With the 33rd pick, the Raptors select Christian Koloko!

[anj]

Don't know where else to put this, but since we're talking 2nd rounders, it's pretty wild that Nembhard just signed for more guaranteed $$$ than picks 18–30 (first round). Teams are beginning to approach the 2nd round in new MLB-ish ways. Wonder what it means for the future of the draft?

https://www.sportsnet.ca/nba/article/report-canadian-andrew-nembhard-signs-record-deal-with-pacers/

[niQ]

Don't know where else to put this, but since we're talking 2nd rounders, it's pretty wild that Nembhard just signed for more guaranteed $$$ than picks 18–30 (first round). Teams are beginning to approach the 2nd round in new MLB-ish ways. Wonder what it means for the future of the draft?

https://www.sportsnet.ca/nba/article/report-canadian-andrew-nembhard-signs-record-deal-with-pacers/

That's pretty crazy that he's getting more guaranteed money than late first rounders. Congrats to Nembhard!

I think we're already seeing a shift in how teams view not just the 2nd round, but also undrafted players in general. Ever since FVV's Bet On Yourself campaign, we're seeing agents literally tell teams not to draft their players in the 2nd round so they have more control in which teams they sign with.

[Hero_Panda]

Don't know where else to put this, but since we're talking 2nd rounders, it's pretty wild that Nembhard just signed for more guaranteed $$$ than picks 18–30 (first round). Teams are beginning to approach the 2nd round in new MLB-ish ways. Wonder what it means for the future of the draft?

https://www.sportsnet.ca/nba/article/report-canadian-andrew-nembhard-signs-record-deal-with-pacers/

Guaranteed money (1st round) vs betting on yourself (2nd round).

As prospects see their chances as a high 1st round pick get lower, I could see more of them asking teams to not draft them in the 1st round and that they'll take their chances at a negotiable NBA contract in the 2nd round.

What I would want to see is having another round or two in the draft with each NBA team having their own dedicated developmental team in the G League. With the way things are going I could see that happening soon.

[ruckus]

Don't know where else to put this, but since we're talking 2nd rounders, it's pretty wild that Nembhard just signed for more guaranteed $$$ than picks 18–30 (first round). Teams are beginning to approach the 2nd round in new MLB-ish ways. Wonder what it means for the future of the draft?

https://www.sportsnet.ca/nba/article/report-canadian-andrew-nembhard-signs-record-deal-with-pacers/

Guaranteed money (1st round) vs betting on yourself (2nd round).

As prospects see their chances as a high 1st round pick get lower, I could see more of them asking teams to not draft them in the 1st round and that they'll take their chances at a negotiable NBA contract in the 2nd round.

I wonder if it would make sense to reduce the draft to the 14 teams that don't make the playoffs and then make everyone else a free agent. It would be a **** trying to reconcile all the traded future picks but I think it would result in better outcomes for the players.

I'd even advocate for doing away with the draft altogether but that presents its own set of problems.

[Hero_Panda]

I'd even advocate for doing away with the draft altogether but that presents its own set of problems.

99.9% chance that the draft will not be going anywhere soon because of a multitude of reasons, but I'm curious as to why you'd want to get rid of the draft altogether.

[ruckus]

I'd even advocate for doing away with the draft altogether but that presents its own set of problems.

99.9% chance that the draft will not be going anywhere soon because of a multitude of reasons, but I'm curious as to why you'd want to get rid of the draft altogether.

Part of it is the lottery aspect that rewards teams for poor performance. Part of it is that the draft process limits the amount of money and movement for incoming players. Extreme example - lets say the Kings win the next lottery and draft that French kid. Maybe the French guy puts the team on his shoulders and lifts the Kings from their woeful state but history kinda says that bad management trumps all. They'll never put the team around him that will make them consistently competitive and if he wants to leave due to the Kings incompetence, he'll have to take a financial penalty. Players should have autonomy to make decisions for their career from the get go.

The socialist aspects of American sports seems out of touch with the overall capitalist nature of the country.

