Start Gary Trent Jr.

[YogurtProducer]

This is just so obvious to me and I cannot believe it has not been done yet.

1) Our worst 3 man combination among the top 6 guys? Schroder, Poeltl, Barnes. -8.3NRTG. Just the worst fitting trio on the team mostly due to Schroder and Barnes having zero chemistry together.

2) Our best 3 man combination among the top 6 guyS? OG, Barnes, GTJ. +18.5NRTG. Who knew playing our two best shooters alongside our best playmaker would lead to success?

2.1) It is not just Barnes though. Siakam/OG/GTJ are a +8.8NRTG as well.

2.2) In fact, GTJ/OG together without Schroder are generally positive everywhere. In the top 10 most used lineups with those 2, the only negative one is with Flynn/Boucher/Precious (aka, the most brain dead lineup we possibly could run)

3) We have 15 (small sample) lineups of Scottie playing without Flynn or Schroder. 11 are positive, 3 are negative, 1 is neutral.

3.1) We have 5 (even smaller sample) lineups of Siakam playing without Flynn or Schroder. 4 are positive, 1 is negative. (But to be clear here, all 5 of these lineups have Barnes. We have no data with a lineup without Barnes/Flynn/Schroder outside garbage time lineups)

4) The starting lineup with GTJ instead of Jak is +37.1 in 5 minutes.

5) Not a lot of evidence as we have not seen it, but Schroder/Poeltl have obvious PnR chemistry. Why not roll them out more against benches where you can play Schroder/Poeltl with some of the bench guys who can "shoot" (OPJ for one, call up Dick for 2, and then you can probably surivive either with Flynn in a two-PG lineup or with Boucher/Achiwua as 1 non shooter).

[Thaddy]

The way Schroder has been dominating the ball and taking too many shots. He is more suitable for the bench. To win in this NBA, which is built on runs, you absolutely need shooting. The less elite shooting you have the harder it is to climb back when you're in the hole, beyond that it's harder to create leads. I previously said you need at least 2 shooters to be a good team, that's probably closer to four considering the parity and competitiveness of the league now.

[mtcan]

I feel like a combo guard like Cole Anthony as a starter makes more sense than either Dennis or Gary. I would want Scottie initiating offense and having a shooter like Anthony who would otherwise be a secondary ball handler/playmaker is a good balance.

Dennis shoots too much IMO. Gary isn't a passer.

[YogurtProducer]

I feel like a combo guard like Cole Anthony as a starter makes more sense than either Dennis or Gary. I would want Scottie initiating offense and having a shooter like Anthony who would otherwise be a secondary ball handler/playmaker is a good balance.

Dennis shoots too much IMO. Gary isn't a passer.

Do we need a passer in a lineup that has Siakam and Scottie (and ****, even Jakob)?

I don't think Scottie or Siakam should be your lead ball handler necessarily, but I also don't think it makes sense to surround them with non-shooters.

Cole Anthony is just another Schroder. A shoot first PG who is not an above average 3 point guy.

A perfect fit is a guy like Coby White. 6'5". 40% from 3. Does not shoot a whole ton. I know there was some discussion on him in the off-season and if we could flip a forward for him in a sign and trade which obviously did not materialize.

[God Squad]

Schroder is Darko's guy. We in doo doo boys

[mtcan]

I feel like a combo guard like Cole Anthony as a starter makes more sense than either Dennis or Gary. I would want Scottie initiating offense and having a shooter like Anthony who would otherwise be a secondary ball handler/playmaker is a good balance.

Dennis shoots too much IMO. Gary isn't a passer.

Do we need a passer in a lineup that has Siakam and Scottie (and ****, even Jakob)?

I don't think Scottie or Siakam should be your lead ball handler necessarily, but I also don't think it makes sense to surround them with non-shooters.

Cole Anthony is just another Schroder. A shoot first PG who is not an above average 3 point guy.

A perfect fit is a guy like Coby White. 6'5". 40% from 3. Does not shoot a whole ton. I know there was some discussion on him in the off-season and if we could flip a forward for him in a sign and trade which obviously did not materialize.

Schroeder and Precious for Coby seems like a trade to make.

Add Dennis to Lavine, Derozan and Vuc makes sense. Precious is easily a better player and prospect than Pat Williams (yes the bar is that low lol).

[YogurtProducer]

I feel like a combo guard like Cole Anthony as a starter makes more sense than either Dennis or Gary. I would want Scottie initiating offense and having a shooter like Anthony who would otherwise be a secondary ball handler/playmaker is a good balance.

Dennis shoots too much IMO. Gary isn't a passer.

Do we need a passer in a lineup that has Siakam and Scottie (and ****, even Jakob)?

I don't think Scottie or Siakam should be your lead ball handler necessarily, but I also don't think it makes sense to surround them with non-shooters.

Cole Anthony is just another Schroder. A shoot first PG who is not an above average 3 point guy.

A perfect fit is a guy like Coby White. 6'5". 40% from 3. Does not shoot a whole ton. I know there was some discussion on him in the off-season and if we could flip a forward for him in a sign and trade which obviously did not materialize.

Schroeder and Precious for Coby seems like a trade to make.

Add Dennis to Lavine, Derozan and Vuc makes sense. Precious is easily a better player and prospect than Pat Williams (yes the bar is that low lol).

I dont think they really have any Schroder interest. Would all come down to if they like Precious.

Precious and Boucher seems more logical for them. Cleans up their guard logjam. But Coby is better and younger than them all.

