2017 OKC Thunder Trade Discussion

[ThunderBolt]

Tim Hardaway Jr will be a restricted free agent. I'm reading that Atlanta probably won't be able to keep him. Is this the kind of guy Presti would target if we got rid of enough cap space?

You're going to clear max cap space and then offer it to Hardaway Jr in hopes that Atlanta doesn't match? Even after Atlanta gives Millsap his max they can still give Hardaway the max without worrying about hitting the tax line. The only way they let Hardaway go is if they lose Millsap and trade Howard to go into a complete rebuild around Schroder.

Last month rumors were that he was being shopped for two second round picks. He's played well as of late. I don't think he's an all star but I think he is a solid player. I was reading on the Atlanta boards that they hope to sign to something like a 5 year $80 million deal. Let's say we could get him at that price via UFA or trade. Would dumping Kanter and other pieces clear enough space or would we still have to drop two out of our big 4? Maybe dump Kanter and singler.

[spearsy23]

MKG should qualify as well. He shoots free throws better than Andre but his 3pt percentage is ....WOW. 12.5% on the year. He makes Andre look like a decent shooter in comparison. I think Andre will get somewhere in the 12 mill per year range. He will take a discount just like everyone else.

I can't make heads or tails of what will happen this trade deadline because Presti is so cryptic. However, if Domantas or Alex are traded, I will be shocked. Forget shocked, I will eat a shoe. I'm almost certain the 3 main guys are morrow, cam, and Andre. The acquired player will probably be one player in the 10-12 million dollar range or a few cheap guys.

Like this: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2693030-free-trade-nba-deals-that-could-jolt-the-playoff-race

Kudos to the author of that article. They know Presti as well as he knows himself.

If we pulled that deal off I'd be ecstatic. I think he's way overvaluing cam but somebody get vlade on the phone. A bench of collison/mclemore/abrines/grant/Kanter goes from one of the worst in the league to top ten IMO.

Mclemore has bust written all over him. But other than that, that should be considered an upgrade.

I don't disagree but even at bust status he can hit an open three and is better than cam/morrow/singler

[hardenASG13]

Roberson should be first team defense. He has to have some value to someone.


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Can you name a comparable player (that goes unguarded, can't shoot and hits 30%from the line) who is in the rotation or even on the roster for another playoff team....or I guess any team for that matter? I'm not talking about bad shooters, who take nba looks, but really bad ones like robes, who gets robes looks (what other guys consistently get the looks he gets?!) And he still can't hit them, or often times even come close! When he is willing to shoot the ball, it's like he just flings it really high towards the basket and hopes for the best.

Tony Allen and luc mbah a moute.

Tony allen is a much more competent offensive player than roberson.....I can't speak much on muah a moute as I haven't seen a ton of him, but isn't he viewed as a position that needs upgrading for the clips? Also he's playing alongside major firepower when that roster is healthy. And that is 2 guys, they aren't highly sought after or common. What's the market for mbah a moute?

[spearsy23]

Can you name a comparable player (that goes unguarded, can't shoot and hits 30%from the line) who is in the rotation or even on the roster for another playoff team....or I guess any team for that matter? I'm not talking about bad shooters, who take nba looks, but really bad ones like robes, who gets robes looks (what other guys consistently get the looks he gets?!) And he still can't hit them, or often times even come close! When he is willing to shoot the ball, it's like he just flings it really high towards the basket and hopes for the best.

Tony Allen and luc mbah a moute.

Tony allen is a much more competent offensive player than roberson.....I can't speak much on muah a moute as I haven't seen a ton of him, but isn't he viewed as a position that needs upgrading for the clips? Also he's playing alongside major firepower when that roster is healthy. And that is 2 guys, they aren't highly sought after or common. What's the market for mbah a moute?

Goalposts be shifting.

[bondom34]

Clearly Allen's 28 percent 3 point shooting is much more competent than Roberson's 26. On fewer attempts for Allen. Oh, and his 4 extra ppg on 3 extra shots.

[hardenASG13]

Clearly Allen's 28 percent 3 point shooting is much more competent than Roberson's 26. On fewer attempts for Allen. Oh, and his 4 extra ppg on 3 extra shots.

