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[Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted

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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1041 » by OakleyDokely » Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:56 pm

Dallas did everything they could. They made up rumours and leaked buyout nonsense. They had Doncic meet up with him. Well, they did everything except offer a respectable package for him which is all they really needed to do.
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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1042 » by Dalek » Tue Sep 14, 2021 8:42 pm

PerfectJab wrote:
Dalek wrote:
Indeed wrote:
Growing pains is after Dragic said he preferred Dallas.

As for positionless, Dragic is a big PG who is the size of SG, so he is a good fit in that strategy. But I think it is best for Nurse to experience different lineup to see if Dragic (big playmaker) is what we needed.

I think the original thought is to try Dragic (agree to take Dragic as S&T) and see if his skillset is what we needed (along with other core players), but since Dragic said he may want to play for Dallas (after the S&T), we changed our approach and rather keep the focus with our existing core.

Regardless, at this point, if we are trading Dragic for any longer contract, we might have to trade Boucher as well, since we cannot keep him. As for Trent, I don't see him fit with us, because we have no player who can create and dish out assists, so I won't be surprised we may look to package Trent and Boucher (or more) for upgrade at trade deadline.


Good points. I completely agree about Trent in particular. Our MO is defensive IQ, size and playmaking and he fits none of that. He is on a good deal for a team looking to deal an unhappy star. Trent is a young prospect who can light it up. A team in need of shooters might want that.

Maybe someone like Beal or Simmons might be something we pursue using Trent and Boucher as key pieces - Dragic as trade ballast.


Trent and Boucher as key pieces isn't landing you Beal or Simmons :lol:


Maybe not Beal or Simmons, but I still think a young scorer like Trent Jr. plus a premium shotblocker and stretch forward is attractive. Add in Dragic a playoff desperate team might take interest. That is about $40m to work with.

If NO wants to move on from Ingram he could be added with Thomas Satoransky for the Dragic/Trent/Boucher plus FRP package.

I still think Philly would consider a deal like this for Simmons if he is still there in December - when this deal would have to wait until.

Golden State might like it if we deal for Wiggins plus Kuminga and spare parts for the same package. Wiggins is less ideal, but if we get Kuminga or Moody in return the deal would be worth it.
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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1043 » by mihaic » Wed Sep 15, 2021 1:16 pm

PerfectJab wrote:
Trent and Boucher as key pieces isn't landing you Beal or Simmons :lol:


Poeltl and DeRozan as key pieces isn't landing you Kawhi :lol:

Stranger things have happened. Beal I agree as Wizards have leverage and he did not demand out, but Simmons situation is similar to Kawhi at the time as well as both of them trying to force his destination to LA only.
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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1044 » by LBJKB24MJ23 » Wed Sep 15, 2021 1:34 pm

mihaic wrote:
PerfectJab wrote:
Trent and Boucher as key pieces isn't landing you Beal or Simmons :lol:


Poeltl and DeRozan as key pieces isn't landing you Kawhi :lol:

Stranger things have happened. Beal I agree as Wizards have leverage and he did not demand out, but Simmons situation is similar to Kawhi at the time as well as both of them trying to force his destination to LA only.


there are better packages out there for Simmons than Trent and Boucher. similar to SA for trading Kawhi, was that they get an all-star back in return. There is no way Philly trades Ben Simmons for role players as they are in contending status.

Similarly if Ben Simmons was a Toronto Raptors, you wouldn't want Trent and Boucher, lets be reasonable here. you would want at least a former first round pick(s), picks, an Allstar- for the all star Ben Simmons.
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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1045 » by WaltFrazier » Wed Sep 15, 2021 2:33 pm

C_Money wrote:
OakleyDokely wrote:
Spoiler:





But but but Fischer said buyout was coming...


Good to see! And he’s here earlier than he has to be.


This IS good. Smart veteran guard, you play him and see how it goes, can always move at the deadline. Meanwhile his experience can only help, not hurt, the young guys.
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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1046 » by Tacoma » Wed Sep 15, 2021 3:17 pm

Dalek wrote:
Indeed wrote:
Dalek wrote:
I can see that Lowry lite role, but Dragic's minutes are down and trending that way, plus that is a very small team which kind of goes against the whole 6'9 positionless concept Nurse and Bobby are promoting in interviews.

My understanding is that the growing pains are about FVV, OG, Siakam playing the leadership roles. Dragic was not even mentioned by Masai as a piece to help Toronto.


Growing pains is after Dragic said he preferred Dallas.

As for positionless, Dragic is a big PG who is the size of SG, so he is a good fit in that strategy. But I think it is best for Nurse to experience different lineup to see if Dragic (big playmaker) is what we needed.

