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2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2

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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1801 » by 10giz » Wed Aug 18, 2021 8:59 am

c3luong wrote:
OhCanada1091 wrote:
Saciid11 wrote:Sacramento is the best trading partner and most realistic trade for Pascal.

Pascal + filler for Fox

Or

Pascal for Buddy Hield+ Bagley + Davion Mitchell + future 1rd pick ...

Why would you trade Pascal? I don't understand why people think thats a good deal...none of those players are btter than Siakam and its very unlikely any of them would be in the future. So why trade away an allstar who wants to be in Toronto, the best player in the package for a bunch of players who create a logjam in our roster?

Not to mention the offer is probably just Hield and Bagley.


Fox has a decent chance of getting better than Siakam.

(He probably also has a decent chance of never getting there - will depend if he ever decides to start playing defense)


Laughable.

Why the **** would we want Fox?

You wanna pay 40M to a PG who will never take you the the championship, handicap your salary cap and literally offer terrible value at the most abundant position in the league?

Everyone gets suckered by these high scoring athletic PGs just like these sucker franchises do. I expect the Raptors to always, barring a outlier talent, always go for value at PG. When it's possible to get guys like Fred in the 2nd or undrafted, I would never, ever want to invest a high pick or a max deal into a PG.

Go find a list of the best PGs in the NBA - tell me how many have a title. I'll wait. Better yet, tell me how many have a title that don't involve Steph Curry or Lebron.

Meanwhile Siakam is an All-NBA level player who can be an elite scorer and defender at a position where there are literally 5 guys who are elite at the positions (AD, Giannis, Zion, PS, Dray + Sabonis IMO).

Pascal will not be traded for anything other than a GSW type package of multiple first round players, multiple first round picks, or a real blue chip prospect on a rookie scale deal.

FOR **** SAKE, Vucevic got traded for Wendell Carter, 2 1sts and a 30M expiring. Vucevic...

Hield is making 20M a year for the next 3 years for the same role as Trent, while being smaller and 6 years older. Get outta here.

Bagley - worst defensive rating in the league this year - RFA, 240 pound PF who's about to get overpaid? No thanks. I'd rather give Precious 10 times less money.

Davion - awesome, but I'm not giving a star player for him. I don't care how **** great he is or how excellent his defence is, elite defenders who are 6'4 and under are, IMO, notably less valuable and desirable then ones 6'7+.

Come talk to me when he's already one of the best pound for pound defenders in the league like Fred is.
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1802 » by LBJKB24MJ23 » Wed Aug 18, 2021 1:49 pm

Fox is a great up and coming player. he just needs better teammates/system around him. he's active on defense, off ball defense - going around players with their back towards the basket - playing the passing lane vs FVV on man defense. but his perimeter shooting is suspect, which is needed from the guard position. thats the only thing I would worry about him when it comes to talent. he doesn't have the same problem FVV has at the rim - Fox is a great finisher at the rim - 76% while FVV is at 53%. but FVV is one of the better 3 point shooters in the league - while Fox is putrid at it, esp from the lead guard. i don't think he's that big of an upgrade over FVV to be honest. we lose spacing, shooting, defense for a guy like Fox, who is now more dependant to score from inside and making Siakam, OG, Barnes spot up shooters, esp with the way Fox plays. Kicking out to Fox to shoot is like turnover with the way he shoots the 3.

I'm thinking Raptors don't make a trade for a PG unless its a significant upgrade of FVV unless their names are Doncic, Curry. with the current type of players on the team, FVV won't be the main ball handler as much as a prototypical team with the point guard handling the ball. FVV just needs to defend his position and hit 3s. Siakam, OG, Barnes etc, can initiate the offense from the SG, SF, PF, C positions now.
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1803 » by StopitLeo » Wed Aug 18, 2021 2:37 pm

LBJKB24MJ23 wrote:FVV won't be the main ball handler as much as a prototypical team with the point guard handling the ball. FVV just needs to defend his position and hit 3s. Siakam, OG, Barnes etc, can initiate the offense from the SG, SF, PF, C positions now.


