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Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains

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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#401 » by Raps in 4 » Mon Sep 13, 2021 2:58 am

Clay Davis wrote:
720 wrote:
Clay Davis wrote:
Not necessarily dude. The Wiz arguably have a top 10 player. So did the Pelicans. Now that I think about it, the Celtics do too. All of em are/were on the treadmill.

How are the Celtics on a treadmill? They have a top 15-20 player in Tatum who is only 22 years old who is already putting up 26, 7 and 6. He is already so good and has room to grow. The Celtic's ceiling will be determined by Tatum and Brown's growth.

I literally said to not be on the treadmill you need a high level shot creator prospect. He is one of the best ones in the league.

Do we have anyone even close on our team?

Okay I forgot how young Tatum and Brown are lol. Tatum is definitely high level, so is Brown, but despite their presence on the team the Celtics haven't felt like true contenders in the last few years and it still feels like they're like two or three pieces away from being contenders. Even then, I don't see them being better than the Nets, the Bucks, or the 76ers within the next two years or the Hawks after that.


If Ainge wasn't so stingy, they could have flipped Brown and a few picks for Harden and easily beaten the Bucks and prevented the Nets super team from forming. When you have the kind of core they do, you're never far from contention.
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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#402 » by dagger » Mon Sep 13, 2021 3:38 am

DG88 wrote:I've said it before we're going to be rebuilding this year. Will be a 32-39 win team and back in the lottery and get another good young player to build with.


39 wins will probably get you the eighth seed and certainly a place in the play-in. So I don't know how good a pick that suggests.
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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#403 » by dagger » Mon Sep 13, 2021 3:41 am

C_Money wrote:Shocking comments from our leader Masai tbh. Ask Fred and Pascal if they think we’re going to suck this year. The answer is no.


Growing pins does not necessarily mean sucks... It might mean nights where Scottie Barnes is 2-20 from from the field and RealGM pulls its hair out, or where Precious takes some threes and they are airballs. It means the team will push the development of its younger assets, maybe go out of its way some nights to make OG the #1 option, and it might look rather bad at times but you don't get better without doing those things.
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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#404 » by ConSarnit » Mon Sep 13, 2021 4:16 am

dagger wrote:
C_Money wrote:Shocking comments from our leader Masai tbh. Ask Fred and Pascal if they think we’re going to suck this year. The answer is no.


Growing pins does not necessarily mean sucks... It might mean nights where Scottie Barnes is 2-20 from from the field and RealGM pulls its hair out, or where Precious takes some threes and they are airballs. It means the team will push the development of its younger assets, maybe go out of its way some nights to make OG the #1 option, and it might look rather bad at times but you don't get better without doing those things.


To me, this would be an acceptable outcome, even if it means more losses.

I can deal with losing as long as there is a supposed payout down the line. Some things that might cause us losses this year but should be acceptable given the long term outlook of this team:

-giving Barnes the ball and seeing what he can do
-ditto for OG
-letting GTJ run pnr to see if he has any feel for it
-Precious “stretching” the floor

Unacceptable: another 2005 Mike James-like season where a random journeyman decides this is “his” offense. Luckily we don’t have a guy like that on this team.

I don’t mind using this season to see what the young guys can (or cannot) do.
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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#405 » by Pointgod » Mon Sep 13, 2021 5:02 am

720 wrote:
Clay Davis wrote:
720 wrote:How are the Celtics on a treadmill? They have a top 15-20 player in Tatum who is only 22 years old who is already putting up 26, 7 and 6. He is already so good and has room to grow. The Celtic's ceiling will be determined by Tatum and Brown's growth.

I literally said to not be on the treadmill you need a high level shot creator prospect. He is one of the best ones in the league.

Do we have anyone even close on our team?

Okay I forgot how young Tatum and Brown are lol. Tatum is definitely high level, so is Brown, but despite their presence on the team the Celtics haven't felt like true contenders in the last few years and it still feels like they're like two or three pieces away from being contenders. Even then, I don't see them being better than the Nets, the Bucks, or the 76ers within the next two years or the Hawks after that.

