Jazz to get the 1st, 2nd, 4th & 12th Picks

[retiredcoach]

1. Cleveland can't afford to piss off their fans--the few they have left. Millsap, Evans, and CJ plus the 3 for the 1 & 4 would piss them off. Big time.

2. Minnesota--Okur and Bell for the 2 pick! The GM would be fired. He probably should be anyway, but this would seal it. Talk about doing the Jazz a favor--a $13 million one! Minnesota needs age and experience but not guys on crutches.

3. Hayward in any trade is just plain stupid. He's the future of the Jazz. The doubters can shove their heads farther up north where there is no light if they want to, but that's the facts. If Hayward gets traded, KOC should be fired.

[Ming Kong!]

1. Cleveland can't afford to piss off their fans--the few they have left. Millsap, Evans, and CJ plus the 3 for the 1 & 4 would piss them off. Big time.

2. Minnesota--Okur and Bell for the 2 pick! The GM would be fired. He probably should be anyway, but this would seal it. Talk about doing the Jazz a favor--a $13 million one! Minnesota needs age and experience but not guys on crutches.

3. Hayward in any trade is just plain stupid. He's the future of the Jazz. The doubters can shove their heads farther up north where there is no light if they want to, but that's the facts. If Hayward gets traded, KOC should be fired.

Ok, I wouldn't go THAT far. We can't get equal return for him for sure, since most teams, except for the Indiana and Lakers really know his worth, and potential. Give me a good offer, and he's on his way out. I would hate to see him leave though, cause I REALLY like the kid.

[Neon Black]

When Hayward proves to be a longer, more athletic Manu Ginobli this thread will be a good laugh.

[Neon Black]

When Hayward proves to be a longer, more athletic Manu Ginobli this thread will be a good laugh.

[retiredcoach]

Post by Ming Kong! on Tue May 24, 2011 8:50 pm

3. Hayward in any trade is just plain stupid. He's the future of the Jazz. The doubters can shove their heads farther up north where there is no light if they want to, but that's the facts. If Hayward gets traded, KOC should be fired.

Ok, I wouldn't go THAT far. We can't get equal return for him for sure, since most teams, except for the Indiana and Lakers really know his worth, and potential. Give me a good offer, and he's on his way out. I would hate to see him leave though, cause I REALLY like the kid.

Ming, why did I go THAT far in what I said.

1. At the end of the season Corbin was using Hayward as scoring option 2 and in the last three games he was scoring option 1. In addition, Corbin was drawing plays for Hayward. There was a shift in confidence--not Hayward's Corbin's.

2. O'Connor and Corbin visited with Hayward in Indianapolis and Favors in Atlanta this Month. They didn't go there to tell them what they were doing wrong or what they needed to work on or to make sure they were doing it. They already knew Hayward was starting up at St. Vincent's in late May, and what he needed to work on had already been laid out for them. They were there building the relationship and instilling in both the rookies, who won't be rookies next year, that they are critical to the future of the Jazz. Do you know how many times the head coach and GM have visited with Jazz players away from Salt Lake in the off season. ZERO times. You don't do that if you're thinking about trading a guy.

3. Favors and Hayward will eventually account for 35% to 50% of the Jazz's offense and be major defensive factors as well. That means a significant amount of the offensive will run through them. No matter who the Jazz have at the point, those two are going to make the point guard look a whole lot better.

4. Whomever they put on the floor with Favors and Hayward will have to compliment their play. D-Will would expect those two to have complimented his play. That won't be the case this time around.

5. Once Favors has more time in the system, you'll see a significant amount of complimentary scoring being created between the two of them. That will make the Jazz much harder to defend.

6. Next year and for two more years after, Favors and Hayward will be two of the biggest bargains in the NBA.

7. Trading Hayward would bring into question KOC's draft judgement. Why draft Hayward if you give up on him after one year. The fans booed KOC. KOC rememmbers that kind of crap, so by the end of the season no one was more pleased with Hayward than KOC.

Ming, I'm glad you like Hayward. He's going to be around awhile.

[retiredcoach]

by Neon Black on Tue May 24, 2011 11:17 pm
When Hayward proves to be a longer, more athletic Manu Ginobli this thread will be a good laugh.

You're right Neon.

I looked back at the posts where I talked about the players who would avoid this draft due to the lockout and was told by a regular on this forum that I was a moron. He was certain the lockout would NOT cause anyone to not declare, and he knew that from personal experience with other drafts during lockouts.

Yeah, I had a good laugh over that. Of course, since I'm a moron I had to get somebody to teach me how to laugh!

[reapaman]

When Hayward proves to be a longer, more athletic Manu Ginobli this thread will be a good laugh.

I compared Hayward to Mike Miller's but on film and any type of statistic you use, he is much worse than Mike Miller was in his rookie season or in college in almost every possile way (they were the same age and both left after their sophmore seasons in college). Even if you take Haywards best stretch of games versus any stretch of games in Miller's rookie season, Miller is still much better in almost every way. I could care less if he is the best perimeter defender on the Jazz because at this point Monta Ellis has a higher defensive rating than anyone on the team. Plus who cares about some lame defensive rating system the Jazz made that rates him highly, hes not good on any other system created which is what matter. I have watch the games and don't see the same things you guys see.

So this guy hasn't even proven that he could potentially live up to Mike Miller, how will he possibly live up to Manu?

[retiredcoach]

Miller, Hayward, Ginobili

Miller

Hayward will shoot a better FG% and 3pt% than Miller.

His assists pg will be more consistent than Miller's.

Turnovers and Rebounds similar. Free throw % higher for Hayward. 5% better.

PPG for Hayward higher at around 17 to 19 as opposed to 13.2. Hayward's first year will hurt those averages a bit but long term it should wind up close to that range.

Hayward's EFF rating will be higher.

They both have similar ability to play multiple positions. I would give the edge to Hayward.

Hayward will contribute more in the playoffs. Money ball counts!

Hayward will make more money during his career and he won't get traded as often.

Hayward won't have a really ugly tat on his shoulder and he won't own a monkey. He also doesn't have a ruptured tendon in his thumb.

Now Ginobilit

Hayward's scoring average will be slightly lower than Ginobili's, but GH's 3pt% will be higher by 3% to 4%.

Hayward's scoring consistency will be close to Ginobili's. His assist average will be a bit more than MG's, ahd their rebound averages will be close.

Hayward's steals per game will be less than MG's, but his blocks per game will be slightly higher.

Hayward's playoff totals will be similar to MG's.

Hayward won't win a Euroleague championship, an Olympic gold metal and may be not an NBA championship. None of Hayward's brother's will play pro-ball. Hayward won't hold dual citizenship.

However, they will both have the same number of career tats.

Gordon Hayward is easier to pronounce than Manu Ginobili. And this is the reason I think Reap is focusing on Mike Miller rather than comparing GTime to Manu-sha.

Mont-A Ellis

Just plain uglier!

[retiredcoach]

Sorry to hear about Miller's daughter. It's tough to concentrate and play with a sick child in your mind. Best wishes for him and his daughter.