WCQF: Oklahoma City Thunder vs Houston Rockets | P1

[getrichordie]

I think that we need to keep in mind that we have 4 players we are relying on that have less than 2 years of experience in the league, an aging Chris Paul, an oft-injured Gallinari, and we are also relying on a center that is more suited for the way the game was played 10 years ago.

Meanwhile, HOU has arguably the best offensive player in the game surrounded by a bunch of veterans who can shoot and they lack a traditional big man which means they can get out in transition faster and switch better than we can...

And here we are pretending that off-Ball movement is a thing that any team can do successfully regardless of personnel. We don't even have one solid 2-guard unless you count Shai as a 2-guard and beyond that, we have trash relative to the competition in the 'Offs.

[mr570]

I mean when we had our run after December the offense didn't look like this. I'm not going to pretend that I know how to scheme guys open but I don't remember it looking like the iso ball that it was the past few games.

[1bigfan13]

The terrible job Sam Presti has done acquiring players who have a strong set of offensive skills really stands out in this series. The youth of the roster and Billy Donovan's brutal 2nd half rotations also crippled us but it's abundantly clear the Rocket players just have superior offensive skills.

This series is highlighting why I'm not homering out about all the draft picks in the Thunder's future. I just don't trust Sam Presti's eye for talent. He's drafted/acquired way too many guys like Dort, Diallo, Roberson, Cam Payne, Huestis, and Ferguson. As far as I'm concerned all the goodwill he earned for the KD, Westbrook, and Harden drafts is completely gone.

If you grade him for his drafts since 2009, he's probably middle of the pack at best. I completely understand that OKC has been drafting in the late teens and twenties during that timeframe, but that's still no excuse for not accidentally stumbling into 2 or 3 quality players with consistent shots. Seems like every team except OKC is able to find themselves a Gary Trent Jr or a sniper like Duncan Robinson. But we're stuck with Presti stacking the roster with athletic wings who can't shoot worth a ****.

Honestly if I had to choose between getting rid of Donovan and Presti, I'd probably choose Presti because I think his decisions have held the franchise back more than Donovan's coaching.

[getrichordie]

The terrible job Sam Presti has done acquiring players who have a strong set of offensive skills really stands out in this series. The youth of the roster and Billy Donovan's brutal 2nd half rotations also crippled us but it's abundantly clear the Rocket players just have superior offensive skills.

This series is highlighting why I'm not homering out about all the draft picks in the Thunder's future. I just don't trust Sam Presti's eye for talent. He's drafted/acquired way too many guys like Dort, Diallo, Roberson, Cam Payne, Huestis, and Ferguson. As far as I'm concerned all the goodwill he earned for the KD, Westbrook, and Harden drafts is completely gone.

If you grade him for his drafts since 2009, he's probably middle of the pack at best. I completely understand that OKC has been drafting in the late teens and twenties during that timeframe, but that's still no excuse for not accidentally stumbling into 2 or 3 quality players with consistent shots. Seems like every team except OKC is able to find themselves a Gary Trent Jr or a sniper like Duncan Robinson. But we're stuck with Presti stacking the roster with athletic wings who can't shoot worth a ****.

Honestly if I had to choose between getting rid of Donovan and Presti, I'd probably choose Presti because I think his decisions have held the franchise back more than Donovan's coaching.

Well said, sir. Not disagreeing with you about Donovan's second half rotations, but what were you seeing that you did not like?

[mr570]

I think the picks are sus too. Like Bazley has been illuminating, but at the time he was drafted he was a "win now" piece for the Thunder with PG13 and Westbrook!!! How bad would that fit have been? He looks like a deer out there on drives sometimes, just timid and lacking the strength to get to the rim.

[getrichordie]

Lineup data from today's game:

https://stats.nba.com/lineups/advanced/?Season=2019-20&SeasonType=Playoffs&TeamID=1610612760&LastNGames=1&sort=MIN&dir=1&GroupQuantity=4

Our SL recorded a -28.2 NetRtg... slowest pace out of big lineups too.

