Oklahoma City Thunder Regular Season 2015-2016 Part 2

[bondom34]

This team is not worth as much emotional investment as w have given. They don't care, F it I don't either, I'll just go for the ride. Hope they don't embarrass themselves at Minny and Dallas and drop both.

[KD35Brah]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ci0lJ3Kk4iQ[/youtube]

Russ and Adams

[getrichordie]

This team is not worth as much emotional investment as w have given. They don't care, F it I don't either, I'll just go for the ride. Hope they don't embarrass themselves at Minny and Dallas and drop both.

I just don't get it. Durant talks about how he is tired of being second best. I think he is complacent. I think Westbrook cares and has a lot of Kobe in him, but needs someone to elevate his mental game. I don't know; maybe I'm wrong. Maybe Durant needs a change of scenery. I wonder what he really thinks and feels about the games right now and his supporting cast. Why does he give such lackadaisical effort? Where did his motor go? Maybe he is saving his energy for the latter half of the season? I don't know. I honestly don't know what to think about this team right now. The talent to win it all is definitely there. Offense has no ceiling. Defensive communication and understanding is not championship quality and can be described as very poor in way too many games and situations. Execution is poor. It's like fundamentals went out the window with this team.

[bondom34]

This team is not worth as much emotional investment as w have given. They don't care, F it I don't either, I'll just go for the ride. Hope they don't embarrass themselves at Minny and Dallas and drop both.

I just don't get it. Durant talks about how he is tired of being second best. I think he is complacent. I think Westbrook cares and has a lot of Kobe in him, but needs someone to elevate his mental game. I don't know; maybe I'm wrong. Maybe Durant needs a change of scenery. I wonder what he really thinks and feels about the games right now and his supporting cast. Why does he give such lackadaisical effort? Where did his motor go? Maybe he is saving his energy for the latter half of the season? I don't know. I honestly don't know what to think about this team right now. The talent to win it all is definitely there. Offense has no ceiling. Defensive communication and understanding is not championship quality and can be described as very poor in way too many games and situations. Execution is poor. It's like fundamentals went out the window with this team.

Durant w/ 3 shots in the 4th. Russ to me was fine mentally tonight, he toned it down when he realized his shot was off. Ibaka seems confused half the time. Adams is one guy I don't ever question, or Robes, or Russ effort wise. The rest to me are questionable, even KD sometimes. I hope he stays and think he does but sometimes this year he seems just tired. Donovan hasn't done much to help the effort either.

[getrichordie]

This team is not worth as much emotional investment as w have given. They don't care, F it I don't either, I'll just go for the ride. Hope they don't embarrass themselves at Minny and Dallas and drop both.

I just don't get it. Durant talks about how he is tired of being second best. I think he is complacent. I think Westbrook cares and has a lot of Kobe in him, but needs someone to elevate his mental game. I don't know; maybe I'm wrong. Maybe Durant needs a change of scenery. I wonder what he really thinks and feels about the games right now and his supporting cast. Why does he give such lackadaisical effort? Where did his motor go? Maybe he is saving his energy for the latter half of the season? I don't know. I honestly don't know what to think about this team right now. The talent to win it all is definitely there. Offense has no ceiling. Defensive communication and understanding is not championship quality and can be described as very poor in way too many games and situations. Execution is poor. It's like fundamentals went out the window with this team.

Durant w/ 3 shots in the 4th. Russ to me was fine mentally tonight, he toned it down when he realized his shot was off. Ibaka seems confused half the time. Adams is one guy I don't ever question, or Robes, or Russ effort wise. The rest to me are questionable, even KD sometimes. I hope he stays and think he does but sometimes this year he seems just tired. Donovan hasn't done much to help the effort either.

I agree. I think Donovan, at this point, needs to be preaching defense and fundamentals at this point and who knows, he may be doing that. Maybe our guys aren't receptive of that? College egos and NBA egos are two different things.

There were a few times tonight that I felt Westbrook should have deferred to Durant late in the game. Durant had shown that his shot was falling earlier but Westbrook decided to bulldoze Plumlee instead. I think Westbrook actually controlled those last 3 possessions at that point without giving the ball to Durant at all. I'll have to go back and re-watch the second half.


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[bondom34]

I just don't get it. Durant talks about how he is tired of being second best. I think he is complacent. I think Westbrook cares and has a lot of Kobe in him, but needs someone to elevate his mental game. I don't know; maybe I'm wrong. Maybe Durant needs a change of scenery. I wonder what he really thinks and feels about the games right now and his supporting cast. Why does he give such lackadaisical effort? Where did his motor go? Maybe he is saving his energy for the latter half of the season? I don't know. I honestly don't know what to think about this team right now. The talent to win it all is definitely there. Offense has no ceiling. Defensive communication and understanding is not championship quality and can be described as very poor in way too many games and situations. Execution is poor. It's like fundamentals went out the window with this team.