He doesn't get robes looks and is covered by defense.....watch him play basketball, he's alot better on offense. No stats, just watch the guy play. What's his market btw? If he got looks robes gets he'd shoot a higher percentage bc he's a confident basketball player. He's by no means a guy that's awesome on offense, but he is respected by the defense, while robes isnt.....that's a problem for a basketball team if you've ever played

[bondom34]

Clearly Allen's 28 percent 3 point shooting is much more competent than Roberson's 26. On fewer attempts for Allen. Oh, and his 4 extra ppg on 3 extra shots.

He doesn't get robes looks and is covered by defense.....watch him play basketball, he's alot better on offense. No stats, just watch the guy play. What's his market btw? If he got looks robes gets he'd shoot a higher percentage bc he's a confident basketball player. He's by no means a guy that's awesome on offense, but he is respected by the defense, while robes isnt.....that's a problem for a basketball team if you've ever played

"No stats, just watch the guy play"

Or you could actually use reality.

Allen's taking 28 percent of his 3s wide open
http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/2754/shots-dash/

Robes 23 percent wide open
http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/203460/shots-dash/

Reality be shifting too.

[hardenASG13]

Again it's not a stats thing....when allen is open, as bad offensive wings are when the stars draw doubles, the defense will actually show him the respect of trying to recover. They don't even bother with roberson. That's a big difference, no stats, you gotta watch and understand bball. And again the fact that you are debating this is beside the point, which is the guys you are comparing roberson to here are not sought after. I don't think see him having much value to anyone in a trade....hope I'm wrong

[bondom34]

Again it's not a stats thing....when allen is open, as bad offensive wings are when the stars draw doubles, the defense will actually show him the respect of trying to recover. They don't even bother with roberson. That's a big difference, no stats, you gotta watch and understand bball. And again the fact that you are debating this is beside the point, which is the guys you are comparing roberson to here are not sought after. I don't think see him having much value to anyone in a trade....hope I'm wrong

So Tony Allen. The guy who shut down Kevin Durant. Is not in any way sought after? Yeah, you don't see it but people in the NBA do.

Guess what teams win titles? Good defensive ones. Guess which ones don't. Ones with a bunch of terrible defenders.

[hardenASG13]

Again it's not a stats thing....when allen is open, as bad offensive wings are when the stars draw doubles, the defense will actually show him the respect of trying to recover. They don't even bother with roberson. That's a big difference, no stats, you gotta watch and understand bball. And again the fact that you are debating this is beside the point, which is the guys you are comparing roberson to here are not sought after. I don't think see him having much value to anyone in a trade....hope I'm wrong

So Tony Allen. The guy who shut down Kevin Durant. Is not in any way sought after? Yeah, you don't see it but people in the NBA do.

Guess what teams win titles? Good defensive ones. Guess which ones don't. Ones with a bunch of terrible defenders.

We'll he can't shut him down anymore, and again I see him as night and day better than roberson on offense. But this isn't a tony/roberson comparison, I'm just saying not many like roberson in the league that have no offense, even TA is alot better. Theres a reason for that. And yes good defensive teams do win titles, but they are also full of good offensively players, like gsw,cleveland,Miamis teams, the spurs, etc. Even the pistons team that won all could shoot on the wings.Who did/do any of those teams play who cant play respectable offense as a wing?

[Bergmaniac]

Again it's not a stats thing....when allen is open, as bad offensive wings are when the stars draw doubles, the defense will actually show him the respect of trying to recover. They don't even bother with roberson. That's a big difference, no stats, you gotta watch and understand bball. And again the fact that you are debating this is beside the point, which is the guys you are comparing roberson to here are not sought after. I don't think see him having much value to anyone in a trade....hope I'm wrong

So Tony Allen. The guy who shut down Kevin Durant. Is not in any way sought after? Yeah, you don't see it but people in the NBA do.

Tony Allen is paid 5 mln. per year. That's peanuts for a non-rookie who plays a lot of minutes on a good team. And he signed that deal after he shut down Durant in the 2013 playoffs. So no, he's not highly sought.

Mbah a Moute has never been paid over 5 mln. per year either and is currently on a 2 mln. per year deal. Sefolosha's highest annual salary is 4.1 mln.

Being a defensive stopper with horrible offense doesn't pay well for perimeter players.

[Pillendreher]

Again it's not a stats thing....when allen is open, as bad offensive wings are when the stars draw doubles, the defense will actually show him the respect of trying to recover. They don't even bother with roberson. That's a big difference, no stats, you gotta watch and understand bball. And again the fact that you are debating this is beside the point, which is the guys you are comparing roberson to here are not sought after. I don't think see him having much value to anyone in a trade....hope I'm wrong

So Tony Allen. The guy who shut down Kevin Durant. Is not in any way sought after? Yeah, you don't see it but people in the NBA do.

