NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread

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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#141 » by Catchall » Thu Apr 30, 2020 6:09 pm

Karim Mane is a 6'4" or 6'5" PG/combo-guard from Canada. He would be a nice value pick in the mid-2nd round if we could get a pick there.



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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#142 » by Pistol King » Thu Apr 30, 2020 6:38 pm

babyjax13 wrote:
Catchall wrote:
Pistol King wrote:I noticed he's over hyped recently. He intrigued me back then but when the hype started to grow I came back
to watch his tape and try to look if I miss something, and he again looked nowhere near a top 5 pick to me in this class. Just too slow, not creative or crafty enough while driving to the rim, and seem not a good shooter in C&S either which is the basic of a shooting. Adding a video someone posted about his finishing struggles:

Read on Twitter


I think the D'lo comps are valid. He's got to become an elite shotmaker. He has the potential to be a borderline All Star, but needs to develop to reach that ceiling. I'm not confident that he gets all the way there.


I think the D'Lo comps are accurate, as well, except Hayes plays defense. That's D'Lo's biggest problem. That's a guy who makes a couple of all-star games (as a floor) so I'm pretty confident in him as a prospect. He's also one of the youngest prospects playing in a decent league, so I'm going to take a wait and see with the finishing. As he adds burst/strength over the next 2-3 years I think that will improve.

The problem as I see it is, D'lo is the exception. The best outcome. Far from being his floor.
How many point guards who lacks quickness and a good first step are really a high level in this league?
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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#143 » by babyjax13 » Thu Apr 30, 2020 7:24 pm

Pistol King wrote:
babyjax13 wrote:
Catchall wrote:
I think the D'lo comps are valid. He's got to become an elite shotmaker. He has the potential to be a borderline All Star, but needs to develop to reach that ceiling. I'm not confident that he gets all the way there.


I think the D'Lo comps are accurate, as well, except Hayes plays defense. That's D'Lo's biggest problem. That's a guy who makes a couple of all-star games (as a floor) so I'm pretty confident in him as a prospect. He's also one of the youngest prospects playing in a decent league, so I'm going to take a wait and see with the finishing. As he adds burst/strength over the next 2-3 years I think that will improve.

The problem as I see it is, D'lo is the exception. The best outcome. Far from being his floor.
How many point guards who lacks quickness and a good first step are really a high level in this league?


I think an 18 year old playing against guys in their athletic prime - unless he is just an unbelievably athlete - is going to look somewhat limited. I'd use Gordon Hayward his first two years as an example. He looked slow and weak - especially lacking lateral quickness. But, as his body developed, it was not a problem. I understand why people are concerned, but I'd point to James Harden, Chauncy Billups, D'Angelo Russell, etc. as guys who weren't incredible athletes but made up for it with smarts, strength, and talent. Hayes seems like he can do that (to me) and some of the questions surrounding his athletecism will go away as his body develops (I mean, just look at him, he is a spindly stretched out kid).
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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#144 » by Pistol King » Thu Apr 30, 2020 8:03 pm

babyjax13 wrote:
Pistol King wrote:
babyjax13 wrote:
I think the D'Lo comps are accurate, as well, except Hayes plays defense. That's D'Lo's biggest problem. That's a guy who makes a couple of all-star games (as a floor) so I'm pretty confident in him as a prospect. He's also one of the youngest prospects playing in a decent league, so I'm going to take a wait and see with the finishing. As he adds burst/strength over the next 2-3 years I think that will improve.

The problem as I see it is, D'lo is the exception. The best outcome. Far from being his floor.
How many point guards who lacks quickness and a good first step are really a high level in this league?


I think an 18 year old playing against guys in their athletic prime - unless he is just an unbelievably athlete - is going to look somewhat limited. I'd use Gordon Hayward his first two years as an example. He looked slow and weak - especially lacking lateral quickness. But, as his body developed, it was not a problem. I understand why people are concerned, but I'd point to James Harden, Chauncy Billups, D'Angelo Russell, etc. as guys who weren't incredible athletes but made up for it with smarts, strength, and talent. Hayes seems like he can do that (to me) and some of the questions surrounding his athletecism will go away as his body develops (I mean, just look at him, he is a spindly stretched out kid).