The Celtics have two guys in their early 20s putting up monster numbers and both are locked up in long term deals. Those are the kind of pieces every rebuilding team would want on their roster. That's the kind of core many people here in this thread want. Give Masai a Tatum and Brown like duo and see what kind of magic he would pull off.


If Ainge had pulled the trigger for Anthony Davis the Celtics would be talked about in the same vein as the Bucks and Nets right now.
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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#406 » by everdiso » Mon Sep 13, 2021 5:25 am

It's amazing to me that people still overrate the Celtics so badly after all these years.
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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#407 » by Clay Davis » Mon Sep 13, 2021 5:41 am

720 wrote:
Clay Davis wrote:
720 wrote:How are the Celtics on a treadmill? They have a top 15-20 player in Tatum who is only 22 years old who is already putting up 26, 7 and 6. He is already so good and has room to grow. The Celtic's ceiling will be determined by Tatum and Brown's growth.

I literally said to not be on the treadmill you need a high level shot creator prospect. He is one of the best ones in the league.

Do we have anyone even close on our team?

Okay I forgot how young Tatum and Brown are lol. Tatum is definitely high level, so is Brown, but despite their presence on the team the Celtics haven't felt like true contenders in the last few years and it still feels like they're like two or three pieces away from being contenders. Even then, I don't see them being better than the Nets, the Bucks, or the 76ers within the next two years or the Hawks after that.

The Celtics have two guys in their early 20s putting up monster numbers and both are locked up in long term deals. Those are the kind of pieces every rebuilding team would want on their roster. That's the kind of core many people here in this thread want. Give Masai a Tatum and Brown like duo and see what kind of magic he would pull off.


My entire point is that having mere pieces of the puzzle doesn't entail you're not treadmilling. The Celtics have been intending to contend for the past few seasons. You can twiddle around with the definition of 'treadmilling' but saying it just implies upside is rather vacuous, since you can't also imply some forms of upside are more restrictive or lower value than others... You'd need to work that into the definition too.

Sure, rebuilding teams would like them, but that's since it implies their rebuild is over as they have two young stars to build around. Fine and dandy, but if you don't surround them with the right talent and have a coherent plan to get it, you'll just be topping out at second round exits and feel pressured to reorganize your entire FO and coaching stuff, since it's clear you're essentially treadmilling. Getting close to being off the treadmill of not contending doesn't imply you're not treadmilling when you've been trying repetitively over three seasons to contend.

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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#408 » by Raps in 4 » Mon Sep 13, 2021 7:19 am

everdiso wrote:It's amazing to me that people still overrate the Celtics so badly after all these years.


Tatum is a legitimate top-10 player. When you have a player of his calibre, getting over the hump becomes a lot easier. For example, trading for Harden last year (which was very much in play for them) would have very likely brought them a title.

When you have one elite talent on your team, you're already halfway to a title.

I'm hoping Barnes can become our Tatum somehow. They are both SFs that were taken ahead of consensus BPA PGs who didn't impress in workouts. Maybe that's the universe telling us their careers will be mirrored too... :pray:
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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#409 » by God Squad » Mon Sep 13, 2021 9:07 am

Raps in 4 wrote:
everdiso wrote:It's amazing to me that people still overrate the Celtics so badly after all these years.


Tatum is a legitimate top-10 player. When you have a player of his calibre, getting over the hump becomes a lot easier. For example, trading for Harden last year (which was very much in play for them) would have very likely brought them a title.

When you have one elite talent on your team, you're already halfway to a title.

I'm hoping Barnes can become our Tatum somehow. They are both SFs that were taken ahead of consensus BPA PGs who didn't impress in workouts. Maybe that's the universe telling us their careers will be mirrored too... :pray:

I also think the Celtics are overrated, but like you said they hit on their top 5 picks (Tatum and Brown) and both hold huge value to rebuilding/contenders.
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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#410 » by HumbleRen » Mon Sep 13, 2021 11:42 am

Regardless of how we feel about the Celtics, I rather be in their position then ours.

Jayson Tatum is GTJ’s age and is already a borderline top 10 player. Jaylen Brown has the best contract in the NBA. He’s basically what we’re hoping OG can become while being the same age as him.