Durant w/ 3 shots in the 4th. Russ to me was fine mentally tonight, he toned it down when he realized his shot was off. Ibaka seems confused half the time. Adams is one guy I don't ever question, or Robes, or Russ effort wise. The rest to me are questionable, even KD sometimes. I hope he stays and think he does but sometimes this year he seems just tired. Donovan hasn't done much to help the effort either.

I agree. I think Donovan, at this point, needs to be preaching defense and fundamentals at this point and who knows, he may be doing that. Maybe our guys aren't receptive of that? College egos and NBA egos are two different things.

There were a few times tonight that I felt Westbrook should have deferred to Durant late in the game. Durant had shown that his shot was falling earlier but Westbrook decided to bulldoze Plumlee instead. I think Westbrook actually controlled those last 3 possessions at that point without giving the ball to Durant at all. I'll have to go back and re-watch the second half.


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Def not the last 3, because 1 of them KD gave it to Serge who was blocked. And KD was also setting up Robes for 3 in the cornr (he hit it) to put them up with 3 minutes left.

[Marcus50]

It's the sort of loss that hopefully reinforces what Donovan has been trying to tell the players about 3pt defense. the loss will in the end be more valuable than a close win would have been.

[getrichordie]

It's the sort of loss that hopefully reinforces what Donovan has been trying to tell the players about 3pt defense. the loss will in the end be more valuable than a close win would have been.

I certainly hope so. Here's a few great quotes from the Daily Thunder on tonight's game:

"This is second-guessing, but it feels like Donovan got caught watching the Blazers’ comeback, rather than making a lineup change to try and slow it down. He stuck with Adams and Ibaka together, instead of going with a small group with Waiters or Singler in there to try and add some extra perimeter help."

"The big picture here, though, is a tight win over the Lakers on Friday where Lou Williams dropped 44, including 23 in the fourth, and now a tight loss to the Blazers where Lillard torched them. That’s certainly disconcerting. The Thunder have simply failed to find a consistent standard of play, one where you can reliably put them in the Warriors/Spurs/Cavs category. You start thinking they’re getting there, and then this happens."

"(Something Billy Donovan talked a lot about in preseason, though, wasn’t just 3-point defense, it was limiting opponents from getting a volume 3s. And the Blazers put up 44 (!) 3-pointers in the game, and hit 19. Both of those are records against the Thunder. So, whoops.)"


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[Pillendreher]

We have to be dumbest team in the whole league. The way we give up rebounds and allow baskets is mindboggling. It's unbelievable.

Oh and I think tsherkin was right: We have never had to rely on KD and Russ in this way. With KD on the bench, we were a -44.7p100p. That is ridiculous.

Oh and **** you Presti. You may be a great drafter, but you are **** GM. Be a scout and stop messing up this franchise.

[Pillendreher]

Oh and guess what? We've sucked at defensive rebounding for quite some time now. How the **** are Westbrook and Durant our best defensive rebounders? Is it really that hard to box guys out?! We've always been an at least good defensive rebounding team, but now that has gone to **** as well.

We're almost halfway through the season and we still can't do **** without Westbrook and KD. We give minutes to a guy that thinks he's a Go-to-Guy in the NBA but couldn't even score in the D-League. Then we have a C that doesn't understand defensive rotations and a Coach that still hasn't figured out that you can't just throw guys in there based on trial-and-error. You know how he's coaching? Like a **** college coach. This is not the Boston Celtics aquiring talents and looking to rebuild. We're here to win and we can't do that until Presti understands that he isn't the mastermind he thinks he is, gets us players that aren't dumb as **** and tells our coach aka Presti's friend to get it together. We suck against over .500 teams and have a generational talent playing like Anthony Morrow.

Man I'm pissed.

[Pillendreher]

It's like fundamentals went out the window with this team.

The problem is they were never there to begin with. We always got by with talent alone but we never were a team that won because of fundamentaly sound basketball. Maybe Scott Brooks' 'Play hard and have fun' was a little bit too much, huh? This quote sums it up quice nicely (from DT):

I will say this again we win games with talent, gsw/spurs/cavs win games with schemes and plans . Until we have the coaching in place to do this we are up **** creek.

[bondom34]

Alright, I've calmed down. I've realized this team is just really unlucky at times and really undisciplined others. The Lillard barrage was a mix of luck and great shooting, and I can't even blame it on a player. 3 point defense percentage wise is luck, and OKC has zero of it. This team seems to not have any luck, ever. This was just a whatever loss. See if they get mad. I'm not too hopeful, but I'm not as mad as last night.

[KD35Brah]

We have to be dumbest team in the whole league. The way we give up rebounds and allow baskets is mindboggling. It's unbelievable.

