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Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0

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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#361 » by Mirotic12 » Thu Jun 10, 2021 2:36 pm

TrueNorth31 wrote:I'm glad you mentioned the Czech's . In many ways given their success at the World Cup they should not be ignored. Adding a solid player in Vesely , a three time Euro League all star and a former NBA lottery pick can only help. They are sort of the antithesis of Canada. They only have 2 guys who play in either the NBA or the Euro League , but what they lack in talent they make up in team chemistry and solid play. I believe 5 guys on the 2019 team all played on the same team in the Czech league. They don't have huge turnover and are well prepared.

At the World Cup they had one big post Balvin surrounded by a bunch of 6' 5" - 6' 7" inch veteran, thick strong, tough guys who could all defend and shoot to a certain degree ( as a team they lead the tournament in three point % ) . Satoransky is quite good and really moves the ball on offence. When your putting together a Canadian roster you need to have the flexibility to play 4 out and match up against such a team by having a lot of big switchable wings.


Czech Republic is well-coached and they have a lot of chemistry from playing together for awhile. Even though there is an untrue myth in US sports media that "all other teams besides USA play together for years" (in fact, many have less continuity than USA does), it's at least fairly true with the Czech team.

It's a versatile team, with length, physicality, good 3 point shooting, good ball handling, and athleticism. I don't think they have enough depth or offensive firepower though. Not to get through a short tournament with quick turnaround single elimination games, with some of these other teams. Especially since no one will be surprised by them, or taking them lightly, after the last World Cup.

They are dangerous for a single game upset though.
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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#362 » by mojo13 » Thu Jun 10, 2021 3:56 pm

Yi Jianlian, Guo Aillun and Wang Zhelin have withdrawn from the China National Basketball Team training camp due to injuries. China will play against Japan & Chinese Taipei in the 2021 FIBA Asia Cup next week and against Canada & Greece in the Olympic Qualifying Tournaments.


Yi and Wang were potential starters I believe? Yi was coming off a an Achilles injury thought and has yet to play. He likely wouldn't have been too good.
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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#363 » by aminiaturebuddha » Thu Jun 10, 2021 7:18 pm

mojo13 wrote:Hearing some stuff out there that the Pacers are putting intense pressure on Brissett to skip on Team Canada. We could have our first NBA player to fall off in the next couple days. I hope he is the first and last.

At least it is at a deep position. However I wouldn’t have minded his versatility and three point shooting from the bench.

This likely paves the way for two of Ejim, Clarke, Powell, Nicholson, Lyles to be on the team.


How about the Pacers get their own house in order, fix their team culture, and figure out who their coach is before they start putting pressure on players not to do what they want to do?

I know, I know, kind of salty. And yes, I understand where professional teams are coming from that they assume lots of risk and get no benefit if a player ends up getting hurt. Still, doesn't stop me from irrationally angry about teams trying to get guys not to join Team Canada.

Also, there seems to be some evidence that players who play with their national teams, end up having better seasons the following year (perhaps due to expanding their games by playing different roles, or just getting extra practice and playing time with and against high quality players in pressure situations).
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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#364 » by Jstock12 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:56 am

aminiaturebuddha wrote:Also, there seems to be some evidence that players who play with their national teams, end up having better seasons the following year (perhaps due to expanding their games by playing different roles, or just getting extra practice and playing time with and against high quality players in pressure situations).


I think you're probably referring to Team USA. Being surrounded by superstars is a great motivator for younger stars to up the confidence in their own game. But for any other national team, I think there's substantial data to suggest that playing for your national team stunts your progress. There are countless of international players who made a substantial jump in their development whenever they had a full summer to themselves, dedicated to getting better and developing new skills.

For all we know, Brissett not representing team Canada could end up as a positive for the national team in the long-term.
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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#365 » by mojo13 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 2:59 pm

Marial Shayok signs with Fenerbahce.
He had a great rookie season in Turkey and this doesn’t come as too much of a surprise.



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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#366 » by aminiaturebuddha » Fri Jun 11, 2021 6:05 pm

Jstock12 wrote:
aminiaturebuddha wrote:Also, there seems to be some evidence that players who play with their national teams, end up having better seasons the following year (perhaps due to expanding their games by playing different roles, or just getting extra practice and playing time with and against high quality players in pressure situations).


