Sloan blames Okur/Boozer for defensive problems

HolyToledo · Post #1 » by **HolyToledo** » Tue Jan 8, 2008 11:11 pm

Sloan says Okur and Boozer are not helping our guards making them look bad, i.e. Webster scoring at will on Miles/Korver etc. Why doesnt Sloan do something about it instead of just telling them to improve? Bench Okur when Ak-47 comes back and start Korver. That would be too innovative for Sloan! He would rather just gripe about their defense. Lets face it, Boozer and Okur are the worst, and I mean worst, defenders in the NBA so limit the time they have with each other. Do your job Mr. Sloan!!!

http://www.sltrib.com/jazz/ci_7910133

Post #2 » by **jazzfan1971** » Tue Jan 8, 2008 11:14 pm

Wow, I predicted something very close to this in the doghouse thread only a day or two ago.

Not bad, eh?

Duiz · Post #3 » by **Duiz** » Tue Jan 8, 2008 11:41 pm

Boozer should have gotten the blame about 14 months ago, but his offense and rebounding was so spectacular, that finally he is being told about it. This was our issue against the Spurs, and this is why Millsap/Collins Combo has given us some of the best blowout wins this year.

Rive · Post #4 » by **Rive** » Wed Jan 9, 2008 12:06 am

How do you blame Sloan for throwing every possible thing we have out there? He tried everything. Switched to a zone, switched to man, put in every 2 guard we have. So ya, I think Sloan did try and do something about it. The Sloan hate on this issue is ridiculous.

It is strictly Boozer's inablility to move his feet on defense that makes us bad. Watch Boozer next time a shot goes up.... he frequently just stands there and watches it. Watch him when a 2 guard drives the lane... the only thing he'll ever do is swipe at the ball. Rarely does he try to step in or change the driver's path.

Okur is better than Boozer, but not by much. He doesn't bend his knees on defense and usually perfectly fits the description of a "stiff" out there. He is always standing straight up, out of position on defense. It drives me crazy, because this allows players to blow by him pretty easily and post him up without much trouble.

I think you try and fix those parts of Boozer's and Okur's games and the Jazz will be in much better shape defensively.

Malone Strong · Post #5 » by **Malone Strong** » Wed Jan 9, 2008 1:11 am

Ill give him credit for not naming names....he must FINALLY be learning.

kebutah · Post #6 » by **kebutah** » Wed Jan 9, 2008 1:17 am

For once it appears that Sloan is right.

Jazzfan Bayamon · Post #7 » by **Jazzfan Bayamon** » Wed Jan 9, 2008 4:44 am

FINALLY, "Bad Sloan" seems to be coming out of hiding. We need more of that to see if we can actually get this team to click and grow a pair. I took quite a while to hear from Sloan actually pointing out the patheticess that has been our defensive efforts as of late. Go Sloan!!

Pappyman · Post #8 » by **Pappyman** » Wed Jan 9, 2008 6:02 am

here's an idea sloan: STOP PLAYING THEM TOGETHER!!! BRING MEMO OFF THE BENCH!!!! at least then we would only have to deal with one bad defender instead of two. when andrei comes back, i think that c.j. miles should keep his job as starting small forward. he basically offers the jazz the same amount of perimeter shooting ability as okur and he actually plays defense. move kirilenko to power forward (the position he thrives in), which would move him closer to the basket on defense, which would allow him to make up for boozer's lack of defensive ability. you would then move boozer to center. he basically plays that position in the offense anyway. it would also allow for him (boozer) to not have to guard the other teams best front court player. a lot of power forwards in the league are becoming more perimeter-oriented anyway (dirk nowitzki, shawn marion, lamar odom, rashard lewis; just to name a few). not to go out on a limb, but i actually think that andrei is a better shooter than memo right now. i actually feel more confident with andrei shooting the ball than i do with memo. if sloan were to finally wise up, we would have a very athletic starting lineup with players who can actually defend while still being able to score. we would also have one of the best benches in the league. if this move actually happens, look at our backups at every position: PG: Jason Hart (i actually think he is starting to get the offense.), SG: Kyle Korver (i am beginning to like his game more and more), SF: Matt Harpring (i don't know why anyone wants to trade him. all he does is come off the bench night after night and gives a solid effort. he is basically automatic when he comes off the curl for that 15 foot jump shot.), PF: Paul Millsap (has sixth man of the year potential), C: Mehmet Okur (one time all-star that can hit the big shot and would cause major headaches for the other teams in front court substitution patterns. he could be a manu ginobili-type player). if memo were willing to embrace the back up center role, this team may finally be the one who wins jerry sloan and the jazz their championship.

