2017 OKC Thunder Trade Discussion

[ThunderBolt]

I'd be okay with moving Steven for a top 6 pick. Draft Jackson or Isaac and at least put a higher ceiling on the team.

I would do that. Other option, what about CJ McCollum? Portland desperately needs a guy like Adams. If we got McCollum we would have a bonafide number 2 scoring option. Then we can make a move for someone like Willie Cauley-Stein, Nurkic, Noel or another young rim protector.

[bondom34]

I'd be semi OK trading Oladipo, but you're not getting value for Adams. You're not getting a starting big cheaper than that in the next few years (honestly same for Vic but people will find that out this summer). Sorry but this talk is a little nuts.

We've now even had a fan of another team saying exactly what I've claimed, and I'd again say ask other fanbases this.

The odds anyone in the draft is worse than either VO or Adams is rather high.

[ThunderBolt]

My thoughts are not based on a three game losing streak. I've watched the majority of our games. Vic and Adams are underperforming. Some of us just aren't content with this roster.

[Kizz Fastfists]

If you start trading Oladpo and Adams for draft picks you are committing to completely wasting Russ' prime. If you are going to that you might as well trade Russ and go with a complete rebuild. By the time a player you add from the draft will be as good as Oladipo or Adams you are in the '19-'20 season and Russ is 31 years old. A complete gutting of the supporting cast doesn't do any good because you aren't going to get better players in FA to come here.

You either trade Russ, along with Oladipo and Kanter, or you accept being a fringe playoff team next year. Then Russ leaves and it is a forced rebuild with no assets and having passed on the opportunity to collect draft picks in a great draft and then you get stuck with top 5 picks in drafts like 2014-2016 where if you don't win the lottery you're getting more of a role player than a star. The timing was perfect to start a rebuild when kd turned bitch because of the draft class. Now it's too late to maximize to maximize this draft so they will probably wait it out until the off-season then try to make some minor and irrelevant moves.

[ThunderBolt]

I'd be semi OK trading Oladipo, but you're not getting value for Adams. You're not getting a starting big cheaper than that in the next few years (honestly same for Vic but people will find that out this summer). Sorry but this talk is a little nuts.

We've now even had a fan of another team saying exactly what I've claimed, and I'd again say ask other fanbases this.

The odds anyone in the draft is worse than either VO or Adams is rather high.

So which is it? You arent getting value for Adams or you aren't getting a starting big cheaper than Adams? Either Adams, a top ten center, is paid fairly or no one wants to give value because he's overpaid.

[bondom34]

My thoughts are not based on a three game losing streak. I've watched the majority of our games. Vic and Adams are underperforming. Some of us just aren't content with this roster.

Which is fine, but those 2 aren't the issue. Particularly Adams who you're not getting better value on contract wise in the foreseeable future.

The salary cap is continuing to rise. You're going to pay a lot of backup bigs nearly what he's making. And he's 22. And he's improved every year and played really well this year.

If you start trading Oladpo and Adams for draft picks you are committing to completely wasting Russ' prime. If you are going to that you might as well trade Russ and go with a complete rebuild. By the time a player you add from the draft will be as good as Oladipo or Adams you are in the '19-'20 season and Russ is 31 years old. A complete gutting of the supporting cast doesn't do any good because you aren't going to get better players in FA to come here.

You either trade Russ, along with Oladipo and Kanter, or you accept being a fringe playoff team next year. Then Russ leaves and it is a forced rebuild with no assets and having passed on the opportunity to collect draft picks in a great draft and then you get stuck with top 5 picks in drafts like 2014-2016 where if you don't win the lottery you're getting more of a role player than a star. The timing was perfect to start a rebuild when kd turned bitch because of the draft class. Now it's too late to maximize to maximize this draft so they will probably wait it out until the off-season then try to make some minor and irrelevant moves.

So, Russ is leaving now? Because I've never actually heard this rumor.

