OKC Thunder Offseason 2015

[bondom34]

Any interest in DeMar DeRozan over here?

I'll give you Dion Waiter and Steve Novak for him. You might even get me to throw in Perry Jones. If you want more than that not interested. DeRozan would be a slight upgrade to Waiters, but not enough to part with anything I'd consider valuable. I definitely don't think I'd give enough to get Toronto to move him as he has become a very overrated fan favorite for them.

I don't know why you wouldn't give any value for him, he's an all-star caliber player who really picked up his shooting after his injury. He's a coaches player and will always be working to get better. With that being said, I would consider the Waiters/PJ3 deal if we are in desperate need of cap relief if we do strike something with LMA/Mathews and need cap ASAP, if theirs nothing better I'd do DD for Waiters, PJ3 and a future 1st or two, but nothing lower then that and only for those circumstances. Maybe we're just not the best trading partners for DD.

Yeah, OKC wouldn't give a first for him, he doesn't fit the roster (and they don't have picks to give). I'd do the Waiters/PJ deal but no picks involved.

[Kizz Fastfists]

I don't know why you wouldn't give any value for him, he's an all-star caliber player who really picked up his shooting after his injury. He's a coaches player and will always be working to get better. With that being said, I would consider the Waiters/PJ3 deal if we are in desperate need of cap relief if we do strike something with LMA/Mathews and need cap ASAP, if theirs nothing better I'd do DD for Waiters, PJ3 and a future 1st or two, but nothing lower then that and only for those circumstances. Maybe we're just not the best trading partners for DD.

What value do you think OKC could give? They aren't trading Russ, KD, Ibaka or Adams. DD does not fit in with what OKC needs. If where a 35% 3pt shooter then we would be having a whole different conversation. He is an inefficient scorer, TS% of 51-53% for his career. He would be a slight upgrade from Dion Waiters, but Waiters should be buried on the end of the bench. DeRozan needs the ball in his hands to be effective and with Russ and KD that isn't going to happen. I'd much rather have Terrance Ross than DeRozan. Ross fits what OKC needs much better.

[Kizz Fastfists]

Yeah, OKC wouldn't give a first for him, he doesn't fit the roster (and they don't have picks to give). I'd do the Waiters/PJ deal but no picks involved.

I'd do that, but since they just gave away Ridnoir they would have to include Novak to make the salaries match. They can trade Novak to Toronto on July 1st. I'd much rather have Terrance Ross for Waiters and PJ though, if Toronto would do that.

[bondom34]

Yeah, OKC wouldn't give a first for him, he doesn't fit the roster (and they don't have picks to give). I'd do the Waiters/PJ deal but no picks involved.

I'd do that, but since they just gave away Ridnoir they would have to include Novak to make the salaries match. They can trade Novak to Toronto on July 1st. I'd much rather have Terrance Ross for Waiters and PJ though, if Toronto would do that.

Yeah, I'd do that too, I would have even done something during the draft involving a possible pick swap, but not now as I like Payne.

[Marcus50]

I don't know why you wouldn't give any value for him, he's an all-star caliber player who really picked up his shooting after his injury. He's a coaches player and will always be working to get better. With that being said, I would consider the Waiters/PJ3 deal if we are in desperate need of cap relief if we do strike something with LMA/Mathews and need cap ASAP, if theirs nothing better I'd do DD for Waiters, PJ3 and a future 1st or two, but nothing lower then that and only for those circumstances. Maybe we're just not the best trading partners for DD.

What value do you think OKC could give? They aren't trading Russ, KD, Ibaka or Adams. DD does not fit in with what OKC needs. If where a 35% 3pt shooter then we would be having a whole different conversation. He is an inefficient scorer, TS% of 51-53% for his career. He would be a slight upgrade from Dion Waiters, but Waiters should be buried on the end of the bench. DeRozan needs the ball in his hands to be effective and with Russ and KD that isn't going to happen. I'd much rather have Terrance Ross than DeRozan. Ross fits what OKC needs much better.

If they sign Kanter for 15m surely Adams cannot be retained when he comes off his rookie contract so why not get max value for him. This trade is not it but a good 2 way SG is worth a look.

[Andre Roberstan]

I don't know why you wouldn't give any value for him, he's an all-star caliber player who really picked up his shooting after his injury. He's a coaches player and will always be working to get better. With that being said, I would consider the Waiters/PJ3 deal if we are in desperate need of cap relief if we do strike something with LMA/Mathews and need cap ASAP, if theirs nothing better I'd do DD for Waiters, PJ3 and a future 1st or two, but nothing lower then that and only for those circumstances. Maybe we're just not the best trading partners for DD.