[ThunderBolt]

It’s not just Donovan “haters” that see it.

Read on Twitter

Cp3 was passive and Adams just struggles.

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

[Pillendreher]

Hey.

Going through this thread feels like going back in time.

"Is Adams injured?"
"Why are we not moving?"
"We don't have any shooters"
"We need to cut the rotation down to 7"
"How can this happen every damn year in the Playoffs?"

I'm just glad I retired, honestly. It's just not worth the emotional investment year after year. Every year you talk yourself into the team being good and every damn season ends the same way.

Nothing is going to change until Donovan and Presti+his disciples are gone.

[ThunderBolt]

Hey.

Going through this thread feels like going back in time.

"Is Adams injured?"
"Why are we not moving?"
"We don't have any shooters"
"We need to cut the rotation down to 7"
"How can this happen every damn year in the Playoffs?"

I'm just glad I retired, honestly. It's just not worth the emotional investment year after year. Every year you talk yourself into the team being good and every damn season ends the same way.

Nothing is going to change until Donovan and Presti+his disciples are gone.

Yep, I’m done until a rebuild.

[Old Man Game]

Hey.

Going through this thread feels like going back in time.

"Is Adams injured?"
"Why are we not moving?"
"We don't have any shooters"
"We need to cut the rotation down to 7"
"How can this happen every damn year in the Playoffs?"

I'm just glad I retired, honestly. It's just not worth the emotional investment year after year. Every year you talk yourself into the team being good and every damn season ends the same way.

Nothing is going to change until Donovan and Presti+his disciples are gone.

Yep, I’m done until a rebuild.

Are you in Oklahoma? Just get yourself a medical card and get stoned out of your mind each game. Maybe the game plan will finally make sense.

Sent from my Pixel using RealGM mobile app

[Pillendreher]

Maybe the game plan will finally make sense.

I think it's more likely that my incoming baldness reverses and I have a full head of hear again before Donovan's so called "game plans" transform into positive outcomes on the court. Last season they had both Westbrook and George in their respective primes and couldn't outscheme Enes Kanter.

Just looking at the boxscore, you have to wonder whether accumulating a worse wing rotation would be possible if one were to try so intentionally. Do the Thunder even have a single NBA level wing player on the entire team? Are their wings even good enough for the G-League? Amazing.

EDIT:

[Galloisdaman]

They did not play like this before the bubble. They were a team that moved more and hustled a lot more. They look confused on both ends. I have defended Billy during the season based on results but he is being outcoached in this series on both ends of the floor.

[Galloisdaman]

Russ and PG were responsible for the offensive issues. They are gone but the issues show up again. Yet Donovan can’t be held accountable because it’s the players fault. Yet when there is turnover to the roster, well...how can Donovan have any type of system in place when he always has new players? There is no way this guy can fail.

I hate Donovan and think he was terrible game 1 but it's tough to blame him today. Just think we lack shooters to beat that crazy Houston defense...

Saying that Donovan sucks doesn’t mean that Presti has constructed a perfect roster,Diallo has a soft touch around the basket and Adams isn’t slow. JVG mentioned the offensive issues multiple times-long jumpers, lack of cutting and movement. Plenty of blame to go around.

So much 1 on 1 chuck a contested shot by OKC. Houston is getting wide open shots off passing and cutting. The only guy on OKC getting wide open looks is Dort and that is because Houston wants Dort to take those shots.

[ThunderBolt]

I hate Donovan and think he was terrible game 1 but it's tough to blame him today. Just think we lack shooters to beat that crazy Houston defense...

Saying that Donovan sucks doesn’t mean that Presti has constructed a perfect roster,Diallo has a soft touch around the basket and Adams isn’t slow. JVG mentioned the offensive issues multiple times-long jumpers, lack of cutting and movement. Plenty of blame to go around.