I think the original thought is to try Dragic (agree to take Dragic as S&T) and see if his skillset is what we needed (along with other core players), but since Dragic said he may want to play for Dallas (after the S&T), we changed our approach and rather keep the focus with our existing core.

Regardless, at this point, if we are trading Dragic for any longer contract, we might have to trade Boucher as well, since we cannot keep him. As for Trent, I don't see him fit with us, because we have no player who can create and dish out assists, so I won't be surprised we may look to package Trent and Boucher (or more) for upgrade at trade deadline.


Good points. I completely agree about Trent in particular. Our MO is defensive IQ, size and playmaking and he fits none of that. He is on a good deal for a team looking to deal an unhappy star. Trent is a young prospect who can light it up. A team in need of shooters might want that.

Maybe someone like Beal or Simmons might be something we pursue using Trent and Boucher as key pieces - Dragic as trade ballast.


A team of defense first players isn't going to work either. Among the <25, we already have OG, Barnes and Flynn who are not offense first players, so you need balance and GTR fits from that perspective. I don't see Masai trading GTR but rather developing him. Masai must saw potential in him to trade Norm for him; he's a hard worker and has lots of self confidence after having worked his way to from a 2nd round pick to being a starter in Portland.

Masai said we are not a "now" team and will give time and opportunities for the younger players to develop this season which will benefit GTR. Nurse deploys good team defensive systems and I think he's going to learn and pleasantly surprise his doubters.
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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1047 » by Federalies » Wed Sep 15, 2021 4:09 pm

If and when Dragic gets moved, this is my dream trade! Not sure Dallas buys in but it’s possible until it’s not! :wink: :lol:

Mavs:
Dragic

Raps:
Powell - for salary matching
Josh Green - as a young SG prospect (rounds out our collection of 2020 FR picks - Green #18, Precious #20, and Flynn #29)
Moses Brown - high upside/low cost C prospect

https://raptorsrapture.com/2021/09/15/raptors-3-best-assets-mavericks-goran-dragic-trade/

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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1048 » by Indeed » Wed Sep 15, 2021 4:10 pm

Tacoma wrote:
Dalek wrote:
Indeed wrote:
Growing pains is after Dragic said he preferred Dallas.

As for positionless, Dragic is a big PG who is the size of SG, so he is a good fit in that strategy. But I think it is best for Nurse to experience different lineup to see if Dragic (big playmaker) is what we needed.

I think the original thought is to try Dragic (agree to take Dragic as S&T) and see if his skillset is what we needed (along with other core players), but since Dragic said he may want to play for Dallas (after the S&T), we changed our approach and rather keep the focus with our existing core.

Regardless, at this point, if we are trading Dragic for any longer contract, we might have to trade Boucher as well, since we cannot keep him. As for Trent, I don't see him fit with us, because we have no player who can create and dish out assists, so I won't be surprised we may look to package Trent and Boucher (or more) for upgrade at trade deadline.


Good points. I completely agree about Trent in particular. Our MO is defensive IQ, size and playmaking and he fits none of that. He is on a good deal for a team looking to deal an unhappy star. Trent is a young prospect who can light it up. A team in need of shooters might want that.

Maybe someone like Beal or Simmons might be something we pursue using Trent and Boucher as key pieces - Dragic as trade ballast.


A team of defense first players isn't going to work either. Among the <25, we already have OG, Barnes and Flynn who are not offense first players, so you need balance and GTR fits from that perspective. I don't see Masai trading GTR but rather developing him. Masai must saw potential in him to trade Norm for him; he's a hard worker and has lots of self confidence after having worked his way to from a 2nd round pick to being a starter in Portland.

Masai said we are not a "now" team and will give time and opportunities for the younger players to develop this season which will benefit GTR. Nurse deploys good team defensive systems and I think he's going to learn and pleasantly surprise his doubters.


Th problem with Trent isn't his mind set.

The problem with Trent is his lack of versatility on offense. He has very limited on ball skills. He cannot make the pass on the move, he cannot drive past his man (lack of quick first step, lack of moves/skills). Those are not something workhard can over come.
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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1049 » by Dalek » Wed Sep 15, 2021 5:03 pm

Tacoma wrote:
Dalek wrote:
Indeed wrote:
Growing pains is after Dragic said he preferred Dallas.

As for positionless, Dragic is a big PG who is the size of SG, so he is a good fit in that strategy. But I think it is best for Nurse to experience different lineup to see if Dragic (big playmaker) is what we needed.

I think the original thought is to try Dragic (agree to take Dragic as S&T) and see if his skillset is what we needed (along with other core players), but since Dragic said he may want to play for Dallas (after the S&T), we changed our approach and rather keep the focus with our existing core.

