Oklahoma City Thunder Regular Season 2015-2016 Part 2

[slick_watts]

You're calling bull on what exactly? I didn't say the shots were better distributed. I'm saying, hypothetically, if Donovan ends up with the same Ortg, but in a way that that makes us less reliant on the shotmaking of KD and Russ I'll be happy.

we don't have the talent to do that anymore. who are they going to be reliant on besides them? dion? anthony morrow seems to be marginalized in this system / coaching staff which is unfortunate since of all the players he's the guy who could probably take some of the pressure off in 4Q. as it stands, morrow's usage in fourth quarters sharing the court with durant and westbrook this year is like 5%. he's invisible.

[Cuban_Linx]

You're calling bull on what exactly? I didn't say the shots were better distributed. I'm saying, hypothetically, if Donovan ends up with the same Ortg, but in a way that that makes us less reliant on the shotmaking of KD and Russ I'll be happy.

we don't have the talent to do that anymore. who are they going to be reliant on besides them? dion? anthony morrow seems to be marginalized in this system / coaching staff which is unfortunate since of all the players he's the guy who could probably take some of the pressure off in 4Q. as it stands, morrow's usage in fourth quarters sharing the court with durant and westbrook this year is like 5%. he's invisible.

I don't really agree with the talent part. On paper this seemed like a very talented cast.

I had some hope for Dion at first, but that's obviously never gonna pan out so forget about him. But for the rest, Kanter and Morrow could be very useful if they got more minutes alongside Russ. Payne could even rund the 2nd unit and set them up if it's true he can run a PnR. DJ was supposed to be this solid backup PG who once was actually good at setting up teammates, but he's not doing much more than hit 3s. Singler, and I don't even want to bring him up, but even he once looked like a solid backup 3 who could space the floor and hit 3s at a 40% clip.

I don't know why all this talent isn't producing as much as I'd hope, but when you look at the names on this team it looks like KD and Russ should have more offensive help than ever. If Donovan can figure that out it'd be great.

[Pillendreher]

I don't know why all this talent isn't producing as much as I'd hope, but when you look at the names on this team it looks like KD and Russ should have more offensive help than ever.

This. At least on paper this is the best roster they've ever had. It's up to them team and the coaching staff to make the most out of it. Which means less Dion, more Morrow, more Roberson, more Kanter and maybe more Payne and McGary. It might take Donovan longer to see it, but Singler is finally out of the rotation - let's hope he finds a role for Dion without damage to the team.

[slick_watts]

I don't know why all this talent isn't producing as much as I'd hope, but when you look at the names on this team it looks like KD and Russ should have more offensive help than ever.

This. At least on paper this is the best roster they've ever had. It's up to them team and the coaching staff to make the most out of it. Which means less Dion, more Morrow, more Roberson, more Kanter and maybe more Payne and McGary. It might take Donovan longer to see it, but Singler is finally out of the rotation - let's hope he finds a role for Dion without damage to the team.

except it isn't. it never was. reggie jackson alone would be superior to anyone on the team offensively aside from westbrook and durant. 2012-13 kevin martin, same. james harden? do we even have to go there? enes kanter is efficient but very limited as to how he can score. dion waiters is one of the worst offensive sg in the nba. morrow is fantastic-- but is being used improperly / not enough. payne and mcgary are not high level role players. and it's not helping that serge ibaka's game offensively has been strategically unsound to boot.

the biggest issue is that westbrook and durant are the only players on the team who can create offense and this was known prior to the season. yes, despite the sensationalism surrounding waiters' preseason-- he's still awful.

the way i see it, the team has a couple things they can do to make the offense better re: the role players:

a) change ibaka's approach. either he has to shoot more threes, or he has to be near the rim more. his current shot distribution is unacceptable. 40% of his attempts from 16-23 feet is taking a step back.

b) eliminate or severely curtail waiters' minutes. with westbrook and durant off the court waiters is at 30% usage, nearly, and is below 50% ts.

c) involve anthony morrow more. get him three point attempts. play small with him in the game.

kanter can be useful when he's in with westbrook. but, and i know you guys hate to hear this, kanter's presence will come a severe cost defensively.

