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Tank World Order 3.0

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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1661 » by NotMyKawhi » Tue Nov 23, 2021 8:46 pm

PrinceAli wrote:Big game tonight between the top 2 teams in college basketball (UCLA and Gonzaga). Rematch since that shot Suggs hit from half court

Should be interesting to see how Chet does against a legit team this time

Also a good look at Peyton Watson


Friday should be even more fun since that’s Duke be Gonzaga. Top 2 prospects in the same game (Chet and Paolo). Surely that game will be watched by all NBA teams


I love chets game idk why ppl don't. He has amazing footwork and dribbling for a big. Off the charts for his size. He can shoot, play D, elite passer for a big.

Considering there's no low post guys like Shaq any more, unless he gets injured, he's gonna be a star imo
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1662 » by PrinceAli » Tue Nov 23, 2021 8:56 pm

NotMyKawhi wrote:
PrinceAli wrote:Big game tonight between the top 2 teams in college basketball (UCLA and Gonzaga). Rematch since that shot Suggs hit from half court

Should be interesting to see how Chet does against a legit team this time

Also a good look at Peyton Watson


Friday should be even more fun since that’s Duke be Gonzaga. Top 2 prospects in the same game (Chet and Paolo). Surely that game will be watched by all NBA teams


I love chets game idk why ppl don't. He has amazing footwork and dribbling for a big. Off the charts for his size. He can shoot, play D, elite passer for a big.

Considering there's no low post guys like Shaq any more, unless he gets injured, he's gonna be a star imo

I like his game, but I need to see how he handles physicality. So far he’s played well against teams that are basically around the same level as high end HS teams. The only game he played against a good team (Texas) he struggled a lot. If he shows he can handle it against UCLA tonight and Duke on Friday, then that’ll help ease those concerns
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1663 » by NotMyKawhi » Tue Nov 23, 2021 9:03 pm

PrinceAli wrote:
NotMyKawhi wrote:
PrinceAli wrote:Big game tonight between the top 2 teams in college basketball (UCLA and Gonzaga). Rematch since that shot Suggs hit from half court

Should be interesting to see how Chet does against a legit team this time

Also a good look at Peyton Watson


Friday should be even more fun since that’s Duke be Gonzaga. Top 2 prospects in the same game (Chet and Paolo). Surely that game will be watched by all NBA teams


I love chets game idk why ppl don't. He has amazing footwork and dribbling for a big. Off the charts for his size. He can shoot, play D, elite passer for a big.

Considering there's no low post guys like Shaq any more, unless he gets injured, he's gonna be a star imo

I like his game, but I need to see how he handles physicality. So far he’s played well against teams that are basically around the same level as high end HS teams. The only game he played against a good team (Texas) he struggled a lot. If he shows he can handle it against UCLA tonight and Duke on Friday, then that’ll help ease those concerns


We aren't going to get him unless we win the lottery so it doesn't really matter

I'm focusing on Ivey, Hardy, Watson bc teams like Pistons(cade, bey) Rockets(Jalen, Porter) Magic(suggs and cole) They all are going to take bigs. So I figure Chet, Pablo, Duren are going to be off the board.
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1664 » by Raps in 4 » Tue Nov 23, 2021 9:54 pm

NotMyKawhi wrote:
Raps in 4 wrote:
brownbobcat wrote:Lowry, Ibaka and Gasol were free agents, they didn't "let" them do anything. Gasol + Serge were sacrificed as a gamble to get Giannis, how is that tanking? Plus, they actually WANTED to keep both, just only on 1-year deals.

Not going all out to win isn't a full tank. They definitely did a mini-tank last season as things were going south, but what've they done this year to tank?


The team is playing 3 guys under 23 starter minutes. They are developing youth. The goal is clearly not to win this year.


I disagree. There's no one on the bench that is any better. Dragic has been horrible. If we played Dragic we would be even worse.

