Trade Ideas for This Season

[red4hf]

I don't think we will see that much movement during the season, that would be more of an offseason type move. By looking at past years we might trade for 1 person. Think Ingles for someone, since he won't be playing for us again under this contract.

Ingles into cap space to reduce tax bill is the likeliest move, imo.......

I think that is the move they want, but I think the cost of dumping the salary is going to be too much. I think we will have to take some salary back.

Ingles for Craig, Holiday work. This would help the Pacers have even more money for free agency this offseason. Unfortunately I think we would have to include a pick to dump Ingles contract. Ugg

You're probably right..... But if it saves the ownership something like $10 million, it may be worth it for them.....

[D Rog]

Makes me laugh that we have accumulated 14 pages of trade talk over a 4-6 week period of time and it comes to
"Ingles into cap space to reduce tax bill is the likeliest move imo..."

If the Jazz move Ingles just to reduce tax they might as well try to move Gay and avoid the tax all together. I think they are $15M - $16M above right now.

[jazzed77]

It's sorta sad that it appears no moves will be made as it's obvious this is not a championship level team.

[Crunch 99]

At minimum, I hope we sign House. The fact we haven't yet might be because the Jazz are pursuing a more impactful move before the deadline. In the meantime, House is an UFA, so I hope we don't lose out on House and lose out on a trade.

Edit: Just looked at some more of House's ratings and stats from past years like DRAPM and DRPM, and he doesn't fare very well, but he did seem to bring good energy in his few games with the Jazz.

http://nbashotcharts.com/rapm3?id=174500606

[D Rog]

Per Shams - Looks like Josh Hart and draft assets to Portland for CJ. I kinda liked the idea of Hart for the Jazz.

Question is - What does Portland do with Dame? Philly?

[ChiroMike]

Locke brought up the salary dump with OKC sending Ingles contract plus probably Hughes to get below the tax line. Which exception contracts would that leave us with?

[babyjax13]

Locke brought up the salary dump with OKC sending Ingles contract plus probably Hughes to get below the tax line. Which exception contracts would that leave us with?

Man I would hate that but if Locke is saying it, it might happen. We'd lose Favors' TPE in the offseason, but it would leave us with a $15m TPE for next year. I guess if we could get under the luxury tax that might not be the worst thing, maybe send to Dallas into their TPE, or something to that effect. Then sign House, see how Forrest/Paschall fare, and once the draft is over and our pick has conveyed to Memphis we can use our 2023 pick and the TPE to trade for someone if we want.

[dr0welf]

3 team trade option:

Assuming New York wants to get out of Randle's large contract and have some free agency dollars this offseason

New York receives: Ingles, Whitesides, Lyles Out: Randle
Utah receives: Grant Out: Ingles, Whitesides, Hughes
Detroit Receives: Randle, Hughes Out: Grant, Lyles

Detroit gets good return for Grant with Randle and some great potential in Hughes

New York, I'm assuming they want out of Randle's contract, move on from Randle with Lyles who is a downgrade but gives them more cap room this offseason to make a move for a bigger asset

Utah we get a long player to help us defend on the perimeter

[babyjax13]

3 team trade option:

Assuming New York wants to get out of Randle's large contract and have some free agency dollars this offseason

New York receives: Ingles, Whitesides, Lyles Out: Randle
Utah receives: Grant Out: Ingles, Whitesides, Hughes
Detroit Receives: Randle, Hughes Out: Grant, Lyles

Detroit gets good return for Grant with Randle and some great potential in Hughes

New York, I'm assuming they want out of Randle's contract, move on from Randle with Lyles who is a downgrade but gives them more cap room this offseason to make a move for a bigger asset

Utah we get a long player to help us defend on the perimeter

Detroit isn't going to want Randle, he's a terrible player.

[dr0welf]

3 team trade option:

Assuming New York wants to get out of Randle's large contract and have some free agency dollars this offseason

New York receives: Ingles, Whitesides, Lyles Out: Randle
Utah receives: Grant Out: Ingles, Whitesides, Hughes
Detroit Receives: Randle, Hughes Out: Grant, Lyles

Detroit gets good return for Grant with Randle and some great potential in Hughes

New York, I'm assuming they want out of Randle's contract, move on from Randle with Lyles who is a downgrade but gives them more cap room this offseason to make a move for a bigger asset

Utah we get a long player to help us defend on the perimeter

Detroit isn't going to want Randle, he's a terrible player.