I think you're probably referring to Team USA. Being surrounded by superstars is a great motivator for younger stars to up the confidence in their own game. But for any other national team, I think there's substantial data to suggest that playing for your national team stunts your progress. There are countless of international players who made a substantial jump in their development whenever they had a full summer to themselves, dedicated to getting better and developing new skills.

For all we know, Brissett not representing team Canada could end up as a positive for the national team in the long-term.


You may be right, I'm probably thinking of people looking at Team USA players. However, I think it also seems to apply to Canadian players. I'm having a hard time thinking of Canadian players whose progress was "stunted" by playing with the national team, and can think of a number who played at a higher level following their stints with the team. Conversely, the most obvious example of a Canadian player who skipped out on playing for the team to work on "developing new skills" is Andreww Wiggins, and we all know how his progress fared over those summers.
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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#367 » by mojo13 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 6:31 pm

aminiaturebuddha wrote:
Jstock12 wrote:
aminiaturebuddha wrote:Also, there seems to be some evidence that players who play with their national teams, end up having better seasons the following year (perhaps due to expanding their games by playing different roles, or just getting extra practice and playing time with and against high quality players in pressure situations).


I think you're probably referring to Team USA. Being surrounded by superstars is a great motivator for younger stars to up the confidence in their own game. But for any other national team, I think there's substantial data to suggest that playing for your national team stunts your progress. There are countless of international players who made a substantial jump in their development whenever they had a full summer to themselves, dedicated to getting better and developing new skills.

For all we know, Brissett not representing team Canada could end up as a positive for the national team in the long-term.


You may be right, I'm probably thinking of people looking at Team USA players. However, I think it also seems to apply to Canadian players. I'm having a hard time thinking of Canadian players whose progress was "stunted" by playing with the national team, and can think of a number who played at a higher level following their stints with the team. Conversely, the most obvious example of a Canadian player who skipped out on playing for the team to work on "developing new skills" is Andreww Wiggins, and we all know how his progress fared over those summers.



Khem Birch publicly credited his time with the national team and specifically under Nurse as drastically improving his game.
Can't help but think Barrett and SGA getting time with the SMNT as teenagers had to help their confidence as the moved into the NCAA ranks. I recall Olynyk really broke through playing for Canada in his Gonzaga days which co-incided with his transition to junior redshirt to breakout All-American year.

But Kevin Pangos may have screwed up his two years in Barcelona by playing for the national team in 2019. That is injury related and may have happened anyways. Kelly Olynyk was certainly impacted by his 2019 injury. That really hampered him for almost a half season in Miami. Again...injuries...but they are part of the equation.
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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#368 » by Mirotic12 » Sun Jun 13, 2021 4:16 pm

Greek NT updates.

After 10 days of training camp, Pitino said that he will probably have Spanoulis, Sloukas, and Printezis in the starting lineup, with the other two starters coming from teams still playing. So maybe that means Calathes won't start, or he will use a 3 guard rotation (old Greek and Yugoslav style) and whomever starts at center. Or maybe it means Calathes isn't even playing. Spanoulis will be the team's primary play maker, with the offense being run by him.

It sounded like Pitino doesn't think Giannis and Thanasis will be on the team. He didn't say that they wouldn't play for sure, but he seemed to very much imply that unless the Bucks lost to the Nets in 4 or 5 games, there wouldn't be enough time for them to join the team. He also basically implied that the Bucks probably wouldn't let them play regardless, and they would have to ignore that and demand to play on their own.

In addition to that, three players were cut from the team: Kostas Papadakis, Christos Saloustros, and Vassilis Charalampopoulo. While four players were added to the team: Dimtris Katsivelis, Michalis Lountzis, Charis Giannopoulos and Linos Chrysikopoulos.

