RealGM

Other than height.

A) Younger
B) Smoother stroke from long distance
C) Read a book once

Actually, I'm not sure he is a better player. I leave that for front office to decide. Similar thread on the Toronto board is interesting. I love Kemba and think he is a winner. I also like Knight and am warming up to him.

Much younger, much better body, better at same age, better shooter, smarter.

Bat wrote:better shooter, smarter.

You can't be serious? On what basis do you get your "smarter" analysis from? I'd argue Kemba is the much smarter player. He's spent three years at UCONN and led them to a National Championship. Not to mention he committed only 1.9 turnovers per game as opposed to Knight's 3.2. One of knocks against Knight is that he takes ill-advised shots too. And sure Walker is smaller, but he still averaged more rebounds than Knight. Walker also showed dramatic improvement each year he was at UCONN. Now onto shooting...Knight shot 42% last year and Walker shot 43%. Pretty much a wash there. Not sure where that logic comes in. As for youth, Kemba is only a year and a half older than Knight and much more experienced at the college level too.

You bring up some good points about Walker's game. But the size issue shouldn't be brushed aside.

Walker has the same standing reach as Nate Robinson. Chris Paul (often described as a midget) has an inch and a half on his reach. Guys that size have to be phenomenal athletes in order to make it in the bigger, faster, stronger NBA, and I'm not sure Kemba is that caliber of athlete.

CarrKeefe wrote:

Bat wrote:better shooter, smarter.

You can't be serious? On what basis do you get your "smarter" analysis from? I'd argue Kemba is the much smarter player. He's spent three years at UCONN and led them to a National Championship. Not to mention he committed only 1.9 turnovers per game as opposed to Knight's 3.2. One of knocks against Knight is that he takes ill-advised shots too. And sure Walker is smaller, but he still averaged more rebounds than Knight. Walker also showed dramatic improvement each year he was at UCONN. Now onto shooting...Knight shot 42% last year and Walker shot 43%. Pretty much a wash there. Not sure where that logic comes in. As for youth, Kemba is only a year and a half older than Knight and much more experienced at the college level too.

Rumor is he's a straight "A" student, or near. If you've proven you are intelligent in the class and have the talent as a basketball player that he has, you'd suppose the smarts would translate into his game.

johnnyblazzed wrote:

CarrKeefe wrote:

Bat wrote:better shooter, smarter.

You can't be serious? On what basis do you get your "smarter" analysis from? I'd argue Kemba is the much smarter player. He's spent three years at UCONN and led them to a National Championship. Not to mention he committed only 1.9 turnovers per game as opposed to Knight's 3.2. One of knocks against Knight is that he takes ill-advised shots too. And sure Walker is smaller, but he still averaged more rebounds than Knight. Walker also showed dramatic improvement each year he was at UCONN. Now onto shooting...Knight shot 42% last year and Walker shot 43%. Pretty much a wash there. Not sure where that logic comes in. As for youth, Kemba is only a year and a half older than Knight and much more experienced at the college level too.

Rumor is he's a straight "A" student, or near. If you've proven you are intelligent in the class and have the talent as a basketball player that he has, you'd suppose the smarts would translate into his game.

Kemba graduated college in three years while playing Division I basketball. I'd call that equally impressive. And all I'm saying is that Brandon Knight is not a better shooter than Kemba, he is only a year and a half younger, and he makes more bad decisions with the ball then Kemba does.

Don't compare junior numbers to Freshman numbers, that is your first problem. Knight is so much better than walker as a freshman it's not close. Look no further than 3pt shooting to see who is the better shooter, it's obvious.

Also, if you don't see the difference between the age of a basketball player who played three years in college against a freshman you don't understand hoops. You reall are trying to compare apples and oranges if you want to look at this comparison statistically.

CarrKeefe wrote:Kemba graduated college in three years while playing Division I basketball. I'd call that equally impressive. And all I'm saying is that Brandon Knight is not a better shooter than Kemba, he is only a year and a half younger, and he makes more bad decisions with the ball then Kemba does.

Brandon knight graduated from high school with a year of college done, that is before stepping foot on a college campus. He had a 4.3 gpa. That is better than straight a's. that's while winning Gatorade player of the year twice in a row, dominating high school basketball. That's far more impressive than graduating in 3 years which really isn't all that out of the ordinary if you take summer classes. Not saying walker is dumb, he's not, but knight is extraordinary for a student athlete.

Bat wrote:Don't compare junior numbers to Freshman numbers, that is your first problem. Knight is so much better than walker as a freshman it's not close. Look no further than 3pt shooting to see who is the better shooter, it's obvious.

Also, if you don't see the difference between the age of a basketball player who played three years in college against a freshman you don't understand hoops. You reall are trying to compare apples and oranges if you want to look at this comparison statistically.

Kemba Walker still shot better as a freshman than Brandon Knight....47%. I don't look at just three point shooting to determine who is the better shooter either. Knight and Kembas roles were different in their freshman year. Knight averaged 10 more minutes a game his freshman year and was asked to take more of the scoring burden. Kemba wasn't asked to do that. If anybody is comparing apples to oranges, it is you.

Kemba Walker has improved dramatically every year he's been in college. He doesn't make a lot of bad decisions passing the ball. Right now, Kemba is the better shooter, better rebounder, better passer, makes better decisions with the ball, he's the smarter player, and he's won a championship. Just because Knight had better freshman numbers shooting the three and scoring doesn't mean he's going to continue to progress well beyond Walker. I'd argue otherwise because again, Walker has shown improvement every year he's played. My argument here is that Knight is not a better shooter and smarter then Walker right now. Stats and their play on the court say otherwise.

