ImageImageImageImageImage

Tank World Order (2.0)

Moderators: Duffman100, Morris_Shatford, DG88, 7 Footer, Rhettmatic, niQ, Patman, pbj, Alfred

At 10-13 where do you stand now?

TWO: True tank... Sell all assets and start hoping to land a Top 5 pick through the Lottery
28
15%
Asset-Building Mode: Trade Powell/Lowry but Keep Long-Term Core
84
46%
Asset-Building Mode: Wait Until Trade Deadline and Let Lowry Make His Own Call
39
22%
Buyer Mode: Trade Multiple Picks/Players to Get Star... Continue Competing with Lowry
6
3%
Organic Growth Mode: Likely Means Waiting Until Offseason Unless No-Brainer Trade Presents Itself
24
13%
 
Total votes: 181

BBS22
Senior
Posts: 724
And1: 625
Joined: Feb 14, 2010
 

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1501 » by BBS22 » Thu Apr 8, 2021 2:51 pm

CoinTossRoss31 wrote:Gameday tanking update

Current rankings

1- Minnesota (13-39)
2. Houston (14- 39)
3. Detroit ( 15-36)
4. Orlando ( 17-34)
T5. Washington ( 18-32)
T5. Cleveland ( 18-32)
T7. OKC (20-31)
T7. Toronto ( 20-31)
9. Chicago ( 21- 28)


Important games for the tank tonight

#1- Chicago vs Toronto. Toronto has to lose this one to make sure they solidify their spot at 7. Losing to Chicago could spiral us out of the top 10 entirely if we go on a run.

#2 - Cleveland vs OKC - Tough to choose who to cheer for. Cleveland winning continues to open up that top 5 for us to sneak in, but if okc can wins the raptors would be alone at #7. Tough game, I guess I can would cheer for OKC because it doesn't seem to be that cleveland is purposely trying to tank this hard.

Detroit vs Sac - hoping coach casey can coach their scrubs out of a top 5 spot. Get some meaningless wins like he knows how to do


Small note. Chicago starts their back-to-back tonight. It's in their best interest to play full out against the Raptors and secure a W, lowering us and moving closer to the playoffs. Rather than conservating tonight's game and going full out against the Hawks tomorrow.

It's a smarter strategy for the Bulls IMO. Best case is that they make quick work against us, rest their starters, get ready for the Hawks and hopefully win that too. Creates more separation between us and them.

As for OKC v Cleveland. I would hope Cleveland gets the W. Then we can hand them another W on Saturday and pull them closer to us.

I'm happy with either result as long as we take care of business on our side.
Image

Thanks Tubrozone!
DelAbbot
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,782
And1: 2,324
Joined: May 22, 2019
   

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1502 » by DelAbbot » Thu Apr 8, 2021 3:07 pm

Look at Team Denial circle-jerk sync'ed blowing their load on Khem Birch taking us into the playoffs.

Laughter followed by SMH.



Baiting. Warned
niQ
metafisical
Assistant Coach
Posts: 3,911
And1: 4,908
Joined: Jun 13, 2014
     

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1503 » by metafisical » Thu Apr 8, 2021 3:27 pm

But seriously, I do not know anything about Birch. Questions:
1. Will he have a positive impact on our team?
2. Is it positive enough to win us enough games to threaten the tank?

Honestly, this guy better be a glorified scrub.
DelAbbot
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,782
And1: 2,324
Joined: May 22, 2019
   

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1504 » by DelAbbot » Thu Apr 8, 2021 3:30 pm

metafisical wrote:But seriously, I do not know anything about Birch. Questions:
1. Will he have a positive impact on our team?
2. Is it positive enough to win us enough games to threaten the tank?

Honestly, this guy better be a glorified scrub.