Regardless, at this point, if we are trading Dragic for any longer contract, we might have to trade Boucher as well, since we cannot keep him. As for Trent, I don't see him fit with us, because we have no player who can create and dish out assists, so I won't be surprised we may look to package Trent and Boucher (or more) for upgrade at trade deadline.


Good points. I completely agree about Trent in particular. Our MO is defensive IQ, size and playmaking and he fits none of that. He is on a good deal for a team looking to deal an unhappy star. Trent is a young prospect who can light it up. A team in need of shooters might want that.

Maybe someone like Beal or Simmons might be something we pursue using Trent and Boucher as key pieces - Dragic as trade ballast.


A team of defense first players isn't going to work either. Among the <25, we already have OG, Barnes and Flynn who are not offense first players, so you need balance and GTR fits from that perspective. I don't see Masai trading GTR but rather developing him. Masai must saw potential in him to trade Norm for him; he's a hard worker and has lots of self confidence after having worked his way to from a 2nd round pick to being a starter in Portland.

Masai said we are not a "now" team and will give time and opportunities for the younger players to develop this season which will benefit GTR. Nurse deploys good team defensive systems and I think he's going to learn and pleasantly surprise his doubters.


I did like GTR with Portland during the Bubble. He had some big games and showed a fearlessness. I just put a bit of ceiling on his growth because he is more of a combo guard. Unless he becomes like Devin Booker (plus shooting with playmaking and foul drawing skill), he is more of a 6 man type to me. To me, he'd be a weakpoint to exploit on defense.
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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1050 » by RapsFan008 » Wed Sep 15, 2021 5:24 pm

Federalies wrote:If and when Dragic gets moved, this is my dream trade! Not sure Dallas buys in but it’s possible until it’s not! :wink: :lol:

Mavs:
Dragic

Raps:
Powell - for salary matching
Josh Green - as a young SG prospect (rounds out our collection of 2020 FR picks - Green #18, Precious #20, and Flynn #29)
Moses Brown - high upside/low cost C prospect

https://raptorsrapture.com/2021/09/15/raptors-3-best-assets-mavericks-goran-dragic-trade/


That's my dream trade too 8-)...but yeah we're not getting that much. If we can throw in some sweetener to get both Green + Brown (collect all the colours!) then I'm also down with that.
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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1051 » by Federalies » Wed Sep 15, 2021 5:54 pm

Interesting ripple effect related to the Mavs picking up Frank Ntilikina.

In short, they seem to be one guaranteed contract over which in turn potentially signals that one or more players are on their way out! This Tweet suggests it’s Burke but it could be anyone…or two…or three! :wink: :wink:

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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1052 » by C_Money » Thu Sep 16, 2021 12:43 am

Why the hell would we want Dwight Powell’s $11 million/yr contract tho?

Also Josh Green and Moses Brown are low level prospects. Any trade with Dallas doesn’t make sense for us.
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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1053 » by alan_156 » Thu Sep 16, 2021 1:05 am

I still think Moses Brown would be a great get for us. I think boucher will be traded at the trade deadline which would leave us pretty thin up front. We also don't have a 7 ftr on our team, which i think is important. Brown has also shown that he can play and put up numbers (i know on a bad team, but still), there's no reason why we can't develop him, he's 22 with tons of potential.

I'm not too worried about Dwight powell's contract, there's worse contracts out there than his for 11 million, plus he only has 2 years left on his contract and could be used as an expiring trade asset next year.

We're only going to improve via trades, not in free agency... Getting a good prospect likes moses brown on a cheap contract and developing him in our system could be a steal.

I would do dragic for powell+brown+burke all day
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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1054 » by Federalies » Thu Sep 16, 2021 2:00 am

C_Money wrote:Why the hell would we want Dwight Powell’s $11 million/yr contract tho?

Also Josh Green and Moses Brown are low level prospects. Any trade with Dallas doesn’t make sense for us.


My friend, no one really wants Powell but you need to make the money work. You’re not going to get a good big dollar player with Dragic! As such, you’re looking for a team who needs a secondary creator and has a few “decent” but not “great” prospects and salary filler I.e. players like Powell.

If you don’t mind me asking, who do you think we can get for Dragic if it’s not the Mavs potential package? What other teams need/want a declining secondary creator making $19.4 mill?
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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1055 » by Kurtz » Thu Sep 16, 2021 3:57 am

Federalies wrote:
C_Money wrote:Why the hell would we want Dwight Powell’s $11 million/yr contract tho?

Also Josh Green and Moses Brown are low level prospects. Any trade with Dallas doesn’t make sense for us.