SlickWilly8 · Post #9 » by **SlickWilly8** » Wed Jan 9, 2008 6:13 am

Duiz wrote:Boozer should have gotten the blame about 14 months ago, but his offense and rebounding was so spectacular, that finally he is being told about it. This was our issue against the Spurs, and this is why Millsap/Collins Combo has given us some of the best blowout wins this year.

Do you mean that because these guy's are in the game in the forth quarter of a blowout, that there the reasons it was a blowout?

red4hf · Post #10 » by **red4hf** » Wed Jan 9, 2008 12:03 pm

Boozer is a bad defender, but Okur isn't....... He's just not a shotblocker and shouldn't be asked to be.......

The problem is our guards just as much as anything else....... Brewer gets steals but he's not a great defender, Deron has been terrible this year on defense and CJ Miles isn't exactly helping either.......

Harpring is beyond awful and I still haven't seen anough of Korver to make up my mind on him.......

We had a good defender at the 2 position, his name was Gordan Giricek...... We all know what happened to him.......

soapblaster · Post #11 » by **soapblaster** » Wed Jan 9, 2008 3:14 pm

red4hf wrote:Boozer is a bad defender, but Okur isn't....... He's just not a shotblocker and shouldn't be asked to be.......

The problem is our guards just as much as anything else....... Brewer gets steals but he's not a great defender, Deron has been terrible this year on defense and CJ Miles isn't exactly helping either.......

Harpring is beyond awful and I still haven't seen anough of Korver to make up my mind on him.......

We had a good defender at the 2 position, his name was Gordan Giricek...... We all know what happened to him.......

Hey Red! Long time no see. I agree that Okur is not nearly as bad a defender as Boozer. Korver seems to be a Giri type of defender. Not great man-on-man, but a hustler and a help defender.

Again, welcome back Red...... I missed your unique way of ending sentances....... :wink:

Six_Fore · Post #12 » by **Six_Fore** » Wed Jan 9, 2008 6:07 pm

I'll agree that Okur needs to come off the bench. There's no need anymore to have him "spread" the defense... We've got guys that can finally do that and Okur hasn't been that good at it all year. Start Korver and bench Memo. Maybe that'll send a bit of a message and get Booze and Okur out of the same lineup. It's waving a white flag on D when they are in the game together, basically screaming "We'll let you to the basket, just don't hurt us..."

Soft... that's the only word that comes to mind.

BTW, Post number 1!! :clap:

Glad to be here...

Post #13 » by **loserX** » Wed Jan 9, 2008 6:14 pm

Six_Fore wrote:BTW, Post number 1!! Glad to be here...

Glad to have you here! Welcome aboard.

soapblaster · Post #14 » by **soapblaster** » Wed Jan 9, 2008 6:48 pm

Six_Fore wrote:I'll agree that Okur needs to come off the bench. There's no need anymore to have him "spread" the defense... We've got guys that can finally do that and Okur hasn't been that good at it all year. Start Korver and bench Memo. Maybe that'll send a bit of a message and get Booze and Okur out of the same lineup. It's waving a white flag on D when they are in the game together, basically screaming "We'll let you to the basket, just don't hurt us..."

Soft... that's the only word that comes to mind.

BTW, Post number 1!! Glad to be here...

Depending on matchups, you can't replace Okur with Korver. You would have to start Collins (gasp) against the bigger centers, if you wanted Memo's punch off the bench. You don't want to put that kind of defensive pressure on an already soft Boozer, and potentially get him in early foul trouble.

If you want to replace Okur's starting firepower in the starting lineup, you would then have to sit either Brewer or AK (When he comes back) to insert Korver into the starting lineup.

I wouldn't be against bringing both Brewer and Okur off the bench together, to try to balance the outside shooting/defensive changes.

Again though, the main thing is matchups. I think we could matchup well against any team in the league, if a few of the starters were willing to put aside their ego and be happy with coming off the bench, if that is what the team needs from them on that particular night.

P.S. Welcome aboard. Hope you keep posting.

Six_Fore · Post #15 » by **Six_Fore** » Wed Jan 9, 2008 7:01 pm

Sloan played with lineup changes a lot during the 03'-04' season. We were predicted to have horrible season and Sloan took us to 42-40. The Jazz have been really struggling, why not play with the lineup a bit? Swapping Korver for Okur may not be too bad of an idea, sliding Booze to center:

Williams (Hart/Price)
Brewer (Miles)
Korver (Harpring)
AK (Millsap)
Boozer (Okur)

Before you flip, yes, I realize we are small. However I think AK is a lot more comfortable at PF and he can make more plays here. He'd be a big help to Booze down low and Korver and Williams spread the defense to hit shots or let Booze do what he does on the offensive end. And we'd be able to run, a lot. This also splits Memo and Booze. The second line is still pretty strong with Miles' shooting coming around and Okur's shot. And Millsap loves the inside game. Just my thoughts though.

