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Al Horford is GTD, no injuries for the Jazz. We are expected to lose but I have a funny feeling about this one, just not enough to change my GTS guess.

I think we steal one of those 2 back to back games @Celtics and @Sixers.

I'm not optimistic about this one, but who knows.

This game is over early.

I didn't expect much, but come on...... Am I the only one who's over Hardy, btw?

John Collins over Walker Kessler is kind of genuinely embarrassing at this point.

I don't think I've ever seen a worse vet prioritized over a better young player just out of the delusion that we would be able to trade the vet later.

Collins is a negative asset who can't be moved without giving up picks, it's over, just bench him and have him play 15 MPG.

Kessler got 14 minutes? Why????? Did he get injured?

red4hf wrote:I didn't expect much, but come on...... Am I the only one who's over Hardy, btw?

Hardy is fine. We've made a roster that doesn't fit together because every deal is about asset accumulation rather than fit. They are trying to find guys who can play better than they have and flip some later. Lauri hit, Sexton is doing well (but has no trade value because he is a 6-2 scoring guard who can't play defense), Collins is a dud, THT is a dud, Olynyk is the one guy we added who makes things kind of work together. I really think Ainge has done a poor job after the Mitchell/Gobert trades.

babyjax13 wrote:

red4hf wrote:I didn't expect much, but come on...... Am I the only one who's over Hardy, btw?

Hardy is fine. We've made a roster that doesn't fit together because every deal is about asset accumulation rather than fit. They are trying to find guys who can play better than they have and flip some later. Lauri hit, Sexton is doing well (but has no trade value because he is a 6-2 scoring guard who can't play defense), Collins is a dud, THT is a dud, Olynyk is the one guy we added who makes things kind of work together. I really think Ainge has done a poor job after the Mitchell/Gobert trades.

If you're a coach and you can't tell who should be playing most minutes on this team, you shouldn't be coaching......

If you can't tell the GM you're going to play the guys who deserve the minutes, you shouldn't be coaching......

red4hf wrote:

babyjax13 wrote:

red4hf wrote:I didn't expect much, but come on...... Am I the only one who's over Hardy, btw?

Hardy is fine. We've made a roster that doesn't fit together because every deal is about asset accumulation rather than fit. They are trying to find guys who can play better than they have and flip some later. Lauri hit, Sexton is doing well (but has no trade value because he is a 6-2 scoring guard who can't play defense), Collins is a dud, THT is a dud, Olynyk is the one guy we added who makes things kind of work together. I really think Ainge has done a poor job after the Mitchell/Gobert trades.

If you're a coach and you can't tell who should be playing most minutes on this team, you shouldn't be coaching......

If you can't tell the GM you're going to play the guys who deserve the minutes, you shouldn't be coaching......

Alternatively, he's been told to play Collins so they can try to trade him...or Kessler isn't fully recovered from injury ... etc. etc.

babyjax13 wrote:

red4hf wrote:

babyjax13 wrote:Hardy is fine. We've made a roster that doesn't fit together because every deal is about asset accumulation rather than fit. They are trying to find guys who can play better than they have and flip some later. Lauri hit, Sexton is doing well (but has no trade value because he is a 6-2 scoring guard who can't play defense), Collins is a dud, THT is a dud, Olynyk is the one guy we added who makes things kind of work together. I really think Ainge has done a poor job after the Mitchell/Gobert trades.

If you're a coach and you can't tell who should be playing most minutes on this team, you shouldn't be coaching......

If you can't tell the GM you're going to play the guys who deserve the minutes, you shouldn't be coaching......

Alternatively, he's been told to play Collins so they can try to trade him...or Kessler isn't fully recovered from injury ... etc. etc.

Kessler obviously isn't injured......

Collins would look much better coming off the bench......

red4hf wrote:Kessler got 14 minutes? Why????? Did he get injured?

No, but we got beaten badly and we have to play vs Embiid tonight. Yurtseven played the 4th, time Kessler would have gotten if it were a close game.

red4hf wrote:Kessler got 14 minutes? Why????? Did he get injured?

He needs to play Embiid tonight. May as well keep him fresh in what has turned out the be a blowout from the start. Without him against Embiid the Jazz could lose by 50.

Inigo Montoya wrote:

red4hf wrote:Kessler got 14 minutes? Why????? Did he get injured?

He needs to play Embiid tonight. May as well keep him fresh in what has turned out the be a blowout from the start. Without him against Embiid the Jazz could lose by 50.

Is he going to start?

I'm sorry, I'm not buying it.......

FJS wrote:

red4hf wrote:Kessler got 14 minutes? Why????? Did he get injured?