[ThunderBolt]

If you start trading Oladpo and Adams for draft picks you are committing to completely wasting Russ' prime. If you are going to that you might as well trade Russ and go with a complete rebuild. By the time a player you add from the draft will be as good as Oladipo or Adams you are in the '19-'20 season and Russ is 31 years old. A complete gutting of the supporting cast doesn't do any good because you aren't going to get better players in FA to come here.

You either trade Russ, along with Oladipo and Kanter, or you accept being a fringe playoff team next year. Then Russ leaves and it is a forced rebuild with no assets and having passed on the opportunity to collect draft picks in a great draft and then you get stuck with top 5 picks in drafts like 2014-2016 where if you don't win the lottery you're getting more of a role player than a star. The timing was perfect to start a rebuild when kd turned bitch because of the draft class. Now it's too late to maximize to maximize this draft so they will probably wait it out until the off-season then try to make some minor and irrelevant moves.

I agree. That's why I said you basically have three options. Rebuild with RW(move Adams, Vic, Kanter, rebuilt without RW, or trade Abrines and Sabonis. No other trade makes much of a difference. I don't see any other way to make an impactful move weather it's long term or immediate. I'm not saying any of these three make us great or even good. However they give us a clear trajectory which is something I don't see at the moment.

[bondom34]

I'd be semi OK trading Oladipo, but you're not getting value for Adams. You're not getting a starting big cheaper than that in the next few years (honestly same for Vic but people will find that out this summer). Sorry but this talk is a little nuts.

We've now even had a fan of another team saying exactly what I've claimed, and I'd again say ask other fanbases this.

The odds anyone in the draft is worse than either VO or Adams is rather high.

So which is it? You arent getting value for Adams or you aren't getting a starting big cheaper than Adams? Either Adams, a top ten center, is paid fairly or no one wants to give value because he's overpaid.

You aren't getting fair value for Adams is what I meant. Because you won't get a return worth giving up an actually good player on a reasonable contract who's close to his age.

Or you could sign a vet center for $25 mil in a year if you want replacement.

[bondom34]

If you start trading Oladpo and Adams for draft picks you are committing to completely wasting Russ' prime. If you are going to that you might as well trade Russ and go with a complete rebuild. By the time a player you add from the draft will be as good as Oladipo or Adams you are in the '19-'20 season and Russ is 31 years old. A complete gutting of the supporting cast doesn't do any good because you aren't going to get better players in FA to come here.

You either trade Russ, along with Oladipo and Kanter, or you accept being a fringe playoff team next year. Then Russ leaves and it is a forced rebuild with no assets and having passed on the opportunity to collect draft picks in a great draft and then you get stuck with top 5 picks in drafts like 2014-2016 where if you don't win the lottery you're getting more of a role player than a star. The timing was perfect to start a rebuild when kd turned bitch because of the draft class. Now it's too late to maximize to maximize this draft so they will probably wait it out until the off-season then try to make some minor and irrelevant moves.

I agree. That's why I said you basically have three options. Rebuild with RW(move Adams, Vic, Kanter, rebuilt without RW, or trade Abrines and Sabonis. No other trade makes much of a difference. I don't see any other way to make an impactful move weather it's long term or immediate.

What were your preseason expectations? Honest question as you weren't around then.

Again, we've now even had other fans chime in on how bizarre this convo is, and people think the solution is "blow it up" and be painfully bad for years to come just because we don't know how awful they'll be for how long.

[ThunderBolt]

If you start trading Oladpo and Adams for draft picks you are committing to completely wasting Russ' prime. If you are going to that you might as well trade Russ and go with a complete rebuild. By the time a player you add from the draft will be as good as Oladipo or Adams you are in the '19-'20 season and Russ is 31 years old. A complete gutting of the supporting cast doesn't do any good because you aren't going to get better players in FA to come here.

You either trade Russ, along with Oladipo and Kanter, or you accept being a fringe playoff team next year. Then Russ leaves and it is a forced rebuild with no assets and having passed on the opportunity to collect draft picks in a great draft and then you get stuck with top 5 picks in drafts like 2014-2016 where if you don't win the lottery you're getting more of a role player than a star. The timing was perfect to start a rebuild when kd turned bitch because of the draft class. Now it's too late to maximize to maximize this draft so they will probably wait it out until the off-season then try to make some minor and irrelevant moves.