[Cuban_Linx]

I don't know why all this talent isn't producing as much as I'd hope, but when you look at the names on this team it looks like KD and Russ should have more offensive help than ever.

This. At least on paper this is the best roster they've ever had. It's up to them team and the coaching staff to make the most out of it. Which means less Dion, more Morrow, more Roberson, more Kanter and maybe more Payne and McGary. It might take Donovan longer to see it, but Singler is finally out of the rotation - let's hope he finds a role for Dion without damage to the team.

except it isn't. it never was. reggie jackson alone would be superior to anyone on the team offensively aside from westbrook and durant. 2012-13 kevin martin, same. james harden? do we even have to go there? enes kanter is efficient but very limited as to how he can score. dion waiters is one of the worst offensive sg in the nba. morrow is fantastic-- but is being used improperly / not enough. payne and mcgary are not high level role players. and it's not helping that serge ibaka's game offensively has been strategically unsound to boot.

the biggest issue is that westbrook and durant are the only players on the team who can create offense and this was known prior to the season. yes, despite the sensationalism surrounding waiters' preseason-- he's still awful.

the way i see it, the team has a couple things they can do to make the offense better re: the role players:

a) change ibaka's approach. either he has to shoot more threes, or he has to be near the rim more. his current shot distribution is unacceptable. 40% of his attempts from 16-23 feet is taking a step back.

b) eliminate or severely curtail waiters' minutes. with westbrook and durant off the court waiters is at 30% usage, nearly, and is below 50% ts.

c) involve anthony morrow more. get him three point attempts. play small with him in the game.

kanter can be useful when he's in with westbrook. but, and i know you guys hate to hear this, kanter's presence will come a severe cost defensively.

I definitely mean since Harden left no question. Otherwise, I thought the collective efforts of DJ-Waiters/Morrow-Singler-Collison-Kanter would outweigh what Reggie brought off the bench on his own. Especially with Augustin's rep as a great backup point. As for K-Mart, he's not much better off the bench than Morrow was last year. Not crazy to think Morrow + all those other dudes would outweigh his impact.

As for Kanter's defensive, I think people know this already. He can try all he wants, but RPM and BPM still paint him as one of the worst defenders in the league. The issue is that if we're gonna use him, lets at least use him in the best way possible. Having him out there with the no D 2nd unit only exposes his defense while only allowing him to make an offensive contribution by crashing the boards and getting the occassional post up. By pairing him up with Russ we can at least make sure he's giving us more points than he's giving up.

[slick_watts]

Especially with Augustin's rep as a great backup point. As for K-Mart, he's not much better off the bench than Morrow was last year. Not crazy to think Morrow + all those other dudes would outweigh his impact.

nick's decline + waiters was going to outweigh anything kanter or morrow could bring with that group. i think this board and a lot of thunder fans in general are seriously underestimating watiers' negative effect on the team when he's not hidden with westbrook and durant on the court.

[bondom34]

Especially with Augustin's rep as a great backup point. As for K-Mart, he's not much better off the bench than Morrow was last year. Not crazy to think Morrow + all those other dudes would outweigh his impact.

nick's decline + waiters was going to outweigh anything kanter or morrow could bring with that group. i think this board and a lot of thunder fans in general are seriously underestimating watiers' negative effect on the team when he's not hidden with westbrook and durant on the court.

FWIW, I'm stepping on board of the "I'm not underestimating that" train. He's awful, and I want him as reduced as possible. He almost has to play due to lack of any other body on the roster, but give at least 4 mpg each to Roberson and Morrow and cut 8-10 of his.

[KD35Brah]

Mitch was supposed to be a big part of the bench. A solid 8 and 8 off the bench would have been huge.

