2018-2019 OKC Thunder Regular Season Pt 1: A Renewed Hope

[CROklahoma]

What is there to change ?
Same old system, same old blaming bad nights from certain players.
What did Donovan do to change the way this team behaves during the season ? Did we do a mighty and punchy streak with consistency ?
This struggles are here for 3 years, thats only thats consistent with Donovan and this group.
Every single year, we're putting out stats blaming certain individuals for them ruining our netrtg and putting bunch of bad stats.
Every team has individuals that dont do work on both sides of the floor, even GSW.

So, if it's not Billy to blame, it is on Presti.

Trades and roster overhaul aint changing ****.

[slick_watts]

Out with old and in with the new. Trade Russ if you can. I’ll take Schroder as my starter for the future over Russ.

as bad as westbrook has been this year, there's no defensible basis for this position unless you want to tank-- which, although i was a supporter of, is probably a non-starter at this point.

take what westbrook is now, keep all the bad stuff, but remove the athleticism, remove the play making abilities in the pnr, and remove the fast break capabilities and you get dennis schroder.

you're dying on the wrong hill. it's sad to see. your brand has potential.

[ThunderBolt]

I wish Clay Bennett would do an honest interview.

[hardenASG13]

For all adams does well (offensive rebounding, boxing out, flip shots), he also kills the team defensively every year once his body starts breaking down, which it is again. His feet are stuck in cement. His pnr defense isn't good, don't care what numbers are thrown out. I've seen called elite in here at switching onto guards, alot of times. He's way, way too slow to do that as a viable option. How many times does the opposing center switch onto Westbrook or Schroeder for example. Unreal okc hasn't stopped doing this with adams and Perkins before him all these years. He's a beast, but give me 2 agile bigs (Noel and a rashaun Holmes type), and some shooters/ an actual bench) over a 100 million dollar adams. He doesn't work on this roster as the third "star". Having 0 rim protection and struggling in the pnr is a major problem in the NBA. Russ/shroeder would have a field day playing against adams, itd be a layup line.

[SecondTake]

Adams would be great if OKC didn't have this BS strategy of trapping on the perimeter and letting the bigs roll uncontested to the basket. I've seen the stats throw around here, but anyone watching these games is going to send an endless layup line of bigs uncontested at the basket. Adams is a slow ass giant that should be planted under the basket to do what he does best. Box out, contest, body up and rebound.

[SecondTake]

I don’t think this is fixable.

Oh give me a break already. Yes, I'm sure we'll have a 120 or so DRtG for the rest of the season. Just like that we get worse by almost 20 pp100p.

Jesus.

I doubt it, but if we don't have the clear #1 defense in the league we're not going to contend for anything in the playoffs. If this defense doesn't revert to what it was in Nov/Dec then this team is going to be bounced in the first round. If it finds that level of defense again and maintains this kind of production from Tferg and Pat (or something close to it) then we're going to the WCF

[SecondTake]

I just don't think we're that dynamic defensively or at least as flexible as we need to be. It's a similar phenomenon to what Milwaukee experienced between their first and second years under Kidd and how their defense plummeted once teams caught on to the gameplan. Kidd's scheme was all about aggressive doubles either on ball screens or on post ups. Billy's defense is all about aggressive high roll coverage and switchability amongst his big men. Everyone on the squad gambles in the passing lanes or on poke aways. I think opponents just know it's coming now and anticipate high coverage on every possession and they prioritize ball security. Westbrook has also been awful again on the defensive end. It seemed like he'd turned a new leaf in regard to his effort getting over screens and closing out on shooters but he's been brutal in this stretch against lottery squads. Obviously every team has lulls in their season but when the trade deadline is so close and you suck on both sides of the ball it's hard to parse what exactly we're missing and if it's even worth pursuing.

Ferguson rules. A petty part of me liked that went ahead and shoved KCP after two garbage whistles.

