SotD: 3PT Talent / Efficiency

[Badonkadonk]

It was suggested elsewhere this should be a separate SotD, which I think makes sense. Source is NBA University (same as many of the other threads) and it just highlights how elite FVV has been as a 3PT shooter.

I hope at least some will understand that given the Raps roster construction, this is exactly why Fred plays the role that he does in the offense. He's our best long-range threat, on a team that doesn't have many, and he's been really, really good at it for both pull-ups and C&S. He's not being selfish when he shoots, he's doing what he needs to do. I think this only gets reinforced next year when Pascal/Scottie are the half-court focal points from the start of the season.

As always, the comments to the tweet are interesting (i.e. fans from other bases commenting).

Read on Twitter

?s=20&t=rBAX93lnpwNL_N5DINTeDg

[OakleyDokely]

VV is the ideal player next to Barnes/Siakam because he can play off ball as a floor spacer: he's one of the best shooters in the league. He can hit the catch and shoot stuff and he can also hit transition 3s and 3s that come at the end of the shot clock when a great shot isn't created.

Not to mention, he can also defend the point of attack and he can be a secondary ballhandler when Barnes/Siakam aren't initiating the offense. He can fill-in the gaps when teams try to take Barnes/Siakam out of games with doubles/triples.

[DelAbbot]

Ah now I see why FVV is a better shooter than Steph Curry

[Indeed]

Trent?

[ATLTimekeeper]

Trent?

He's upper right corner, just below Kevin Love. So very good C&S and low pull-up talent.

[ruckus]

Trent?

He's upper right corner, just below Kevin Love. So very good C&S and low pull-up talent.

It's encouraging as i think it was Nurse that during his year ender that the focus this year was for Trent to get better in his catch and shoots and that it was basically nonexistent in prior seasons.

[Courtside]

VV is the ideal player next to Barnes/Siakam because he can play off ball as a floor spacer: he's one of the best shooters in the league. He can hit the catch and shoot stuff and he can also hit transition 3s and 3s that come at the end of the shot clock when a great shot isn't created.

Not to mention, he can also defend the point of attack and he can be a secondary ballhandler when Barnes/Siakam aren't initiating the offense. He can fill-in the gaps when teams try to take Barnes/Siakam out of games with doubles/triples.

Lots of good stuff in here.

I think the main reason people get on FVV is because he's not a "true PG" or doesn't QB the offense as well as Lowry did, or others maybe could. Those aren't wrong, but they also fail to consider that this team doesn't worry itself so much about traditional roles based on positional size, and what you get more of in one area from someone else you may get less of in areas that Freddie excels - like the elite 3pt shooting as the graph shows.

If you have 4 of our "longboi" guys out there and the opposing team has a quick guard or small ballhandler, then Freddie is an extremely good specialist at defending the opponent, shooting and spacing from 3, and also being an additional ballhandler. People stuck on the PG being the primary ballhandler will struggle with this the most, and in fairness the ball does stick a bit too much as Fred does slow down the offense, but for what he's making and for what he's about to make if he agrees to the extension, he's an entirely good fit with this team.

I do think reducing his minutes will help with his health as he seems to break down over a season, so transitioning to more Pascal and Scottie as primaries will pay dividends both in terms of minutes and health, but also pressure on opposing defenses. If we can mix in Fred's time with both the starters and the bench, and bring him into the 34mpg range, he's an exceptional player.

That said, I could see how age and health and contract and roster construct could steer us away from Freddie as the permanent piece there. Just because Lowry stayed until 35 it doesn't mean FVV will, or should. If he's extended, then he becomes a very tradeable piece in the coming years.

[Reeko]

So according to the chart, Fred is essentially the best 3pt shooter in the league when you factor in catch and shoot, along with pull up 3s. Or am I missing something here?

[niQ]

So according to the chart, Fred is essentially the best 3pt shooter in the league when you factor in catch and shoot, along with pull up 3s. Or am I missing something here?

Looks like it according to the chart:

Read on Twitter

[OakleyDokely]

VV is the ideal player next to Barnes/Siakam because he can play off ball as a floor spacer: he's one of the best shooters in the league. He can hit the catch and shoot stuff and he can also hit transition 3s and 3s that come at the end of the shot clock when a great shot isn't created.

Not to mention, he can also defend the point of attack and he can be a secondary ballhandler when Barnes/Siakam aren't initiating the offense. He can fill-in the gaps when teams try to take Barnes/Siakam out of games with doubles/triples.

Lots of good stuff in here.

I think the main reason people get on FVV is because he's not a "true PG" or doesn't QB the offense as well as Lowry did, or others maybe could. Those aren't wrong, but they also fail to consider that this team doesn't worry itself so much about traditional roles based on positional size, and what you get more of in one area from someone else you may get less of in areas that Freddie excels - like the elite 3pt shooting as the graph shows.

