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Continued from here viewtopic.php?f=32&t=2343946&start=2140

Since Scottie has returned to the lineup:

35.5 MIN, 25.3 PPG, 6.6 REB, 5.6 AST, .542 FG, .389 3PT, .702 FT, .629 TS, 28.2 USG

OakleyDokely wrote:Since Scottie has returned to the lineup:

35.5 MIN, 25.3 PPG, 6.6 REB, 5.6 AST, .542 FG, .389 3PT, .702 FT, .629 TS, 28.2 USG

Ridiculous. Love his relentless attack of the bucket.If he can stop with the awful turnovers and get that 3p% to 37%, he's a real true find. Oh ... and play some defense.

What a great complementary to Barnes.

Duffman100 wrote:

OakleyDokely wrote:Since Scottie has returned to the lineup:

35.5 MIN, 25.3 PPG, 6.6 REB, 5.6 AST, .542 FG, .389 3PT, .702 FT, .629 TS, 28.2 USG

Ridiculous. Love his relentless attack of the bucket.If he can stop with the awful turnovers and get that 3p% to 37%, he's a real true find. Oh ... and play some defense.

What a great complementary to Barnes.

To be fair.....the whole team has to stop with the awful turnovers. Scottie as well. It's on Darko & the coaching staff to figure out ways to clean this up. I do think having IQ & Dick back will help.

OakleyDokely wrote:Since Scottie has returned to the lineup:

35.5 MIN, 25.3 PPG, 6.6 REB, 5.6 AST, .542 FG, .389 3PT, .702 FT, .629 TS, 28.2 USG

Key with him has always been developing either defense or 3 so he isn’t impairing the team or a net negative at times

If he keeps that 3 up, he’s a certified all-star alongside our superstar Barnes

Naysorn wrote:

OakleyDokely wrote:Since Scottie has returned to the lineup:

35.5 MIN, 25.3 PPG, 6.6 REB, 5.6 AST, .542 FG, .389 3PT, .702 FT, .629 TS, 28.2 USG

Key with him has always been developing either defense or 3 so he isn’t impairing the team or a net negative at times

If he keeps that 3 up, he’s a certified all-star alongside our superstar Barnes

RJ has generally been good from the right corner and cold from above the break. If we can find ways to a
support that, it will only help him and us.

Duffman100 wrote:

OakleyDokely wrote:Since Scottie has returned to the lineup:

35.5 MIN, 25.3 PPG, 6.6 REB, 5.6 AST, .542 FG, .389 3PT, .702 FT, .629 TS, 28.2 USG

Ridiculous. Love his relentless attack of the bucket.If he can stop with the awful turnovers and get that 3p% to 37%, he's a real true find. Oh ... and play some defense.

What a great complementary to Barnes.

Him and Scottie compliment each other really well. They cover each other's weaknesses, and the fact that they're 23 & 24 years old respectively is a huge plus. Two amazing building blocks for this franchise, we just need to surround them with defense and shooting.

XTC wrote:

Duffman100 wrote:

OakleyDokely wrote:Since Scottie has returned to the lineup:

35.5 MIN, 25.3 PPG, 6.6 REB, 5.6 AST, .542 FG, .389 3PT, .702 FT, .629 TS, 28.2 USG

Ridiculous. Love his relentless attack of the bucket.If he can stop with the awful turnovers and get that 3p% to 37%, he's a real true find. Oh ... and play some defense.

What a great complementary to Barnes.

Him and Scottie compliment each other really well. They cover each other's weaknesses, and the fact that they're 23 & 24 years old respectively is a huge plus. Two amazing building blocks for this franchise, we just need to surround them with defense and shooting.

It feels like RJ is 28, but 24 damn.

I haven’t been able to watch the last couple of games (damn iptv) but I’ve found his defense this season passable. I do think it will be difficult long term starting him with Gradey and Quick unless all 3 are bananas offensively and our twin towers Scottie/Yak can be elite on D. This will be fun regular season wise though so looking too far down the road. No surprise that his play picked up again with Scottie taking some usage off him.

