RealGM

We could have done the Miami trade easily, and we could have forced Dallas' hand on this exception deal.

I think we will rue the day on Perry Jones!

Discuss:

the jazz had two players they red flagged perhaps one was perry jones guess they thought he wasnt worth the late first. They will regret it later.

Maybe the Jazz had as much interest as the other 20+ teams who passed on him. Also what would they give up to get a hurt Perry Jones? Is he worth our 2013 first rnd pick? The GState pick? Big Al? sap? Really I doubt swapping or 47th pick and a future 2nd round pick would have done it.

I think he is worth what Philly gave Miami for #27. This guys has top 5 talent and he fell based on motor and knee concerns. Character is not an issue... he is a great young man.

So really it was a motor issue. If you read the article out on him today... his motor has more to do with the selfish chuckers he played with than his reluctance to take over and be selfish himself.

I would have done this deal in a heartbeat and especially to prevent OKC from getting him.

2 players in this draft have the upside to be the top player in this draft over Davis and they were Drummond and PJ3... you do the deal unless there are character issues... there weren't.... should have done the deal.

What do you lose out on? A mid first rounder... Totally worth it,

Bottom line is KOC gets paid millions of dollars because he is damn good at what he does. I'm sure he weighed his options and didn't feel it was worth the risk.

Why are we going to question that?

He's really bad and plays the position as most of their good players.

blackham9258 wrote:

What do you lose out on? A mid first rounder... Totally worth it,

PJ3 is not worth the Jazz 2013 pick, which could be between #8 to #17.......the Jazz could easily be in the lottery again.

PJ3 sucked in college. I watched him play a lot since last year when he was expected to be the #2 pick. He sucks. He is 6-11, tall, coordinated, awesome athlete. All that " talent " will not work in the NBA where everyone else is equal. He wants to be a SF.....but cannot play defense. As a PF he will get pushed around like a wimp in prison. He will get bullied. No drive....no motor. He could not dominate in college!!!!!!!

Seems like a good guy, but no mean streak. Sucks.

Jazz Fans would suffer if we gave up the 2013 pick.

If we has the 27th pick I would have taken Jones, but what do you have to give up to get him?
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Sullinger is actually good, NBA strength, very skilled.....but a bit small for the nba game. I would have picked him with the #18 pick we gave to Minnesota. He is good, but the Jazz are full of PF's.

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I trust KOC could not make a good deal, and that other teams were asking too high of a price. I am happy he did not trade the Jazz 2013 pick GSW pick for something crappy.

Mo Willams for free is getting a career 39% 3 point shooter who can score.

PJ3 is earl clarke 2.0. He has the same problems earl clark did. He's too skinny to bang in the post, his jumper is way too inconsistent, he's not an "energy" guy, he doesn't play alot of defense and he's not a distributor or leader either. I mean what is he gonna do in the nba?

And don't tell me "he can learn" how to do those thing because that never happens. At least with a guy like drummond I know he has nba translatable shot blocking skills and he has great size to be in the post. PJ3 isn't a risk, that would be a leap of faith. I glad didn't do anything stupid and drafted the stud of the 2nd round in kevin Murphy. Getting another pick for Doron lamb wouldve been nice also, but I'm not complaining.

rick333 wrote:Bottom line is KOC gets paid millions of dollars because he is damn good at what he does. I'm sure he weighed his options and didn't feel it was worth the risk.

Why are we going to question that?

cuz only fools dont question nothing, and im tired of all that talk praising O'connor for nothing, like @blackham said we could easily get Jones, getting English woudn't be hard either, we didnt get them because oconnor is lousy gm thats all, but from better perspective its great that he finally get that we need shooter it just took him 2 f*cking years

ps. its not so obvious that Mo will land back in Utah,firstly we shouldn't release him in 2004

eLo wrote:

rick333 wrote:Bottom line is KOC gets paid millions of dollars because he is damn good at what he does. I'm sure he weighed his options and didn't feel it was worth the risk.