When I watch him, I really try to test his quickness and first step as an individual and less focused on his defenders.
I just follow his feet quickness, the first step, the burst and vertically pop regardless his opponents.
Just out of curiosity I went back to watch D'lo and Harden college tapes now and It really feels he doesn't have the same level of quickness or first step D'lo has the same age, and Harden seemed way quicker and more explosive. I've watched also now Hayward's college tape and it seem a much better comp, but Hayward isn't a guard. I'm sure he will improve his quickness and athleticism at some degree and he's not physically where he would be a few years from now, but even if so, his floor seem very low on this regard and I think it will really make it hard for him to translate his game at the next level, unless he shows some basketball brilliancy he hasn't shown yet.
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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#145 » by babyjax13 » Thu Apr 30, 2020 10:02 pm

Catchall wrote:Karim Mane is a 6'4" or 6'5" PG/combo-guard from Canada. He would be a nice value pick in the mid-2nd round if we could get a pick there.





I'm intrigued.
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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#146 » by Catchall » Thu Apr 30, 2020 10:41 pm

babyjax13 wrote:
Catchall wrote:Karim Mane is a 6'4" or 6'5" PG/combo-guard from Canada. He would be a nice value pick in the mid-2nd round if we could get a pick there.





I'm intrigued.


Several people seem to agree that he reminds them of Jrue Holliday.
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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#147 » by Catchall » Fri May 1, 2020 7:47 pm

ESPN has Bolmaro going #22 in their latest mock draft. If the season does resume, I hope the Jazz can lose a couple games and slide by OKC and Miami in the draft order. There's no homecourt advantage to compete for.
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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#148 » by youngWizzy » Sat May 9, 2020 2:10 am

Hello everybody,

Tool: https://nbadraftcomp.herokuapp.com

I recently developed an NBA Draft Comparison tool that has gained a good amount of popularity on Twitter by several draft analysts

The tool retrieves similar physical, statistical (per40), and advanced stat comparisons for any player dating back to the 2000 NBA Draft based on their position

Note: Advanced stats only go back to the 2011 Draft and there are currently only limited physical comparisons for some of the 2020 prospects as the combine hasn't reported official measurements. Additionally, if you cannot find a player in the stats, visuals, or advanced pages you can enter their sports-reference url and the site will generate the comparisons then.

If you end up seeing this, any feedback/comments/suggestions that you have or would like me to add a feature to the website is something that I'd appreciate a whole lot. You can dm me here but preferable on twitter:youngwizzydfs and I will respond asap.

The experience is a lot better on desktop/laptop than mobile which is something I am working on right now

If you don't mind sharing the tool with your friends and people that would mean a whole lot as it could lead to potential donations to my site that will help keep it up! Been working on this for a few years now so it's been one hell of a roller coaster ride!

Per 40 stat comparison can be found here: https://nbadraftcomp.herokuapp.com/stats

Image


Advanced stat comparisons can be found here: https://nbadraftcomp.herokuapp.com/advanced

Image


Physical comparisons can be found here: https://nbadraftcomp.herokuapp.com/measurements

Image


A visualizations page which visualizes how a player compares to their position can be found here: https://nbadraftcomp.herokuapp.com/visuals

Image


Twitter: @youngwizzydfs
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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#149 » by Catchall » Sat May 9, 2020 3:53 am

youngWizzy wrote:Hello everybody,

Tool: https://nbadraftcomp.herokuapp.com

I recently developed an NBA Draft Comparison tool that has gained a good amount of popularity on Twitter by several draft analysts



Cool. Will check it out.
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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#150 » by Catchall » Sat May 9, 2020 5:04 pm

Here's a little exercise. Name the players in this draft who can make the following sequence: 1) grab a rebound in traffic, 2) handle the ball behind his back, 3) push the ball up the full length of the floor at full speed, 4) make a spin move around a defender at or above the foul line, and 5) finish with a dunk.

Those players are potential All Stars in this draft.

