12/7 - POSTGAME | Oklahoma City Thunder (95) - (100) Brooklyn Nets

[dakomish23]

Also, I'm not really sure what Russ could do tonight. The wing rotation was Abrines/Roberson/Ferguson/Singler, that's close to the most worthless group you could find, especially on offense. Then Melo was clanking everything, and Russ tried to get Steven going but he started throwing up horrible shots. He even willingly gave the ball up down the stretch (when we should've went to p&r), and Melo threw up even worse Ish than Russ had been.

Roberson at least moves without the ball and is a monster on defense. Ferguson is a rookie who’s not ready to contribute.

The other two don’t seem like good fits with the current composition of the roster. I bet if they went to a team like BKN who spaces it out and chucks it up, they’d look better.

It seems like players who need to have stuff created for them on the perimeter won’t do well.

[Jstock12]

I know it's not a pleasant thought, but Donovan might not be the only one to blame here. Melo/Westbrook also need to realize that they're just wasting 1 year of what's left of their careers if the team keeps playing like this. Although, Melo has played in New York for years now... he might already be used to this and be completely fine with it, as long as he gets his shots... If he's happy about his legacy being of a 'career loser', then fine. Anyway, they need to take a long, hard look in the mirror.

[slick_watts]

And I know they're a better team but man Rockets fans are some salty salty people. Just cant accept Harden wasn't as good until this year. I cant believe I'll be cheering for GSW over them but here I am.

after having it rammed down their throats last year despite a superior team, they're entitled to some braggadocio. james harden is blowing westbrook away this year. i'm sure thunder fans would be restrained and civil if the situation was reversed.

i dunno why anyone could be surprised with this loss. was it much different than our win against the spurs g-league team? westbrook looks like he might be done.

People are trying to rewrite history by using current events. Russ being trash so far does not take anything away from what he has done in the past. It just enables haters to let their hottakes fly.

the main argument against westbrook last year (from detractors) was that in spite of his numbers he wasn't a winning player. i'd say that westbrook's performance and the team's performance so far this season could be construed as supporting this position. it doesn't seem too outlandish to me.

[bondom34]

after having it rammed down their throats last year despite a superior team, they're entitled to some braggadocio. james harden is blowing westbrook away this year. i'm sure thunder fans would be restrained and civil if the situation was reversed.

i dunno why anyone could be surprised with this loss. was it much different than our win against the spurs g-league team? westbrook looks like he might be done.

People are trying to rewrite history by using current events. Russ being trash so far does not take anything away from what he has done in the past. It just enables haters to let their hottakes fly.

the main argument against westbrook last year (from detractors) was that in spite of his numbers he wasn't a winning player. i'd say that westbrook's performance and the team's performance so far this season could be construed as supporting this position. it doesn't seem too outlandish to me.

So Westbrook playing objectively worse means he's not a winning player. No that makes no sense. If he was playing near last years level this team would be very good. He's not. That says zero about last year.

Its saying Houston was 41 and 41 2 years ago so Harden isn't a winning player when he's objectively playing better now. One is playing better than last year and one worse. One has won more in the past than the other (hint not harden). This year is irrelevant to last year when objectively looking at data.

[slick_watts]

People are trying to rewrite history by using current events. Russ being trash so far does not take anything away from what he has done in the past. It just enables haters to let their hottakes fly.

the main argument against westbrook last year (from detractors) was that in spite of his numbers he wasn't a winning player. i'd say that westbrook's performance and the team's performance so far this season could be construed as supporting this position. it doesn't seem too outlandish to me.

So Westbrook playing objectively worse means he's not a winning player. No that makes no sense. If he was playing near last years level this team would be very good. He's not. That says zero about last year.

Its saying Houston was 41 and 41 2 years ago so Harden isn't a winning player when he's objectively playing better now.

i don't agree with it but i don't think it's an outlandish position for fans of houston to have. fans of oklahoma city think westbrook is better than kevin durant and believe that kevin durant threw a playoff series deliberately.

[bondom34]

the main argument against westbrook last year (from detractors) was that in spite of his numbers he wasn't a winning player. i'd say that westbrook's performance and the team's performance so far this season could be construed as supporting this position. it doesn't seem too outlandish to me.

So Westbrook playing objectively worse means he's not a winning player. No that makes no sense. If he was playing near last years level this team would be very good. He's not. That says zero about last year.

Its saying Houston was 41 and 41 2 years ago so Harden isn't a winning player when he's objectively playing better now.

i don't agree with it but i don't think it's an outlandish position for fans of houston to have. fans of oklahoma city think westbrook is better than kevin durant and believe that kevin durant threw a playoff series deliberately.

