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Updated salary situation for 2021-2022.

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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#201 » by Indeed » Wed Oct 27, 2021 12:01 pm

douggood wrote:
Marmoset wrote:I apologize if this has already been answered somewhere, but I have a question about Dragic and the luxury tax. I've read in this thread that we're slightly above the tax line right now. If we trade Dragic, that would be an ideal way to solve the problem. However, I was wondering how it works if we end up buying out Dragic. I believe we're something like $1.7M above the tax, so if we bought out Dragic for let's say $2M less than his total salary for the season, does this mean that we are under the luxury tax, or does the full salary still count towards that?

we would be under the tax if we bought him out in your scenario.


I am not sure that would be the case.
We are 1m above the tax. If Dragic signed for 1m + vet min contract, we should be at the tax line. I think he will need him to sign a 3m contract for us to be below the tax.
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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#202 » by douggood » Wed Oct 27, 2021 1:21 pm

Indeed wrote:
douggood wrote:
Marmoset wrote:I apologize if this has already been answered somewhere, but I have a question about Dragic and the luxury tax. I've read in this thread that we're slightly above the tax line right now. If we trade Dragic, that would be an ideal way to solve the problem. However, I was wondering how it works if we end up buying out Dragic. I believe we're something like $1.7M above the tax, so if we bought out Dragic for let's say $2M less than his total salary for the season, does this mean that we are under the luxury tax, or does the full salary still count towards that?

we would be under the tax if we bought him out in your scenario.


I am not sure that would be the case.
We are 1m above the tax. If Dragic signed for 1m + vet min contract, we should be at the tax line. I think he will need him to sign a 3m contract for us to be below the tax.

what? what dragic signs for after a buyout with another team doesnt matter to the raptors tax cap, the buyout amount does, as long as he forgoes more than 1.7 mil we would be under the tax line..

are you taking about next season or this, because i responded to a question about the cap/tax situation this season.
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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#203 » by aligator » Wed Oct 27, 2021 1:23 pm

Good to see that folks are finally coming to the realization that a Dragic buyout is the best move going forward.
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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#204 » by ItsDanger » Wed Oct 27, 2021 1:49 pm

aligator wrote:Good to see that folks are finally coming to the realization that a Dragic buyout is the best move going forward.

But I was lectured repeatedly that it was a "stupid" move? Unfortunately this was predictable during free agency period.
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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#205 » by Indeed » Wed Oct 27, 2021 2:49 pm

douggood wrote:
Indeed wrote:
douggood wrote:we would be under the tax if we bought him out in your scenario.


I am not sure that would be the case.
We are 1m above the tax. If Dragic signed for 1m + vet min contract, we should be at the tax line. I think he will need him to sign a 3m contract for us to be below the tax.

what? what dragic signs for after a buyout with another team doesnt matter to the raptors tax cap, the buyout amount does, as long as he forgoes more than 1.7 mil we would be under the tax line..

are you taking about next season or this, because i responded to a question about the cap/tax situation this season.


Please see the definition of Buyout from cbafaq:
http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q66

My understanding is that it is equivalent of being waived. The detailed of his guaranteed salary being reduced is uncertain to me, but if a player is waived, his salary is on the book with the subtraction of any money he makes above vet min.
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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#206 » by douggood » Wed Oct 27, 2021 3:20 pm

Indeed wrote:
douggood wrote:
Indeed wrote:
I am not sure that would be the case.
We are 1m above the tax. If Dragic signed for 1m + vet min contract, we should be at the tax line. I think he will need him to sign a 3m contract for us to be below the tax.

what? what dragic signs for after a buyout with another team doesnt matter to the raptors tax cap, the buyout amount does, as long as he forgoes more than 1.7 mil we would be under the tax line..

are you taking about next season or this, because i responded to a question about the cap/tax situation this season.