No, but we got beaten badly and we have to play vs Embiid tonight. Yurtseven played the 4th, time Kessler would have gotten if it were a close game.

Maybe we wouldn't have gotten beaten so badly if we, you know, started our best players..... Just saying....... Something to think about.......

red4hf wrote:

Inigo Montoya wrote:

red4hf wrote:Kessler got 14 minutes? Why????? Did he get injured?

He needs to play Embiid tonight. May as well keep him fresh in what has turned out the be a blowout from the start. Without him against Embiid the Jazz could lose by 50.

Is he going to start?

I'm sorry, I'm not buying it.......

1. Don't know if he'll start, but given that we see Hardy changing lineups very often, I think it's quite possible.
2. Even if he doesn't start, he could still play starter/a lot of minutes as long as he keeps his fouls in check.
3. Collins is being showcased, and it comes at a price.
4. Maybe he did get injured a bit. I have no idea.
5. I can't get worked up about this particular issue. It was just one of those nights. I'd care more if it was a close game but the Jazz just didn't have it tonight. Credit to the Celtics, they played really good defense.

Inigo Montoya wrote:

red4hf wrote:

Inigo Montoya wrote:He needs to play Embiid tonight. May as well keep him fresh in what has turned out the be a blowout from the start. Without him against Embiid the Jazz could lose by 50.

Is he going to start?

I'm sorry, I'm not buying it.......

1. Don't know if he'll start, but given that we see Hardy changing lineups very often, I think it's quite possible.
2. Even if he doesn't start, he could still play starter/a lot of minutes as long as he keeps his fouls in check.
3. Collins is being showcased, and it comes at a price.
4. Maybe he did get injured a bit. I have no idea.
5. I can't get worked up about this particular issue. It was just one of those nights. I'd care more if it was a close game but the Jazz just didn't have it tonight. Credit to the Celtics, they played really good defense.

Everyone can have their own opinion on this, but between the lineups and the ridiculous zone play, I'm just not having it.......

I do give them a bit of a break they traveled cross country on their day off to play the best team in the league. Hate to say it but the Jazz best player, Lauri, might only be the 3rd or 4th best player for the Celtics. They really needed to start Kessler to have a fighting chance but we all know why they are starting Collins and I'm guessing that is a decision that might even go over Hardy's pay grade. I know +/- is a flawed stat but it does become an indicator when one particular guy is the worst in that category every single game.

Didn't catch any of the garbage time but do find it funny THT got in there and still got his double digit shot attempts in the 4th quarter.

red4hf wrote:Everyone can have their own opinion on this, but between the lineups and the ridiculous zone play, I'm just not having it.......

Fair enough.

On the topic of Hardy, I remember many discussions over the years about how great it would be if we had a coach who is able to change the lineups based on the matchups of each individual game instead of always rolling out the same starters just because of egos, contracts and other non-basketball considerations. I think we have it now, and it's quite remarkable that Hardy is able to pull it off, regardless of what we think of the results. I guess we now see how this approach looks like in practice.

Regarding the zone, sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. In many cases this season, it hasn't worked. I find it much easier to accept when taking the view of this season being a developmental season, and one that lays the foundation. We know this team isn't getting anywhere this season, and the players who will stick around will essentially get an entire season of real live game experience in playing the zone, which should pay dividends in future seasons. If we assume that Kessler is a part of the future, playing the zone is in part meant to help him stay out of foul trouble and so it's important he gets the reps.

Inigo Montoya wrote:

red4hf wrote:Everyone can have their own opinion on this, but between the lineups and the ridiculous zone play, I'm just not having it.......

Fair enough.

On the topic of Hardy, I remember many discussions over the years about how great it would be if we had a coach who is able to change the lineups based on the matchups of each individual game instead of always rolling out the same starters just because of egos, contracts and other non-basketball considerations. I think we have it now, and it's quite remarkable that Hardy is able to pull it off, regardless of what we think of the results. I guess we now see how this approach looks like in practice.

Regarding the zone, sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. In many cases this season, it hasn't worked. I find it much easier to accept when taking the view of this season being a developmental season, and one that lays the foundation. We know this team isn't getting anywhere this season, and the players who will stick around will essentially get an entire season of real live game experience in playing the zone, which should pay dividends in future seasons. If we assume that Kessler is a part of the future, playing the zone is in part meant to help him stay out of foul trouble and so it's important he gets the reps.

This is perfectly fine, in theory...... I'm just not so sure that's actually what is happening......

red4hf wrote:This is perfectly fine, in theory...... I'm just not so sure that's actually what is happening......

What do you think is actually happening?