[tleikheen]

As for Kanter's defensive, I think people know this already. He can try all he wants, but RPM and BPM still paint him as one of the worst defenders in the league.

Id really like to see if Kanter's RPM and BPM get better playing alongside Ibaka and Durant on the frontline AND see if Adams RPM and BPM stays as high playing alongside Collison,Waiters and Augustin.
No matter how some of these guys try to paint this as a one on one defense league while ignoring who plays alongside you or in front of you, it does matter who your playing with

[bondom34]

As for Kanter's defensive, I think people know this already. He can try all he wants, but RPM and BPM still paint him as one of the worst defenders in the league.

Id really like to see if Kanter's RPM and BPM get better playing alongside Ibaka and Durant on the frontline AND see if Adams RPM and BPM stays as high playing alongside Collison,Waiters and Augustin.
No matter how some of these guys try to paint this as a one on one defense league while ignoring who plays alongside you or in front of you, it does matter who your playing with

I've said he's improved, but there's a reason every lineup with Kanter has a much worse D rating than the exact same with Adams.

[Thabo Sefolosha]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/WTLC/status/675883456920875009[/tweet]

Our time guys! Our time! Our time to shine!

[NaturalThunder]

I know the Bucks have talent, and I know it was the second night of a road back-to-bak, but I'm still shocked the Warriors streak ended in semi-decisive fashion to a 9-15 team.

[mattao313]

This. At least on paper this is the best roster they've ever had. It's up to them team and the coaching staff to make the most out of it. Which means less Dion, more Morrow, more Roberson, more Kanter and maybe more Payne and McGary. It might take Donovan longer to see it, but Singler is finally out of the rotation - let's hope he finds a role for Dion without damage to the team.

except it isn't. it never was. reggie jackson alone would be superior to anyone on the team offensively aside from westbrook and durant. 2012-13 kevin martin, same. james harden? do we even have to go there? enes kanter is efficient but very limited as to how he can score. dion waiters is one of the worst offensive sg in the nba. morrow is fantastic-- but is being used improperly / not enough. payne and mcgary are not high level role players. and it's not helping that serge ibaka's game offensively has been strategically unsound to boot.

the biggest issue is that westbrook and durant are the only players on the team who can create offense and this was known prior to the season. yes, despite the sensationalism surrounding waiters' preseason-- he's still awful.

the way i see it, the team has a couple things they can do to make the offense better re: the role players:

a) change ibaka's approach. either he has to shoot more threes, or he has to be near the rim more. his current shot distribution is unacceptable. 40% of his attempts from 16-23 feet is taking a step back.

b) eliminate or severely curtail waiters' minutes. with westbrook and durant off the court waiters is at 30% usage, nearly, and is below 50% ts.

c) involve anthony morrow more. get him three point attempts. play small with him in the game.

kanter can be useful when he's in with westbrook. but, and i know you guys hate to hear this, kanter's presence will come a severe cost defensively.

I definitely mean since Harden left no question. Otherwise, I thought the collective efforts of DJ-Waiters/Morrow-Singler-Collison-Kanter would outweigh what Reggie brought off the bench on his own. Especially with Augustin's rep as a great backup point. As for K-Mart, he's not much better off the bench than Morrow was last year. Not crazy to think Morrow + all those other dudes would outweigh his impact.

As for Kanter's defensive, I think people know this already. He can try all he wants, but RPM and BPM still paint him as one of the worst defenders in the league. The issue is that if we're gonna use him, lets at least use him in the best way possible. Having him out there with the no D 2nd unit only exposes his defense while only allowing him to make an offensive contribution by crashing the boards and getting the occassional post up. By pairing him up with Russ we can at least make sure he's giving us more points than he's giving up.

DJ Augustin isn't a very good back up imo. He was terrible in Detroit last season as the back up. he only played well when he got big minutes and lots of freedom on offense.