We aren't tanking, we just aren't good enough


That's exactly what tanking is though. You're trying to develop your youth, not win games. You aren't going to play Dragic because he'd be taking minutes away from Banton and Flynn.
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1665 » by Los_29 » Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:06 pm

Raps in 4 wrote:
NotMyKawhi wrote:
Raps in 4 wrote:
The team is playing 3 guys under 23 starter minutes. They are developing youth. The goal is clearly not to win this year.


I disagree. There's no one on the bench that is any better. Dragic has been horrible. If we played Dragic we would be even worse.

We aren't tanking, we just aren't good enough


That's exactly what tanking is though. You're trying to develop your youth, not win games. You aren't going to play Dragic because he'd be taking minutes away from Banton and Flynn.


No disrespect but this is just an incredibly illogical take here. It's nonsensical.

We have three players in the top 20 in minutes. Two of whom are #1 and #2. GTJ is in the top 35 now in minutes played. Siakam would be there had he not been eased back.

Banton is playing like 12 minutes a game and Flynn has been DNP'd 6 times this year and when he does play he's playing 6 minutes a game.

Come on man, this is not the hill you want to be dying on here. Do you truly believe Nick Nurse and the Raptors aren't trying to win games even though they are playing their starters more minutes than any team in the league? :lol:
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1666 » by Raps in 4 » Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:08 pm

Los_29 wrote:
Raps in 4 wrote:
NotMyKawhi wrote:
I disagree. There's no one on the bench that is any better. Dragic has been horrible. If we played Dragic we would be even worse.

We aren't tanking, we just aren't good enough


That's exactly what tanking is though. You're trying to develop your youth, not win games. You aren't going to play Dragic because he'd be taking minutes away from Banton and Flynn.


No disrespect but this is just an incredibly illogical take here. It's nonsensical.

We have three players in the top 20 in minutes. Two of whom are #1 and #2. GTJ is in the top 35 now in minutes played. Siakam would be there had he not been eased back.

Banton is playing like 12 minutes a game and Flynn has been DNP'd 6 times this year and when he does play he's playing 6 minutes a game.

Come on man, this is not the hill you want to be dying on here. Do you truly believe Nick Nurse and the Raptors aren't trying to win games even though they are playing their starters more minutes than any team in the league? :lol:


It doesn't matter what Nick Nurse is trying to do. He works with the tools he has. Masai Ujiri is not trying to win games. We are clearly a rebuilding team. We are playing Barnes, GTJ, Precious, and Banton heavy minutes. A team trying to win wouldn't do that. A team trying to win now would sign or trade for veterans.
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1667 » by Danny1616 » Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:11 pm

Raps in 4 wrote:
NotMyKawhi wrote:
Raps in 4 wrote:
The team is playing 3 guys under 23 starter minutes. They are developing youth. The goal is clearly not to win this year.


I disagree. There's no one on the bench that is any better. Dragic has been horrible. If we played Dragic we would be even worse.

We aren't tanking, we just aren't good enough


That's exactly what tanking is though. You're trying to develop your youth, not win games. You aren't going to play Dragic because he'd be taking minutes away from Banton and Flynn.


Nurse started Dragic the first 2 games and he was terrible.

He played Banton out of desperation when we were down big and he played great.

Nurse played Banton because he outplayed Dragic, it's pretty simple.

This is a really weird take. Your theory has zero merit considering Nurse literally only removed Dragic because the team played better with him not playing.

Your take is even more strange due to this:

https://www.espn.com/nba/stats/player/_/table/general/sort/avgMinutes/dir/desc

Look here. Fred and OG literally lead the league in minutes. Fred is #1 and OG is #2 in the ENTIRE NBA. We literally had threads a week ago that Nurse was going to get our starters hurt because of how much they are playing, lol. Banton is playing 13 minutes a night, Flynn is barely playing and guys like Bonga, Champagne, Johnson etc. are literally getting 0 minutes.
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1668 » by Los_29 » Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:16 pm

Raps in 4 wrote:
Los_29 wrote:
Raps in 4 wrote:
That's exactly what tanking is though. You're trying to develop your youth, not win games. You aren't going to play Dragic because he'd be taking minutes away from Banton and Flynn.