I agree. That's why I said you basically have three options. Rebuild with RW(move Adams, Vic, Kanter, rebuilt without RW, or trade Abrines and Sabonis. No other trade makes much of a difference. I don't see any other way to make an impactful move weather it's long term or immediate.

What were your preseason expectations? Honest question as you weren't around then.

Again, we've now even had other fans chime in on how bizarre this convo is, and people think the solution is "blow it up" and be painfully bad for years to come just because we don't know how awful they'll be for how long.

I wanted to trade Russ to Boston or LA. Not because I didn't like him, but because I thought we would be stuck. As it stood, I thought Vic and Russ would be a really deadly backcourt. Like Lillard and Mccolum. I thought Adams would avg 15 ppg pretty comfortably. I thought we would be closer to being as good as the Jazz. Our record isn't horrible. I'm more concerned with the trajectory of the team. I thought we had a solid core 3, but I don't see that now.

[Kizz Fastfists]

So, Russ is leaving now? Because I've never actually heard this rumor.

You aren't going to hear it as a rumor because Russ isn't the drama queen that kd is. He'll quietly go about playing his best the rest of this year and next then go to the team that gives him the best chance at a ring, which isn't OKC. The only thing you'll hear Russ say about it is that he wants to win championships, which he has said several times this season. He's been laying the groundwork for his exit, but not a lot are listening because they think he signed the extension as some loyalty thing and not what it really was which was maximizing his basketball earnings.

[bondom34]

So, Russ is leaving now? Because I've never actually heard this rumor.

You aren't going to hear it as a rumor because Russ isn't the drama queen that kd is. He'll quietly go about playing his best the rest of this year and next then go to the team that gives him the best chance at a ring, which isn't OKC. The only thing you'll hear Russ say about it is that he wants to win championships, which he has said several times this season. He's been laying the groundwork for his exit, but not a lot are listening because they think he signed the extension as some loyalty thing and not what it really was which was maximizing his basketball earnings.

He's also said he never thought of leaving and wants to see this team grow. So now we've got comments saying he wants to stay. He's been laying groundwork for staying, and leaving (oh and giving up over $50 million) sounds pretty unlikely.

He's not going anywhere he's winning a title unless Lebron decides he wants Russ or GSW moves Curry. He's got as good a shot in OKC as anywhere else.

[bondom34]

I agree. That's why I said you basically have three options. Rebuild with RW(move Adams, Vic, Kanter, rebuilt without RW, or trade Abrines and Sabonis. No other trade makes much of a difference. I don't see any other way to make an impactful move weather it's long term or immediate.

What were your preseason expectations? Honest question as you weren't around then.

Again, we've now even had other fans chime in on how bizarre this convo is, and people think the solution is "blow it up" and be painfully bad for years to come just because we don't know how awful they'll be for how long.

I wanted to trade Russ to Boston or LA. Not because I didn't like him, but because I thought we would be stuck. As it stood, I thought Vic and Russ would be a really deadly backcourt. Like Lillard and Mccolum. I thought Adams would avg 15 ppg pretty comfortably. I thought we would be closer to being as good as the Jazz. Our record isn't horrible. I'm more concerned with the trajectory of the team. I thought we had a solid core 3, but I don't see that now.

This is the first season these 3 have played together, they've got no time to gel, and so far the 3 man lineup of those 3 is a +6. And that's starting a rookie at PF and not yet making a move for another wing.

This roster was going to take time. Again, read that Magic fan's post, and tell me you'd rather be a Magic fan than an OKC fan honestly.

[bondom34]

“This is professional sports,” Westbrook sniffs. “You have to live with it. I just continued about my day.” As the afternoon wore on, and more dominoes were played, Beverly turned the topic to Oklahoma City and the franchise left behind. “I like my team,” Westbrook told him. “I still really like my team.” His tone took Beverly back a decade, to the blank navy thermal sweatshirts they wore in layup lines at Leuzinger High, as rivals from Westchester and Artesia rocked shiny jackets with shoe company logos. Westbrook, desperate for a college scholarship, could have mulled a transfer. “Oh no,” he says now, cutting off the question. “No, no, no. That school was where I’m from. It’s where my friends went. I was never going to leave. I was never going to be a follower.”