Why are we going to question that?

cuz only fools dont question nothing, and im tired of all that talk praising O'connor for nothing, like @blackham said we could easily get Jones, getting English woudn't be hard either, we didnt get them because oconnor is lousy gm thats all, but from better perspective its great that he finally get that we need shooter it just took him 2 f*cking years

ps. its not so obvious that Mo will land back in Utah,firstly we shouldn't release him in 2004

I believe it's been well documented that KOC is one of the top GM's in the league. Unfortunately, he doesn't have the luxury of being as aggressive as bigger market teams. Everyone is going to make mistakes, but I think we all agree that he is doing a much better job than any of us would do. Only fools would disagree.

Maybe its me but pj3 still seems pretty raw. Even if his knees are fine over the long haul, I see the jazz as a team not needing another raw talent who they need to mold. I would rather see that effort be focused on Enes and Favors. Also I don't know that investing assets for the most questionable guy in the 2012 draft serves our needs for next season. I am fine with the jazz not taking this incalculable risk.

Since the first round price seems to have probably been Millsap, when has a player big on potential, short on experience, and medically flagged ever become a better player than Paul Millsap? We wouldn't trade Millsap for Dejuan Blair after proving he isn't a bust. Why would we trade him for someone in a similar situation before he is proven?

rick333 wrote:

eLo wrote:

rick333 wrote:Bottom line is KOC gets paid millions of dollars because he is damn good at what he does. I'm sure he weighed his options and didn't feel it was worth the risk.

Why are we going to question that?

cuz only fools dont question nothing, and im tired of all that talk praising O'connor for nothing, like @blackham said we could easily get Jones, getting English woudn't be hard either, we didnt get them because oconnor is lousy gm thats all, but from better perspective its great that he finally get that we need shooter it just took him 2 f*cking years

ps. its not so obvious that Mo will land back in Utah,firstly we shouldn't release him in 2004

I believe it's been well documented that KOC is one of the top GM's in the league. Unfortunately, he doesn't have the luxury of being as aggressive as bigger market teams. Everyone is going to make mistakes, but I think we all agree that he is doing a much better job than any of us would do. Only fools would disagree.

U have to remember these guys are fans not a gm who has a fiscal responsibility to his organization to make the best possible moves to keep the team competitive and fiscally sound.

DelaneyRudd wrote:Since the first round price seems to have probably been Millsap, when has a player big on potential, short on experience, and medically flagged ever become a better player than Paul Millsap? We wouldn't trade Millsap for Dejuan Blair after proving he isn't a bust. Why would we trade him for someone in a similar situation before he is proven?

Derrick Favors. Derrick Favors is why. Also, Millsap is in his last year. You know these things.

Also, Miami traded #27 to Philly (a conference rival AND playoff contender) for #45 and their 2013 1st rounder. That's not the price you're saying it was. Not even close.

We could have provided a better offer, and garnered a top five talent. But we'd need testicles to do that. Actually, at 27 and with an additional 2013 pick, I'd say there wasn't even the need for testicles. Just a couple phone calls. Risk would be gone. Also, remember what they tell us when we don't have picks: It's not like we need more youth!

Then next year, with two picks: It's always best to have as many assets as possible. It makes them more comfortable to sit on.

eLo wrote:

rick333 wrote:Bottom line is KOC gets paid millions of dollars because he is damn good at what he does. I'm sure he weighed his options and didn't feel it was worth the risk.

Why are we going to question that?

cuz only fools dont question nothing, and im tired of all that talk praising O'connor for nothing, like @blackham said we could easily get Jones, getting English woudn't be hard either, we didnt get them because oconnor is lousy gm thats all, but from better perspective its great that he finally get that we need shooter it just took him 2 f*cking years

ps. its not so obvious that Mo will land back in Utah,firstly we shouldn't release him in 2004

The Utah Jazz have the 5th highest winning percentage of all active franchises at .544. Since KOC took over the Jazz have a winning percentage of .561.

I'd say he's earned the benefit of the doubt, and we're damn lucky to have him in a small market.

DiscoLives4ever wrote:

eLo wrote:

rick333 wrote:Bottom line is KOC gets paid millions of dollars because he is damn good at what he does. I'm sure he weighed his options and didn't feel it was worth the risk.

Why are we going to question that?

cuz only fools dont question nothing, and im tired of all that talk praising O'connor for nothing, like @blackham said we could easily get Jones, getting English woudn't be hard either, we didnt get them because oconnor is lousy gm thats all, but from better perspective its great that he finally get that we need shooter it just took him 2 f*cking years

ps. its not so obvious that Mo will land back in Utah,firstly we shouldn't release him in 2004

The Utah Jazz have the 5th highest winning percentage of all active franchises at .544. Since KOC took over the Jazz have a winning percentage of .561.