What value do you think OKC could give? They aren't trading Russ, KD, Ibaka or Adams. DD does not fit in with what OKC needs. If where a 35% 3pt shooter then we would be having a whole different conversation. He is an inefficient scorer, TS% of 51-53% for his career. He would be a slight upgrade from Dion Waiters, but Waiters should be buried on the end of the bench. DeRozan needs the ball in his hands to be effective and with Russ and KD that isn't going to happen. I'd much rather have Terrance Ross than DeRozan. Ross fits what OKC needs much better.

If they sign Kanter for 15m surely Adams cannot be retained when he comes off his rookie contract so why not get max value for him. This trade is not it but a good 2 way SG is worth a look.

Unless Kanter improves his defense I'd expect Adams to be more likely to be a long-term piece. Kanter on a decent contract will be a very tradeable piece in a year or two if it comes to that.

[bondom34]

I don't know why you wouldn't give any value for him, he's an all-star caliber player who really picked up his shooting after his injury. He's a coaches player and will always be working to get better. With that being said, I would consider the Waiters/PJ3 deal if we are in desperate need of cap relief if we do strike something with LMA/Mathews and need cap ASAP, if theirs nothing better I'd do DD for Waiters, PJ3 and a future 1st or two, but nothing lower then that and only for those circumstances. Maybe we're just not the best trading partners for DD.

What value do you think OKC could give? They aren't trading Russ, KD, Ibaka or Adams. DD does not fit in with what OKC needs. If where a 35% 3pt shooter then we would be having a whole different conversation. He is an inefficient scorer, TS% of 51-53% for his career. He would be a slight upgrade from Dion Waiters, but Waiters should be buried on the end of the bench. DeRozan needs the ball in his hands to be effective and with Russ and KD that isn't going to happen. I'd much rather have Terrance Ross than DeRozan. Ross fits what OKC needs much better.

If they sign Kanter for 15m surely Adams cannot be retained when he comes off his rookie contract so why not get max value for him. This trade is not it but a good 2 way SG is worth a look.

Yeah, I expect Adams to be kept over Kanter if its a choice long term. And Derozan isn't a good 2 way SG. He's a slightly above average 1 way SG.

[Marcus50]

http://blogs.mercurynews.com/kawakami/2015/06/29/2015-defense/#disqus_thread

For me Adams is the keeper but Presti seems set on Kanter. Worth a read for Kanters defensive stats. We are going to pay this guy but would not pay Harden SMH

[Andre Roberstan]

http://blogs.mercurynews.com/kawakami/2015/06/29/2015-defense/#disqus_thread

For me Adams is the keeper but Presti seems set on Kanter. Worth a read for Kanters defensive stats. We are going to pay this guy but would not pay Harden SMH

False equivalency—two completely different situations. The cap jump alone makes a huge difference. Also Kanter would be the second center—it's not an either/or choice at this point.

FWIW I wrote a huge rant about how the Harden trade was defensible at the time on Reddit. http://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/38eopd/what_is_an_unpopular_opinion_you_have_in_terms_of/cruip6t

I know there are plenty of people who disagree, but I think hindsight has been far worse on the Harden trade than it was at the time.

[bondom34]

http://blogs.mercurynews.com/kawakami/2015/06/29/2015-defense/#disqus_thread

For me Adams is the keeper but Presti seems set on Kanter. Worth a read for Kanters defensive stats. We are going to pay this guy but would not pay Harden SMH

False equivalency—two completely different situations. The cap jump alone makes a huge difference. Also Kanter would be the second center—it's not an either/or choice at this point.

FWIW I wrote a huge rant about how the Harden trade was defensible at the time on Reddit. http://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/38eopd/what_is_an_unpopular_opinion_you_have_in_terms_of/cruip6t

I know there are plenty of people who disagree, but I think hindsight has been far worse on the Harden trade than it was at the time.

Honestly I agree and I think most Thunder fans do. From everything I've seen, most outrage on Harden is from non-Thunder fans. I mean in a perfect world it wouldn't have happened, but its far from a disaster.

And agree on Adams, this isn't an either/or to me.

[Balkman32]

I don't know why you wouldn't give any value for him, he's an all-star caliber player who really picked up his shooting after his injury. He's a coaches player and will always be working to get better. With that being said, I would consider the Waiters/PJ3 deal if we are in desperate need of cap relief if we do strike something with LMA/Mathews and need cap ASAP, if theirs nothing better I'd do DD for Waiters, PJ3 and a future 1st or two, but nothing lower then that and only for those circumstances. Maybe we're just not the best trading partners for DD.