I don't know what you're implying I think here but no it's quite outlandish. Joel Embiid has been a top 3 center this year. He wasn't last year. That doesn't mean he was one last year because he is one this year and its terrible logic that reeks of sour grapes or someone who still won't credit Westbrook for anything

[slick_watts]

So Westbrook playing objectively worse means he's not a winning player. No that makes no sense. If he was playing near last years level this team would be very good. He's not. That says zero about last year.

Its saying Houston was 41 and 41 2 years ago so Harden isn't a winning player when he's objectively playing better now.

i don't agree with it but i don't think it's an outlandish position for fans of houston to have. fans of oklahoma city think westbrook is better than kevin durant and believe that kevin durant threw a playoff series deliberately.

I don't know what you're implying I think here but no it's quite outlandish. Joel Embiid has been a top 3 center this year. He wasn't last year. That doesn't mean he was one last year because he is one this year and its terrible logic that reeks of sour grapes or someone who still won't credit Westbrook for anything

they were unhappy westbrook got mvp as a sixth seed. something rare and unusual. although westbrook was objectively superior individually, the mvp voting has tended to err on the side of the player with more wins in a close race. so houston fans complained that westbrook didn't deserve the mvp because although he put up numbers (i.e.: triple doubles) that didn't translate to team wins.

now the thunder suck and westbrook's been disappointing despite more talent (allegedly) surround him. and the rockets are blasting off to greater heights than before even with chris paul out for much of the year to date. so the rockets fan contention that westbrook doesn't lead to wins can be strengthened.

i don't believe in any of this, really. but the line of thought is not outlandish for a fan of the rockets to have. there are far more outlandish posts / beliefs expressed on this board regarding the thunder on a daily basis.

[bondom34]

i don't agree with it but i don't think it's an outlandish position for fans of houston to have. fans of oklahoma city think westbrook is better than kevin durant and believe that kevin durant threw a playoff series deliberately.

I don't know what you're implying I think here but no it's quite outlandish. Joel Embiid has been a top 3 center this year. He wasn't last year. That doesn't mean he was one last year because he is one this year and its terrible logic that reeks of sour grapes or someone who still won't credit Westbrook for anything

they were unhappy westbrook got mvp as a sixth seed. something rare and unusual. although westbrook was objectively superior individually, the mvp voting has tended to err on the side of the player with more wins in a close race. so houston fans complained that westbrook didn't deserve the mvp because although he put up numbers (i.e.: triple doubles) that didn't translate to team wins.

now the thunder suck and westbrook's been disappointing despite more talent (allegedly) surround him. and the rockets are blasting off to greater heights than before even with chris paul out for much of the year to date. so the rockets fan contention that westbrook doesn't lead to wins can be strengthened.

i don't believe in any of this, really. but the line of thought is not outlandish for a fan of the rockets to have. there are far more outlandish posts / beliefs expressed on this board regarding the thunder on a daily basis.

Not by anyone with half an ounce of logic.

Its an indefensible stance. Curry won mvp in 2015. It doesn't mean he deserves it in 2014 when he objectively wasn't deserving.

[slick_watts]

I don't know what you're implying I think here but no it's quite outlandish. Joel Embiid has been a top 3 center this year. He wasn't last year. That doesn't mean he was one last year because he is one this year and its terrible logic that reeks of sour grapes or someone who still won't credit Westbrook for anything

they were unhappy westbrook got mvp as a sixth seed. something rare and unusual. although westbrook was objectively superior individually, the mvp voting has tended to err on the side of the player with more wins in a close race. so houston fans complained that westbrook didn't deserve the mvp because although he put up numbers (i.e.: triple doubles) that didn't translate to team wins.

now the thunder suck and westbrook's been disappointing despite more talent (allegedly) surround him. and the rockets are blasting off to greater heights than before even with chris paul out for much of the year to date. so the rockets fan contention that westbrook doesn't lead to wins can be strengthened.

i don't believe in any of this, really. but the line of thought is not outlandish for a fan of the rockets to have. there are far more outlandish posts / beliefs expressed on this board regarding the thunder on a daily basis.

Not by anyone with half an ounce of logic.

Its an indefensible stance. Curry won mvp in 2015. It doesn't mean he deserves it in 2014 when he objectively wasn't deserving.

it's not really defensible if you drill down enough since westbrook was better than harden last year, but if you disagree with that premise in the first place (which, many rockets fans do on the basis that houston had more wins thus harden is more valuable), extending it to this season isn't that outlandish.