My friend, no one really wants Powell but you need to make the money work. You’re not going to get a good big dollar player with Dragic! As such, you’re looking for a team who needs a secondary creator and has a few “decent” but not “great” prospects and salary filler I.e. players like Powell.

If you don’t mind me asking, who do you think we can get for Dragic if it’s not the Mavs potential package? What other teams need/want a declining secondary creator making $19.4 mill?


I'd bet that several contenders would be interested in a 6th man like Dragic (if he looks good early). How much value they'd be willing to give up is a different matter though.
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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1056 » by mihaic » Thu Sep 16, 2021 4:10 am

C_Money wrote:Why the hell would we want Dwight Powell’s $11 million/yr contract tho?

Also Josh Green and Moses Brown are low level prospects. Any trade with Dallas doesn’t make sense for us.


And I was told Birch is paid lavishly... what's dwight powell then?
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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1057 » by Federalies » Thu Sep 16, 2021 4:17 am

Kurtz wrote:
Federalies wrote:
C_Money wrote:Why the hell would we want Dwight Powell’s $11 million/yr contract tho?

Also Josh Green and Moses Brown are low level prospects. Any trade with Dallas doesn’t make sense for us.


My friend, no one really wants Powell but you need to make the money work. You’re not going to get a good big dollar player with Dragic! As such, you’re looking for a team who needs a secondary creator and has a few “decent” but not “great” prospects and salary filler I.e. players like Powell.

If you don’t mind me asking, who do you think we can get for Dragic if it’s not the Mavs potential package? What other teams need/want a declining secondary creator making $19.4 mill?


I'd bet that several contenders would be interested in a 6th man like Dragic (if he looks good early). How much value they'd be willing to give up is a different matter though.


Oh I agree there’s likely a few, just not many!

Your second point re: value is key. It just seems hard to beat the Mavs mix of need (secondary creator), want (Luka’s buddy/mentor), and ability (decent but not great prospects and acceptable but not exciting salary filler)!
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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1058 » by C_Money » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:44 am

Federalies wrote:
C_Money wrote:Why the hell would we want Dwight Powell’s $11 million/yr contract tho?

Also Josh Green and Moses Brown are low level prospects. Any trade with Dallas doesn’t make sense for us.


My friend, no one really wants Powell but you need to make the money work. You’re not going to get a good big dollar player with Dragic! As such, you’re looking for a team who needs a secondary creator and has a few “decent” but not “great” prospects and salary filler I.e. players like Powell.

If you don’t mind me asking, who do you think we can get for Dragic if it’s not the Mavs potential package? What other teams need/want a declining secondary creator making $19.4 mill?


There’s no reason to do the trade if all we’re getting back is a bad contract and a couple bench warmers. We’d be better off just buying Dragic out.

Wait until the trade deadline and see if something better comes along.
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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1059 » by alan_156 » Thu Sep 16, 2021 12:40 pm

C_Money wrote:
Federalies wrote:
C_Money wrote:Why the hell would we want Dwight Powell’s $11 million/yr contract tho?

Also Josh Green and Moses Brown are low level prospects. Any trade with Dallas doesn’t make sense for us.


My friend, no one really wants Powell but you need to make the money work. You’re not going to get a good big dollar player with Dragic! As such, you’re looking for a team who needs a secondary creator and has a few “decent” but not “great” prospects and salary filler I.e. players like Powell.

If you don’t mind me asking, who do you think we can get for Dragic if it’s not the Mavs potential package? What other teams need/want a declining secondary creator making $19.4 mill?


There’s no reason to do the trade if all we’re getting back is a bad contract and a couple bench warmers. We’d be better off just buying Dragic out.

Wait until the trade deadline and see if something better comes along.


Buy out dragic and do what with the cap room exactly? Sign a fringe nba player from overseas? We'll only get better via trades or draft, not through free agency.
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Re: [Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted 

Post#1060 » by bongmarley » Thu Sep 16, 2021 1:04 pm

alan_156 wrote:
C_Money wrote:
Federalies wrote:
My friend, no one really wants Powell but you need to make the money work. You’re not going to get a good big dollar player with Dragic! As such, you’re looking for a team who needs a secondary creator and has a few “decent” but not “great” prospects and salary filler I.e. players like Powell.

If you don’t mind me asking, who do you think we can get for Dragic if it’s not the Mavs potential package? What other teams need/want a declining secondary creator making $19.4 mill?


There’s no reason to do the trade if all we’re getting back is a bad contract and a couple bench warmers. We’d be better off just buying Dragic out.

Wait until the trade deadline and see if something better comes along.


Buy out dragic and do what with the cap room exactly? Sign a fringe nba player from overseas? We'll only get better via trades or draft, not through free agency.


There is no cap space even if you buy him out

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