Basketball_Jones wrote:I haven’t been able to watch the last couple of games (damn iptv) but I’ve found his defense this season passable. I do think it will be difficult long term starting him with Gradey and Quick unless all 3 are bananas offensively and our twin towers Scottie/Yak can be elite on D. This will be fun regular season wise though so looking too far down the road. No surprise that his play picked up again with Scottie taking some usage off him.

I honestly think Gradey will be a 6th man Tyler Hero type. At least this season & possibly next. If he takes his offensive game to another level (& improves his defense), then we have some questions to ask. Right now RJ is the better player on both sides of the floor & has some serious chemistry with Scottie & IQ.

We need Ochai's POA defense in the SL.

My thinking is we need at least 2 of our elite level defenders in the game at all times (Barnes, Poeltl, Mitchell, Ochai, Mogbo). Walter, Brown & Shead are also capable defenders. Ochai is our only legit 3+D player on the roster right now. I could eventually see Walter becoming another.

Duffman100 wrote:

XTC wrote:

Duffman100 wrote:
Ridiculous. Love his relentless attack of the bucket.If he can stop with the awful turnovers and get that 3p% to 37%, he's a real true find. Oh ... and play some defense.

What a great complementary to Barnes.

Him and Scottie compliment each other really well. They cover each other's weaknesses, and the fact that they're 23 & 24 years old respectively is a huge plus. Two amazing building blocks for this franchise, we just need to surround them with defense and shooting.

It feels like RJ is 28, but 24 damn.

Yeah 1 year older than Scottie only. IQ is the oldest of the 3 but all 3 are within 24 months of each other.

Would like to see him starting to take on PG defending duties. He's laterally quick and I feel as if his on ball defence less detrimental than his offball defence. Would also open up room on the perimeter for a strong wing defender to let Scottie do what he does best on that end.

RJ/Gradey/Wing Defender/Scottie 1-4 kinda moves me. Still can get IQ his 30 minutes a night off the bench either way. Ochai good for that Wing Defender slot right now. But maybe in this set up you'd like someone a bit taller.

MEDIC wrote:

Basketball_Jones wrote:I haven’t been able to watch the last couple of games (damn iptv) but I’ve found his defense this season passable. I do think it will be difficult long term starting him with Gradey and Quick unless all 3 are bananas offensively and our twin towers Scottie/Yak can be elite on D. This will be fun regular season wise though so looking too far down the road. No surprise that his play picked up again with Scottie taking some usage off him.

I honestly think Gradey will be a 6th man Tyler Hero type. At least this season & possibly next. If he takes his offensive game to another level (& improves his defense), then we have some questions to ask. Right now RJ is the better player on both sides of the floor & has some serious chemistry with Scottie & IQ.

We need Ochai's POA defense in the SL.

My thinking is we need at least 2 of our elite level defenders in the game at all times (Barnes, Poeltl, Mitchell, Ochai, Mogbo). Walter, Brown & Shead are also capable defenders. Ochai is our only legit 3+D player on the roster right now. I could eventually see Walter becoming another.

Tbh I strongly disagree that RJ is better than Gradey on the defensive side of the ball. Don't mind Gradey 6th man this year. But in the long term he is pretty clearly the 2nd most important player on this roster. By next year he needs to be starting. Gotta manufacture a way to make that happen. Think there's a way to make it work with RJ starting as well if he keeps improving and establishing himself in the way he has been.

Also Tyler Herro is not a 6th man at this point. And if anyone is better suited to the 6th man role between the two, RJ is. Gradey adds better spacing to the SL, better off ball defence/is easier to hide on D, and RJ is a much better playmaker so he's better suited to run a bench unit.

Would like to try with both starting though.