Cap room to sign a max next year. I think they’ll just be fine lol.
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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#411 » by lobosloboslobos » Mon Sep 13, 2021 11:43 am

lol man oh man what a collection of whiny biatches
i miss the days when the haters and trolls on this board had humour and intelligence and swag
now it's just spoiled brats complaining endlessly
i'd love to put the 20 or 30 of you who can't stop with your know-it-all negativity in a room with Masai and watch him shred your hot takes like a katana through tofu
then he'd take you out on the court and dunk on all your asses and then he'd hand me a thick wad of Benjamins to Uber you all to Buffalo and leave you in Lackawanna
8-) :lol:
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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#412 » by everdiso » Mon Sep 13, 2021 12:02 pm

Raps in 4 wrote:
Tatum is a legitimate top-10 player.


I repeat - it is amazing to me that people overrate the Celtics so badly after all these years.
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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#413 » by everdiso » Mon Sep 13, 2021 12:07 pm

HumbleRen wrote:Regardless of how we feel about the Celtics, I rather be in their position then ours.

Jayson Tatum is GTJ’s age


False.

and is already a borderline top 10 player.


False.

Jaylen Brown has the best contract in the NBA.


False.

He’s basically what we’re hoping OG can become


False.

while being the same age as him.


False.

Cap room to sign a max next year.



False.
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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#414 » by HumbleRen » Mon Sep 13, 2021 12:33 pm

everdiso wrote:
HumbleRen wrote:Regardless of how we feel about the Celtics, I rather be in their position then ours.

Jayson Tatum is GTJ’s age


False.

and is already a borderline top 10 player.


False.

Jaylen Brown has the best contract in the NBA.


False.

He’s basically what we’re hoping OG can become


False.

while being the same age as him.


False.

Cap room to sign a max next year.



False.



Less than a year difference between Jayson Tatum and GTJ

Truth.

Borderline top 10 player.

Truth

Jaylen Brown makes 25M a year as one of the best 2 way players in the league.

Truth

Less than a year difference between OG and Jaylen Brown.

Truth.


Extremely salary friendly contracts to make a move for a max player in 2022.

Truth.
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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#415 » by everdiso » Mon Sep 13, 2021 12:38 pm

HumbleRen wrote:
everdiso wrote:
HumbleRen wrote:Regardless of how we feel about the Celtics, I rather be in their position then ours.

Jayson Tatum is GTJ’s age


False.

and is already a borderline top 10 player.


False.

Jaylen Brown has the best contract in the NBA.


False.

He’s basically what we’re hoping OG can become


False.

while being the same age as him.


False.

Cap room to sign a max next year.



False.



Less than a year difference between Jayson Tatum and GTJ

Truth.

Borderline top 10 player.

Truth

Jaylen Brown makes 25M a year as one of the best 2 way players in the league.

Truth

Less than a year difference between OG and Jaylen Brown.

Truth.


Extremely salary friendly contracts to make a move for a max player in 2022.

Truth.


They are all demonstrably false.

Why would you lie to yourself about them?
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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#416 » by HumbleRen » Mon Sep 13, 2021 12:53 pm

everdiso wrote:
HumbleRen wrote:
everdiso wrote:
False.



False.



False.



False.



False.




False.



Less than a year difference between Jayson Tatum and GTJ

Truth.

Borderline top 10 player.

Truth

Jaylen Brown makes 25M a year as one of the best 2 way players in the league.

Truth

Less than a year difference between OG and Jaylen Brown.

Truth.


Extremely salary friendly contracts to make a move for a max player in 2022.

Truth.


They are all demonstrably false.

Why would you lie to yourself about them?



They’re really not. If you want to be a homer be my guest but I’m not about to feel bad for a team who have 2 wings that will give you basically 25/5/5 on any given night all before the age of 25.

They’ve made the ECF 3 out of the last 5 playoffs even with max players at the time being a shell of themselves or just completely injured in Hayward’s case.

If anything, the only reason why you think Tatum & Brown are overrated is because they’ve been over performing for their entire career.
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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#417 » by everdiso » Mon Sep 13, 2021 1:02 pm

HumbleRen wrote:
everdiso wrote:
HumbleRen wrote:

Less than a year difference between Jayson Tatum and GTJ

Truth.

Borderline top 10 player.

Truth

Jaylen Brown makes 25M a year as one of the best 2 way players in the league.