Bat wrote:Don't compare junior numbers to Freshman numbers, that is your first problem.

This.

Of course the danger is that a guy doesn't continue on the same improvement path, but I'm confident Knight will continue to get better.

On a related note, TrueHoop (ESPN blog) posted this today:

Players Drafted In Top 15, Past 20 Years
Age No. of players Pct. of All-Stars
17 2 50
18 17 23.5
19 50 24
20 58 27.9
21 81 22.2
22 75 9.3*
23 15 0*
24 2 50*

Full article: http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_ ... -nba-draft

I think the idea is that a 22-yr old college senior has most likely reached a significant developmental plateau. Of course he can still improve, but it won't be as significant as the improvement from age 18 to 22.

This is one reason people should fear drafting Jimmer. With Jimmer you're likely getting what you see today and there's not much chance he'll drastically improve.

Bat wrote:

CarrKeefe wrote:Kemba graduated college in three years while playing Division I basketball. I'd call that equally impressive. And all I'm saying is that Brandon Knight is not a better shooter than Kemba, he is only a year and a half younger, and he makes more bad decisions with the ball then Kemba does.

Brandon knight graduated from high school with a year of college done, that is before stepping foot on a college campus. He had a 4.3 gpa. That is better than straight a's. that's while winning Gatorade player of the year twice in a row, dominating high school basketball. That's far more impressive than graduating in 3 years which really isn't all that out of the ordinary if you take summer classes. Not saying walker is dumb, he's not, but knight is extraordinary for a student athlete.

Having a 4.0 in high school is more impressive than graduating college in three years?

CarrKeefe wrote:Kemba Walker still shot better as a freshman than Brandon Knight....47%.

If we use a more telling shooting percentage stat, like eFG% or TS%, then Knight was a better shooter as a freshman than Walker. With better stats readily available there's no excuse to continue using straight FG% is there?

Edit: clarified that I meant Knight was a better shooter

I'm not arguing which player will be the better player. Kemba could be better or Knight could be better. I'm arguing Bat's assessment that Knight is the smarter player and better shooter. Right now, Walker is. Could Knight's improvement and development turn into something special and become better than Knight? Maybe. That could be why the Jazz take him at 3.

CarrKeefe wrote:

Bat wrote:

CarrKeefe wrote:Kemba graduated college in three years while playing Division I basketball. I'd call that equally impressive. And all I'm saying is that Brandon Knight is not a better shooter than Kemba, he is only a year and a half younger, and he makes more bad decisions with the ball then Kemba does.

Brandon knight graduated from high school with a year of college done, that is before stepping foot on a college campus. He had a 4.3 gpa. That is better than straight a's. that's while winning Gatorade player of the year twice in a row, dominating high school basketball. That's far more impressive than graduating in 3 years which really isn't all that out of the ordinary if you take summer classes. Not saying walker is dumb, he's not, but knight is extraordinary for a student athlete.

Having a 4.0 in high school is more impressive than graduating college in three years?

Did you read whatbi wrote. 4.3 withna year of college done before stepping foot on campus.

HappyProle wrote:

CarrKeefe wrote:Kemba Walker still shot better as a freshman than Brandon Knight....47%.

If we use a more telling shooting percentage stat, like eFG% or TS%, then Knight was better as a freshman than Walker. With better stats readily available there's no excuse to continue using straight FG% is there?

Comparing freshman numbers is so far overrated. Both players had different roles and were in completely different situations.

Knight's freshman year: Took the most shots of anybody on the team. 513 regular season shots. Averaged 36 minutes per game.

Walkers freshman year: Took fifth most shots on the team. 234 regular season shots. As a freshman he had to split minutes with Senior Craig Austrie. Kemba averaged 25mins a game and Austrie averaged 25mins a game.

Completely different situations and roles. Calipari gave Knight the greenlight to lead the team in scoring, but Jim Calhoun didn't hand over the reigns to Kemba right away.

Walker is the much better athlete, ball handler, and passer.

CarrKeefe wrote:Completely different situations and roles. Calipari gave Knight the greenlight to lead the team in scoring, but Jim Calhoun didn't hand over the reigns to Kemba right away.

One could spin that as a point in favor of Knight.

ANALOGY:

Deron Williams first year in the NBA: 10.8 ppg, 4.5 assists per game, 2.4 rebounds per game, and shot 42% from the floor.

Chris Paul's first year in the NBA: 16.1 ppg, 7.8 assists per game, 5.1 rebounds per game, shot 43% from the floor.

So we obviously should have taken Chris Paul right? He had the better first year numbers. What you're failing to see is that the two players were in completely different situations. Chris Paul wasn't the obviously better player, he just had a different role right away. Deron was stuck behind Milt frickin Palacio. That's why analyzing freshman numbers when roles/situations/minutes are different is so overrated.

CarrKeefe wrote:ANALOGY:

Deron Williams first year in the NBA: 10.8 ppg, 4.5 assists per game, 2.4 rebounds per game, and shot 42% from the floor.

Chris Paul's first year in the NBA: 16.1 ppg, 7.8 assists per game, 5.1 rebounds per game, shot 43% from the floor.

So we obviously should have taken Chris Paul right? He had the better first year numbers. What you're failing to see is that the two players were in completely different situations. Chris Paul wasn't the obviously better player, he just had a different role right away. Deron was stuck behind Milt frickin Palacio. That's why analyzing freshman numbers when roles/situations/minutes are different is so overrated.

Then why are you trying to compare shooting percentages.