No disrespect but this is just an incredibly illogical take here. It's nonsensical.

We have three players in the top 20 in minutes. Two of whom are #1 and #2. GTJ is in the top 35 now in minutes played. Siakam would be there had he not been eased back.

Banton is playing like 12 minutes a game and Flynn has been DNP'd 6 times this year and when he does play he's playing 6 minutes a game.

Come on man, this is not the hill you want to be dying on here. Do you truly believe Nick Nurse and the Raptors aren't trying to win games even though they are playing their starters more minutes than any team in the league? :lol:


It doesn't matter what Nick Nurse is trying to do. Masai Ujiri is not trying to win games. We are clearly a rebuilding team.


But it does matter because if Masai wasn't trying to win then he wouldn't let Nurse play his best players 40 minutes a night. And we are a young, rebuilding team that is trying to win. Those two aren't mutually exclusive. Nurse plays his best players. If not then you'd be seeing guys like Birch, Svi and Boucher firmly planted on the bench.
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1669 » by Los_29 » Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:18 pm

Raps in 4 wrote:
Los_29 wrote:
Raps in 4 wrote:
That's exactly what tanking is though. You're trying to develop your youth, not win games. You aren't going to play Dragic because he'd be taking minutes away from Banton and Flynn.


No disrespect but this is just an incredibly illogical take here. It's nonsensical.

We have three players in the top 20 in minutes. Two of whom are #1 and #2. GTJ is in the top 35 now in minutes played. Siakam would be there had he not been eased back.

Banton is playing like 12 minutes a game and Flynn has been DNP'd 6 times this year and when he does play he's playing 6 minutes a game.

Come on man, this is not the hill you want to be dying on here. Do you truly believe Nick Nurse and the Raptors aren't trying to win games even though they are playing their starters more minutes than any team in the league? :lol:


It doesn't matter what Nick Nurse is trying to do. He works with the tools he has. Masai Ujiri is not trying to win games. We are clearly a rebuilding team. We are playing Barnes, GTJ, Precious, and Banton heavy minutes. A team trying to win wouldn't do that. A team trying to win now would sign or trade for veterans.


This is a nonsensical, completely illogical take. I think deep down you know this.
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1670 » by KL78192020 » Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:19 pm

Danny1616 wrote:
Raps in 4 wrote:
NotMyKawhi wrote:
I disagree. There's no one on the bench that is any better. Dragic has been horrible. If we played Dragic we would be even worse.

We aren't tanking, we just aren't good enough


That's exactly what tanking is though. You're trying to develop your youth, not win games. You aren't going to play Dragic because he'd be taking minutes away from Banton and Flynn.


Nurse started Dragic the first 2 games and he was terrible.

He played Banton out of desperation when we were down big and he played great.

Nurse played Banton because he outplayed Dragic, it's pretty simple.

This is a really weird take. Your theory has zero merit considering Nurse literally only removed Dragic because the team played better with him not playing.

Your take is even more strange due to this:

https://www.espn.com/nba/stats/player/_/table/general/sort/avgMinutes/dir/desc

Look here. Fred and OG literally lead the league in minutes. Fred is #1 and OG is #2 in the ENTIRE NBA. We literally had threads a week ago that Nurse was going to get our starters hurt because of how much they are playing, lol. Banton is playing 13 minutes a night, Flynn is barely playing and guys like Bonga, Champagne, Johnson etc. are literally getting 0 minutes.


I'd hope they give more minutes to Flynn/Banton and the other guys. The team isn't tanking yet, but looks like this core just isn't good enough to even make the playoffs yet. Hopefully in the 2nd half of the season if they're in the same spot the bench guys get a lot more burn. Flynn is just wasting away.
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1671 » by Danny1616 » Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:21 pm

KL78192020 wrote:
Danny1616 wrote:
Raps in 4 wrote:
That's exactly what tanking is though. You're trying to develop your youth, not win games. You aren't going to play Dragic because he'd be taking minutes away from Banton and Flynn.