Please see the definition of Buyout from cbafaq:
http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q66

My understanding is that it is equivalent of being waived. The detailed of his guaranteed salary being reduced is uncertain to me, but if a player is waived, his salary is on the book with the subtraction of any money he makes above vet min.
'
goran makes 19.4, if he agrees to buy out of $2.4, he will count 17 mil to the raptors cap.

you should be looking at qestion 67
How do buyouts affect team salary?
Any guaranteed salary still owed to the player as the result of a buyout continues to be included in team salary, just as with any waived player.

the buyout agreement will reduce the guaranteed salary.

also you can go look at the multitude of examples from past year, kemba, blake griffin, lamarcus, deandre jordan etc.

this link explains is better in plain english, not the cbafaq legalese

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2020/02/hoops-rumors-glossary-buyouts-2.html

The equation for a player in the final year of his contract is pretty simple — the amount he agrees to give up in the buyout is simply subtracted from his overall cap hit. Kidd-Gilchrist, for instance, agreed to surrender $810,763 from his $13MM salary, reduced his cap charge for the Hornets from $13,000,000 to $12,189,237.
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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#207 » by mapka » Wed Oct 27, 2021 4:43 pm

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/oklahoma-city-thunder/cap/

Look at the dead money for Kemba. It´s his guaranteed salary minus the money he earns in NYK. Doesn´t matter at all, how much he left on the table with his buyout.

€dit. OK you can´t really see it, because the figures are to similar.
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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#208 » by Indeed » Wed Oct 27, 2021 5:32 pm

mapka wrote:https://www.spotrac.com/nba/oklahoma-city-thunder/cap/

Look at the dead money for Kemba. It´s his guaranteed salary minus the money he earns in NYK. Doesn´t matter at all, how much he left on the table with his buyout.

€dit. OK you can´t really see it, because the figures are to similar.


At the end, players aren't making a 10% paycut, as my understanding.
To me, I don't think Dragic is taking more than 2m off in our case.
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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#209 » by mapka » Thu Oct 28, 2021 3:47 pm

Indeed wrote:
mapka wrote:https://www.spotrac.com/nba/oklahoma-city-thunder/cap/

Look at the dead money for Kemba. It´s his guaranteed salary minus the money he earns in NYK. Doesn´t matter at all, how much he left on the table with his buyout.

€dit. OK you can´t really see it, because the figures are to similar.


At the end, players aren't making a 10% paycut, as my understanding.
To me, I don't think Dragic is taking more than 2m off in our case.


As longer it takes, as less will he give back. Until there has to be any trade just to not look as you have feckud it up. But I can also understand to keep him in, at least to ´til everybody is tradeable.
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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#210 » by Indeed » Thu Oct 28, 2021 3:57 pm

mapka wrote:
Indeed wrote:
mapka wrote:https://www.spotrac.com/nba/oklahoma-city-thunder/cap/

Look at the dead money for Kemba. It´s his guaranteed salary minus the money he earns in NYK. Doesn´t matter at all, how much he left on the table with his buyout.

€dit. OK you can´t really see it, because the figures are to similar.


At the end, players aren't making a 10% paycut, as my understanding.
To me, I don't think Dragic is taking more than 2m off in our case.


As longer it takes, as less will he give back. Until there has to be any trade just to not look as you have feckud it up. But I can also understand to keep him in, at least to ´til everybody is tradeable.


It was Dragic who wants to be traded to Dallas, it doesn't mean Toronto wants to trade him to Dallas, please understand that fact.

His expiring may attach with Boucher / Flynn or even Trent to acquire for an upgrade. He is more a filler than we are expecting him to have value on his own. We are holding him for a bigger contract than you think he can be traded by himself.
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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#211 » by bluerap23 » Sun Nov 7, 2021 12:07 am

Updated:

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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#212 » by TheProfessor » Mon Nov 8, 2021 12:20 am

If we could trade Birch and GTjr for cap, We could be in the running for Jokic in 23-24. Fred/OG/Barnes/Siakam/Jokic. Yes please
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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#213 » by Indeed » Wed Nov 10, 2021 3:23 pm

TheProfessor wrote:If we could trade Birch and GTjr for cap, We could be in the running for Jokic in 23-24. Fred/OG/Barnes/Siakam/Jokic. Yes please


It depends on Banton's contract as well. And assume our 2022 and 2023 rookie contracts are averaging 3m, we may still be a tax team even moving away from Birch and Trent.