[DreamTeam09]

It’s still a risk to go in the 2nd, not all of these rookies are gonna get guaranteed money, mainly the top of the 2nd round. 2nd round doesn’t guarantee you a 2nd year contract ala David Johnson

[ATLTimekeeper]

Are 4 year deals for 2nd rounders even team friendly? Usually if the player is good they'll decline the team option and re-negotiate. Good for Nembhard, and I'm not seeing much benefit for the Pacers.

It's definitely strange that Koloko hasn't signed yet, and that could very well be because Klutch is upset we didn't play ball with them this summer and there's a stand-off.

[Tripod]

Are 4 year deals for 2nd rounders even team friendly? Usually if the player is good they'll decline the team option and re-negotiate. Good for Nembhard, and I'm not seeing much benefit for the Pacers.

It's definitely strange that Koloko hasn't signed yet, and that could very well be because Klutch is upset we didn't play ball with them this summer and there's a stand-off.

Naw. They are waiting in case something happens with Durant. Just like Fred's extension is on hold.

As for Klutch, MU and BW went to LA on FA signing day to re-sign Gary to show how much he meant to the team. I don't think things have changed much since then. Nothing to see there.

[wegotthabeet]

It’s still a risk to go in the 2nd, not all of these rookies are gonna get guaranteed money, mainly the top of the 2nd round. 2nd round doesn’t guarantee you a 2nd year contract ala David Johnson

It's true there is a high degree of risk dropping to the 2nd round, but it can be much more fruitful if you show any potential. 2nd round picks especially in the 30's can earn more, have greater control of what team they end up on etc...

Using the 2018 draft as an example where Gary Trent Jr. went 37th overall. Over the first 4 years in the NBA he made roughly the equivalent of the 8th overall pick, albeit Sexton had that $ guaranteed. Seems weird that a 2nd round pick could be make more than the 9th overall pick over the first 4 years in the league, but it happened.

Trent: $ 20,144,177 after 4 seasons
Ayton: $ 40,379,230 (rookie scale) as the 1st overall pick
Sexton: $ 20,175,111 as the 8th overall pick
Simons: $10,175,938 as the 24th overall pick

So a 2nd round pick can theoretically make if roughly twice what an 18th overall pick can make if everything breaks right and goes well and more than half the lotto picks. Doesn't seem right, but it happens.

[wegotthabeet]

Don't know where else to put this, but since we're talking 2nd rounders, it's pretty wild that Nembhard just signed for more guaranteed $$$ than picks 18–30 (first round). Teams are beginning to approach the 2nd round in new MLB-ish ways. Wonder what it means for the future of the draft?

https://www.sportsnet.ca/nba/article/report-canadian-andrew-nembhard-signs-record-deal-with-pacers/

Guaranteed money (1st round) vs betting on yourself (2nd round).

As prospects see their chances as a high 1st round pick get lower, I could see more of them asking teams to not draft them in the 1st round and that they'll take their chances at a negotiable NBA contract in the 2nd round.

I wonder if it would make sense to reduce the draft to the 14 teams that don't make the playoffs and then make everyone else a free agent. It would be a **** trying to reconcile all the traded future picks but I think it would result in better outcomes for the players.

I'd even advocate for doing away with the draft altogether but that presents its own set of problems.

That's an interesting idea, but it would lead to late lotto picks preferring to go undrafted. As I outlined in my post above you can already earn more than lotto picks as a 2nd rounder and have greater control over where you play. Not without risk of course, but it's very doable. Trent Jr. made more $ than SGA over their first 4 seasons respectively.

[Boardbreaker]

I'd even advocate for doing away with the draft altogether but that presents its own set of problems.

99.9% chance that the draft will not be going anywhere soon because of a multitude of reasons, but I'm curious as to why you'd want to get rid of the draft altogether.