He wasn't last year, what changed? He seemed to play hard last night at Utah and shot decent. I just wonder if their are some issues in New York that a change of scenery for him will fix

[babyjax13]

3 team trade option:

Assuming New York wants to get out of Randle's large contract and have some free agency dollars this offseason

New York receives: Ingles, Whitesides, Lyles Out: Randle
Utah receives: Grant Out: Ingles, Whitesides, Hughes
Detroit Receives: Randle, Hughes Out: Grant, Lyles

Detroit gets good return for Grant with Randle and some great potential in Hughes

New York, I'm assuming they want out of Randle's contract, move on from Randle with Lyles who is a downgrade but gives them more cap room this offseason to make a move for a bigger asset

Utah we get a long player to help us defend on the perimeter

Detroit isn't going to want Randle, he's a terrible player.

He wasn't last year, what changed? He seemed to play hard last night at Utah and shot decent. I just wonder if their are some issues in New York that a change of scenery for him will fix

Well he has always been a terrible defender, but even last year his shooting felt unsustainable and he has regressed back down. I do think the attitude issues are an environment thing, but having Randle fart up midrange jumpers and take touches away from younger or better players is a recipe for low-level mediocrity. Look how he disappeared in the playoffs last year. I don't blame people for seeing that season and thinking he has some value, but regressing back to the mean immediately after doesn't bode well for his future trajectory, imo, and a young team shouldn't take the risk of adding a malcontent veteran. That's my take, at least, and Knicks fans seem to hate his game (well, and him), too.

[CAE15]

3 team trade option:

Assuming New York wants to get out of Randle's large contract and have some free agency dollars this offseason

New York receives: Ingles, Whitesides, Lyles Out: Randle
Utah receives: Grant Out: Ingles, Whitesides, Hughes
Detroit Receives: Randle, Hughes Out: Grant, Lyles

Detroit gets good return for Grant with Randle and some great potential in Hughes

New York, I'm assuming they want out of Randle's contract, move on from Randle with Lyles who is a downgrade but gives them more cap room this offseason to make a move for a bigger asset

Utah we get a long player to help us defend on the perimeter

The Jazz are providing nothing in this trade.. Ingles(out), Hughes (okay prospect) Whiteside(there's a reason he's on a minimum)

I really don't think it's an exaggeration to say every last team in the nba would offer a better package for Grant

[SoCalJazzFan]

This has a lot of moving parts, but makes at least some degree of sense for everyone involved. I posted it on Trades and Transactions, and it didn't get crucified.

Bulls in- Paul Millsap and Dennis Schroder
Celtics in- Jevon Carter and Hassan Whiteside
Jazz in- Jerami Grant and Nic Claxton
Nets in- Rudy Gay and Matt Thomas and Bulls 2nd
Pistons in- Ingles, Brown Jr, Kanter, Fernando (all expriring contracts), Jazz 1st, Jazz 2nd, Celtics 2nd and Celtics cash

Why?
Bulls- reportedly are interested in Millsap and Schroder
Celtics- Get below tax (reportedly super important to their owner) yet keep their core and remain competitive
Jazz- they are in win now mode and have to mix it up, hoping Grant and Claxton fill their weaknesses
Nets- Get a shooter and a vet to help them win now while trading Millsap to a team he wants to play with and getting value from Claxton, who they can't afford to keep.
Pistons- Grant doesn't fit their timeline. They become the dumping grounds, but in return net two 2nds and a 1st and have a ton of cap space next season to take on other contracts next year, which puts them in a better position than keeping/extending Grant.

[babyjax13]

This has a lot of moving parts, but makes at least some degree of sense for everyone involved. I posted it on Trades and Transactions, and it didn't get crucified.