Oh and I think tsherkin was right: We have never had to rely on KD and Russ in this way. With KD on the bench, we were a -44.7p100p. That is ridiculous.

Oh and **** you Presti. You may be a great drafter, but you are **** GM. Be a scout and stop messing up this franchise.

Makes me think how big Perkins and Sef were to our defense...

[KD35Brah]

Alright, I've calmed down. I've realized this team is just really unlucky at times and really undisciplined others. The Lillard barrage was a mix of luck and great shooting, and I can't even blame it on a player. 3 point defense percentage wise is luck, and OKC has zero of it. This team seems to not have any luck, ever. This was just a whatever loss. See if they get mad. I'm not too hopeful, but I'm not as mad as last night.

I don't know what it is, but teams just seem to make tough shots against us like it's nothing.

I watch a lot of other teams and their defense gets by with players just missing shots with weaker contests and weaker rotations, maybe it's Russ, KD, and Waiters talking trash that fires teams up or something.

[bondom34]

Alright, I've calmed down. I've realized this team is just really unlucky at times and really undisciplined others. The Lillard barrage was a mix of luck and great shooting, and I can't even blame it on a player. 3 point defense percentage wise is luck, and OKC has zero of it. This team seems to not have any luck, ever. This was just a whatever loss. See if they get mad. I'm not too hopeful, but I'm not as mad as last night.

I don't know what it is, but teams just seem to make tough shots against us like it's nothing.

I watch a lot of other teams and their defense gets by with players just missing shots with weaker contests and weaker rotations, maybe it's Russ, KD, and Waiters talking trash that fires teams up or something.

Yeah, and FWIW, I posted this on reddit, but Nylon Calc even looked into it, and 3 point percentage defense is mostly luck:

http://nyloncalculus.com/2015/12/21/measuring-skill-vs-luck-in-nba-defense/

We have written about this before, but it bears repeating this point until the myth finally dies: The influence a player has on opponent Three Point Percentage is so minuscule that it probably should never be mentioned. The proof is in NBA.com tracking data:

I hate luck.

[Pillendreher]

We're not just imagining players going off on us. Here's how many times an opposing player has scored 25 pts or more this season:

Contenders:

OKC: 26 (12th pace)
CLE: 15 (28th pace)
GSW: 21 (2nd pace)
SAS: 10 (23rd pace)
LAC: 21 (13th pace)

Other Top 10 defensive teams:

BOS: 14 (4th pace)
IND: 19 (8th pace)
CHI: 19 (10th pace)
DET: 15 (17th pace)
MIA: 20 (29th pace)
TOR: 16 (26th pace)
ORL: 16 (22nd pace)

The worst defensive teams of the league have allowed 23 (Lakers), 15 (Bucks) and 21 (Pelicans) guys go off against them. This just can't stand. I don't know what causes this, but it has to stop. Guys can get hot, but you can't just shrugg it off if it happens 2 out of 3 games.

[Bergmaniac]

Why does it matter anyway? it's the overall defense that counts, not whether one player tends to score a lot against you. The inability to secure defensive rebounds lately seems a much bigger issue to me.

[bondom34]

Also, posted on WTLC and reddit but the issue seems to be Kanter/the bench. But Kanter's fallen real hard on D. In November had a DRtg around 103. Last 10 games? 114.9.

[getrichordie]

Also, posted on WTLC and reddit but the issue seems to be Kanter/the bench. But Kanter's fallen real hard on D. In November had a DRtg around 103. Last 10 games? 114.9.

He is certainly apart of the problem on the bench. There is no question. I think it would do us good to bench/trade Waiters and give Singler some run. Singler shows up on defense but not in the stat box. He makes hustle plays and sticks on his man. He would immediately improve the bench from a defensive standpoint. But it doesn't help that you have Payne, Morrow, and Collison as your other bench guys. Collison, while savvy and experienced, is old. Morrow, while improving, is still god awful on defense and Payne just gets beat regularly, albeit maybe not as bad as Augustin.

P.S. What is WTLC? Is that a radio station?

[bondom34]

Also, posted on WTLC and reddit but the issue seems to be Kanter/the bench. But Kanter's fallen real hard on D. In November had a DRtg around 103. Last 10 games? 114.9.

He is certainly apart of the problem on the bench. There is no question. I think it would do us good to bench/trade Waiters and give Singler some run. Singler shows up on defense but not in the stat box. He makes hustle plays and sticks on his man. He would immediately improve the bench from a defensive standpoint. But it doesn't help that you have Payne, Morrow, and Collison as your other bench guys. Collison, while savvy and experienced, is old. Morrow, while improving, is still god awful on defense and Payne just gets beat regularly, albeit maybe not as bad as Augustin.

P.S. What is WTLC? Is that a radio station?

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