Nurse started Dragic the first 2 games and he was terrible.

He played Banton out of desperation when we were down big and he played great.

Nurse played Banton because he outplayed Dragic, it's pretty simple.

This is a really weird take. Your theory has zero merit considering Nurse literally only removed Dragic because the team played better with him not playing.

Your take is even more strange due to this:

https://www.espn.com/nba/stats/player/_/table/general/sort/avgMinutes/dir/desc

Look here. Fred and OG literally lead the league in minutes. Fred is #1 and OG is #2 in the ENTIRE NBA. We literally had threads a week ago that Nurse was going to get our starters hurt because of how much they are playing, lol. Banton is playing 13 minutes a night, Flynn is barely playing and guys like Bonga, Champagne, Johnson etc. are literally getting 0 minutes.


I'd hope they give more minutes to Flynn/Banton and the other guys. The team isn't tanking yet, but looks like this core just isn't good enough to even make the playoffs yet. Hopefully in the 2nd half of the season if they're in the same spot the bench guys get a lot more burn. Flynn is just wasting away.


Well as we've said, the next 10-15 games will be critical to see what direction this team goes. 7 of the next 10 games are at home, and not a hard schedule, so will be interesting to see how we do, especially with OG back in the lineup.
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1672 » by Los_29 » Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:23 pm

KL78192020 wrote:
Danny1616 wrote:
Raps in 4 wrote:
That's exactly what tanking is though. You're trying to develop your youth, not win games. You aren't going to play Dragic because he'd be taking minutes away from Banton and Flynn.


Nurse started Dragic the first 2 games and he was terrible.

He played Banton out of desperation when we were down big and he played great.

Nurse played Banton because he outplayed Dragic, it's pretty simple.

This is a really weird take. Your theory has zero merit considering Nurse literally only removed Dragic because the team played better with him not playing.

Your take is even more strange due to this:

https://www.espn.com/nba/stats/player/_/table/general/sort/avgMinutes/dir/desc

Look here. Fred and OG literally lead the league in minutes. Fred is #1 and OG is #2 in the ENTIRE NBA. We literally had threads a week ago that Nurse was going to get our starters hurt because of how much they are playing, lol. Banton is playing 13 minutes a night, Flynn is barely playing and guys like Bonga, Champagne, Johnson etc. are literally getting 0 minutes.


I'd hope they give more minutes to Flynn/Banton and the other guys. The team isn't tanking yet, but looks like this core just isn't good enough to even make the playoffs yet. Hopefully in the 2nd half of the season if they're in the same spot the bench guys get a lot more burn. Flynn is just wasting away.


To be fair, we haven't seen the core together yet. Just 2-3 games.
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1673 » by Los_29 » Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:34 pm

I think most would agree that the Pacers, Thunder, Magic, Kings, Pelicans, Rockets, Pistons and Spurs are worse than us.

Then you got teams like the Cavs, Wizards, Nuggets (without Murray and MPJ), Grizzlies, Timberwolves, Celtics, Knicks, Hornets that are in our tier. Then teams like the Clippers can easily start to crumble as their team just lacks talent and will be without Kawhi all season.

So if we managed to finish at the bottom of this tier we crack the top 10 in the lottery. But the possibility of finishing higher than some of these teams is a very strong possibility especially the Cavs, Timberwolves, Wizards and Grizzlies.
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1674 » by tecumseh18 » Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:47 pm

Los_29 wrote:
Raps in 4 wrote:
Los_29 wrote:
No disrespect but this is just an incredibly illogical take here. It's nonsensical.

We have three players in the top 20 in minutes. Two of whom are #1 and #2. GTJ is in the top 35 now in minutes played. Siakam would be there had he not been eased back.

Banton is playing like 12 minutes a game and Flynn has been DNP'd 6 times this year and when he does play he's playing 6 minutes a game.