While some of this is true, I don't think that you can be that good defensively for multiple months just on a "gimmick". To me it looks like

a) some rotations are just off

b) we forever reason prioritize swarming guys over guarding players

c) we are playing way too many horrible players with the bench

Regarding c):

Schröder+Patterson with no Adams and George and no Diallo or Nader: 103.1 DRtG (63 minutes)
Schröder+Patterson+Diallo with no Adams, George and Nader: 116.5 DRtG (125 minutes)
Schröder+Patterson+Diallo+Nader with no Adams and George: 145.3 DRtG (44 minutes)

We can't go on like this. Whatever lead we build with the starters, the bench erases it in a matter of minutes. Adams was gone four minutes from the 1st to the 2nd quarter and the Lakers had scored 24 points on 13 possessions. This is like the Rockets series 2017 in the Playoffs, but now we're doing it against horrible squads as well. That bench at least was good. Now we're getting lit up by guys that are barely NBA players in some cases.

The starters didn't do anything in OT or the 4th to win this game. Against a Lakers that's probably a bottom 5 team in the NBA right now. The bench sucks, but I didn't see the starters make a case when it mattered that they're being dragged down by the bench. If that were the case they should have sealed the deal in the 4th and OT.

[SecondTake]

Been away for a while. Just wow.

7 for 30.

I stand by my belief that a Russ-centric team cannot be considered a true contender. Russ’ only real skill is his athleticism and passing and he’s picked it up on defense this year. He sucks at almost everything else.

Just tired of watching Russ make mistake after mistake and bad decision after bad decision. He’s not Kobe. He doesn’t deserve the “leeway” that he’s been getting within our offense. Not anymore, anyway.

Out with old and in with the new. Trade Russ if you can. I’ll take Schroder as my starter for the future over Russ.

Let’s just pray that Presti isn’t married to Russ.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

That's like 3 major skills. Even if that's all I gave you, that's not too shabby. How many great athlete, passer, defender combos are there?

[Pillendreher]

The bench sucks, but I didn't see the starters make a case when it mattered that they're being dragged down by the bench. If that were the case they should have sealed the deal in the 4th and OT.

The 4th quarter and overtime weren't any more important than the rest of the game. In the 41 minutes Adams played, the team had a +12.5 NetRtG. That should be enough. But of course it wasn't because they got completely destroyed with him off the floor: -74 NetRtG (this is not a typo) in 12 minutes.

We can't expect the starters to make up for that every game. It's impossible.

[RalphSampsonJr]

The bench sucks, but I didn't see the starters make a case when it mattered that they're being dragged down by the bench. If that were the case they should have sealed the deal in the 4th and OT.

The 4th quarter and overtime weren't any more important than the rest of the game. In the 41 minutes Adams played, the team had a +12.5 NetRtG. That should be enough. But of course it wasn't because they got completely destroyed with him off the floor: -74 NetRtG (this is not a typo) in 12 minutes.

We can't expect the starters to make up for that every game. It's impossible.

Yep. Very hard to do damage in OT when your best players have already played 35+ minutes..

Billy is turning into the new thibs because of the bench.

[Pillendreher]

The bench sucks, but I didn't see the starters make a case when it mattered that they're being dragged down by the bench. If that were the case they should have sealed the deal in the 4th and OT.

The 4th quarter and overtime weren't any more important than the rest of the game. In the 41 minutes Adams played, the team had a +12.5 NetRtG. That should be enough. But of course it wasn't because they got completely destroyed with him off the floor: -74 NetRtG (this is not a typo) in 12 minutes.

We can't expect the starters to make up for that every game. It's impossible.

Yep. Very hard to do damage in OT when your best players have already played 35+ minutes..

Billy is turning into the new thibs because of the bench.

Which is why I think it's important to mix starters and bench more. You might lose a little bit of production coming from the starters, but it should stabilize the 2nd unit and give the whole team more of a balance.

Patterson has been making his 3s for the last month or so. Give him some minutes next to Westbrook, George and Adams. That also enables you to give Grant some minutes against opposing benches. Give Ferguson some minutes with the bench. Pray that Abrines comes back soon.

[SecondTake]

The 4th quarter and overtime weren't any more important than the rest of the game. In the 41 minutes Adams played, the team had a +12.5 NetRtG. That should be enough. But of course it wasn't because they got completely destroyed with him off the floor: -74 NetRtG (this is not a typo) in 12 minutes.

We can't expect the starters to make up for that every game. It's impossible.

Yep. Very hard to do damage in OT when your best players have already played 35+ minutes..

Billy is turning into the new thibs because of the bench.