And thanks for the welcome!

soapblaster · Post #16 » by **soapblaster** » Wed Jan 9, 2008 7:17 pm

Six_Fore wrote:Sloan played with lineup changes a lot during the 03'-04' season. We were predicted to have horrible season and Sloan took us to 42-40. The Jazz have been really struggling, why not play with the lineup a bit? Swapping Korver for Okur may not be too bad of an idea, sliding Booze to center:

Williams (Hart/Price)
Brewer (Miles)
Korver (Harpring)
AK (Millsap)
Boozer (Okur)

Before you flip, yes, I realize we are small. However I think AK is a lot more comfortable at PF and he can make more plays here. He'd be a big help to Booze down low and Korver and Williams spread the defense to hit shots or let Booze do what he does on the offensive end. And we'd be able to run, a lot. This also splits Memo and Booze. The second line is still pretty strong with Miles' shooting coming around and Okur's shot. And Millsap loves the inside game. Just my thoughts though.

And thanks for the welcome!

Cool. I think this lineup could be pretty potent. Again though, if a matchup dictates differently, I am all for that idea.

The only times I would be against slotting Korver for Okur straight across is when we are playing a team like the Magic, Rockets, Lakers or Hornets (Just to name a few). You don't want Boozer to be responsible to guard a Center like those teams have, and not get in foul trouble.

Duiz · Post #17 » by **Duiz** » Wed Jan 9, 2008 7:41 pm

Six_Fore wrote:I'll agree that Okur needs to come off the bench. There's no need anymore to have him "spread" the defense... We've got guys that can finally do that and Okur hasn't been that good at it all year. Start Korver and bench Memo. Maybe that'll send a bit of a message and get Booze and Okur out of the same lineup. It's waving a white flag on D when they are in the game together, basically screaming "We'll let you to the basket, just don't hurt us..."

Soft... that's the only word that comes to mind.

BTW, Post number 1!! Glad to be here...

There is 2 things that make Memo indispensable. Spreading the floor and drawing the Center out of the paint. And the other is that he almost 7 footer. Carlos Boozer a 6-9 PF would very very likely have to guard the big man of the other team, and will likely get him in foul trouble and out of the flow of the game. Only if they play a much faster pace, then Boozer could pull it off. Even if Memo is soft on defense, I prefer him drawing fouls rather than Boozer drawin the fouls.

And Welcome to the board dude

red4hf · Post #18 » by **red4hf** » Thu Jan 10, 2008 6:34 pm

soapblaster wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Hey Red! Long time no see. I agree that Okur is not nearly as bad a defender as Boozer. Korver seems to be a Giri type of defender. Not great man-on-man, but a hustler and a help defender.

Again, welcome back Red...... I missed your unique way of ending sentances.......

Thanks for the kind words...... Unfortunately, I'm too busy at work to contribute more regularly.......

soapblaster · Post #19 » by **soapblaster** » Thu Jan 10, 2008 6:46 pm

red4hf wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Thanks for the kind words...... Unfortunately, I'm too busy at work to contribute more regularly.......

Well, I hope you post when you can. In all seriousness, I like your posts and attitude. We are lacking great debaters these days. Don't get me wrong, most everyone is cool, we just don't get the discussions we used to.

Malone Strong · Post #20 » by **Malone Strong** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 1:58 am

red4hf wrote:Boozer is a bad defender, but Okur isn't....... He's just not a shotblocker and shouldn't be asked to be.......

The problem is our guards just as much as anything else....... Brewer gets steals but he's not a great defender, Deron has been terrible this year on defense and CJ Miles isn't exactly helping either.......

Harpring is beyond awful and I still haven't seen anough of Korver to make up my mind on him.......

We had a good defender at the 2 position, his name was Gordan Giricek...... We all know what happened to him.......

You're right, except about Memo. He's awful. I was interested in his defense since his stellar play against Yao in the playoffs, so I've been watching him closely. And he is really bad. Worse than Boozer.

But the sad truth is we are an extremely poor defensive team. And alot of that is our coaching. If Sloan would just let his guys man up and not double off the ball to leave shooters wide open, torching us for career highs time after time, then we'd probably have s top 5 team in the league.