Come on man, this is not the hill you want to be dying on here. Do you truly believe Nick Nurse and the Raptors aren't trying to win games even though they are playing their starters more minutes than any team in the league? :lol:


It doesn't matter what Nick Nurse is trying to do. He works with the tools he has. Masai Ujiri is not trying to win games. We are clearly a rebuilding team. We are playing Barnes, GTJ, Precious, and Banton heavy minutes. A team trying to win wouldn't do that. A team trying to win now would sign or trade for veterans.


This is a nonsensical, completely illogical take. I think deep down you know this.


That's a little strong. There's no question that Masai has in his mind what a true contender is. That's what he wants, and that's not what the Raptors are yet.

I wonder how much of Masai's approach was conditioned by the Rudy Gay for a bench trade? He learned there that sometimes, you just have let the team find it's own special chemistry. If not, then trade the vets and ostenatiously tank. But right now, the Raps are learning what we have. We're learning how Scottie, Pascal and OG will play together. We're developing Precious. That's not "tanking", but it sure isn't a guaranteed formula for instant success either.

Of course Nurse is coaching to win every game. But he hasn't implemented a simple defensive system that would make it easier to do that. He's trying to teach a bunch of kids how to play championship-winning defence. And he needs to play Fred, Pascal and OG maximum minutes to help them help the kids.

These aren't dumb people. They know what they're doing. They're playing the long game.
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1675 » by KL78192020 » Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:50 pm

Danny1616 wrote:
KL78192020 wrote:
Danny1616 wrote:
Nurse started Dragic the first 2 games and he was terrible.

He played Banton out of desperation when we were down big and he played great.

Nurse played Banton because he outplayed Dragic, it's pretty simple.

This is a really weird take. Your theory has zero merit considering Nurse literally only removed Dragic because the team played better with him not playing.

Your take is even more strange due to this:

https://www.espn.com/nba/stats/player/_/table/general/sort/avgMinutes/dir/desc

Look here. Fred and OG literally lead the league in minutes. Fred is #1 and OG is #2 in the ENTIRE NBA. We literally had threads a week ago that Nurse was going to get our starters hurt because of how much they are playing, lol. Banton is playing 13 minutes a night, Flynn is barely playing and guys like Bonga, Champagne, Johnson etc. are literally getting 0 minutes.


I'd hope they give more minutes to Flynn/Banton and the other guys. The team isn't tanking yet, but looks like this core just isn't good enough to even make the playoffs yet. Hopefully in the 2nd half of the season if they're in the same spot the bench guys get a lot more burn. Flynn is just wasting away.


Well as we've said, the next 10-15 games will be critical to see what direction this team goes. 7 of the next 10 games are at home, and not a hard schedule, so will be interesting to see how we do, especially with OG back in the lineup.


Yea..the next ten games aren't gona be easy though. Some good teams there I'd say 6-4 on the high end or 3-7 worst case scenario, Bucks are finally healthy, Celtics got Brown back. Memphis has also been playing better, beat the Jazz last night. Out of the next 10, OKC and Sac could be easy wins, the rest could go either way.

I don't think the Masai will do anything until 50 games in though in terms of looking at draft position.
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1676 » by ConSarnit » Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:52 pm

Los_29 wrote:
ConSarnit wrote:
Raps in 4 wrote:
The draft is only a crapshoot if you have bad management. Good management is able to identify and develop top talent reliably. They're also able to build a winning team around that talent.


The "draft is a crapshoot" is a lazy narrative. How can anyone look at our FO's draft record and think "welp, they must have gotten lucky over and over and over and over again". It's pretty simple: good front office's make better use of draft picks then bad ones. We have a good (if not great) FO. They haven't just been getting "lucky" all of these years.


While I agree that well managed teams make less mistakes, the reality is they still make them and they can happen in the lottery. Heat drafted Justice Winslow 5 years ago with the 10th overall pick. They also drafted Michael Beasley with the 2nd overall pick. Bucks drafted Thon Maker 10th overall. Warriors drafted Epke Udoh 6th overall the year after Curry, also drafted Anthony Randolph 14th overall a year before Curry. Nuggets drafted Mudiay with the 5th overall pick a few years ago.