Which is why I think it's important to mix starters and bench more. You might lose a little bit of production coming from the starters, but it should stabilize the 2nd unit and give the whole team more of a balance.

Patterson has been making his 3s for the last month or so. Give him some minutes next to Westbrook, George and Adams. That also enables you to give Grant some minutes against opposing benches. Give Ferguson some minutes with the bench. Pray that Abrines comes back soon.

IDK, they seem to keep trying to do that with PG at the end of the 1sts but it never looks good.

[Pillendreher]

Yep. Very hard to do damage in OT when your best players have already played 35+ minutes..

Billy is turning into the new thibs because of the bench.

Which is why I think it's important to mix starters and bench more. You might lose a little bit of production coming from the starters, but it should stabilize the 2nd unit and give the whole team more of a balance.

Patterson has been making his 3s for the last month or so. Give him some minutes next to Westbrook, George and Adams. That also enables you to give Grant some minutes against opposing benches. Give Ferguson some minutes with the bench. Pray that Abrines comes back soon.

IDK, they seem to keep trying to do that with PG at the end of the 1sts but it never looks good.

That's another thing I don't agree with. Maybe give the guy some rest for a change and don't play him 12 minutes straight.

[SecondTake]

Which is why I think it's important to mix starters and bench more. You might lose a little bit of production coming from the starters, but it should stabilize the 2nd unit and give the whole team more of a balance.

Patterson has been making his 3s for the last month or so. Give him some minutes next to Westbrook, George and Adams. That also enables you to give Grant some minutes against opposing benches. Give Ferguson some minutes with the bench. Pray that Abrines comes back soon.

IDK, they seem to keep trying to do that with PG at the end of the 1sts but it never looks good.

That's another thing I don't agree with. Maybe give the guy some rest for a change and don't play him 12 minutes straight.

Well apparently he asked Billy last year to play him through the 1st so he can get in to rhythm so it's his idea. But he doesn't seem to have much chemistry with the bench. No one does. I think the only guy that can make something out of that bench is WB and you need him to work with the starters, because without him Adams doesn't look like the same guy and PG turns in to a ball hog.

[slick_watts]

Russ/shroeder would have a field day playing against adams, itd be a layup line.

[RalphSampsonJr]

Russ/shroeder would have a field day playing against adams, itd be a layup line.

Its not the gaurds getting to the rim its the bigs.

The bigs that dont have Adams on them because
Russ or Dennis have lost their man and now Adams is playing two on one..

Billys scheme to get Adams up on the pnr instead of hanging back is very confusing. It only works if the gaurd is in position. After 10 possesions of witnessing neither gaurd stay in position, Adams should be told to stay back.

[RalphSampsonJr]

IDK, they seem to keep trying to do that with PG at the end of the 1sts but it never looks good.

That's another thing I don't agree with. Maybe give the guy some rest for a change and don't play him 12 minutes straight.

Well apparently he asked Billy last year to play him through the 1st so he can get in to rhythm so it's his idea. But he doesn't seem to have much chemistry with the bench. No one does. I think the only guy that can make something out of that bench is WB and you need him to work with the starters, because without him Adams doesn't look like the same guy and PG turns in to a ball hog.

Adams and dennis had a pretty nice two man game when Russ was out. I say get russ out after 5-7 mins and leave pg tferg and Adams with dennis and 2pat.

2pat pg and tferg keep the 3pt defense honest and give adams and dennis space for a two man game. This can also create open 3s with the d collapsing in on them.

After that you have noel grant and russ run with say nader and diallo. The wings will be weak but the rim protection is strong. Russ can create no matter who is in and Grant will more often than not, score on 2nd unit bigs

[Dadouv47]

Adams is not playing as well as the beginning of regular season..he looks a bit tired lately. He's still the more consistent Thunder player though

[oreojenkins]

This losing streak is affecting my real life mood way more than it should.

[hardenASG13]

Russ/shroeder would have a field day playing against adams, itd be a layup line.

Yea I'm sure they wouldn't blow right by him when he pulled the adams switch at the three point line and just put up a hand a prayed. Russ could finish on him at will at the rim, the guy is not much of a factor bothering shots there, since he can barely move or jump. Very slow off his feet compared to other modern day centers. I'd take javale mcgee for him tbh.