Late in his senior season one player quit and two others were ruled academically ineligible. “You can guess how he responded,” Beverly says. “‘Forget ’em. We’ll go with what we got. We’ll run with who we have. We’ll fight to the end.’” When Leuzinger fell in the sectional quarterfinals, finishing 25–4, Westbrook staggered to the locker room with cramps buckling both legs. Beverly eyed his fuming friend and worried he might slug an opponent. But Westbrook felt oddly at peace. “You don’t win a championship every year,” he says. “The moment, the process, the ups and downs, the bumps and bruises, are special to me. We didn’t win it all, but we became better, we became closer.” He savored the struggle. He treasured the crew.

[Kizz Fastfists]

I thought Vic and Russ would be a really deadly backcourt. Like Lillard and Mccolum. I thought Adams would avg 15 ppg pretty comfortably. I thought we would be closer to being as good as the Jazz. Our record isn't horrible. I'm more concerned with the trajectory of the team. I thought we had a solid core 3, but I don't see that now.

Oladipo isn't McCollum and never will be. McCollum is a PG playing SG. Oladipo is not a PG. Adams is averaging 12 points on 8.5 shots. They aren't giving him the touches to score more. They aren't going to him and pounding it inside. Adams is shooting 59%. Adams has the best TS% on the team. Only Nick Collison has a better eFG% than Adams. He can't pass the ball to himself. Judging a player on PPG is about the worst possible way to judge a player you are basically judging a player based on how many shots they get.

OKC doesn't have a good #2 option and everyone should have known that going into the season. That is why the timing on the extensions was terrible. OKC needs that other star player. Oladipo and Adams are great if they are your 3rd and 4th best players, but they are current 2nd and 3rd which isn't going to get you anywhere unless LeBron is your #1. It's even worse that Roberson is the 4th best player on the team because there is nothing after Oladipo and Adams right now. Abrines and Sabonis should end up better than Roberson by the end of next year, but they aren't going to be good enough to push the team to a new level and that will still leave Roberson as your 6th best player, which isn't where you want him if you have championship goals. You took a top 5 player in the world off of the roster. Of course OKC was going to have a massive drop off. If you didn't expect this you are either very new to basketball or very naive.

[bondom34]

Sorry to chime in but this convo has really fascinated me. It seems a bit odd that a good team is worrying about the future of their franchise when they have a great base in a superstar and young players. OKC is in a nice spot going forward and I am not sure fans would want to trade their current basketball product for say Orlando's which I've barely gotten the enjoyment of watching this season.

The competitive state of the league(Golden State) and Sixers recent rebuild project has gotten fans to think more and more about the future of their teams than past years it seems. I think seeing the asset base of the Wolves/76ers and the dominance of the Warriors has gotten fans longing for a better future seeing as the present looks to be a Warriors dynasty. It appears now fans would rather enjoy the euphoria of not knowing the future state/ceiling of their basketball product than being guaranteed a locked in good product compared to fans of yesteryear.

I think fans just need to understand that fortunes can change quickly in the NBA.

[ThunderBolt]

What were your preseason expectations? Honest question as you weren't around then.

Again, we've now even had other fans chime in on how bizarre this convo is, and people think the solution is "blow it up" and be painfully bad for years to come just because we don't know how awful they'll be for how long.

I wanted to trade Russ to Boston or LA. Not because I didn't like him, but because I thought we would be stuck. As it stood, I thought Vic and Russ would be a really deadly backcourt. Like Lillard and Mccolum. I thought Adams would avg 15 ppg pretty comfortably. I thought we would be closer to being as good as the Jazz. Our record isn't horrible. I'm more concerned with the trajectory of the team. I thought we had a solid core 3, but I don't see that now.