I'll say the following guys can do it: Obi Toppin, Lamelo Ball, Isaac Okoro, RJ Hampton, Jaden McDaniels, maybe Anthony Edwards, maybe Deni Avdija.

Anyone else?

One sleeper I see here might be Aleksej Pokusevski. Another might be Karim Mane. Leandro Bolmaro might do it.
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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#151 » by Catchall » Sun May 10, 2020 9:27 pm

Considering how much I think the Jazz liked Lauri Markkanen and Zach Collins in 2017, I think the Jazz have to be pretty high on Pokusevski. Outside of the lottery, I don't think there's a prospect who could singlehandedly raise the Jazz's ceiling as a team more than him. He's a 7-footer who runs the floor and finishes, shows shooting range, and has a legit handle and passing. He can play next to Rudy as a stretch 4.

He's only 18, and if he develops well, he could be comparable to Keith Van Horn.

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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#152 » by Catchall » Tue May 12, 2020 4:15 pm

Catchall wrote:Considering how much I think the Jazz liked Lauri Markkanen and Zach Collins in 2017, I think the Jazz have to be pretty high on Pokusevski. Outside of the lottery, I don't think there's a prospect who could singlehandedly raise the Jazz's ceiling as a team more than him. He's a 7-footer who runs the floor and finishes, shows shooting range, and has a legit handle and passing. He can play next to Rudy as a stretch 4.

He's only 18, and if he develops well, he could be comparable to Keith Van Horn.



2:25 -- Pokusevski brings the ball up under some pressure. He handles the ball like a guard, going behind his back and crossing between both hands. He gets his defender moving backwards to hedge against the drive, and then he effortlessly raises up off a hang dribble to drain a mid-range jumper on the move. It shows body control, balance, awareness and touch.

3:10 -- Here he's pushing on the break. He takes off from about the foul line and extends to finish with a finger roll at the rim. Next sequence at 3:16, he takes the outlet pass, pushes the full length of the court, jumps off of one foot above the dotted circle and finishes with an easy flush at full speed.

3:41 -- Hits a 3pt shot above the break and off the dribble over a tight contest from a forward-sized defender.

4:09 -- He spaces out on the weak side and calls for the ball to hit a corner 3 without hesitation. The key here is his confidence to call for the ball, catch and shoot with a quick release.

4:16 -- He comes up to receive the ball above the break, fakes his defender, takes a side-dribble and knocks down a 3, maintaining nice balance and focus throughout.
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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#153 » by Catchall » Tue May 19, 2020 8:11 pm

@babyjax13 -- Would you trade Gobert to Minnesota if the package coming back included their top-5 pick (Toppin/Okoro) and #16 (Bolmaro/Pokusevski)? Bolmaro/Toppin would give the Jazz an elite pick-and-roll with Mitchell, Bogdanovic and Clarkson, while Okoro/Pokusevski would give the Jazz a lot of versatility and fire power.
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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#154 » by babyjax13 » Tue May 19, 2020 8:52 pm

Catchall wrote:@babyjax13 -- Would you trade Gobert to Minnesota if the package coming back included their top-5 pick (Toppin/Okoro) and #16 (Bolmaro/Pokusevski)? Bolmaro/Toppin would give the Jazz an elite pick-and-roll with Mitchell, Bogdanovic and Clarkson, while Okoro/Pokusevski would give the Jazz a lot of versatility and fire power.


I would not. I'd want a probably lottery pick in 2021, or some kind of young player who can be a top 3 piece on a contending team. Minnesota doesn't have that outside of Towns (and I don't see Rudy and Towns being a great fit).

I'd be looking at Washington (Hachimura, Brown, 2020 1st), Golden State (2020 GSW 1st, 2021 MIN 1st), Phoenix (Ayton, 2020 PHX 1st), and Chicago (White, 2020 1st, Lauri) as possibilities if we were to trade Rudy (which I don't think we will, or should).
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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#155 » by Catchall » Fri May 22, 2020 7:35 pm

Below are the players the Jazz have drafted in the 20s during the past 20 years. I've bolded the players who have had the best careers as starters in the league.

