RealGM

Can someone tell me when we have the unprotected first round pick of the Knicks - is it 2009? If so, it appears it will be a lottery pick - do we need another rookie - seems like a nice piece to package in a trade this offseason.

Kirilenko + Knicks lottery pick = ?

Almond, Hart, Collins + Knicks lottery pick = ?

If it is 2009 (and I'm not sure so someone please advise) and we don't trade it, what players are on your radar?

Blake Griffin? Hasheem Thabeet? Tyler Hansbrough? Others?

2010 its fully unprotected

Thanks!

2010 makes it too early to speculate on players but I still think the pick might be nicely packaged this offseason.

partnerfusion wrote:2010 makes it too early to speculate on players but I still think the pick might be nicely packaged this offseason.

I agree with that statement. This pick has a high value amongst GMs in the leauge, so it should bring good value in a trade. It is tempting though to wait another year and see how it looks then.

I'm a little worried D'Antoni can turn the Knicks around in two years...I thnk he's a good coach especially compared to Isaiah. It would be a bummer if we kept it and it ended up being a mid round pick.

dingojazz wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



I agree with that statement. This pick has a high value amongst GMs in the leauge, so it should bring good value in a trade. It is tempting though to wait another year and see how it looks then.

I'm a little worried D'Antoni can turn the Knicks around in two years...I thnk he's a good coach especially compared to Isaiah. It would be a bummer if we kept it and it ended up being a mid round pick.

Larry Brown couldnt do anything with that trainwreck, is Dnatoni better then Larry Brown? He's a overrated coach IMO. Cant take criticism at all, makes no adjustments, cant teach D. Horrible crunch time management. Plus He doesnt have Amare, Nash and Marion in New York. I dont think that pick is going to get less valuable anytime soon.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/columns/s ... lsh-080513

Looks like the Knicks aren't willing to pay to get better. I think this is excellent news for us, since being desperate to shed salary to sign James in 2010 should == more crappiness

I think that the Knicks will get worse before then get better. This next year I think that they will have growing pains but it will be the low.

It's our only lottery pick we will get for the next 10 years! We need to keep it.

No way we package this pick IMO. The only thing it's going to bring is another salary, which is something we really cant afford especially if we want to resign CJ.

We hang on to it, and even if it is a mid round pick (which i HIGHLY doubt, that team is a mess talent and cap wise) we'll still have our late round pick to package to move down or use two 1st rounders to get young again. We are in a win, win situation with this pick. I say keep it and get a stud for Deron and Booze to mentor.

I hate to burst everyoe's bubble, but if Philly doesn't take our 2009 pick, they have the rights to the Knicks pick in 2010 as part of the Korver trade.
I heard KOC talking about it on 1320 KFAN. There is some kind of protection on the pick, but it is not very good.

Here's hoping they take next years pick in 2009.

Farsider322 wrote:I hate to burst everyoe's bubble, but if Philly doesn't take our 2009 pick, they have the rights to the Knicks pick in 2010 as part of the Korver trade.
I heard KOC talking about it on 1320 KFAN. There is some kind of protection on the pick, but it is not very good.

Here's hoping they take next years pick in 2009.

Im pretty sure this isn't true, Im pretty sure the only way the NY pick goes to Philly is if the Knicks finish top 23 or somewhere around there.

Farsider322 wrote:I hate to burst everyoe's bubble, but if Philly doesn't take our 2009 pick, they have the rights to the Knicks pick in 2010 as part of the Korver trade.
I heard KOC talking about it on 1320 KFAN. There is some kind of protection on the pick, but it is not very good.

Here's hoping they take next years pick in 2009.

That's not quite how it works. It's complicated.

2009

New York's pick to Utah - top 22 protected
Utah's pick to Philly - ALSO top 22 protected

Scenario A - NY's pick in top 22, Utah's pick in top 22
Scenario B - NY's pick in top 22, Utah's pick 23 or lower
Scenario C - NY's pick 23 or lower, Utah's pick in top 22
Scenario D - NY's pick 23 or lower, Utah's pick 23 or lower

In Scenario A: New York keeps their pick, Utah keeps their pick, Philly gets nothing
In Scenario B: New York keeps their pick, Utah gets nothing, Philly gets Utah's pick
In Scenario C: New York gets nothing, Utah keeps their pick, Philly gets New York's pick
In Scenario D: New York gets nothing, Utah gets the worse pick, Philly gets the better pick

If either of Scenarios C or D happen, Utah has received a pick and Philly has received a pick and all debts are satisfied. Everyone keeps their own pick in 2010 no matter what, and Scenarios E and F (below) are not applicable.

If scenario B happens, Philly has received a pick and NY still owes Utah a pick. Utah would get their own AND New York's picks in 2010 no matter what, and Scenarios E and F (below) are not applicable.

If Scenario A happens, both Utah and Philly are still owed picks.

2010

New York's pick to Utah - unprotected
Utah's pick to Philly - top 15 protected

Scenario E - Utah's pick in top 15
Scenario F - Utah's pick #16 or lower

In Scenario E - New York gets nothing, Utah keeps BOTH picks, Philly gets nothing
In Scenario F - New York gets nothing, Utah gets better pick, Philly gets worse pick

So, to sum up: Philadelphia cannot possibly get New York's pick from us unless it's either
- #23 or lower in 2009
- #17 or lower in 2010

Under every other scenario, either New York keeps it (2009 only) or we do.

Nice summary. It is a little different than the summary I had a while back but suffice to say the odds that the Jazz keep the Knicks pick is very high.

So with Philly being involved in this is the pick untradable, or at least they have to assume the risk in giving it to Philly?

Only way Philly is involved with the Knicks pick is if it's a non lotto pick next year and higher than the Korver trade states.

Can we just give them this year's pick? It is 23rd.

So, to sum up: Philadelphia cannot possibly get New York's pick from us unless it's either
- #23 or lower in 2009
- #17 or lower in 2010

Under every other scenario, either New York keeps it (2009 only) or we do.

so in other words NY has to be one of the best 8 teams in the league next year. (in this case do we need NY's pick....no). Utah is no better than the 8th seed in the playoffs in 2010 ??? (in this case, Utah's pick is better than NY's so all is good for Utah)

right?

Bottom line: Knicks suck until 2010, Jazz will get a great pick for paying for Tom Gugliottas contract.

hoops4life wrote:Can we just give them this year's pick? It is 23rd.

We could, but they would have to agree to it. We'd essentially be trading this year's pick for next year's...we can't just decide to do it unilaterally.

hoops4life wrote:Can we just give them this year's pick? It is 23rd.

No, everything I've seen says the pick traded to Philadelphia is a 2009 pick. Sure Philly could work out a deal to change the terms of the traded pick but what would motivate this (us wanting to give them a worse pick doesn't count as a reason for Philly)?