Anytime you take away mins from Baynes, it's a positive, so even as a slightly sub-replacement-level player Birch will bring net positive impact on our team. Whether it gets us into the play-in game, there are other bigger factors than Birch (like Lowry coming back, FVV coming back).
User avatar
OAKLEY_2
RealGM
Posts: 16,944
And1: 7,329
Joined: Dec 19, 2008

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1505 » by OAKLEY_2 » Thu Apr 8, 2021 3:33 pm

CoinTossRoss31 wrote:Gameday tanking update

Current rankings

1- Minnesota (13-39)
2. Houston (14- 39)
3. Detroit ( 15-36)
4. Orlando ( 17-34)
T5. Washington ( 18-32)
T5. Cleveland ( 18-32)
T7. OKC (20-31)
T7. Toronto ( 20-31)
9. Chicago ( 21- 28)


Important games for the tank tonight

#1- Chicago vs Toronto. Toronto has to lose this one to make sure they solidify their spot at 7. Losing to Chicago could spiral us out of the top 10 entirely if we go on a run.

#2 - Cleveland vs OKC - Tough to choose who to cheer for. Cleveland winning continues to open up that top 5 for us to sneak in, but if okc can wins the raptors would be alone at #7. Tough game, I guess I can would cheer for OKC because it doesn't seem to be that cleveland is purposely trying to tank this hard.

Detroit vs Sac - hoping coach casey can coach their scrubs out of a top 5 spot. Get some meaningless wins like he knows how to do


OKC loses. Presti the best exec in Basketball.
metafisical
Assistant Coach
Posts: 3,911
And1: 4,908
Joined: Jun 13, 2014
     

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1506 » by metafisical » Thu Apr 8, 2021 3:36 pm

DelAbbot wrote:
metafisical wrote:But seriously, I do not know anything about Birch. Questions:
1. Will he have a positive impact on our team?
2. Is it positive enough to win us enough games to threaten the tank?

Honestly, this guy better be a glorified scrub.


Anytime you take away mins from Baynes, it's a positive, so even as a slightly sub-replacement-level player Birch will bring net positive impact on our team. Whether it gets us into the play-in game, there are other bigger factors than Birch (like Lowry coming back, FVV coming back).


****!!!!

See? I hate this lukewarm crap. Either go for the championship, or go hard for a great draft pick (top 5). I don't see the need for to be swept by Milwaukee, Brooklyn or Philly. Just blows my mind.
BBS22
Senior
Posts: 724
And1: 625
Joined: Feb 14, 2010
 

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1507 » by BBS22 » Thu Apr 8, 2021 3:45 pm

The Birch move probably comes with the understanding that he gets to play a lot of minutes and showcase his skills. He's an interesting piece that can play smallball. I do see it as an antitank move.

He didn't have any trade value going in as a UFA. He's probably going for his final major contract. No hate in my heart for the guy, hope he does well enough.

I do hope our team continues to tank however as it's best for our franchise in my opinion than a play in only to get eliminated by Brooklyn or Sixers.
Image

Thanks Tubrozone!
Jerry Lucas
Ballboy
Posts: 30
And1: 28
Joined: Apr 01, 2021
     

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1508 » by Jerry Lucas » Thu Apr 8, 2021 3:47 pm

rocky_da_best wrote:
Jerry Lucas wrote:
OAKLEY_2 wrote:
Not counting out Trent Jr. just yet.

Off of one game winner against a garbage Wizards team without Beal? Gimme a break with these team mediocre delusions, I guess you probably didn't count out TJ Ford being our closer either after his buzzer beater against the Clips.


At least Trent's actually hit a game winner in a professional setting lol

Okay team mediocre so by your logic TJ Ford and Trent Jr are gonna end up better than Cade and Jalen Green because they've hit professional game winners lmao smh :clown:
Team Find The Next Closer
User avatar
Pooh_Jeter
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,420
And1: 7,205
Joined: Apr 29, 2008

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1509 » by Pooh_Jeter » Thu Apr 8, 2021 5:44 pm

Birch is probably a slight hit to the tank. He is fairly mobile and a decent rebounder. Offensively he is pretty much just a garbage man. The thing is if he is taking away minutes from mainly just Baynes it helps the team on the court, but if he is taking away minutes from Boucher and small lineups I wouldn't be surprised if it's either a net neutral or even a slight negative.