Part of it is the lottery aspect that rewards teams for poor performance. Part of it is that the draft process limits the amount of money and movement for incoming players. Extreme example - lets say the Kings win the next lottery and draft that French kid. Maybe the French guy puts the team on his shoulders and lifts the Kings from their woeful state but history kinda says that bad management trumps all. They'll never put the team around him that will make them consistently competitive and if he wants to leave due to the Kings incompetence, he'll have to take a financial penalty. Players should have autonomy to make decisions for their career from the get go.

The socialist aspects of American sports seems out of touch with the overall capitalist nature of the country.

All this would lead to is highly ranked prospects deciding to team up together on the Lakers and nobody outside of lakers fans and espn want to see that.

[douggood]

Don't know where else to put this, but since we're talking 2nd rounders, it's pretty wild that Nembhard just signed for more guaranteed $$$ than picks 18–30 (first round). Teams are beginning to approach the 2nd round in new MLB-ish ways. Wonder what it means for the future of the draft?

https://www.sportsnet.ca/nba/article/report-canadian-andrew-nembhard-signs-record-deal-with-pacers/

the reporting is a little weird.
its true that nembhard got more guranteed money, but that is over 3 years, vs comparing to 1st round picks who have guaranteed 2 years.

unless teams start not picking up 3rd year team options (like jalen smith; which happens once in a blue moon), 1st round picks 18-30 still make more than nembhard.

nembhard got $6.4 mil over 3 years, pick 30 if 3rd year option is picked up (peyton watson /nuggets) will get 3 years $6.9.

4 years for nembard is $8.6, 4 years for watson is $11.26

this whole thing about making more than picks 18-30,pick #18 was dalen terry bulls
$3,191,400 + $3,350,760 = $6.54 over the first 2 years but $10 mil over 3 years.

[ruckus]

99.9% chance that the draft will not be going anywhere soon because of a multitude of reasons, but I'm curious as to why you'd want to get rid of the draft altogether.

Part of it is the lottery aspect that rewards teams for poor performance. Part of it is that the draft process limits the amount of money and movement for incoming players. Extreme example - lets say the Kings win the next lottery and draft that French kid. Maybe the French guy puts the team on his shoulders and lifts the Kings from their woeful state but history kinda says that bad management trumps all. They'll never put the team around him that will make them consistently competitive and if he wants to leave due to the Kings incompetence, he'll have to take a financial penalty. Players should have autonomy to make decisions for their career from the get go.

The socialist aspects of American sports seems out of touch with the overall capitalist nature of the country.

All this would lead to is highly ranked prospects deciding to team up together on the Lakers and nobody outside of lakers fans and espn want to see that.

Thats one of the risks. But I don't think it would work that way in practice. There would have to be strategies put into place to mitigate situations like that from happening. Honestly, I not sure what those would be. Maybe your final standing in the previous season dictates how much you can spend on a rookie contract? That way, the rookie gets to decide to either go to the crap team for beaucoup bucks or to the winners for minimal salary or any of the inbetween teams for whatever other factors there are. I'm sure there would also be 3rd party manipulation that would have to be accounted for as well i.e. Nike wanting x, y, z rookie going to specific cities and reimbursing them thusly. Like I said, it creates it own set of problems.

[Johnny Bball]

When are we signing this guy?

As soon as they find a way to dump Svi maybe?

[ruckus]

Guaranteed money (1st round) vs betting on yourself (2nd round).

As prospects see their chances as a high 1st round pick get lower, I could see more of them asking teams to not draft them in the 1st round and that they'll take their chances at a negotiable NBA contract in the 2nd round.

I wonder if it would make sense to reduce the draft to the 14 teams that don't make the playoffs and then make everyone else a free agent. It would be a **** trying to reconcile all the traded future picks but I think it would result in better outcomes for the players.

I'd even advocate for doing away with the draft altogether but that presents its own set of problems.

That's an interesting idea, but it would lead to late lotto picks preferring to go undrafted. As I outlined in my post above you can already earn more than lotto picks as a 2nd rounder and have greater control over where you play. Not without risk of course, but it's very doable. Trent Jr. made more $ than SGA over their first 4 seasons respectively.