This is the first season these 3 have played together, they've got no time to gel, and so far the 3 man lineup of those 3 is a +6. And that's starting a rookie at PF and not yet making a move for another wing.

This roster was going to take time. Again, read that Magic fan's post, and tell me you'd rather be a Magic fan than an OKC fan honestly.

I don't want to be Orlando. I'll admit that. Do you realistically think we are that far away from them? I believe Russ wants to win a championship and wants to do so here. I don't believe that means he won't leave. Do you really feel this core will develop enough that at the end of next year Russ believes he will win here? Russ and Adams aren't new playing together. As Russ and Vic play longer together, what do you think we can realistically expect? I don't think it's enough. If Russ walks at the end of next year this franchise will be much worse off than the magic. Either you're content with where we are at, or you choose one of the paths I mentioned. If you disagree, tell me another option.

[bondom34]

I don't want to be Orlando. I'll admit that. Do you realistically think we are that far away from them? I believe Russ wants to win a championship and wants to do so here. I don't believe that means he won't leave. Do you really feel this core will develop enough that at the end of next year Russ believes he will win here? Russ and Adams aren't new playing together. As Russ and Vic play longer together, what do you think we can realistically expect? I don't think it's enough. If Russ walks at the end of next year this franchise will be much worse off than the magic. Either you're content with where we are at, or you choose one of the paths I mentioned. If you disagree, tell me another option.

Yes, I do.

And read the quote from the Magic fan just here. It is easier to make incremental moves than start over.

I think OKC is lightyears ahead of Orlando. It isn't even close. But if you trade Russ? You're maybe on equal ground, because you never get back remotely close to value. And if you expect to you'd be very disappointed.

[ThunderBolt]

I thought Vic and Russ would be a really deadly backcourt. Like Lillard and Mccolum. I thought Adams would avg 15 ppg pretty comfortably. I thought we would be closer to being as good as the Jazz. Our record isn't horrible. I'm more concerned with the trajectory of the team. I thought we had a solid core 3, but I don't see that now.

Oladipo isn't McCollum and never will be. McCollum is a PG playing SG. Oladipo is not a PG. Adams is averaging 12 points on 8.5 shots. They aren't giving him the touches to score more. They aren't going to him and pounding it inside. Adams is shooting 59%. Adams has the best TS% on the team. Only Nick Collison has a better eFG% than Adams. He can't pass the ball to himself. Judging a player on PPG is about the worst possible way to judge a player you are basically judging a player based on how many shots they get.

OKC doesn't have a good #2 option and everyone should have known that going into the season. That is why the timing on the extensions was terrible. OKC needs that other star player. Oladipo and Adams are great if they are your 3rd and 4th best players, but they are current 2nd and 3rd which isn't going to get you anywhere unless LeBron is your #1. It's even worse that Roberson is the 4th best player on the team because there is nothing after Oladipo and Adams right now. Abrines and Sabonis should end up better than Roberson by the end of next year, but they aren't going to be good enough to push the team to a new level and that will still leave Roberson as your 6th best player, which isn't where you want him if you have championship goals. You took a top 5 player in the world off of the roster. Of course OKC was going to have a massive drop off. If you didn't expect this you are either very new to basketball or very naive.

Adams gets fewer touches because the paint is clogged. I'll admit that. However you're still admitting that we don't have a good number two option, and that's what I'm saying. Also, I didn't say I didn't expect OKC to not drop off. Look at guys like McCollum and Butlers first few years in the league, then they popped. Vic has put up better numbers than those two in his early years. I said I "hoped" he would develop into a player that gave us a dynamic backcourt. As far as calling me naive, where did I say anything about not expecting this team to not drop off? Slow down and read more carefully.

[spearsy23]

Neither Adams nor Oladipo are good enough to be second options. We don't have cap space or trade chips beyond the two of them. That's what it all boils down to. The easiest way to remake the roster is to trade one of them (or both) for rookies or rookie scale contracts and build an actual team around Russ. You don't have to have 3 superstars to be a very good team, but you can't have two good players and crap around your superstar either.