Truth

Less than a year difference between OG and Jaylen Brown.

Truth.


Extremely salary friendly contracts to make a move for a max player in 2022.

Truth.


They are all demonstrably false.

Why would you lie to yourself about them?



They’re really not. If you want to be a homer be my guest but I’m not about to feel bad for a team who have 2 wings that will give you basically 25/5/5 on any given night all before the age of 25.

They’ve made the ECF 3 out of the last 5 playoffs even with max players at the time being a shell of themselves or just completely injured in Hayward’s case.

If anything, the only reason why you think Tatum & Brown are overrated is because they’ve been over performing for their entire career.


Why would you call me a homer when literally everything you said there was clearly false?

And overperforming? this season was the first time the Celtics have finished ahead of the raps in 5yrs, and they finished .500, while the raps were blatantly tanking.
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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#418 » by WuTang_OG » Mon Sep 13, 2021 1:16 pm

Duffman100 wrote:
User_denied wrote:
Duffman100 wrote:
Agreed 100%. And honestly, I'm not too upset.

Win a title
Game 7 of the 2nd round
4th pick overall

Would it have been nice to repeat? Sure. But the next generation of this team has started and we're in a decent place considering we won a title 2 years ago.


Going through this tread I feel like this has been seriously understated. The fact that the only future equity that championship cost us was Jakob Poeltl and Delon Wright bears repeating. Look at virtually every serious contender to win a championship this year. Their entire future is mortgaged just for the chance to win a championship. It's kinda cool that we did it and get the skip the dark days that are ahead for some of those current contending teams.


Don't forget JV too. A big piece lost.

The magic was getting Kawhi without giving up OG or Siakam (which I thought was impossible). I remember the trade clearly. I was on a road trip with my brother, he woke up and went "kawhi!" and I popped up and said "OG or Siakam?" ...


Masai/Bobby dont get enough credit for that negotiation. Kawhi's mystery injury and only 1 year left gave them leverage and they got it done only giving up Derozan, Poetle and a 1st.
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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#419 » by HumbleRen » Mon Sep 13, 2021 1:23 pm

everdiso wrote:
HumbleRen wrote:
everdiso wrote:
They are all demonstrably false.

Why would you lie to yourself about them?



They’re really not. If you want to be a homer be my guest but I’m not about to feel bad for a team who have 2 wings that will give you basically 25/5/5 on any given night all before the age of 25.

They’ve made the ECF 3 out of the last 5 playoffs even with max players at the time being a shell of themselves or just completely injured in Hayward’s case.

If anything, the only reason why you think Tatum & Brown are overrated is because they’ve been over performing for their entire career.


Why would you call me a homer when literally everything you said there was clearly false?

And overperforming? this season was the first time the Celtics have finished ahead of the raps in 5yrs, and they finished .500, while the raps were blatantly tanking.


Nothing I said was false, only one I’m willing to budge on is Jaylen Brown’s contract, even then he’s easily on the list of best contracts in the NBA.

Why are you even using data from last year to judge a team ? COVID impacted the Celtics the most out of any team and it isn’t even close.
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Re: Masai: We have a Young Team and there will be Growing Pains 

Post#420 » by Raps in 4 » Mon Sep 13, 2021 1:43 pm

HumbleRen wrote:
everdiso wrote:
HumbleRen wrote:

They’re really not. If you want to be a homer be my guest but I’m not about to feel bad for a team who have 2 wings that will give you basically 25/5/5 on any given night all before the age of 25.

They’ve made the ECF 3 out of the last 5 playoffs even with max players at the time being a shell of themselves or just completely injured in Hayward’s case.

If anything, the only reason why you think Tatum & Brown are overrated is because they’ve been over performing for their entire career.


Why would you call me a homer when literally everything you said there was clearly false?

And overperforming? this season was the first time the Celtics have finished ahead of the raps in 5yrs, and they finished .500, while the raps were blatantly tanking.


Nothing I said was false, only one I’m willing to budge on is Jaylen Brown’s contract, even then he’s easily on the list of best contracts in the NBA.

Why are you even using data from last year to judge a team ? COVID impacted the Celtics the most out of any team and it isn’t even close.


*any team other than us.

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