The Jazz don't value first round picks

[dalekjazz]

The Jazz gave away talented Eric Maynor for cash relief. They gave up on Morris Almond, another former first round pick, who could have been a Redd-type player. Now its looks like they are giving up on Koufos, who seems to be regressing and not getting any playing time. They are not even sending Koufos to the D-League so he could work on his game during live game action. That's what the Developmental League is supposed to be for. The Jazz only had two worthwhile first round picks the whole decade, Deron Williams and Ronnie Brewer. The Jazz wasted first round picks on guys like Kirk Snyder, Curtis Borchardt, and Raul Lopez, who were traded for superstar Greg Ostertag. Kris Humphries was traded for one of biggest busts in lottery history, Rafael Araujo. Sasha Pavlovic was left unprotected and he went to Cleveland. In the 1990's the Jazz only had two worthwhile first round picks, Greg Ostertag and Andrei Kirilenko. The Jazz have more success with second round picks and undrafted rookies.

[jazzrock]

Of all those names you list, who is a worthwhile pick????? You say we gave up on Mo Almond who could be a "Redd type player". What is Monuts doing now? And where is Snyder????? Maybe we gave up on them cuz they werent good picks. So maybe its not that we dont value first round picks. Its just that when you pick in the late first round, most guys dont pan out.

In essence, dont be a hater. We would not be any better if we let Koufos or other rookies play. Maybe Koufos is just not that good. We have an $83mm payroll. With that kind of payroll, we dont need to develop players. We need to win.

[DelaneyRudd]

I'm going to randomly click on-Orlando.


Courtney Lee
J. J. Redick
Fran Vázquez
Dwight Howard
Reece Gaines
Ryan Humphry (via the Borchardt deal)
Jerryl Sasser
Steven Hunter
Courtney Alexander
Keyon Dooling
Mike Miller


That's all the 1st rounders since 2000. There's a reason the 2 players you called out as the exception are also the two lottery picks, the only ones the Jazz have ever had.

[dalekjazz]

Of all those names you list, who is a worthwhile pick????? You say we gave up on Mo Almond who could be a "Redd type player". What is Monuts doing now? And where is Snyder????? Maybe we gave up on them cuz they werent good picks. So maybe its not that we dont value first round picks. Its just that when you pick in the late first round, most guys dont pan out.

In essence, dont be a hater. We would not be any better if we let Koufos or other rookies play. Maybe Koufos is just not that good. We have an $83mm payroll. With that kind of payroll, we dont need to develop players. We need to win.

If the Jazz repeatedly draft players in the first round who lack talent, somebody should be held accountable. The Jazz talent scout would be a good start.

[dalekjazz]

I'm going to randomly click on-Orlando.


Courtney Lee
J. J. Redick
Fran Vázquez
Dwight Howard
Reece Gaines
Ryan Humphry (via the Borchardt deal)
Jerryl Sasser
Steven Hunter
Courtney Alexander
Keyon Dooling
Mike Miller



That's all the 1st rounders since 2000. There's a reason the 2 players you called out as the exception are also the two lottery picks, the only ones the Jazz have ever had.

Kris Humphries was a lottery pick.

[DelaneyRudd]

Would you feel better about yourself if Paul Millsap and Wes Matthews were taken in the first round? The late first round picks the Jazz get haven't been spectacular but they aren't unusual either.

[dalekjazz]

Would you feel better about yourself if Paul Millsap and Wes Matthews were taken in the first round? The late first round picks the Jazz get haven't been spectacular but they aren't unusual either.

In addition there are guys like CJ Miles, Mo Williams, Jarron Collins, Bryon Russell, and Shandon Anderson. Maybe the Jazz take the time to develop a guy like CJ Miles because he is cheaper than a first round pick to develop. They have been plenty patient with him.

[HammerDunk]

Would you feel better about yourself if Paul Millsap and Wes Matthews were taken in the first round? The late first round picks the Jazz get haven't been spectacular but they aren't unusual either.

In addition there are guys like CJ Miles, Mo Williams, Jarron Collins, Bryon Russell, and Shandon Anderson. Maybe the Jazz take the time to develop a guy like CJ Miles because he is cheaper than a first round pick to develop. They have been plenty patient with him.

What has Koufos done to show he deserves more PT? The guy works hard, but never looks comfortable on the court. He never maximizes the minutes he gets. Should we develop a guy like this at the expense of a win? of two wins? of five wins? The problem with sending him down to the d-league is that we have a very foul prone Millsap, and sometimes Boozer can be just as bad. When that happens, our options dwindle. Plus, we need to fill at least 13 roster spots. You can't send everyone not getting enough PT down to the d-league.

[UTJazzFan_Echo1]

First of all the Jazz have not given up on Kosta. How old is he? 20? 21? The kid is still just that, a kid. He works extremely hard and the Jazz value that kind of work ethic in their young players. Just give him time; he probably needs another 2-3 seasons before he can steadily contribute for any team.

Second, Morris Almond was never an NBA player and still is not an NBA player and most likely never will be an NBA player.

Third, the Jazz loved Eric Maynor but traded him away because of their large payroll. OKC was one of the couple teams that were capable of being trade partners with the Jazz in a trade that would allow the Jazz to save lots of money by trading away Harp. The price was Maynor and the Jazz jumped at the chance to save money for the sake of the franchise; any smart franchise would have done the same thing. Had the Jazz not been in such a tight money situation they most certainly would have loved to keep Maynor. Plus his loss was not that big of a deal since we have Ronnie Price.