[bondom34]

they were unhappy westbrook got mvp as a sixth seed. something rare and unusual. although westbrook was objectively superior individually, the mvp voting has tended to err on the side of the player with more wins in a close race. so houston fans complained that westbrook didn't deserve the mvp because although he put up numbers (i.e.: triple doubles) that didn't translate to team wins.

now the thunder suck and westbrook's been disappointing despite more talent (allegedly) surround him. and the rockets are blasting off to greater heights than before even with chris paul out for much of the year to date. so the rockets fan contention that westbrook doesn't lead to wins can be strengthened.

i don't believe in any of this, really. but the line of thought is not outlandish for a fan of the rockets to have. there are far more outlandish posts / beliefs expressed on this board regarding the thunder on a daily basis.

Not by anyone with half an ounce of logic.

Its an indefensible stance. Curry won mvp in 2015. It doesn't mean he deserves it in 2014 when he objectively wasn't deserving.

it's not really defensible if you drill down enough since westbrook was better than harden last year, but if you disagree with that premise in the first place (which, many rockets fans do on the basis that houston had more wins thus harden is more valuable), extending it to this season isn't that outlandish.

It really is. One player is by any measure objectively playing worse than last year on an individual level and one better. It would be arguing Melo was a bad player in 2013 because he's not nearly as good today. Its an entirely illogical stance by anyone unless their entire premise started on the sole ground of not crediting Westbrook either way to being with. Which seems the case.

[slick_watts]

Not by anyone with half an ounce of logic.

Its an indefensible stance. Curry won mvp in 2015. It doesn't mean he deserves it in 2014 when he objectively wasn't deserving.

it's not really defensible if you drill down enough since westbrook was better than harden last year, but if you disagree with that premise in the first place (which, many rockets fans do on the basis that houston had more wins thus harden is more valuable), extending it to this season isn't that outlandish.

It really is. One player is by any measure objectively playing worse than last year on an individual level and one better. It would be arguing Melo was a bad player in 2013 because he's not nearly as good today. Its an entirely illogical stance by anyone unless their entire premise started on the sole ground of not crediting Westbrook either way to being with. Which seems the case.

i'm not sure the gap between westbrook and harden last year was large enough objectively as individual performers to justify this level of outrage. i really think the main difference between them was that westbrook was much less futile on defense. most fans don't even care about defense. christ, there are fans on this board who think kanter was good.

[bondom34]

it's not really defensible if you drill down enough since westbrook was better than harden last year, but if you disagree with that premise in the first place (which, many rockets fans do on the basis that houston had more wins thus harden is more valuable), extending it to this season isn't that outlandish.

It really is. One player is by any measure objectively playing worse than last year on an individual level and one better. It would be arguing Melo was a bad player in 2013 because he's not nearly as good today. Its an entirely illogical stance by anyone unless their entire premise started on the sole ground of not crediting Westbrook either way to being with. Which seems the case.

i'm not sure the gap between westbrook and harden last year was large enough objectively as individual performers to justify this level of outrage. i really think the main difference between them was that westbrook was much less futile on defense. most fans don't even care about defense. christ, there are fans on this board who think kanter was good.

I'm not talking about them and I think you k ow it.

The PC board had Westbrook 4th in POY voting and Harden 8th. It was a pretty large gap in individual play and Hardens only case was being bolstered by a much stronger bench. He had literally no case on an individual basis and over the last few years has been voted as a consistently worse player. And not by OKC fans but others. Using the okc fanbase as a crutch for poor logic here isn't fitting when I'm not even talking about them.

[slick_watts]

It really is. One player is by any measure objectively playing worse than last year on an individual level and one better. It would be arguing Melo was a bad player in 2013 because he's not nearly as good today. Its an entirely illogical stance by anyone unless their entire premise started on the sole ground of not crediting Westbrook either way to being with. Which seems the case.

i'm not sure the gap between westbrook and harden last year was large enough objectively as individual performers to justify this level of outrage. i really think the main difference between them was that westbrook was much less futile on defense. most fans don't even care about defense. christ, there are fans on this board who think kanter was good.

I'm not talking about them and I think you k ow it.

The PC board had Westbrook 4th in POY voting and Harden 8th. It was a pretty large gap in individual play and Hardens only case was being bolstered by a much stronger bench. He had literally no case on an individual basis and over the last few years has been voted as a consistently worse player. And not by OKC fans but others. Using the okc fanbase as a crutch for poor logic here isn't fitting when I'm not even talking about them.

singling out rockets fans as 'salty' or whatever to me is silly since i think any fanbase would generally be treating the situation the same. you think if the situation was reversed, the thunder board and blogosphere wouldn't be rife with "westbrook > harden" propaganda? rockets fans and even mgmt (morey's posts) have been consistent with their stance on james harden. "objectively true" or not, it's not an outlandish thing for a fanbase to believe in. the comparison to the okc fanbase is to show that illogical takes on marginal positions is part of what being a fan is all about.