Guess what teams win titles? Good defensive ones. Guess which ones don't. Ones with a bunch of terrible defenders.

There's a distinct difference between playing good team defense and having all defense, no offense guys on the floor tho.

[bondom34]

We'll he can't shut him down anymore, and again I see him as night and day better than roberson on offense. But this isn't a tony/roberson comparison, I'm just saying not many like roberson in the league that have no offense, even TA is alot better. Theres a reason for that. And yes good defensive teams do win titles, but they are also full of good offensively players, like gsw,cleveland,Miamis teams, the spurs, etc. Even the pistons team that won all could shoot on the wings.Who did/do any of those teams play who cant play respectable offense as a wing?

Sure at age 35. And I never said a word about not having good offense too but if you don't see value in Tony Allen, I got nothing, and it was your idea to bring up guys like him.

[bondom34]

Again it's not a stats thing....when allen is open, as bad offensive wings are when the stars draw doubles, the defense will actually show him the respect of trying to recover. They don't even bother with roberson. That's a big difference, no stats, you gotta watch and understand bball. And again the fact that you are debating this is beside the point, which is the guys you are comparing roberson to here are not sought after. I don't think see him having much value to anyone in a trade....hope I'm wrong

So Tony Allen. The guy who shut down Kevin Durant. Is not in any way sought after? Yeah, you don't see it but people in the NBA do.

Tony Allen is paid 5 mln. per year. That's peanuts for a non-rookie who plays a lot of minutes on a good team. And he signed that deal after he shut down Durant in the 2013 playoffs. So no, he's not highly sought.

Mbah a Moute has never been paid over 5 mln. per year either and is currently on a 2 mln. per year deal. Sefolosha's highest annual salary is 4.1 mln.

Being a defensive stopper with horrible offense doesn't pay well for perimeter players.

In which case I don't know why anyone's worrying about Robes making 12 mil a year.

Again it's not a stats thing....when allen is open, as bad offensive wings are when the stars draw doubles, the defense will actually show him the respect of trying to recover. They don't even bother with roberson. That's a big difference, no stats, you gotta watch and understand bball. And again the fact that you are debating this is beside the point, which is the guys you are comparing roberson to here are not sought after. I don't think see him having much value to anyone in a trade....hope I'm wrong

So Tony Allen. The guy who shut down Kevin Durant. Is not in any way sought after? Yeah, you don't see it but people in the NBA do.

Guess what teams win titles? Good defensive ones. Guess which ones don't. Ones with a bunch of terrible defenders.

There's a distinct difference between playing good team defense and having all defense, no offense guys on the floor tho.

Never said there wasn't

[hardenASG13]

We'll he can't shut him down anymore, and again I see him as night and day better than roberson on offense. But this isn't a tony/roberson comparison, I'm just saying not many like roberson in the league that have no offense, even TA is alot better. Theres a reason for that. And yes good defensive teams do win titles, but they are also full of good offensively players, like gsw,cleveland,Miamis teams, the spurs, etc. Even the pistons team that won all could shoot on the wings.Who did/do any of those teams play who cant play respectable offense as a wing?

Sure at age 35. And I never said a word about not having good offense too but if you don't see value in Tony Allen, I got nothing, and it was your idea to bring up guys like him.

I do see value in allen....not in roberson ha. I think allen is the better offensive player, by far,which is saying something. Hopefully there is a market for robes in trades. We shall see. I'd be really curious to see him on a different team

[bondom34]

We'll he can't shut him down anymore, and again I see him as night and day better than roberson on offense. But this isn't a tony/roberson comparison, I'm just saying not many like roberson in the league that have no offense, even TA is alot better. Theres a reason for that. And yes good defensive teams do win titles, but they are also full of good offensively players, like gsw,cleveland,Miamis teams, the spurs, etc. Even the pistons team that won all could shoot on the wings.Who did/do any of those teams play who cant play respectable offense as a wing?

Sure at age 35. And I never said a word about not having good offense too but if you don't see value in Tony Allen, I got nothing, and it was your idea to bring up guys like him.