So currently, Greece's training camp roster looks like this:

PG Vassilis Spanoulis / Ioannis Athinaiou / Michalis Lountzis
SG Kostas Sloukas / Dimitris Katsivelis
SF Giannoulis Larentzakis / Charis Giannopoulos / Nikos Rogkavopoulos
PG Georgios Printezis / Linos Chrysikopoulos / Nikos Chougkaz
C Vassilis Kavvadas / Kostas Antetokounmpo
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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#369 » by ItsDanger » Mon Jun 14, 2021 2:48 am

From a purely selfish perspective, Kyrie's injury makes our chances of not facing Giannis just went up huge.
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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#370 » by TrueNorth31 » Mon Jun 14, 2021 2:15 pm

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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#371 » by mojo13 » Mon Jun 14, 2021 3:34 pm

TrueNorth31 wrote:Victoria organizers hoping to have 10% of spectator capacity at the qualifiers.

https://www.timescolonist.com/sports/victoria-organizers-request-10-capacity-for-olympic-basketball-qualifying-tournament-1.24329958


Awesome. Anything is better than a fully dead arena. We need some sort of home court advantage to make these guys sort of feel at home.

They should somehow ban anyone from other nations to be honest....




On another note Fenerbahce locked up Dyshawn Pierre on an extension and guaranteed 21/22 and 22/23. With a club option for 23/24.

Will be fun to see Pierre and Shayok together on Fener. Even some rumors out there on them sniffing around Kevin Pangos too. He is demanding a clear NBA out from Zenit, who has so far balked. Maybe Fener would agree to it, otherwise it looks like he will wait out NBA free agency.
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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#372 » by frumble » Mon Jun 14, 2021 6:52 pm

Sorry if this was covered earlier, but has there been any word on when training camp will start? Barely two weeks until the first game.

Also, other than the Brissett rumours discussed above, anything else re potential dropouts since the initial list of 21 players was posted?

Thanks.
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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#373 » by mojo13 » Mon Jun 14, 2021 7:07 pm

frumble wrote:Sorry if this was covered earlier, but has there been any word on when training camp will start? Barely two weeks until the first game.

Also, other than the Brissett rumours discussed above, anything else re potential dropouts since the initial list of 21 players was posted?

Thanks.


Camp is 16th to 24th in Tampa.
Then head to Victoria.
Train 26-28th in Victoria and then games begin on the 29th.

Doesn't look like any exhibition games (which really bothers me) and a really short prep time. Other countries have been in camp for weeks already and exhibition games have already started. Czech played the other day (win over Finland) and China I think plays today. Greece and Turkey starting around the 18th (about 2-3 games a piece I think).

Not a peep on drop outs besides Brissett (still unconfirmed) out there yet.


Anyone else concerned about the lack of exhibition games? I understand the intersquad games have better talent than almost any opponents we'd play, but the live game experience and facing similar strategy/tactics of some the European opponents would be quite helpful.
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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#374 » by BilboBanginz » Mon Jun 14, 2021 9:37 pm

I'm still holding out hope for an exhibition game (or two). Without fans these things can be organized much faster, although we are quickly losing runway.

Do we know which teams could feasibly play an exhibition game against Canada with the little time we have left? I believe several national teams usually host their pre-tournament camps in the USA (Nigeria comes to mind - although they have already qualified, so maybe they are waiting to start their camp until closer to the Olympics).

Maybe the Dominican Republic, Puerto Rico, or Mexico would be available for a game or two before they head to their respective qualifying tournaments in Europe.
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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#375 » by mojo13 » Mon Jun 14, 2021 10:09 pm

BilboBanginz wrote:I'm still holding out hope for an exhibition game (or two). Without fans these things can be organized much faster, although we are quickly losing runway.

Do we know which teams could feasibly play an exhibition game against Canada with the little time we have left? I believe several national teams usually host their pre-tournament camps in the USA (Nigeria comes to mind - although they have already qualified, so maybe they are waiting to start their camp until closer to the Olympics).

Maybe the Dominican Republic, Puerto Rico, or Mexico would be available for a game or two before they head to their respective qualifying tournaments in Europe.


DR, PR and Mexico are all already in Europe (where they will player their qualifiers) and all have multiple games lined up already. Mexico played Poland over the weekend I believe.

Uruguay, from what I know, has no exhibition games scheduled either, they would be the logical choice.

Maybe Greece, Turkey, Czech, China would want another game on the 26 or 27t. But they all already have games on the calendar before they head to Victoria.
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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#376 » by frumble » Tue Jun 15, 2021 12:12 am

mojo13 wrote:
frumble wrote:Sorry if this was covered earlier, but has there been any word on when training camp will start? Barely two weeks until the first game.