Exactly tho. Shouldn't late lotto picks have the same freedom of movement and same ability to earn as 2nd rounders/undrafted guys? Technically, they aren't being forced to do anything but they kinda are in that late lotto guys have to trade security in a longer term guaranteed contract vs the ability to "bet on themselves". As far as I know, players aren't allowed to decline their draft position. Maybe your agent can make that argument on your behalf prior to the draft but if you don't play ball with whatever team drafts you, it puts a black mark on your career from the get.

[Johnny Bball]

Don't know where else to put this, but since we're talking 2nd rounders, it's pretty wild that Nembhard just signed for more guaranteed $$$ than picks 18–30 (first round). Teams are beginning to approach the 2nd round in new MLB-ish ways. Wonder what it means for the future of the draft?

https://www.sportsnet.ca/nba/article/report-canadian-andrew-nembhard-signs-record-deal-with-pacers/

Guaranteed money (1st round) vs betting on yourself (2nd round).

As prospects see their chances as a high 1st round pick get lower, I could see more of them asking teams to not draft them in the 1st round and that they'll take their chances at a negotiable NBA contract in the 2nd round.

I wonder if it would make sense to reduce the draft to the 14 teams that don't make the playoffs and then make everyone else a free agent. It would be a **** trying to reconcile all the traded future picks but I think it would result in better outcomes for the players.

I'd even advocate for doing away with the draft altogether but that presents its own set of problems.

considering they protect draft picks from moving from 55-60 because they are so worthless to teams, yeah it probably makes sense.

[720]

I'd even advocate for doing away with the draft altogether but that presents its own set of problems.

99.9% chance that the draft will not be going anywhere soon because of a multitude of reasons, but I'm curious as to why you'd want to get rid of the draft altogether.

I agree, look at baseball before the draft. Before the draft the richest teams (Yankees and Cardinals) got all the best prospects because they paid the most (not to mention the Yankees and their name recognition). No draft reduces parity.

[Hero_Panda]

I'd even advocate for doing away with the draft altogether but that presents its own set of problems.

99.9% chance that the draft will not be going anywhere soon because of a multitude of reasons, but I'm curious as to why you'd want to get rid of the draft altogether.

I agree, look at baseball before the draft. Before the draft the richest teams (Yankees and Cardinals) got all the best prospects because they paid the most (not to mention the Yankees and their name recognition). No draft reduces parity.

I'm not opposed to abolishing the draft if it makes for a better outcome for both the league and the players. I think it's important to look at what's working and what's not, as well as what can be improved because circumstances are constantly changing.

For instance, I'm surprised at the number of 2nd round prospects earning more than late lotto picks which. It's understandable for those who prefer to take the risk of acquiring an NBA contact as a 2nd round/undrafted player, but at the same time, it doesn't make much sense for those selected in the 2nd rounder or undrafted making more than those picked in the 15-30 in the 1st round.

[ruckus]

I'd even advocate for doing away with the draft altogether but that presents its own set of problems.

99.9% chance that the draft will not be going anywhere soon because of a multitude of reasons, but I'm curious as to why you'd want to get rid of the draft altogether.

I agree, look at baseball before the draft. Before the draft the richest teams (Yankees and Cardinals) got all the best prospects because they paid the most (not to mention the Yankees and their name recognition). No draft reduces parity.

Does it? The MLB draft was enacted 60 years ago when salaries and opportunities were wholly different. The world was an entirely different place back then.

From the franchise side, its better to have more control over your players. However, I think the parity term is thrown around to disguise that control over the players.

I think, the player empowerment era has been good for competition in the NBA. That empowerment extended to rookies coming into the NBA, in my opinion, would be a good thing. It would force teams like the Kings and Thunder to actually act to make their teams attractive to free agents instead of relying on churning draft picks. Wouldn't having 30 competent management teams increase parity?

There are people that believe the hard cap helps with parity. Baseball doesn't have a hard cap. Yes, a lot of prized free agents end up on the Yankees. But they don't win every year. Competent management teams have found ways to build competitive baseball teams with what has been given to them. If its not the draft, it would be another avenue.