The bigger issue is that while Birch is perfectly useful and would be a quality bench big on most teams, why are you using development time on a 28 year old bench piece instead of a young guy? This is again why not dealing Lowry for a prospect or dealing Norm for someone with more team control was a mistake. Basically only Flynn and OG are the only young guys getting any proper development time. Contrast this to what basically every other top 10 lotto team is doing.
User avatar
PrinceAli
Analyst
Posts: 3,554
And1: 6,043
Joined: Mar 11, 2018
       

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1510 » by PrinceAli » Thu Apr 8, 2021 5:53 pm

Pooh_Jeter wrote:Birch is probably a slight hit to the tank. He is fairly mobile and a decent rebounder. Offensively he is pretty much just a garbage man. The thing is if he is taking away minutes from mainly just Baynes it helps the team on the court, but if he is taking away minutes from Boucher and small lineups I wouldn't be surprised if it's either a net neutral or even a slight negative.

The bigger issue is that while Birch is perfectly useful and would be a quality bench big on most teams, why are you using development time on a 28 year old bench piece instead of a young guy? This is again why not dealing Lowry for a prospect or dealing Norm for someone with more team control was a mistake. Basically only Flynn and OG are the only young guys getting any proper development time. Contrast this to what basically every other top 10 lotto team is doing.

Trent?
Image
User avatar
rocky_da_best
Veteran
Posts: 2,933
And1: 6,195
Joined: Feb 10, 2010
       

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1511 » by rocky_da_best » Thu Apr 8, 2021 6:04 pm

Jerry Lucas wrote:
rocky_da_best wrote:
Jerry Lucas wrote:Off of one game winner against a garbage Wizards team without Beal? Gimme a break with these team mediocre delusions, I guess you probably didn't count out TJ Ford being our closer either after his buzzer beater against the Clips.


At least Trent's actually hit a game winner in a professional setting lol

Okay team mediocre so by your logic TJ Ford and Trent Jr are gonna end up better than Cade and Jalen Green because they've hit professional game winners lmao smh :clown:


You know, for someone who is brand new to this forum, you sure are familiar with a lot of the board's jargon and allusions. Hmmm
User avatar
Psubs
RealGM
Posts: 11,313
And1: 7,344
Joined: Nov 20, 2004
Location: Toronto

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1512 » by Psubs » Thu Apr 8, 2021 6:20 pm

Pooh_Jeter wrote:Birch is probably a slight hit to the tank. He is fairly mobile and a decent rebounder. Offensively he is pretty much just a garbage man. The thing is if he is taking away minutes from mainly just Baynes it helps the team on the court, but if he is taking away minutes from Boucher and small lineups I wouldn't be surprised if it's either a net neutral or even a slight negative.

The bigger issue is that while Birch is perfectly useful and would be a quality bench big on most teams, why are you using development time on a 28 year old bench piece instead of a young guy? This is again why not dealing Lowry for a prospect or dealing Norm for someone with more team control was a mistake. Basically only Flynn and OG are the only young guys getting any proper development time. Contrast this to what basically every other top 10 lotto team is doing.


Birch will get PT and take Baynes' place completely next season. Give him half the MLE sized contract for 2 years. That would be a raise from his contract in Orlando.
Image
User avatar
Pooh_Jeter
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,420
And1: 7,205
Joined: Apr 29, 2008

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1513 » by Pooh_Jeter » Thu Apr 8, 2021 6:27 pm

PrinceAli wrote:
Pooh_Jeter wrote:Birch is probably a slight hit to the tank. He is fairly mobile and a decent rebounder. Offensively he is pretty much just a garbage man. The thing is if he is taking away minutes from mainly just Baynes it helps the team on the court, but if he is taking away minutes from Boucher and small lineups I wouldn't be surprised if it's either a net neutral or even a slight negative.