[bondom34]

i'm not sure the gap between westbrook and harden last year was large enough objectively as individual performers to justify this level of outrage. i really think the main difference between them was that westbrook was much less futile on defense. most fans don't even care about defense. christ, there are fans on this board who think kanter was good.

I'm not talking about them and I think you k ow it.

The PC board had Westbrook 4th in POY voting and Harden 8th. It was a pretty large gap in individual play and Hardens only case was being bolstered by a much stronger bench. He had literally no case on an individual basis and over the last few years has been voted as a consistently worse player. And not by OKC fans but others. Using the okc fanbase as a crutch for poor logic here isn't fitting when I'm not even talking about them.

singling out rockets fans as 'salty' or whatever to me is silly since i think any fanbase would generally be treating the situation the same. you think if the situation was reversed, the thunder board and blogosphere wouldn't be rife with "westbrook > harden" propaganda? rockets fans and even mgmt (morey's posts) have been consistent with their stance on james harden. "objectively true" or not, it's not an outlandish thing for a fanbase to believe in. the comparison to the okc fanbase is to show that illogical takes on marginal positions is part of what being a fan is all about.

Except claiming I'm using some false logic isn't what I've done. One player playing better and one worse means nothing foe last year and its a shot logic
I don't care who you're a fan of. And or not were an OKC fan using that logic you'd call b.s. on it. Just like you do in every other thread except now.

[slick_watts]

Except claiming I'm using some false logic isn't what I've done. One player playing better and one worse means nothing foe last year and its a shot logic
I don't care who you're a fan of. And or not were an OKC fan using that logic you'd call b.s. on it. Just like you do in every other thread except now.

it means the allegations that westbrook's presence is less conducive to winning is strengthened.

[bondom34]

Except claiming I'm using some false logic isn't what I've done. One player playing better and one worse means nothing foe last year and its a shot logic
I don't care who you're a fan of. And or not were an OKC fan using that logic you'd call b.s. on it. Just like you do in every other thread except now.

it means the allegations that westbrook's presence is less conducive to winning is strengthened.

Clearly. Since he's playing objectively worse thats what it means. Especially when he's been more conducive to winning historically. Totally sensible. Except not at all.

[slick_watts]

Except claiming I'm using some false logic isn't what I've done. One player playing better and one worse means nothing foe last year and its a shot logic
I don't care who you're a fan of. And or not were an OKC fan using that logic you'd call b.s. on it. Just like you do in every other thread except now.

it means the allegations that westbrook's presence is less conducive to winning is strengthened.

Clearly. Since he's playing objectively worse thats what it means. Especially when he's been more conducive to winning historically. Totally sensible. Except not at all.

the disconnect here is whether or not harden was better last year. you're not going to convince the average rockets fan, it's too close. and the whole argument was based on wins. operating from that assumption, the reasoning is consistent. they're just wrong that harden was better last year, and wrong to read into team wins and losses this way.

[Dadouv47]

Those arguments are silly. Westbrook was better than Harden last year and won the 2016-2017 MVP, period. What he's doing in 2017-2018 has nothing to do with anything his detractors could say. He was better than Harden in any other year (except 2014-2015 season).

The only thing they may have a point if he keeps playing like that is that Westbrook is not taking the great (and maybe only) opportunity he has to show he can win a championship as the main leader of the team (which doesn't mean he's not a ''winning'' player). But yeah so far he's losing a great opportunity

[bondom34]

it means the allegations that westbrook's presence is less conducive to winning is strengthened.

Clearly. Since he's playing objectively worse thats what it means. Especially when he's been more conducive to winning historically. Totally sensible. Except not at all.

the disconnect here is whether or not harden was better last year. you're not going to convince the average rockets fan, it's too close. and the whole argument was based on wins. operating from that assumption, the reasoning is consistent. they're just wrong that harden was better last year, and wrong to read into team wins and losses this way.

So you agree its entirely illogical then. In that case were on the same page. Hence what I would call salty.

That said the Dubs fans are just weird about it bit I assume that's from the Durant stuff.

[slick_watts]

Clearly. Since he's playing objectively worse thats what it means. Especially when he's been more conducive to winning historically. Totally sensible. Except not at all.

the disconnect here is whether or not harden was better last year. you're not going to convince the average rockets fan, it's too close. and the whole argument was based on wins. operating from that assumption, the reasoning is consistent. they're just wrong that harden was better last year, and wrong to read into team wins and losses this way.

So you agree its entirely illogical then. In that case were on the same page. Hence what I would call salty.

That said the Dubs fans are just weird about it bit I assume that's from the Durant stuff.

i just don't find it particularly offensive and i'm not sure why you do. would any fanbase not be bragging in houston's position?