MEDIC wrote:

Duffman100 wrote:

OakleyDokely wrote:Since Scottie has returned to the lineup:

35.5 MIN, 25.3 PPG, 6.6 REB, 5.6 AST, .542 FG, .389 3PT, .702 FT, .629 TS, 28.2 USG

Ridiculous. Love his relentless attack of the bucket.If he can stop with the awful turnovers and get that 3p% to 37%, he's a real true find. Oh ... and play some defense.

What a great complementary to Barnes.

To be fair.....the whole team has to stop with the awful turnovers. Scottie as well. It's on Darko & the coaching staff to figure out ways to clean this up. I do think having IQ & Dick back will help.

I actually think these are one of the few things that don't warrant any real concern. It's a young team learning to play together, turnovers will happen until guys know where the others are most likely to be. RJ was playing outside of his role while Scottie was back so those turnovers aren't too surprising, and I think Scottie is always gonna have a few "huh" turnovers as he goes for high risk high reward plays.

That said, our backup guards need to be solid.

Shwaguy wrote:Would like to see him starting to take on PG defending duties. He's laterally quick and I feel as if his on ball defence less detrimental than his offball defence. Would also open up room on the perimeter for a strong wing defender to let Scottie do what he does best on that end.

RJ/Gradey/Wing Defender/Scottie 1-4 kinda moves me. Still can get IQ his 30 minutes a night off the bench either way. Ochai good for that Wing Defender slot right now. But maybe in this set up you'd like someone a bit taller.

One of RJs biggest issues causing him to be a poor defender is that he can't turn his hips particularly well, PGs would eat him alive.

Scase wrote:

MEDIC wrote:

Duffman100 wrote:
Ridiculous. Love his relentless attack of the bucket.If he can stop with the awful turnovers and get that 3p% to 37%, he's a real true find. Oh ... and play some defense.

What a great complementary to Barnes.

To be fair.....the whole team has to stop with the awful turnovers. Scottie as well. It's on Darko & the coaching staff to figure out ways to clean this up. I do think having IQ & Dick back will help.

I actually think these are one of the few things that don't warrant any real concern. It's a young team learning to play together, turnovers will happen until guys know where the others are most likely to be. RJ was playing outside of his role while Scottie was back so those turnovers aren't too surprising, and I think Scottie is always gonna have a few "huh" turnovers as he goes for high risk high reward plays.

That said, our backup guards need to be solid.

Shwaguy wrote:Would like to see him starting to take on PG defending duties. He's laterally quick and I feel as if his on ball defence less detrimental than his offball defence. Would also open up room on the perimeter for a strong wing defender to let Scottie do what he does best on that end.

RJ/Gradey/Wing Defender/Scottie 1-4 kinda moves me. Still can get IQ his 30 minutes a night off the bench either way. Ochai good for that Wing Defender slot right now. But maybe in this set up you'd like someone a bit taller.

One of RJs biggest issues causing him to be a poor defender is that he can't turn his hips particularly well, PGs would eat him alive.

I personally find his biggest issue is his attentiveness. Seems lost when the ball is away from him. League trending towards bigger PGs as well. He's probably gonna get cooked anywhere sadly.

People need to come to grips that IQ, Barnes and RJ will all he starters...as will Yak.

That leaves 1 spot and that's where Ochai fits in as he can use his energy on defense at the POA and now is looking like a reliable 3pt option and cutter on offense as the 5th option.

That is the best balanced type lineup.

Then being able to bring in Gradey when one of the big 3 sit, the offense doesn't die.

Gradey given his age and contract will be coming off the bench for a few years imo. Now that could change vs some teams where he starts and Ochai comes off the bench. Dick will still get lots of minutes.

Tripod wrote:People need to come to grips that IQ, Barnes and RJ will all he starters...as will Yak.

That leaves 1 spot and that's where Ochai fits in as he can use his energy on defense at the POA and now is looking like a reliable 3pt option and cutter on offense as the 5th option.