Bulls in- Paul Millsap and Dennis Schroder
Celtics in- Jevon Carter and Hassan Whiteside
Jazz in- Jerami Grant and Nic Claxton
Nets in- Rudy Gay and Matt Thomas and Bulls 2nd
Pistons in- Ingles, Brown Jr, Kanter, Fernando (all expriring contracts), Jazz 1st, Jazz 2nd, Celtics 2nd and Celtics cash

Why?
Bulls- reportedly are interested in Millsap and Schroder
Celtics- Get below tax (reportedly super important to their owner) yet keep their core and remain competitive
Jazz- they are in win now mode and have to mix it up, hoping Grant and Claxton fill their weaknesses
Nets- Get a shooter and a vet to help them win now while trading Millsap to a team he wants to play with and getting value from Claxton, who they can't afford to keep.
Pistons- Grant doesn't fit their timeline. They become the dumping grounds, but in return net two 2nds and a 1st and have a ton of cap space next season to take on other contracts next year, which puts them in a better position than keeping/extending Grant.

We aren't getting Claxton and Grant for a distant first, a player out for the season, a second, and old players with no upside.

[SoCalJazzFan]

This has a lot of moving parts

We aren't getting Claxton and Grant for a distant first, a player out for the season, a second, and old players with no upside.

Maybe not, but maybe they can.

I mean who would have predicted that the Kings would have traded Tyrese Freakin Haliburton, their best/most promising player?
Who would have predicted that the Clippers would have been able to get Powell and RoCo for practically nothing?

While Grant is a potential positive asset to the Pistons, if they don't trade him he becomes a negative asset to them. Why? He helps them win, which is contra to their desire for a first overall draft pick this summer.

Also, he takes up over $20M of their cap space next year. Those old worthless vets are all expiring contracts, who both help them lose this season and free up cap space to the tune of the Pistons having roughly $60M in cap space next year, which = picks and young players to go along with the undesirable contract dumps next year. Exactly what a team like the Pistons need.

Also, we probably overrate Grant. Several teams that were rumored to be in the running for him have made trades that didn't include him. The reality is that he is the Piston's Clarkson, but a starter. He will regress to his Nuggets days most likely if the 3rd or 4th option, as he would be on the Jazz. I'm sure that other GMs recognize that, and that probably gives them pause to pay out 1sts or good players for him. However, that could still be enough to make a difference for the Jazz during the playoffs. (If not, there will be a lot of contracts on the block this summer).

The Jazz pick, which I reluctantly give up to chase perhaps the best chance of a Jazz deep run over the next year or two, might be pretty valuable in 2026. The Jazz would probably have to put only soft protections on it, and perhaps the Celtics would be willing to take it and give up their 2022 1st, lottery protected, in the deal instead. If not, the Jazz pick becomes a trade chip for the Pistons in the near future for teams that can put off a draft pick now for a better pick later, and they also get two additional 2nds, not a bad haul for a player whose trade value is drying up pretty fast.

Claxton is a RFA, whom the Nets absolutely cannot afford next season, regardless if he makes $5M or $15M in actual salary as he would cost them $25M-$65M with taxes. Rudy Gay, a vet who can help them this year and a 2nd is probably about as much as they can hope to get for him. Their problems lie in their misguided, ethereal PG, who is going to miss over half of the season and playoffs and will probably cost them Harden.

[CAE15]

This has a lot of moving parts

We aren't getting Claxton and Grant for a distant first, a player out for the season, a second, and old players with no upside.

Maybe not, but maybe they can.

I mean who would have predicted that the Kings would have traded Tyrese Freakin Haliburton, their best/most promising player?
Who would have predicted that the Clippers would have been able to get Powell and RoCo for practically nothing?

While Grant is a potential positive asset to the Pistons, if they don't trade him he becomes a negative asset to them. Why? He helps them win, which is contra to their desire for a first overall draft pick this summer.

Also, he takes up over $20M of their cap space next year. Those old worthless vets are all expiring contracts, who both help them lose this season and free up cap space to the tune of the Pistons having roughly $60M in cap space next year, which = picks and young players to go along with the undesirable contract dumps next year. Exactly what a team like the Pistons need.