Yes our chances of developing a player is better but developing talent isn't easy and it requires patience even for lottery picks. There are no guarantees.


I’m not really sure what your point is.

There are 3 ways to get a star: draft, trade or sign.

We’ve never signed anyone close to a star, ever. We don’t even get meetings.

We traded for one under extremely unique circumstances. So unique that replicating that trade is near impossible and I’d wager never happens again (for us or anyone).

That leaves the draft. Out of the three “star” acquiring options this is our best bet. We know we can draft well and we know the higher you draft the better the players available are.

If we want to play the best odds to get a star then it’s through the draft. That’s all we can do. There are no guarantees with any method, we just play the best odds.
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1677 » by KL78192020 » Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:59 pm

ConSarnit wrote:
Los_29 wrote:
ConSarnit wrote:
The "draft is a crapshoot" is a lazy narrative. How can anyone look at our FO's draft record and think "welp, they must have gotten lucky over and over and over and over again". It's pretty simple: good front office's make better use of draft picks then bad ones. We have a good (if not great) FO. They haven't just been getting "lucky" all of these years.


While I agree that well managed teams make less mistakes, the reality is they still make them and they can happen in the lottery. Heat drafted Justice Winslow 5 years ago with the 10th overall pick. They also drafted Michael Beasley with the 2nd overall pick. Bucks drafted Thon Maker 10th overall. Warriors drafted Epke Udoh 6th overall the year after Curry, also drafted Anthony Randolph 14th overall a year before Curry. Nuggets drafted Mudiay with the 5th overall pick a few years ago.

Yes our chances of developing a player is better but developing talent isn't easy and it requires patience even for lottery picks. There are no guarantees.


I’m not really sure what your point is.

There are 3 ways to get a star: draft, trade or sign.

We’ve never signed anyone close to a star, ever. We don’t even get meetings.

We traded for one under extremely unique circumstances. So unique that replicating that trade is near impossible and I’d wager never happens again (for us or anyone).

That leaves the draft. Out of the three “star” acquiring options this is our best bet. We know we can draft well and we know the higher you draft the better the players available are.

If we want to play the best odds to get a star then it’s through the draft. That’s all we can do. There are no guarantees with any method, we just play the best odds.


Yea the team has drafted stars, Carter/McGrady/Bosh/Demar vs trading for 1 star whose value was depressed. The problem during the McGrady era was RFA did not exist, if they drafted VC and Tmac today they would both be here. OKC also did a great job drafting KD/Harden/Westbrook, they haven't traded for any stars. Management just made a stupid decision based on cheapness getting rid of Harden.

For small market/non destination cities its easier get your star via draft.
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1678 » by Danny1616 » Tue Nov 23, 2021 11:02 pm

ConSarnit wrote:
Los_29 wrote:
ConSarnit wrote:
The "draft is a crapshoot" is a lazy narrative. How can anyone look at our FO's draft record and think "welp, they must have gotten lucky over and over and over and over again". It's pretty simple: good front office's make better use of draft picks then bad ones. We have a good (if not great) FO. They haven't just been getting "lucky" all of these years.


While I agree that well managed teams make less mistakes, the reality is they still make them and they can happen in the lottery. Heat drafted Justice Winslow 5 years ago with the 10th overall pick. They also drafted Michael Beasley with the 2nd overall pick. Bucks drafted Thon Maker 10th overall. Warriors drafted Epke Udoh 6th overall the year after Curry, also drafted Anthony Randolph 14th overall a year before Curry. Nuggets drafted Mudiay with the 5th overall pick a few years ago.

Yes our chances of developing a player is better but developing talent isn't easy and it requires patience even for lottery picks. There are no guarantees.


I’m not really sure what your point is.

There are 3 ways to get a star: draft, trade or sign.