That is the best balanced type lineup.

Then being able to bring in Gradey when one of the big 3 sit, the offense doesn't die.

Gradey given his age and contract will be coming off the bench for a few years imo. Now that could change vs some teams where he starts and Ochai comes off the bench. Dick will still get lots of minutes.

Gradey has more upside than anyone else on this team besides Scottie, and I don't think that's particularly close either. I don't think it will be for that long that he comes off the bench. I also think Gradey should be playing with Creators more often, than being relied upon to be the creator. At least until that handle has been shored up.

Shwaguy wrote:

Tripod wrote:People need to come to grips that IQ, Barnes and RJ will all he starters...as will Yak.

That leaves 1 spot and that's where Ochai fits in as he can use his energy on defense at the POA and now is looking like a reliable 3pt option and cutter on offense as the 5th option.

That is the best balanced type lineup.

Then being able to bring in Gradey when one of the big 3 sit, the offense doesn't die.

Gradey given his age and contract will be coming off the bench for a few years imo. Now that could change vs some teams where he starts and Ochai comes off the bench. Dick will still get lots of minutes.

Gradey has more upside than anyone else on this team besides Scottie, and I don't think that's particularly close either. I don't think it will be for that long that he comes off the bench. I also think Gradey should be playing with Creators more often, than being relied upon to be the creator. At least until that handle has been shored up.

He WILL play with creators as when healthy, he can be out there with 1-2 starters, KO, Mogbo, Walter.

And to be clear, I would have him as the #1 guy off the bench because I do think he has a great upside. But not everyone can start and RJ has earned it...and IQ's contract means he will too.

I like that of Barnes comes out first, we replace him with a movement 3pt shooter for IQ, RJ and Yak to pass to.

Shwaguy wrote:Tbh I strongly disagree that RJ is better than Gradey on the defensive side of the ball.

How so? Neither of them are good on ball defenders right now. RJ plays a little more "safe" on defense because he doesn't have the foot speed/ lateral quickness. You aren't going to see him put a ton of pressure on the ball handler, which is fine......you have to work with what you have.

Having said that, I do see moments with Gradey. I think Gradey has faster feet, can change direction quicker & has better anticipation. He still struggles with stronger offensive players & gets bullied (one issue you don't see as much with RJ). I think Gradey has the potential to be a better POA defender than RJ, but he isn't there yet (not consistently anyway). I find when Gradey gets beat, he gets beat really bad. He does have his moments where he surprises me & "tells on himself" (as Casey used to say). I think he will get there eventually with more practice & strength training. Gradey is better at defending "space" & is better at anticipating passes & picking them off....sure.

One thing that I have notice about RJ is that he actually does a decent job when he gets stuck down low with a big. He is strong enough to make it tough for the big to establish good position to score, even when he gets outsized. I don't think he gets enough credit for his defense on mismatches down low.

Don't mind Gradey 6th man this year. But in the long term he is pretty clearly the 2nd most important player on this roster.

He started off the season pretty hot, but once the defense started targeting him, he struggled. I don't think he has established himself as 2nd most important....not yet anyway.

Also Tyler Herro is not a 6th man at this point. And if anyone is better suited to the 6th man role between the two, RJ is. Gradey adds better spacing to the SL, better off ball defence/is easier to hide on D, and RJ is a much better playmaker so he's better suited to run a bench unit.

This is Herro's 6th season. Gradey is in year 2. Building his game up to 6th MOY was a good achievement for him. Now he earns himself a starting spot.

Personally, I think RJ adds an element to the offense that nobody else on the team can add & it just happens to work well with Scottie & IQ's game. I think RJ also takes some of the pressure off Scottie to always be "the guy"

Would like to try with both starting though.

I am open to that for sure. It would be interesting to see in spurts. See how it goes. I think it could be a very good closing lineup in various situations.

RJ is pretty good. I like him.