1999 - Andrei Kirilenko
1999 - Scott Padgett
2000 - Deshaun Stevenson
2001 - Raul Lopez
2004 - Pavel Podkolzin
2007 - Morris Almond
2008 - Kosta Kofous
2009 - Eric Maynor
2013 - Rudy Gobert
2014 - Rodney Hood
2017 - Tony Bradley
2018 - Grayson Allen

Of these 12 players drafted, the two best players were the foreigners who were underdeveloped physically. Kirilenko stayed overseas for 2 years before coming over. Gobert was a polarizing prospect who lasted all the way to the 27th pick. Then the third best player was Stevenson, an athletic kid drafted right out of high school.

When you're drafting in the 20s, quite often you have to look around the fringes for guys who are a bit undervalued, either because they're overseas or because they're young and unproven. Or, you can draft more mainstream college players and expect them to be backups.

The players in this draft that meet that description are Pokusevski, Maledon, maybe Bolmaro, Josh Hall and Karim Mane if he stays in the draft.
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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#156 » by babyjax13 » Fri May 22, 2020 9:23 pm

I really, really like Grant Riller. Wouldn't mind seeing if Philly would trade up with their second round picks (say 34, 36, 45). Could see us walking away with Nwora, Riller, and Isaiah Joe in that scenario. I'd imagine at least one of them would become an NBA caliber rotation player - if not an okay starter - and that's kind of the upside (normally) at 24.
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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#157 » by Catchall » Sat May 23, 2020 4:02 am

babyjax13 wrote:I really, really like Grant Riller. Wouldn't mind seeing if Philly would trade up with their second round picks (say 34, 36, 45). Could see us walking away with Nwora, Riller, and Isaiah Joe in that scenario. I'd imagine at least one of them would become an NBA caliber rotation player - if not an okay starter - and that's kind of the upside (normally) at 24.


If Riller is the guy you want, I don't think you can count on him being on the board in the 2nd round. He could go in the 26 - 30 range.

I still think the Jazz should try to come away with Poku or Bolmaro. Maledon and McDaniels are also likely to be available.
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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#158 » by babyjax13 » Sat May 23, 2020 4:09 am

Catchall wrote:
babyjax13 wrote:I really, really like Grant Riller. Wouldn't mind seeing if Philly would trade up with their second round picks (say 34, 36, 45). Could see us walking away with Nwora, Riller, and Isaiah Joe in that scenario. I'd imagine at least one of them would become an NBA caliber rotation player - if not an okay starter - and that's kind of the upside (normally) at 24.


If Riller is the guy you want, I don't think you can count on him being on the board in the 2nd round. He could go in the 26 - 30 range.

I still think the Jazz should try to come away with Poku or Bolmaro. Those are both potentially starters.


I think Riller is a potential star, tbh. I'd probably put him somewhere in that 6-8 range on my big board.
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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#159 » by Catchall » Sat May 23, 2020 4:12 am

babyjax13 wrote:
Catchall wrote:
babyjax13 wrote:I really, really like Grant Riller. Wouldn't mind seeing if Philly would trade up with their second round picks (say 34, 36, 45). Could see us walking away with Nwora, Riller, and Isaiah Joe in that scenario. I'd imagine at least one of them would become an NBA caliber rotation player - if not an okay starter - and that's kind of the upside (normally) at 24.


If Riller is the guy you want, I don't think you can count on him being on the board in the 2nd round. He could go in the 26 - 30 range.

I still think the Jazz should try to come away with Poku or Bolmaro. Those are both potentially starters.


I think Riller is a potential star, tbh. I'd probably put him somewhere in that 6-8 range on my big board.


I think Boston is very likely to take him at #30 if he lasts that long.
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Re: NBA 2020 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#160 » by Catchall » Sat May 23, 2020 4:15 am

FWIW, Vernon Carey at Duke is a 1st-round grade prospect. Only drawback is his 7' wingspan, but otherwise he's like a slightly lesser version of Demarcus Cousins at UK. Really skilled for a big dude, and he put up freshman stats that compare well to Karl Anthony Towns, Bam Adebayo, Wendell Carter.

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