If you have 4 of our "longboi" guys out there and the opposing team has a quick guard or small ballhandler, then Freddie is an extremely good specialist at defending the opponent, shooting and spacing from 3, and also being an additional ballhandler. People stuck on the PG being the primary ballhandler will struggle with this the most, and in fairness the ball does stick a bit too much as Fred does slow down the offense, but for what he's making and for what he's about to make if he agrees to the extension, he's an entirely good fit with this team.

I do think reducing his minutes will help with his health as he seems to break down over a season, so transitioning to more Pascal and Scottie as primaries will pay dividends both in terms of minutes and health, but also pressure on opposing defenses. If we can mix in Fred's time with both the starters and the bench, and bring him into the 34mpg range, he's an exceptional player.

That said, I could see how age and health and contract and roster construct could steer us away from Freddie as the permanent piece there. Just because Lowry stayed until 35 it doesn't mean FVV will, or should. If he's extended, then he becomes a very tradeable piece in the coming years.

Fred had the ball in his hands a lot more because the Raptors didn't have many offensive options, especially at the beginning of the year. Siakam was out. Barnes was a rookie. Precious was very raw. But this won't be the case forever, especially as Barnes develops his offensive game including his shot.

I think the dream is to have Siakam/Barnes initiate the offense with the ball in their hands most of the time and they're surrounded by 3+Ds like OG, VV, GTJ, Precious. If they see big size mismatches, like OG having a small on him in the post, they will attack that. The Raps aren't going to play with a 'traditional' PG and the ball be won't going through just one guy.

[aroc23]

Imagine where FVV was on this chart before he went cold for 2 months.

Maybe the answer is to lower FVV's minutes so he does not burn out by March every year rather than trade him for a tall non-shooter?

[YogurtProducer]

So according to the chart, Fred is essentially the best 3pt shooter in the league when you factor in catch and shoot, along with pull up 3s. Or am I missing something here?

I guess so, although I do not fully get how Steph who has higher volume on higher %'s is somehow lower.. what other type of 3 point shot is missing here?

But FVV is easily up there. 13th highest volume per 100 in the entire league and has the 5th highest percentage among those 13 players. Only guys up there who are primary creators are Steph, Mitchell, FVV, Clarkson. The rest are all more offball dudes with inflated #'s

[Reeko]

So according to the chart, Fred is essentially the best 3pt shooter in the league when you factor in catch and shoot, along with pull up 3s. Or am I missing something here?

I guess so, although I do not fully get how Steph who has higher volume on higher %'s is somehow lower.. what other type of 3 point shot is missing here?

But FVV is easily up there. 13th highest volume per 100 in the entire league and has the 5th highest percentage among those 13 players. Only guys up there who are primary creators are Steph, Mitchell, FVV, Clarkson. The rest are all more offball dudes with inflated #'s

Is there a different classification when a player catches, takes a dribble to side step and shoots?

[bbalnation]

Steph moves so much. His game is heavily centered off-ball first, imo.

Theres a lot of consequences to that to opposing teams, and for his own team.

My assumption is that may be some consequences to his own shooting % when he moves a **** ton, sets screens for his teams (which Fred does well too), etc.

In other news:

Fred is really **** terrific at basketball.

[Courtside]

New SotD hread based on how good FVV is at some valuable skills... struggles to reach 2 pages in 2 days because the usual suspects can't bring themselves to say anything good after running their mouths in the other SotD thread where they misinterpreted it to show that Fred and Gary were bad players.

Quelle surprise.

[Los_29]

I was told that FVV isn't an elite shooter.

Elite defender, elite shooter and solid playmaker. What's not to like?

[Johnny Bball]

Since pullup threes are usually inefficient for most players, it's nice to see we have someone that excels at it.

[pingpongrac]

I was told that FVV isn't an elite shooter.

Elite defender, elite shooter and solid playmaker. What's not to like?

That low FG% at the rim is just too much to let go...

Sent from my Pixel 4 using RealGM mobile app

[Los_29]

I was told that FVV isn't an elite shooter.

Elite defender, elite shooter and solid playmaker. What's not to like?

That low FG% at the rim is just too much to let go...

Sent from my Pixel 4 using RealGM mobile app

He's nothing more than a stat padding chucker with his 2 attempts at the rim per game (less than half as many as Trae and Lamelo).

[And1+2]

I was told that FVV isn't an elite shooter.

Elite defender, elite shooter and solid playmaker. What's not to like?

Who says that? He's a terrific shooter, especially on catch and shoot and the pull-up. If all Fred did was run around creating off-ball chaos with minimal ball handling duties, he would be living up to his ridiculous potential...

... Which I think is coming, actually.