I think that's the general recipe for contending teams. Your offense can't be structured around a traditional PG initiating everything (especially when they don't have size). You want skilled wing players handling the ball because they are bigger scoring threats. What you need from your traditional PG is defense and the ability to hit open 3s when those wing players draw multiple defenders.
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1804 » by LBJKB24MJ23 » Wed Aug 18, 2021 3:24 pm

StopitLeo wrote:
LBJKB24MJ23 wrote:FVV won't be the main ball handler as much as a prototypical team with the point guard handling the ball. FVV just needs to defend his position and hit 3s. Siakam, OG, Barnes etc, can initiate the offense from the SG, SF, PF, C positions now.


I think that's the general recipe for contending teams. Your offense can't be structured around a traditional PG initiating everything (especially when they don't have size). You want skilled wing players handling the ball because they are bigger scoring threats. What you need from your traditional PG is defense and the ability to hit open 3s when those wing players draw multiple defenders.


ya, i've always thought if these point guards were so amazing, why haven't any of these amazing point guards won a championship as "the man" in a long time outside of Curry - basically took a guy who became historically great to win as the man - albeit funny that he 0 Finals MVP, given the circumstances he was the backbone of all those teams that won a championship - prime example.

i think Masai and Webster have picked up on that and the needs of a team that could transform the future of the NBA.
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1805 » by StopitLeo » Wed Aug 18, 2021 3:52 pm

LBJKB24MJ23 wrote:
StopitLeo wrote:I think that's the general recipe for contending teams. Your offense can't be structured around a traditional PG initiating everything (especially when they don't have size). You want skilled wing players handling the ball because they are bigger scoring threats. What you need from your traditional PG is defense and the ability to hit open 3s when those wing players draw multiple defenders.


ya, i've always thought if these point guards were so amazing, why haven't any of these amazing point guards won a championship as "the man" in a long time outside of Curry - basically took a guy who became historically great to win as the man - albeit funny that he 0 Finals MVP, given the circumstances he was the backbone of all those teams that won a championship - prime example.

i think Masai and Webster have picked up on that and the needs of a team that could transform the future of the NBA.


I think it comes down to the fact that defenses can more effectively stop a scoring PG than a big perimeter scorer. Curry is an exception because he's the best shooter of all time who also finishes at the rim at a high level. I believe he should have won MVP over Iguodala but the fact that Durant won the other two times supports the argument. This is one reason why Barnes was a better pick than Suggs; as good as Suggs might become, he doesn't have the size that you need from the best player on a contender.
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1806 » by NotMyKawhi » Wed Aug 18, 2021 4:21 pm

So the Sixers are looking for win now players. Twolves want Simmons...

I'm thinking the sixers don't want to wait on Edwards, I would love Edwards! This D is legit. Barnes, Edwards, OG, Pascal is an elite defensive team.

Would you give up FVV and maybe more to get Edwards?
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1807 » by Rapsfan07 » Wed Aug 18, 2021 7:29 pm

RonaldArtest wrote:
Rapsfan07 wrote:
HomieOmey wrote:I'd like to start targeting young back court depth or a starting center. Would definitely reach out to Orlando to see if they had interest in using their trade exception on him in a larger deal for Cole Anthony or if the Spurs would throw us an expiring for Powell while also sending back Jakob in exchange for Boucher. Jakob had great chemistry with Siakam, would improve our team def even further, and likely save us some long term money while cleaning up our depth chart a bit.


Would love to do something around Boucher for Markkanen, if possible.

LM doesn’t strike me as a target of Masai and Co. I like his offensive skill set but that D leaves you unimpressed.


I agree with that idea in theory but practicality - how much defense do you need? We need someone who can score the basketball. This team as currently constructed is littered top to bottom with above average defenders and only one slightly above average scorer.

That simply isn't going to cut it.
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1808 » by PrinceAli » Wed Aug 18, 2021 7:35 pm

NotMyKawhi wrote:So the Sixers are looking for win now players. Twolves want Simmons...

I'm thinking the sixers don't want to wait on Edwards, I would love Edwards! This D is legit. Barnes, Edwards, OG, Pascal is an elite defensive team.

Would you give up FVV and maybe more to get Edwards?

Would I? Yes obviously

Minnesota wouldn’t even consider that tho
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1809 » by vulture » Wed Aug 18, 2021 10:45 pm

Got word from former colleagues that the whole team is in LA with the coaching staff for the Rico Runs. Earl Watson is also there.
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1810 » by DreamTeam09 » Thu Aug 19, 2021 1:15 am

We need to find a way to poach Jalen Smith from the the phx suns. His first step for someone his size is amazing, plus he block shots and hits 3s with a beautiful looking jumper.