Also, other than the Brissett rumours discussed above, anything else re potential dropouts since the initial list of 21 players was posted?

Thanks.


Camp is 16th to 24th in Tampa.
Then head to Victoria.
Train 26-28th in Victoria and then games begin on the 29th.

Doesn't look like any exhibition games (which really bothers me) and a really short prep time. Other countries have been in camp for weeks already and exhibition games have already started. Czech played the other day (win over Finland) and China I think plays today. Greece and Turkey starting around the 18th (about 2-3 games a piece I think).

Not a peep on drop outs besides Brissett (still unconfirmed) out there yet.


Anyone else concerned about the lack of exhibition games? I understand the intersquad games have better talent than almost any opponents we'd play, but the live game experience and facing similar strategy/tactics of some the European opponents would be quite helpful.


Thanks for the info.

Yes, I am also concerned about the lack of exhibition games. Especially given that the other teams are getting them in.

I doubt Greece, China, Turkey, or Czechia will want to schedule Canada for the 26th or 27th so, yeah, that leaves Uruguay as the best (only?) hope.
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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#377 » by TrueNorth31 » Tue Jun 15, 2021 12:27 pm

I doubt that they will have exhibition games, but a controlled scrimmage with Uruguay or China could certainly be done ( no fans, have fiba refs, don't keep score , play 4-5 quarters - this is a common thing at the college level ).

I would have liked to have seen some exhibition games , but then camp would have had to open 10-14 days earlier and you would have had to have gone to Europe most likely to find matches. If you did this though, you'd have much less NBA player participation ( remember if they qualify they have to further commit for another 6 weeks ). I've heard through a source that the 3 week Aussie training camp slog before the World Cup was the primary reason NBA players didn't participate. With an abbreviated break between the bubble this last season, as well as the late season this year opening camp early was a no go for the NBA contingent. Another issue is that the French Jeep league is still playing and we have an inordinate number of Canadian players in that league. Alas the cold hard reality of Covid and not qualifying out of the World Cup has become an issue.
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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#378 » by mojo13 » Tue Jun 15, 2021 1:29 pm

Sort of confirming that Brissett is out.


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But nothing else so far.
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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#379 » by Mirotic12 » Tue Jun 15, 2021 1:38 pm

TrueNorth31 wrote:I doubt that they will have exhibition games, but a controlled scrimmage with Uruguay or China could certainly be done ( no fans, have fiba refs, don't keep score , play 4-5 quarters - this is a common thing at the college level ).

I would have liked to have seen some exhibition games , but then camp would have had to open 10-14 days earlier and you would have had to have gone to Europe most likely to find matches. If you did this though, you'd have much less NBA player participation ( remember if they qualify they have to further commit for another 6 weeks ). I've heard through a source that the 3 week Aussie training camp slog before the World Cup was the primary reason NBA players didn't participate. With an abbreviated break between the bubble this last season, as well as the late season this year opening camp early was a no go for the NBA contingent. Another issue is that the French Jeep league is still playing and we have an inordinate number of Canadian players in that league. Alas the cold hard reality of Covid and not qualifying out of the World Cup has become an issue.


I once read about a rule that NBA players on international teams (so non USA Basketball) can only spend a total of 28 days with their national teams in a calendar year. I can't remember where I read it, but it was a major sports media source. If that's correct (it may not be), then a long training camp probably wouldn't work for Canada, since if they qualify for the Olympics, they would probably need another training camp and preparation period in the same summer.
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Re: Team Canada Basketball Thread V3.0 

Post#380 » by Mirotic12 » Tue Jun 15, 2021 1:54 pm

Italian media seems to imply that Paolo Banchero and Donte DiVincenzo could play together for Italy, despite that neither of them had Italian citizenship by age 16. Never mind that Greece and Spain claim they are required to have their players by age 14 (not 16), or they count as naturalized. DiVincenzo has supposedly not yet gotten Italian citizenship at age 24, and Banchero got it at either age 17 or age 18, depending on the source.

These double standards in these rules just make no sense.

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