What value do you think OKC could give? They aren't trading Russ, KD, Ibaka or Adams. DD does not fit in with what OKC needs. If where a 35% 3pt shooter then we would be having a whole different conversation. He is an inefficient scorer, TS% of 51-53% for his career. He would be a slight upgrade from Dion Waiters, but Waiters should be buried on the end of the bench. DeRozan needs the ball in his hands to be effective and with Russ and KD that isn't going to happen. I'd much rather have Terrance Ross than DeRozan. Ross fits what OKC needs much better.

If they sign Kanter for 15m surely Adams cannot be retained when he comes off his rookie contract so why not get max value for him. This trade is not it but a good 2 way SG is worth a look.

I think Adams is the future at Center.

[Andre Roberstan]

Thunder and Kanter to meet July 1:

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/238486/Enes-Kanter-Thunder-Set-Meeting-To-Discuss-3-4-Year-Deal-In-Early-Window

[bondom34]

Thunder and Kanter to meet July 1:

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/238486/Enes-Kanter-Thunder-Set-Meeting-To-Discuss-3-4-Year-Deal-In-Early-Window

Not thrilled w/ the money, but hey gotta keep him.

[Andre Roberstan]

Thunder and Kanter to meet July 1:

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/238486/Enes-Kanter-Thunder-Set-Meeting-To-Discuss-3-4-Year-Deal-In-Early-Window

Not thrilled w/ the money, but hey gotta keep him.

Agreed, though I'll reserve judgment until we see what he gets. If he does get max money I still think it's a moveable contract with the cap jumps.

[bondom34]

Thunder and Kanter to meet July 1:

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/238486/Enes-Kanter-Thunder-Set-Meeting-To-Discuss-3-4-Year-Deal-In-Early-Window

Not thrilled w/ the money, but hey gotta keep him.

Agreed, though I'll reserve judgment until we see what he gets. If he does get max money I still think it's a moveable contract with the cap jumps.

Yeah, should be. That said, I think in the end there's gonna be a lockout, because I'm not seeing any way it could be justifiable for a bunch of guys who really are role players to make over 15 mil a year. They're saying Afflalo is getting 12, and that's insane, Derozan for a 25 mil max is just bizarre. I think they're gonna change something in the CBA before 2017.

[Grolgar]

While paying Kanter the max is not ideal (maybe it's only a max with defensive incentives! ), it's not like it really matters right now. We can't spend money on free agents either way. The only people this matters to is the richy owners paying the contract. Like others have said, lets get him signed, work on his defense, and then trade him on a season or two if need be.

[Grolgar]

But, yeah, LOL at the people talking about $8-10 million contracts.

[RealityIsDemar]

I don't know why you wouldn't give any value for him, he's an all-star caliber player who really picked up his shooting after his injury. He's a coaches player and will always be working to get better. With that being said, I would consider the Waiters/PJ3 deal if we are in desperate need of cap relief if we do strike something with LMA/Mathews and need cap ASAP, if theirs nothing better I'd do DD for Waiters, PJ3 and a future 1st or two, but nothing lower then that and only for those circumstances. Maybe we're just not the best trading partners for DD.

What value do you think OKC could give? They aren't trading Russ, KD, Ibaka or Adams. DD does not fit in with what OKC needs. If where a 35% 3pt shooter then we would be having a whole different conversation. He is an inefficient scorer, TS% of 51-53% for his career. He would be a slight upgrade from Dion Waiters, but Waiters should be buried on the end of the bench. DeRozan needs the ball in his hands to be effective and with Russ and KD that isn't going to happen. I'd much rather have Terrance Ross than DeRozan. Ross fits what OKC needs much better.

Ross is definitely available, but we're not interested in Waiters really, the idea would be to trade DeRozan if we have deals lined up with big FAs. We wouldn't trade garbage for Ross though, he is garbage but garbage with potential who showed what he could do then lost it. We'd need some sort of sweetener which is why I don't think TOR and OKC are good trade partners.

[Pillendreher]

I'd think the salaries are going to be even higher in the future. If they keep them at their current level, all that money is going into the owner's pocket and I don't see the players agreeing to that.

[spearsy23]

I'd pay Kanter whatever it takes. If he gives you exactly what he gave you last year he's Al Jefferson, Jefferson has always had positive value.