We’ve never signed anyone close to a star, ever. We don’t even get meetings.

We traded for one under extremely unique circumstances. So unique that replicating that trade is near impossible and I’d wager never happens again (for us or anyone).

That leaves the draft. Out of the three “star” acquiring options this is our best bet. We know we can draft well and we know the higher you draft the better the players available are.

If we want to play the best odds to get a star then it’s through the draft. That’s all we can do. There are no guarantees with any method, we just play the best odds.


https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/lamarcus-aldridge-to-meet-with-raptors-in-free-agency/

We had a meeting with Lamarcus Aldridge in 2015 and were on his short list.

I do believe that the perception of Toronto has changed drastically in the last decade. Players coming up see Toronto is a legit destination which excellent management and development program. We'll see how this pans out in the future. Winning, more than anything, brings free agents.

Also, while no one is disputing a very high lottery pick is an avenue, it's not the only one and it comes at a cost if you get there by gutting your roster or abandoning your culture in the process. We traded for the best player in franchise history - Lowry. We managed to develop guys later in the draft like Fred, Pascal, OG, Delon, Powell and Poeltl. Delon and Poeltl were used as trade pieces for Kawhi and Gasol.
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1679 » by Los_29 » Tue Nov 23, 2021 11:57 pm

ConSarnit wrote:
Los_29 wrote:
ConSarnit wrote:
The "draft is a crapshoot" is a lazy narrative. How can anyone look at our FO's draft record and think "welp, they must have gotten lucky over and over and over and over again". It's pretty simple: good front office's make better use of draft picks then bad ones. We have a good (if not great) FO. They haven't just been getting "lucky" all of these years.


While I agree that well managed teams make less mistakes, the reality is they still make them and they can happen in the lottery. Heat drafted Justice Winslow 5 years ago with the 10th overall pick. They also drafted Michael Beasley with the 2nd overall pick. Bucks drafted Thon Maker 10th overall. Warriors drafted Epke Udoh 6th overall the year after Curry, also drafted Anthony Randolph 14th overall a year before Curry. Nuggets drafted Mudiay with the 5th overall pick a few years ago.

Yes our chances of developing a player is better but developing talent isn't easy and it requires patience even for lottery picks. There are no guarantees.


I’m not really sure what your point is.

There are 3 ways to get a star: draft, trade or sign.

We’ve never signed anyone close to a star, ever. We don’t even get meetings.

We traded for one under extremely unique circumstances. So unique that replicating that trade is near impossible and I’d wager never happens again (for us or anyone).

That leaves the draft. Out of the three “star” acquiring options this is our best bet. We know we can draft well and we know the higher you draft the better the players available are.

If we want to play the best odds to get a star then it’s through the draft. That’s all we can do. There are no guarantees with any method, we just play the best odds.


Well as mentioned earlier, we did have a meeting with Aldridge and this narrative that we can't recruit free agents is a strange one because when have we actually had the opportunity to do so? I don't remember the last time we had cap space and a competitive team. We've had cap space and a terrible team and we've had an excellent team but no cap space. But not both. We have more and more high caliber Canadians entering the league. More than ever before.

You know what else is unique? Drafting a Lebron/KD type talent in the draft. These types of players simply don't come around often and it's incredibly foolish to think you can get this kind of player so easily. This is why bad teams stay bad for so long because instead of getting a Lebron or KD they are getting Dion Waiters, Marvin Bagley, Tristan Thompson or Dragan Bender. So no, the draft isn't our best bet because there are only a few players in this league that are capable of carrying a team to a championship and two of them were outside the lottery.

The draft is exciting. No doubt about that. I love the NBA draft but unfortunately if you want your star player, you're better off getting them via trade. Continue to accumulate assets and in a year or two this team might have the depth to trade for a star/superstar. That is far better than wishing and praying that player comes along in the draft.
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Re: Tank World Order 3.0 

Post#1680 » by 720 » Wed Nov 24, 2021 12:21 am

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We were right all along. #tWo

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