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Disclaimer: If you are happy with Jose's play, and feel he is doing everything he can to help us win games, this is not the thread for you.

Just to clarify, if you have read my posts you will know that I love what TJ brings as our starter, however, this does not mean I dislike Jose. He had an opportunity to grab the bull by the horns and show the league what his game is all about, but instead he looks like any other role player out there. I know many people love this guy, including me, but I'm not so sure Jose is having quite the positive effect on our team that everyone thinks.

Since Jose has been a starter, and this season in general, his game has changed substantially. I'm sure his biggest backers will also agree that this is not the same Jose as last year.

Last year the word I would use to describe Jose would be "opportunistic", always looking for that lane to the basket for a lay up. Also, many of his assists last year were from the drive and kick, and numerous times he would drive deep into the paint and suck in the defence before the kick. He would do a lot of the same things TJ would do, but in a "safer" manner.
Even though TJ was playing against starters, for the purposes of this thread, lets assume all things equal for last season.

This is where many of the "start Jose" threads originated, as TJ and Jose were doing a lot of the same things but in different manners. Jose was considered more "methodical" while TJ was looked upon as "out of control".

This year has been a completely different story. TJ came into this season with an improved jump shot, changing speeds, less turnovers and just overall making better decisions with the ball. Jose continued to be his solid self off the bench but his game had changed from last year. He was no longer attacking but rather using the PnR / high screen alot more and also making the crisp lateral pass to the wings (probably due to the improved roster).

Now comes the fun part, TJ gets injured and Jose has been our starter for approx. a month. Now he comes up the court and pounds the ball, looks for the high screen and will either pass it off to CB4 or make the perimeter pass to a wing. He rarely looks to drive for a layup (even when he has a lane) and he seldom uses the drive and kick (reason we haven't seen very many open 3's lately). Also, with his great fg% you would figure the guy should look for his own shot more, especially when his teammates are struggling, but no, he usually shoots when CB4 passes out of the double.

So my question is why has Jose changed his game? Or am I somehow completely missing his impact in the game? (pls don't just throw stats)

Here are some of the things that COULD be a factor, but I'd love to get everyones feedback.

1) He is overwhelmed (talent wise) playing against starters?
2) He is concerned about injuring himself?
3) Confidence issues?
4) He doesn't want to jeopardize his stats by taking risks?
5) He is more of a role player than a bonafide starter?
6) He has been overrated by fans?

PS. I do realize he isn't playing with any great backup, but that shouldn't change his overall game. As a starter he needs to be able to play at a high level and have an impact, and Sam has done a reasonable job of keeping his minutes down. Also, I couldn't even tell you the names of many back up point guards, but guys like Deron and CP3 still manage to leave their mark on the game.

7) Teams are more alert to his driving so they cut off the lane most times.

You place it all on him, and give defences no credit. Teams adjust, especially when they only have one Raptor PG to think about.

1) teams have adjusted on defense and they don't allow him to drive any more.

2) teams have adjusted on offense and, knowing full well he's a poor defender, zero in on him to create one-on-one mismatches.

His shot is also a lot better this season, so he tries to rely on that as well.

maybe he is pacing himself since he knows he is going to play 35+ minutes now. I notice that he makes hella effort to get to the basket in the 4th.

Unfortunately, jose is not very effective at getting easy baskets for his team. He makes the right passes on the perimeter (he's excellent at that), but how many times has he gotten in the lane and dropped it to someone for a dunk? Very rarely. He also has a bizarre habit of constantly pulling up on 3-2s or 4-3s.

dagger wrote:7) Teams are more alert to his driving so they cut off the lane most times.

You place it all on him, and give defences no credit. Teams adjust, especially when they only have one Raptor PG to think about.

So your telling me you haven't seen Jose pass up open lanes?

I've been watching ball long enough to know that defences adjust to players, but I've all watched ball long enough to see open lanes being passed up.

He has ABANDONED the driving game except for a few layups here and there. I give the defence credit, but not that much credit.

dagger wrote:7) Teams are more alert to his driving so they cut off the lane most times.

You place it all on him, and give defences no credit. Teams adjust, especially when they only have one Raptor PG to think about.

Exactly. With 2 different PGs are 2 different playing styles.

Original game plans were to contain Ford. Now its game planning versus Calderon each night. Calderon is playing fine, its other things that are hurting us right now.

Spragga wrote:maybe he is pacing himself since he knows he is going to play 35+ minutes now. I notice that he makes hella effort to get to the basket in the 4th.

How many other starting point guards follow this same philosophy considering most play 35+ minutes?

Shak23 wrote:Original game plans were to contain Ford. Now its game planning versus Calderon each night. Calderon is playing fine, its other things that are hurting us right now.