I'd say he's earned the benefit of the doubt, and we're damn lucky to have him in a small market.

im asking how good gm may let his team to play for two seasons without any shooter, that cost us miserable 11/12 and easy knock in play offs this year.

eLo wrote:

DiscoLives4ever wrote:
The Utah Jazz have the 5th highest winning percentage of all active franchises at .544. Since KOC took over the Jazz have a winning percentage of .561.

I'd say he's earned the benefit of the doubt, and we're damn lucky to have him in a small market.

im asking how good gm may let his team to play for two seasons without any shooter, that cost us miserable 11/12 and easy knock in play offs this year.

Please, show me ANY evidence of these incredible deals that KOC is passing up on. You do know we can't force another team to accept a trade right? It has to be a good deal for them as well. Not to mention other factors (How do salaries come into play? How does it affect us long-term? Etc. etc.).

What would we realistically gain this year by having Jones over Murphy? Maybe a win or two? And how much do we lose out on by not having the 8-15 pick next year? Is it worth not having a lottery pick next year just to maybe pick up a couple games more this year?

Well I want him to set us up for the future to win a championship and not rentals for next year or guys who are pure specialist. Mo williams does us no good past next year and a guy like english is just a shooting specialist. I want my shooters to at least be capable of good defense and even though english tries, he just doesn't have it in him defensively.

I say we are in a perfect position to take a run at courtney lee because he's exactly what we need. He's young, he won't cost a lot, a very good 3 point shooter, plays good defense and has experience in the playoffs. Plus the rockets got enough wings and guards so they probably won't try too hard to keep him. He would be a perfect long term move and fit right into the starting line up next to Murphy or Hayward.

By picking murphy and not doing anything stupid, KOC is on the road to redeeming himself. BTW Kevin Jones is an undersized PF with limited potential, no more of those. Stop that thinking, that mediocracy thinking. If he joins the jazz as a summer league invite then fine but I'm not making any serious effort for a guy like him.

DiscoLives4ever wrote:

eLo wrote:

DiscoLives4ever wrote:
The Utah Jazz have the 5th highest winning percentage of all active franchises at .544. Since KOC took over the Jazz have a winning percentage of .561.

I'd say he's earned the benefit of the doubt, and we're damn lucky to have him in a small market.

im asking how good gm may let his team to play for two seasons without any shooter, that cost us miserable 11/12 and easy knock in play offs this year.

Please, show me ANY evidence of these incredible deals that KOC is passing up on. You do know we can't force another team to accept a trade right? It has to be a good deal for them as well. Not to mention other factors (How do salaries come into play? How does it affect us long-term? Etc. etc.).

What would we realistically gain this year by having Jones over Murphy? Maybe a win or two? And how much do we lose out on by not having the 8-15 pick next year? Is it worth not having a lottery pick next year just to maybe pick up a couple games more this year?

im sure that at least it wasn't to hard to get couple picks higher to get English who is perfect fit for Jazz, im not blaming O'Connor for not bringing Lillard, im blaming him( at this moment) for not trying to do any thing else

reapaman wrote:Well I want him to set us up for the future to win a championship and not rentals for next year or guys who are pure specialist. Mo williams does us no good past next year and a guy like english is just a shooting specialist. I want my shooters to at least be capable of good defense and even though english tries, he just doesn't have it in him defensively.

I say we are in a perfect position to take a run at courtney lee because he's exactly what we need. He's young, he won't cost a lot, a very good 3 point shooter, plays good defense and has experience in the playoffs. Plus the rockets got enough wings and guards so they probably won't try too hard to keep him. He would be a perfect long term move and fit right into the starting line up next to Murphy or Hayward.

By picking murphy and not doing anything (Please Use More Appropriate Word), KOC is on the road to redeeming himself. BTW Kevin Jones is an undersized PF with limited potential, no more of those. Stop that thinking, that mediocracy thinking. If he joins the jazz as a summer league invite then fine but I'm not making any serious effort for a guy like him.

English is very good defensive player, it's clear that You dont know much about this guy if you are saying that he is "just a shooter"