[bondom34]

I know the Bucks have talent, and I know it was the second night of a road back-to-bak, but I'm still shocked the Warriors streak ended in semi-decisive fashion to a 9-15 team.

I am and I'm not. I kinda thought it would just be some random game, not the Clips/Indy/big name games. Don't know why, just always seems that way.

[Pillendreher]

I don't know why all this talent isn't producing as much as I'd hope, but when you look at the names on this team it looks like KD and Russ should have more offensive help than ever.

This. At least on paper this is the best roster they've ever had. It's up to them team and the coaching staff to make the most out of it. Which means less Dion, more Morrow, more Roberson, more Kanter and maybe more Payne and McGary. It might take Donovan longer to see it, but Singler is finally out of the rotation - let's hope he finds a role for Dion without damage to the team.

except it isn't. it never was. reggie jackson alone would be superior to anyone on the team offensively aside from westbrook and durant. 2012-13 kevin martin, same. james harden? do we even have to go there? enes kanter is efficient but very limited as to how he can score. dion waiters is one of the worst offensive sg in the nba. morrow is fantastic-- but is being used improperly / not enough. payne and mcgary are not high level role players. and it's not helping that serge ibaka's game offensively has been strategically unsound to boot.

Oh, it clearly is. We're talking about the team as a whole. Sure, Harden was better than anyhting we have right now and maybe Reggie as well. But what was there other than that? The rest of the team is clearly better than anything this team has ever had.

the biggest issue is that westbrook and durant are the only players on the team who can create offense and this was known prior to the season. yes, despite the sensationalism surrounding waiters' preseason-- he's still awful.

Yeah, we agree on that. That's why I want minutes for Payne. Augustin is a nice backup pg, but at the moment he's just a jump shooter and we need to get the ball out of Waiters' hands.

the way i see it, the team has a couple things they can do to make the offense better re: the role players:

a) change ibaka's approach. either he has to shoot more threes, or he has to be near the rim more. his current shot distribution is unacceptable. 40% of his attempts from 16-23 feet is taking a step back.

Yeah, I'm with you on that. He's a good midrange shooter, but him just standing there near the 3pt-line is stupid. Let him take 3s if he has that range.

b) eliminate or severely curtail waiters' minutes. with westbrook and durant off the court waiters is at 30% usage, nearly, and is below 50% ts.

+1

c) involve anthony morrow more. get him three point attempts. play small with him in the game.

+1

kanter can be useful when he's in with westbrook. but, and i know you guys hate to hear this, kanter's presence will come a severe cost defensively.

Kanter has been better defensively though. Not great, but not that terrible.

[Zagor]

I want to see Russ-Morrow-Singler-Durant-Ibaka lineup.
Or DJ/Payne-Morrow-Waiters-Durant-Ibaka.....or Russ-Waiters-Morrow-Singler-Adams

Donovan needs to mix more.
And some things are not his fault. Roster isn't balanced. Too many players who depend on others to create. With very poor fundamentals.
And it seems Donovan doesn't want to create some actions with Kanter in the post. He should be center of many things....but Donovan prefers guards.

[Pillendreher]

No, no, no. No more Singler. Cut it out

[bondom34]

If Singler gets another minute of real time with no good reason (foul trouble/injury) I will flip.

[Marcus50]

I have tried to be positive about Kanters defense and at least this year he is trying to get back but a duck in traffic that's trying hard is still a.duck in traffic. His defense remains terrible and you can try to blame it on who he plays with and Donovan lineups but the awful reality is OKC has saddled itself with perhaps the most bloated contract in the league that is going to be very difficult to trade.

[Marcus50]

I have tried to be positive about Kanters defense and at least this year he is trying to get back but a duck in traffic that's trying hard is still a.duck in traffic. His defense remains terrible and you can try to blame it on who he plays with and Donovan lineups but the awful reality is OKC has saddled itself with perhaps the most bloated contract in the league that is going to be very difficult to trade.