So much 1 on 1 chuck a contested shot by OKC. Houston is getting wide open shots off passing and cutting. The only guy on OKC getting wide open looks is Dort and that is because Houston wants Dort to take those shots.

This is why so many of us thunder fans are jaded. Although this particular team in the regular season had moments that made them more enjoyable to watch, we've been dealing with the same frustrations for years. It just gets old debating on divvying up blame between Presti, Donovan and the players.

[Galloisdaman]

Saying that Donovan sucks doesn’t mean that Presti has constructed a perfect roster,Diallo has a soft touch around the basket and Adams isn’t slow. JVG mentioned the offensive issues multiple times-long jumpers, lack of cutting and movement. Plenty of blame to go around.

So much 1 on 1 chuck a contested shot by OKC. Houston is getting wide open shots off passing and cutting. The only guy on OKC getting wide open looks is Dort and that is because Houston wants Dort to take those shots.

This is why so many of us thunder fans are jaded. Although this particular team in the regular season had moments that made them more enjoyable to watch, we've been dealing with the same frustrations for years. It just gets old debating on divvying up blame between Presti, Donovan and the players.

What I'm seeing is more scheme than individual players. When players are confused its hard to hustle 100% because you do not know where your teammates will be going if anywhere. Lesser Houston players can look great when given wide open looks in full stride while good players can look bad under tight defense. Now with that said all season I heard CP3 was coaching not Billy so where is that CP3 coaching? Houston is playing at 100mph on offense. OKC is playing at 25mph. Speed kills and I'm not talking about foot speed. I'm talking about execution speed. You can run the same play 2 times. You can score at full speed but if you hesitate even a half second it can be defended. How many times do we see OKC players get the ball then hesitate? He who hesitates is lost.

[ThunderBolt]

Now with that said all season I heard CP3 was coaching not Billy so where is that CP3 coaching?

Like I said, we can blame anyone, everyone or no one. The result is the same every year.

[Galloisdaman]

Now with that said all season I heard CP3 was coaching not Billy so where is that CP3 coaching?

Like I said, we can blame anyone, everyone or no one. The result is the same every year.

I see a combination of things. A less than 100% attitude going in to the bubble games, poor schemes on offense and defense. Houston packs the paint. OKC leaves the paint wide open. Hou is moving on offense. OKC stands still. They just take turns playing 1 on 1 hero ball. Lack of hustle from many players in part because they seem confused on where to go. If the only guy that gets wide open looks is Dort there is a major problem in offensive scheme. That reminds me of a Knicks game. Wilson Chandler was shooting horrible from 3 point range one season. Clyde Frazier asked him why he kept taking the 3's. Wilson told Clyde I'm wide open. I have to take them. Clyde replied, Wilson you are wide open for a reason.

[Bergmaniac]

I didn't watch you much this regular season, but this definitely looks like the classic Billy offense from the previous seasons, only at a slower pace - a lot of standing around and "my turn to iso". Houston's defence is definitely a bad matchup for you, but you are making it easy for them too - the key against their small ball is to tire them since they have to spend so much energy fighting for boards and hustling around without a shotblocker behind to erase mistakes, but that won't happen when the other plays so slow and with minimal offball movement.

But the lack of shooters is obviously also an issue, when Gallinari is on the bench, you just can't score.

[getrichordie]

Lmao.

Houston is a good and heavy 3-pt. shooting team and has size advantages everywhere.

"HOU is getting points off cutting and passing."

No ****. They can shoot and have veteran players who understand that there threat from deep opens up cutting and they have the athleticism to take advantage (I.E. not a banged up Gallinari).

It's not that hard to see that if you are giving up size/athleticism everywhere but the post and you are a worse shooting team and have younger players , you are going to be at a serious disadvantage.

You can coach all you want, but you can't force a player to shoot well and you can't magically make them more athletic or bigger.

[ThunderBolt]

Now we don't have enough atheltes, lol. And unless I missed something, there have been no reports of Gallo being injured.