anybody else who "maxes out", then sure. But then you're arguing something completely different than what others are.
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#75 » by bon » Thu Dec 17, 2020 8:31 pm

Steelo Green wrote:
bon wrote:Can't even have one Siakam appreciation thread without his haters come out in full force

It's unhealthy at this point

Really? It’s unhealthy to speak your mind.

I didn’t realize we had armchair psychotherapists on realgm.

:lol:

The irony of this mental health approach to opinion is hilarious.

My life is terrible man. Really. It’s just so bad. I can’t even wake up in the morning. You can extrapolate a lot from someone’s opinion.

Didn't even quote you but you still felt the need to reply. If the shoe fits I guess..
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#76 » by pingpongrac » Thu Dec 17, 2020 8:48 pm

Jef wrote:Steelo is that dude at the party that is never invited but always shows up anyway.
Honestly lol. This is literally a thread to show your support for Siakam and they have to come in here spouting nonsense (again).

Even assuming their stupid argument that Siakam's contract extension which comes into effect this season actually means he needed to perform at a 30M level LAST year, he certainly did that up until the bubble. He would have been paid as the ~20th highest in the league, and it's safe to say he played up to or very close to that level. Among eligible players, Siakam was 20th in PPG, 38th in REB, top ~15 in AST among PF/C, and had had the 15th best NetRTG in the entire league. Obviously he also made 2nd team all-NBA, which was voted on before the bubble.

But if you're going to hold Siakam to those high standards of an extension, you need to do the same to every other player who signed an extension last season as well as this season, which means that Siakam is more in the 25-30 range of top-paid players. He's certainly in that range of top 20-25 when accounting for impact/contributions.
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#77 » by Badonkadonk » Thu Dec 17, 2020 9:22 pm

pingpongrac wrote:
Jef wrote:Steelo is that dude at the party that is never invited but always shows up anyway.
Honestly lol. This is literally a thread to show your support for Siakam and they have to come in here spouting nonsense (again).

Even assuming their stupid argument that Siakam's contract extension which comes into effect this season actually means he needed to perform at a 30M level LAST year, he certainly did that up until the bubble. He would have been paid as the ~20th highest in the league, and it's safe to say he played up to or very close to that level. Among eligible players, Siakam was 20th in PPG, 38th in REB, top ~15 in AST among PF/C, and had had the 15th best NetRTG in the entire league. Obviously he also made 2nd team all-NBA, which was voted on before the bubble.

But if you're going to hold Siakam to those high standards of an extension, you need to do the same to every other player who signed an extension last season as well as this season, which means that Siakam is more in the 25-30 range of top-paid players. He's certainly in that range of top 20-25 when accounting for impact/contributions.

Pascal is 30th on the list by AAV, and dropping:

https://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/players.html

Again, any argument against Pascal is an argument against the CBA and how individual contract limits warp the market, not the actual player. Just look at the names on that list.
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#78 » by Swag » Fri Dec 18, 2020 1:56 am

I'm hoping we can package him to get Harden.

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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#79 » by Johnny Bball » Fri Dec 18, 2020 2:40 am

Don't we have a constant negativity rule that is eventually going to be enforced here? I mean, what's the thread for? Any mod?
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Re: If you're a Siakam Fan then post here! 

Post#80 » by billy_hoyle » Fri Dec 18, 2020 2:45 am

I'm a big Siakam fan. Hoping the team finds a #1 option to pair him with.

It's a failing on Masai and Bobby if Pascal is being asked to ISO and bail the team out in high leverage spots.

Siakam is a king **** #2, how can you argue otherwise? He BATTLES defensively. Do people only watch and get entertained by offense? Watching Fred Kyle, OG and Pascal fighting on D will be the best part of raptor ball this year. Pay attention to it. Appreciate it. Teams filled with All NBA defenders aren't common.

Siakam needs to rediscover his mid-range touch, it eluded him after his injury. Without it, he's afraid to attack and that really limits our offense. It's a rhythm thing tho, who knows when that clicks.

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