I do see value in allen....not in roberson ha. I think allen is the better offensive player, by far,which is saying something. Hopefully there is a market for robes in trades. We shall see. I'd be really curious to see him on a different team

So despite all evidence you think Allen is better on offense. Welp

[hardenASG13]

Sure at age 35. And I never said a word about not having good offense too but if you don't see value in Tony Allen, I got nothing, and it was your idea to bring up guys like him.

I do see value in allen....not in roberson ha. I think allen is the better offensive player, by far,which is saying something. Hopefully there is a market for robes in trades. We shall see. I'd be really curious to see him on a different team

So despite all evidence you think Allen is better on offense. Welp

Those open shooting percentages aren't evidence, which you can't see. What makes him better is that the defense respects and recovers to him, unlike roberson.....you realize how big of a difference that is when it comes to running an effective team offense, right? Maybe you dont....but the fact that he can dribble and shoot a pull up jumper, make a free throw, or anything but a driving dunk or a really wide open 3, thus commanding the defense to at least pay attention to him, is why he's a better offensive player. And he's not good on offense. To fair I think roberson is currently better on D, but big deal. Fingers crossed robes is shipped. The whole play a sg that can't shoot idea didnt pan out with 2 superstars, it's not gonna with 1.

[Andre Roberstan]

I do see value in allen....not in roberson ha. I think allen is the better offensive player, by far,which is saying something. Hopefully there is a market for robes in trades. We shall see. I'd be really curious to see him on a different team

So despite all evidence you think Allen is better on offense. Welp

Those open shooting percentages aren't evidence, which you can't see. What makes him better is that the defense respects and recovers to him, unlike roberson.....you realize how big of a difference that is when it comes to running an effective team offense, right? Maybe you dont....but the fact that he can dribble and shoot a pull up jumper, make a free throw, or anything but a driving dunk or a really wide open 3, thus commanding the defense to at least pay attention to him, is why he's a better offensive player. And he's not good on offense. To fair I think roberson is currently better on D, but big deal. Fingers crossed robes is shipped. The whole play a sg that can't shoot idea didnt pan out with 2 superstars, it's not gonna with 1.

And the fact that everyone calls sagging off a guy who can't shoot the "Tony Allen treatment" after the 2015 GSW series?

I actually agree with you that Allen's a little better offensive player than Roberson. He's a smarter cutter, at least, and his tweaked hamstring played a big part in GSW's vaunted "ignore Allen" defense. But he doesn't get much respect on defense.

[bondom34]

Those open shooting percentages aren't evidence, which you can't see. What makes him better is that the defense respects and recovers to him, unlike roberson.....you realize how big of a difference that is when it comes to running an effective team offense, right? Maybe you dont....but the fact that he can dribble and shoot a pull up jumper, make a free throw, or anything but a driving dunk or a really wide open 3, thus commanding the defense to at least pay attention to him, is why he's a better offensive player. And he's not good on offense. To fair I think roberson is currently better on D, but big deal. Fingers crossed robes is shipped. The whole play a sg that can't shoot idea didnt pan out with 2 superstars, it's not gonna with 1.

Soo...getting the "Tony Allen treatment" is something you don't see happen to Tony Allen? I'm not sure you know who he is.

Dre also rates better in ORPM. Which you don't care about because stats and all. So basically despite every single bit of tangible evidence you don't buy it.

So much that a year ago you started a thread to ask other fans if Roberson would play on their team, with a resounding reply of "yes".

[hardenASG13]

So despite all evidence you think Allen is better on offense. Welp

Those open shooting percentages aren't evidence, which you can't see. What makes him better is that the defense respects and recovers to him, unlike roberson.....you realize how big of a difference that is when it comes to running an effective team offense, right? Maybe you dont....but the fact that he can dribble and shoot a pull up jumper, make a free throw, or anything but a driving dunk or a really wide open 3, thus commanding the defense to at least pay attention to him, is why he's a better offensive player. And he's not good on offense. To fair I think roberson is currently better on D, but big deal. Fingers crossed robes is shipped. The whole play a sg that can't shoot idea didnt pan out with 2 superstars, it's not gonna with 1.

And the fact that everyone calls sagging off a guy who can't shoot the "Tony Allen treatment" after the 2015 GSW series?

I actually agree with you that Allen's a little better offensive player than Roberson. He's a smarter cutter, at least, and his tweaked hamstring played a big part in GSW's vaunted "ignore Allen" defense. But he doesn't get much respect on defense.

No, he doesn't get a ton....but he gets alot more than robes...that's my whole point. Doesnt that say alot about roberson