The Jazz don't give up on young players; just look at CJ Miles, Ronnie Brewer and Paul Millsap. They waited and kept faith in them even when some (CJ comes to mind) seemed like they weren't going anywhere or had seemingly large limitations (Millsap's size, Brewer's jumpshot). They have even kept Fesenko around when he looked like nothing more than an imature kid who just wanted to eat donuts and be famous and now he has even started to show promise. Wesley Matthews is another great example of how the franchise values young talent. The Jazz are one of the best teams at finding and developing young talent and will contuine to do so.

[DelaneyRudd]

Would you feel better about yourself if Paul Millsap and Wes Matthews were taken in the first round? The late first round picks the Jazz get haven't been spectacular but they aren't unusual either.

In addition there are guys like CJ Miles, Mo Williams, Jarron Collins, Bryon Russell, and Shandon Anderson. Maybe the Jazz take the time to develop a guy like CJ Miles because he is cheaper than a first round pick to develop. They have been plenty patient with him.

What has Koufos done to show he deserves more PT? The guy works hard, but never looks comfortable on the court. He never maximizes the minutes he gets. Should we develop a guy like this at the expense of a win? of two wins? of five wins? The problem with sending him down to the d-league is that we have a very foul prone Millsap, and sometimes Boozer can be just as bad. When that happens, our options dwindle. Plus, we need to fill at least 13 roster spots. You can't send everyone not getting enough PT down to the d-league.

Well, Koufos or Fesenko have to be in street clothes now with 13 on the roster.

[Neon Black]

The Knicks wouldn't even sign Almond. Doesn't that tell you something?

[hoops4life]

I don't think that they don't value you them. They stockpiled them the year that we got Deron. They know that they are a great assest to have. The draft is a crap shoot for the most part especially in the range that the jazz draft. Even the Clippers have had terrible successs and they have the best overall average pick for the last 15 years.

[erudite23]

C'mon. Let's get real. Judast. You want to know a team that doesn't value 1st round picks? Look at Phoenix. They sold the rights to Luol Deng, Rajon Rondo, and Rudy Fernandez, among others...FOR CASH. CASH, not even cap relief, just plain old cash. The Jazz got 10m+ in relief for the 20th pick in the 2009 draft (Maynor) who might become a starter in the league. That's solid value, whether

you like it or not. Phoenix got 3m out of the 21st pick which turned into one of the best PGs in the league.


Bottom line is that the expectation for a pick in the 20s is set at "solid rotation guy." If you can get a guy that can give you 20m a night and provide one NBA talent, that's a hit. A guy like Linas Klieza, who was a tweener forward who only really contributed as a shooter and floor spacer, was a hit. He's out of the league because he could make a little more money being a big fish in a small pond than vice versa, AND HE WAS A HIT. Stop it with the ridiculous expectations. The Jazz got Deron with their only meaningfully valuable pick in the last 25 years. As long as you hit big on one pick and then find some meaningful role players with your other assets (FA dollars, other 1st rounders, 2nd rounders, trades etc) then you are going to be ahead of the curve. Learn a thing or two about the standard in the league before you lash out.

Damn.

[dalekjazz]

In the last two decades the Jazz have had two first round picks kicked out of the NBA because of mental illness (Luther Wright, Kirk Snyder). Even the Clippers cannot make that claim. These guys make Marbury and Artest look sane. Somebody obviously is not doing their homework.

[hoops4life]

They weren't kicked out of the NBA for mental illness.

[Fido]

Amen to most of the comments in here. Dalekjazz hasn't made a single argument in this entire thread that I would buy.

[HammerDunk]

In the last two decades the Jazz have had two first round picks kicked out of the NBA because of mental illness (Luther Wright, Kirk Snyder). Even the Clippers cannot make that claim. These guys make Marbury and Artest look sane. Somebody obviously is not doing their homework.

Yeah well at least we didn't pay millions upon millions for a guy who packs heat to the locker room or a guy that would rather sit on the bench than play or a chucker (Miles doesn't touch the ball enough to matter that much) or something like that. Our problems could be much worse, and expecting every late first round pick to pan out is sheer lunacy.

[The Sheik]

I wouldnt say that they do not value draft picks, but here is where I think the problem is...

1) Scouting
2) Jerry's preference
3) Jerry developing players

We shy away from players because they "dont fit" in with the Jazz. Whether that is the Utah community or Jerry's system. Personally I am not a fan of a coach that has a system in place for specific players and cannot adjust to all players. I truly feel that had JJ Reddick fallen to us we would have selected him over a player like Ronnie Brewer whom we have historically shyed away from.

Secondly, I think KOC has a big thing to do with this. He just hasnt done a very good job of scouting players. We took a guy in Almond over the rights to Splitter (which could be valuable in a trade), Big Baby Davis, Marc Gasol and many others. Almond did exactly what he showed in college...shoots a lot and isnt interested in team ball.

Lastly Jerry just hasnt been good at developing players. He is old school and expects the players to figure it all out on their own and please spare me the Wes Matthews excuse. What exactly has Jerry developed with Matthews or even Milsap his rookie year? All Jerry did was give them PT. We have never developed a young player...CJ has shown flashes, but I cannot think of a single young player (21 or younger) that has developed under Jerry's tutelage. Deron Williams, Paul Milsap, Ronnie Brewer are all players that have developed on their own. AK is a perfect example of a player that never panned out. He showed flashes, but has been very inconsistent since.

[StocktonShorts]

I think the young guys you see excel under Sloan are the ones who figure it out on their own and work hard without being given a ton of direction. As we all know that leaves a lot of guys out of the picture. Whether this is good or bad for the team/franchise is a good, long debate.