However - that leaves Toronto without a backup big at all

[Boselecta]

If you thought the Nurse FVV duo was bad wait till you get a full season of the Darko Dennis experience lol.

Dennis wont be going to the bench there's more of a chance we bring Barnes off the bench to run the second unit. We kinda already see this taking place with the rotations.

[mtcan]

Do we need a passer in a lineup that has Siakam and Scottie (and ****, even Jakob)?

I don't think Scottie or Siakam should be your lead ball handler necessarily, but I also don't think it makes sense to surround them with non-shooters.

Cole Anthony is just another Schroder. A shoot first PG who is not an above average 3 point guy.

A perfect fit is a guy like Coby White. 6'5". 40% from 3. Does not shoot a whole ton. I know there was some discussion on him in the off-season and if we could flip a forward for him in a sign and trade which obviously did not materialize.

Schroeder and Precious for Coby seems like a trade to make.

Add Dennis to Lavine, Derozan and Vuc makes sense. Precious is easily a better player and prospect than Pat Williams (yes the bar is that low lol).

I dont think they really have any Schroder interest. Would all come down to if they like Precious.

Precious and Boucher seems more logical for them. Cleans up their guard logjam. But Coby is better and younger than them all.

However - that leaves Toronto without a backup big at all

Time to promote Mohamadu Gueye (I like to call him Precious Boucher...the love child or laboratory created hybrid of his namesakes lol)...??

[Scase]

So who runs point then? I was informed numerous times in the off season that Scottie can't play PG.

[Hero_Panda]

No objections from me. I've been on the "start Scottie at PG" boat even wile FVV was here, and now with FVV gone it makes sense to start GTJ as he's the best shooter on the team.

PG: Scottie
SG: Trent
SF: OG
PF: Siakam
C: Poeltl

At this point, why the eff not? Surely the trend couldn't get any worse. Schroeder has proven he can thrive as a 6th man while Trent plays better as a starter.

On the other hand, I was always a fan of the OG/Siakam/Barnes frontcourt and think this team would be more dynamic with those 3 up front and have Schroeder running point, and I would love Scottie to be more brutish in the paint.

All in all, the SL we have now is not working.

[Badonkadonk]

I'll re-state what I did in preseason. Schroder makes no sense in the starting unit. I love him as a player, I think his contract is good value, but his skill-set is specifically suited for dominating other 2nd units.

He is not an organizer in the half-court, and he subverts too many sets by hunting his own shot, which I think is just in his DNA. Raps also need more shooting, so it's a natural swap. OR, feature OPJ because he's an obvious flip at the deadline.

I'm guessing the FO/Darko set expectations of being the starting PG to help lure him, and it'll take a certain number of games to demonstrate that it's not optimal. I'd be surprised if there wasn't a lineup change over the next 10 games.

[YogurtProducer]

So who runs point then? I was informed numerous times in the off season that Scottie can't play PG.

It still is not a preferable situation, but it is better than the alternative.

The growing pain / negatives of having Scottie (or Siakam) doing most of the ball handling offset the negatives of having zero spacing with Schroder.

Preferably, we have a guard who can shoot and handle the ball a bit but we just do not. Gotta make the most of what we got.

[Spida888]

So who runs point then? I was informed numerous times in the off season that Scottie can't play PG.

It still is not a preferable situation, but it is better than the alternative.

The growing pain / negatives of having Scottie (or Siakam) doing most of the ball handling offset the negatives of having zero spacing with Schroder.

Preferably, we have a guard who can shoot and handle the ball a bit but we just do not. Gotta make the most of what we got.

Plus it's not like we're winning games anyways. Wouldn't hurt to give Scottie a chance here and see what happens. Dennis can help with the bench production too.

I'm not confident that Darko benches Dennis unless FO actually steps in. It's time for a change though.

[Oakvillehoops]

Scottie and Gary play incredibly well together. GTJ’s,
Shooting percentage on 3s is amazing off of passes from Scottie.

[hype_2004]

Schroder is Darko's guy. We in doo doo boys

Schroder should be the 6th man, Trent should be there with Barnes and Siakam for his shooting. You can't have 3 ball handlers and a non shooting C in the starting lineup, this creates an awful dynamic out of balance lineup. Darko needs to grow some balls and tank Dennis from the starting unit for the sake of the team.

[traps#10]

I was told that no one above 6’3 can be a point guard since at that height they can’t dribble the ball up to half court.

[mtcan]

So who runs point then? I was informed numerous times in the off season that Scottie can't play PG.

What do other teams do when their best player and playmaker is a long 6'8 (or taller) guy? Is a pure pass first point guard needed in those situations?

[hype_2004]

I'll re-state what I did in preseason. Schroder makes no sense in the starting unit. I love him as a player, I think his contract is good value, but his skill-set is specifically suited for dominating other 2nd units.

He is not an organizer in the half-court, and he subverts too many sets by hunting his own shot, which I think is just in his DNA. Raps also need more shooting, so it's a natural swap. OR, feature OPJ because he's an obvious flip at the deadline.

I'm guessing the FO/Darko set expectations of being the starting PG to help lure him, and it'll take a certain number of games to demonstrate that it's not optimal. I'd be surprised if there wasn't a lineup change over the next 10 games.

If he wants another contract he needs to know his role and sftu. Ujiri saved him from going to China or Europe he needs to be humble and accept the demotion to the second unit. This type of sacrifice will prolong his NBA career beyond 2025.

[ItsDanger]

This is Schroder's team now.