Calderon has put up great numbers as a starter.. but the offense has become far too predictable.

Tommy Gun wrote:Unfortunately, jose is not very effective at getting easy baskets for his team. He makes the right passes on the perimeter (he's excellent at that), but how many times has he gotten in the lane and dropped it to someone for a dunk? Very rarely. He also has a bizarre habit of constantly pulling up on 3-2s or 4-3s.

I can't stand it when he pulls up on the fast breaks... it's really annoying. I guess there's a reason why Jose leads the NBA in Assists to Turnover ratio... It's because he never takes any risks. I actually hold that against Jose now... I'd actually prefer him attempt at making more plays out of nothing and risk turnovers than always set it up and act like a role player out there. He has the skillset... now he just has to adjust his mentality.

Shak23 wrote:Original game plans were to contain Ford. Now its game planning versus Calderon each night. Calderon is playing fine, its other things that are hurting us right now.

Calderon is the floor general. If the team overall is not playing well on offence he has to shoulder much of that blame.

xAIRNESSx wrote:His shot is also a lot better this season, so he tries to rely on that as well.

Considering his FG% you would think that he would shoot more when the offence is stagnant, but he doesn't do that. This leads me to believe he is protecting his stats to an extent.

Reignman wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Considering his FG% you would think that he would shoot more when the offence is stagnant, but he doesn't do that. This leads me to believe he is protecting his stats to an extent.

I think it's more likely that he likes to get his teammates involved in the offense. Anyone can tell from Jose's play, that he's an unselfish player.

rdtx2005 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Calderon has put up great numbers as a starter.. but the offense has become far too predictable.

I've saying for a couple of weeks that our offence is far too cautious. No fast break opportunities and a lot fewer open 3 point opportunities.

Since TJ's injury, the Raps are 5-7 and scoring only 91.7 ppg. I know there are a lot of reasons for that .... but clearly the offence is not clicking like it should.

rdtx2005 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Calderon has put up great numbers as a starter.. but the offense has become far too predictable.

Unfortunately numbers mean nothing when your team can't buy a bucket and you lose the game.

rdtx2005 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Calderon has put up great numbers as a starter.. but the offense has become far too predictable.

The offence has always been too predictable. That's part of the problem. TJ only makes it unpredictable by running around like a chicken without a head, but that often leads to poor results because teammates don't know where he's heading.

If we had more plays than the pick and roll or find-a-bit-of-open-space-and-take-a-shot, the offence with Jose would look less predictable. For that matter, a more structured offence wouldn't hurt Ford either.

As Hubie Brown said last Friday night, the Raptors have a hard time finding easy ways to score baskets. TJ, for all of his talent, is no better at finding easy ways to score. He does a fair bit of things with a high degree of difficulty.

We need an offensive structure that helps both PG initiate plays that end with easy buckets. Why, for example, do we see one backdoor cut every 10 games? Are they being rationed? And why don't our three point corner shooters switch sides? Yesterday, Damon Jones spotted up in the corner for a 3, was covered, sprinted to the other corner thus losing his defender, and fired of a wide-open 3. I never see JK or CD do that. AP might occasionally. None of this is rocket science.

My gut says Sam spent so much time in training camp trying to improve our D - and I think, by and large, we are a bit better, we didn't do more to diversify the offence with the result that other teams are figuring out how to stop us. A few days ago, the coaches supposedly "tweaked" the offence. Isn't that something we should have done three months ago?

I agree with T.Duncan21. Jose is the only guard who pulls up on 3 vs 2 break and allow the defense to get back & set up. He hardly ever passes when a man cuts to the basket or he always hesitates. Therefore, the offense never has any flow. The team would be better with a play making point guard who could take advantage of the Raptor's speed. TJ is too erratic

Tommy Gun wrote:Unfortunately, jose is not very effective at getting easy baskets for his team. He makes the right passes on the perimeter (he's excellent at that), but how many times has he gotten in the lane and dropped it to someone for a dunk? Very rarely. He also has a bizarre habit of constantly pulling up on 3-2s or 4-3s.

Why is this perception continuing? We were last in the league in points in the paint last year with TJ playing most of the minutes so why do people think that TJ is creating a layup line for a team full of jump shooters?

Several layups for Moon and Bosh yesterday from Calderon feeds. The overall problem? Other than those 2 players and probably Hump, the rest of the team is a bunch of jump shooters who have trouble getting easy baskets. He's 2nd in the league in assists per minute yet some how, none of these are easy baskets? WTF?

This is how our team is built and when TJ returns, you're going to notice that most of his assists are exactly the same as Jose's. Pick and rolls at the top of the key and kicking the ball to an open jump shooter. That's how the team is built.