The bigger issue is that while Birch is perfectly useful and would be a quality bench big on most teams, why are you using development time on a 28 year old bench piece instead of a young guy? This is again why not dealing Lowry for a prospect or dealing Norm for someone with more team control was a mistake. Basically only Flynn and OG are the only young guys getting any proper development time. Contrast this to what basically every other top 10 lotto team is doing.

Trent?


I should have clarified, young guys with team control. Trent still has upside and it's not like they should be limiting his playing time, but I'd argue letting him chuck his way into a huge RFA contract is a net negative. He projects more as a quality bench guy or depth starter and the Raptors are artificially inflating his value right before he gets paid.
User avatar
Pooh_Jeter
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,420
And1: 7,205
Joined: Apr 29, 2008

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1514 » by Pooh_Jeter » Thu Apr 8, 2021 6:29 pm

Psubs wrote:
Pooh_Jeter wrote:Birch is probably a slight hit to the tank. He is fairly mobile and a decent rebounder. Offensively he is pretty much just a garbage man. The thing is if he is taking away minutes from mainly just Baynes it helps the team on the court, but if he is taking away minutes from Boucher and small lineups I wouldn't be surprised if it's either a net neutral or even a slight negative.

The bigger issue is that while Birch is perfectly useful and would be a quality bench big on most teams, why are you using development time on a 28 year old bench piece instead of a young guy? This is again why not dealing Lowry for a prospect or dealing Norm for someone with more team control was a mistake. Basically only Flynn and OG are the only young guys getting any proper development time. Contrast this to what basically every other top 10 lotto team is doing.


Birch will get PT and take Baynes' place completely next season. Give him half the MLE sized contract for 2 years. That would be a raise from his contract in Orlando.


Wouldn't be the worst idea to have a competent back-up centre, but that is way down the list of priorities going into this off-season IMO. Like I mentioned with Trent, he is also going to have his value artificially inflated with increased playing time.
User avatar
PrinceAli
Analyst
Posts: 3,554
And1: 6,043
Joined: Mar 11, 2018
       

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1515 » by PrinceAli » Thu Apr 8, 2021 6:29 pm

Pooh_Jeter wrote:
PrinceAli wrote:
Pooh_Jeter wrote:Birch is probably a slight hit to the tank. He is fairly mobile and a decent rebounder. Offensively he is pretty much just a garbage man. The thing is if he is taking away minutes from mainly just Baynes it helps the team on the court, but if he is taking away minutes from Boucher and small lineups I wouldn't be surprised if it's either a net neutral or even a slight negative.

The bigger issue is that while Birch is perfectly useful and would be a quality bench big on most teams, why are you using development time on a 28 year old bench piece instead of a young guy? This is again why not dealing Lowry for a prospect or dealing Norm for someone with more team control was a mistake. Basically only Flynn and OG are the only young guys getting any proper development time. Contrast this to what basically every other top 10 lotto team is doing.

Trent?


I should have clarified, young guys with team control. Trent still has upside and it's not like they should be limiting his playing time, but I'd argue letting him chuck his way into a huge RFA contract is a net negative. He projects more as a quality bench guy or depth starter and the Raptors are artificially inflating his value right before he gets paid.

You don’t think what he’s shown as a 22 year old could justify his potential as our starter at the 2 for the future? Teams already have seen what he can do in Portland and in the bubble. He was gonna be getting paid regardless so might as well let him develop with more opportunity
Image
Jerry Lucas
Ballboy
Posts: 30
And1: 28
Joined: Apr 01, 2021
     

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1516 » by Jerry Lucas » Thu Apr 8, 2021 6:41 pm

rocky_da_best wrote:
Jerry Lucas wrote:
rocky_da_best wrote:
At least Trent's actually hit a game winner in a professional setting lol

Okay team mediocre so by your logic TJ Ford and Trent Jr are gonna end up better than Cade and Jalen Green because they've hit professional game winners lmao smh :clown:


You know, for someone who is brand new to this forum, you sure are familiar with a lot of the board's jargon and allusions. Hmmm

Yeah because I've been a lurker longer than I've been a poster.