Assume VanVleet and Trent opts in for their player option, and we trade Trent and Birch, we might be best to move Flynn (3.8m) for two vet min contracts in filling out the roster. That would be about 140m for 9 players, and 7m below the tax with 6 (or 5) roster spots to fill (1m for rookie min, maybe that works).
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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#214 » by 10giz » Fri Nov 12, 2021 8:19 am

Indeed wrote:
TheProfessor wrote:If we could trade Birch and GTjr for cap, We could be in the running for Jokic in 23-24. Fred/OG/Barnes/Siakam/Jokic. Yes please


It depends on Banton's contract as well. And assume our 2022 and 2023 rookie contracts are averaging 3m, we may still be a tax team even moving away from Birch and Trent.

Assume VanVleet and Trent opts in for their player option, and we trade Trent and Birch, we might be best to move Flynn (3.8m) for two vet min contracts in filling out the roster. That would be about 140m for 9 players, and 7m below the tax with 6 (or 5) roster spots to fill (1m for rookie min, maybe that works).


No thanks. We don't sign stars here. We build our own.
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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#215 » by 10giz » Fri Nov 12, 2021 8:23 am

ItsDanger wrote:
aligator wrote:Good to see that folks are finally coming to the realization that a Dragic buyout is the best move going forward.

But I was lectured repeatedly that it was a "stupid" move? Unfortunately this was predictable during free agency period.


Most people just stopped caring.

Sports changes fast. What was stupid then might not be now and vice versa.

The only "stupid move" is any of us thinking we know better than our FO.

I will never, ever believe a player can't be traded for value. Not after the Bargnani deal.

That was the ultimate - never ever say never ever - moment for me.

The deal that kicked off our little dynasty that could.
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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#216 » by Chandan » Tue Nov 16, 2021 5:49 am

Can't believe we are this close to going over the CAP with this crappy roster.
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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#217 » by aligator » Tue Nov 16, 2021 7:51 pm

We are way over the Cap. It's the luxury tax that we are near.
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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#218 » by SFour » Tue Nov 16, 2021 7:58 pm

TheProfessor wrote:If we could trade Birch and GTjr for cap, We could be in the running for Jokic in 23-24. Fred/OG/Barnes/Siakam/Jokic. Yes please


I don't see Jokic leaving the Nuggets
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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#219 » by 10giz » Tue Nov 16, 2021 11:17 pm

Chandan wrote:Can't believe we are this close to going over the CAP with this crappy roster.


Crappy? What are you talking about? This is the best roster we've had outside our title year and it ain't even close.

2/3 of the **** league is at or above $130M.

FVV, OG, Siakam and Trent are all amongst the best contracts in the leagues for what they do right now, all top defenders at their positions, all borderline all star caliber players.

Svi, Birch and Yuta are all tremendous values for what they provide and make combined lesss than Josh Richardson or Dwight Powell alone.

CHI, CLE, WAS, MIN, BOS, POR all have higher payrolls than us. IND, SAC, HOU and DET are within 9 million lower. All these **** rosters are crappier than ours as a whole and in terms of flexibility/value contracts.

We also have as of now 30M coming off the books this year. Not only that but basically all our players will come off the books either summer 2023 or 2024.

Explain to me what you prefer to this roster we have? How would you uncrappify it?
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Re: Updated salary situation for 2021-2022. 

Post#220 » by Young Moosehead » Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:54 am

Indeed wrote:
TheProfessor wrote:If we could trade Birch and GTjr for cap, We could be in the running for Jokic in 23-24. Fred/OG/Barnes/Siakam/Jokic. Yes please


It depends on Banton's contract as well. And assume our 2022 and 2023 rookie contracts are averaging 3m, we may still be a tax team even moving away from Birch and Trent.

Assume VanVleet and Trent opts in for their player option, and we trade Trent and Birch, we might be best to move Flynn (3.8m) for two vet min contracts in filling out the roster. That would be about 140m for 9 players, and 7m below the tax with 6 (or 5) roster spots to fill (1m for rookie min, maybe that works).


Not a bad vision of the future. With the cap jump in 2025 we could have the cash to sign a nice bench piece and still be under the tax.

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