He's gonna break out one year
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1811 » by Raps1103 » Thu Aug 19, 2021 3:40 am

OhCanada1091 wrote:
c3luong wrote:
OhCanada1091 wrote:Why would you trade Pascal? I don't understand why people think thats a good deal...none of those players are btter than Siakam and its very unlikely any of them would be in the future. So why trade away an allstar who wants to be in Toronto, the best player in the package for a bunch of players who create a logjam in our roster?

Not to mention the offer is probably just Hield and Bagley.


Fox has a decent chance of getting better than Siakam.

(He probably also has a decent chance of never getting there - will depend if he ever decides to start playing defense)


Right but they aren't trading Fox. To even think he's in conversations is ridiculous.


Not as ridiculous as the raps trading our all nba 2nd team, all star !
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1812 » by PrinceAli » Thu Aug 19, 2021 4:55 am

vulture wrote:Got word from former colleagues that the whole team is in LA with the coaching staff for the Rico Runs. Earl Watson is also there.

Really hope that includes Scottie
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1813 » by agkagk » Fri Aug 20, 2021 12:57 am

With siakam out to start the year:


Feed boucher 15 shots a game.

Hopefully he can average 20+ a game.

Try to package his value contract and bird rights with dragic for a grandfather package.
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1814 » by NotMyKawhi » Fri Aug 20, 2021 1:57 am

DreamTeam09 wrote:We need to find a way to poach Jalen Smith from the the phx suns. His first step for someone his size is amazing, plus he block shots and hits 3s with a beautiful looking jumper.

He's gonna break out one year


He can play the 4, they won't trade him. Tha'ts probably their weakest position.
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1815 » by Syd-TK3 » Fri Aug 20, 2021 5:29 am

Someone should make a offseason workout thread
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1816 » by inrapscity » Fri Aug 20, 2021 4:26 pm

Trade's brewing. No mention of Gary Trent Jr as part of future in Masai's interview.

Gary Trent + Dragic for?
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1817 » by hyper316 » Fri Aug 20, 2021 6:20 pm

inrapscity wrote:Trade's brewing. No mention of Gary Trent Jr as part of future in Masai's interview.

Gary Trent + Dragic for?


:lol:
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1818 » by agkagk » Fri Aug 20, 2021 6:31 pm

hyper316 wrote:
inrapscity wrote:Trade's brewing. No mention of Gary Trent Jr as part of future in Masai's interview.

Gary Trent + Dragic for?


:lol:



officially rooting for a dragic and trent jr for simmons trade just so we can role out a starting lineup of fred and 4 power forwards

fred-og-simmons-siakam-barnes.

'ship time folks.
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1819 » by PT416 » Fri Aug 20, 2021 6:32 pm

inrapscity wrote:Trade's brewing. No mention of Gary Trent Jr as part of future in Masai's interview.

Gary Trent + Dragic for?

Would be a dream come true. 35 million package for both of them combined. Perfect for bringing in a disgruntled all-star.

Trent + Dragic + (Boucher) 1st + (2nd) for _________

Leaves us with:
Fred
Siakam
Barnes
OG
_________
Birch
Flynn
Achiuwa
Watanabe
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Re: 2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2 

Post#1820 » by Rapsfan07 » Fri Aug 20, 2021 6:43 pm

PT416 wrote:
inrapscity wrote:Trade's brewing. No mention of Gary Trent Jr as part of future in Masai's interview.

Gary Trent + Dragic for?

Would be a dream come true. 35 million package for both of them combined. Perfect for bringing in a disgruntled all-star.

Trent + Dragic + (Boucher) 1st + (2nd) for _________

Leaves us with:
Fred
Siakam
Barnes
OG
_________
Birch
Flynn
Achiuwa
Watanabe


While I am of the belief that Masai overpaid for GTJ and he should be traded, I would imagine teams around the league would want to see him play before agreeing to take on that much money, much less send assets back in return.

On the other hand, if we're truly rebuilding, we should hang onto him unless a) his value tanks or b) we get a godfather offer.

So you see, either way we slice this, he's going to need to suit up for us. We can re-assess after that.
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