Also while I've ripped on team mediocre a lot since joining because I noticed they've been extra delusional lately, I am neither TWO or team mediocre, my team's on my signature if no one else is on this team I guess I started it. As of right now the quickest path to a closer is a stealth tank so this year I have agreed more with TWO.
Team Find The Next Closer
User avatar
rocky_da_best
Veteran
Posts: 2,933
And1: 6,195
Joined: Feb 10, 2010
       

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1517 » by rocky_da_best » Thu Apr 8, 2021 7:13 pm

Jerry Lucas wrote:
rocky_da_best wrote:
Jerry Lucas wrote:Okay team mediocre so by your logic TJ Ford and Trent Jr are gonna end up better than Cade and Jalen Green because they've hit professional game winners lmao smh :clown:


You know, for someone who is brand new to this forum, you sure are familiar with a lot of the board's jargon and allusions. Hmmm

Yeah because I've been a lurker longer than I've been a poster.

Also while I've ripped on team mediocre a lot since joining because I noticed they've been extra delusional lately, I am neither TWO or team mediocre, my team's on my signature if no one else is on this team I guess I started it. As of right now the quickest path to a closer is a stealth tank so this year I have agreed more with TWO.


Cool. Welcome to the forum. One thing you should know though is you're walking a slippery slope calling people clowns for disagreeing with your opinion. Just a heads up :wink:
Raptors_128
Starter
Posts: 2,292
And1: 2,128
Joined: Sep 27, 2018
       

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1518 » by Raptors_128 » Thu Apr 8, 2021 7:18 pm

Man it’s too hard to get into the top-5. Those other teams absolutely suck and we’re still playing guys playoff minutes.

Rockets/Timberwolves/Pistons have the top-3 locked up. Magic and Thunder are actively tanking. Cavs and Wizards are just ass.

Feel like at best we get the 7th best odds now. Just gotta pray we move up in the lottery now.
Jerry Lucas
Ballboy
Posts: 30
And1: 28
Joined: Apr 01, 2021
     

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1519 » by Jerry Lucas » Thu Apr 8, 2021 7:53 pm

rocky_da_best wrote:
Jerry Lucas wrote:
rocky_da_best wrote:
You know, for someone who is brand new to this forum, you sure are familiar with a lot of the board's jargon and allusions. Hmmm

Yeah because I've been a lurker longer than I've been a poster.

Also while I've ripped on team mediocre a lot since joining because I noticed they've been extra delusional lately, I am neither TWO or team mediocre, my team's on my signature if no one else is on this team I guess I started it. As of right now the quickest path to a closer is a stealth tank so this year I have agreed more with TWO.


Cool. Welcome to the forum. One thing you should know though is you're walking a slippery slope calling people clowns for disagreeing with your opinion. Just a heads up :wink:

I mean look, if the opinion is that Trent could be better than Cade or Jalen Green I gotta easily disagree with that. I've seen no evidence to suggest Trent could become a closer against top teams, and no evidence to suggest Cade and Jalen Green wont be franchise talents and very possibly future hall of famers.

And here's where I gotta rip on TWO a bit. I've seen some real die hard TWO doom and gloom posts suggesting that one of Cade or Jalen Green wouldn't even be enough to get the Raptors back to contention. While we do also need to add a center who can provide elements that Gasol provided, any TWO poster who still thinks there's no light at the end of the tunnel with Cade/Green is out to lunch.
Team Find The Next Closer
User avatar
MixxSRC
Head Coach
Posts: 7,080
And1: 12,398
Joined: Aug 01, 2013
 

Re: Tank World Order (2.0) 

Post#1520 » by MixxSRC » Fri Apr 9, 2021 1:41 am

Read on Twitter

Return to Toronto Raptors