Also, we probably overrate Grant. Several teams that were rumored to be in the running for him have made trades that didn't include him. The reality is that he is the Piston's Clarkson, but a starter. He will regress to his Nuggets days most likely if the 3rd or 4th option, as he would be on the Jazz. I'm sure that other GMs recognize that, and that probably gives them pause to pay out 1sts or good players for him. However, that could still be enough to make a difference for the Jazz during the playoffs. (If not, there will be a lot of contracts on the block this summer).

The Jazz pick, which I reluctantly give up to chase perhaps the best chance of a Jazz deep run over the next year or two, might be pretty valuable in 2026. The Jazz would probably have to put only soft protections on it, and perhaps the Celtics would be willing to take it and give up their 2022 1st, lottery protected, in the deal instead. If not, the Jazz pick becomes a trade chip for the Pistons in the near future for teams that can put off a draft pick now for a better pick later, and they also get two additional 2nds, not a bad haul for a player whose trade value is drying up pretty fast.

Claxton is a RFA, whom the Nets absolutely cannot afford next season, regardless if he makes $5M or $15M in actual salary as he would cost them $25M-$65M with taxes. Rudy Gay, a vet who can help them this year and a 2nd is probably about as much as they can hope to get for him. Their problems lie in their misguided, ethereal PG, who is going to miss over half of the season and playoffs and will probably cost them Harden.

He is not the pistons Clarkson.. mostly because he's actually a legitimate two way player. Detroit is sitting where they are because they're waiting for the best deal to come along. They aren't trying to make a deal to beat the other teams to the punch. They're waiting around and may even wait until the offseason to move him. He's a valuable player and a hot commodity. Your trade just doesn't have enough upside in it for the jazz to come out with Grant and Claxton. So many teams can beat that, the only chance jazz have at a Grant deal is if someone is enamored with Clarkson for some reason or Bogey being involved or less likely Royce. Possibly Butler and an additional pick could close it but I imagine there would be another team.

[bkohler]

Seeing how things are shaking out here’s what I’d try and do:


Ingles + 2nd(s) for KCP
Clarkson + Whiteside + update protections on picks for Kenrich Williams

Get out of the tax and return a perimeter defender who’s shooting hopefully comes around and add a player who seems to make the world better for his team.

[Charlie_S]

Take it with the proverbial grain of salt, but the main Italian sports newspaper is reporting that the Jazz have made an offer to the Hawks for Gallinari that would include Ingles and Gay.

[SoCalJazzFan]

He is not the pistons Clarkson.. mostly because he's actually a legitimate two way player. Detroit is sitting where they are because they're waiting for the best deal to come along. They aren't trying to make a deal to beat the other teams to the punch. They're waiting around and may even wait until the offseason to move him. He's a valuable player and a hot commodity. Your trade just doesn't have enough upside in it for the jazz to come out with Grant and Claxton. So many teams can beat that, the only chance jazz have at a Grant deal is if someone is enamored with Clarkson for some reason or Bogey being involved or less likely Royce. Possibly Butler and an additional pick could close it but I imagine there would be another team.[/quote]

I'm not saying that Grant is on par with Clarkson, what I am saying is that some of his stats are inflated due to his role on the Pistons. Just like Clarkson has the green light to shoot at will with the bench unit, Grant has been the #1 guy on the Pistons for the most part.
For example, he has averaged roughly 21 ppg with Detroit. The prior two seasons with OKC and DEN he averaged roughly 13 ppg.
He is averaging 2.6 asts with DET, but only 1.1 asts prior two years
6.2 FTA/game vs 2.8 FTA
However, his advanced stats (LEBRON, RAPTOR, Ortg/Drtg, WS/48) have been pretty pedestrian the past two years.
One would think that once he joins a contender and goes back to being the 3rd or 4th option, he will regress to his old stats.

He is a good player, and would hopefully be for the Jazz what Iguadala was for the Warriors, that necessary piece of the puzzle that pulls them over the top. He is not an All Star level player, or even close to that, though.

We'll see if the Pistons get more than a 1st, two 2nds and OKC-level cap space from anyone else. They are certainly not interested in Clarkson, Bogey or Royce, and I wonder who would be that could be the 3rd team in the deal that wouldn't want Grant instead.

There is near complete radio silence with respect to Claxton getting traded, although the Nets stand to lose him for nothing if they don't trade him.

[red4hf]

Well..... I was off......