Let's Make a Deal: Thunder Trade Targets

[jbk1234]

Cavs said they're not trading the pick (check sporting news). Don't want bad contracts back. Better letting him expire than taking bad money

Here's the best I can do Bondom: Brooklyn 1st, JR, & Shump for PG & Singler. JR's last year is only guaranteed for $3 million, and frankly, he's a pretty good fit next to Westbrook. Both teams buyout or stretch Shump & Singler next summer (unless OKC wants to hold onto Shump's expiring contract to see what offers come along).

[Dn4sty]

Courtney Lee remains my preferred possibly realistic target.

I don't want any part of that contract.

We're at a crossroad here where you either have to go for it or start selling. If George leaves in FA then we're out of shots at contention. I commend Presti for unloading his ammo this season even though it seems to have backfired horrendously, but we are to the point where we have to make a change. If Lee (or whoever) can help us this year then we make that move even if it screws us down the road, either that or it's about time to start selling. Either way we aren't contenders 3 years from now.

I think you have to push all your chips in (hopefully they could keep Ferguson) and hope that with the addition of Lee (who is definitely the player I want to trade for) it somehow clicks. I don’t think you can have it both ways at this point. If you had to give up Ferguson maybe you can get the Bulls 2018 2nd back.

I wonder what the Knicks would want for Lee

[ThunderBolt]

I don't want any part of that contract.

We're at a crossroad here where you either have to go for it or start selling. If George leaves in FA then we're out of shots at contention. I commend Presti for unloading his ammo this season even though it seems to have backfired horrendously, but we are to the point where we have to make a change. If Lee (or whoever) can help us this year then we make that move even if it screws us down the road, either that or it's about time to start selling. Either way we aren't contenders 3 years from now.

I think you have to push all your chips in (hopefully they could keep Ferguson) and hope that with the addition of Lee (who is definitely the player I want to trade for) it somehow clicks. I don’t think you can have it both ways at this point. If you had to give up Ferguson maybe you can get the Bulls 2018 2nd back.

I wonder what the Knicks would want for Lee

Push all your chips in for what? The 7th seed? Lee doesn’t help russ finish layups and make free throws. If we were the four seed, then yeah I might see it.

[Dn4sty]

We're at a crossroad here where you either have to go for it or start selling. If George leaves in FA then we're out of shots at contention. I commend Presti for unloading his ammo this season even though it seems to have backfired horrendously, but we are to the point where we have to make a change. If Lee (or whoever) can help us this year then we make that move even if it screws us down the road, either that or it's about time to start selling. Either way we aren't contenders 3 years from now.

I think you have to push all your chips in (hopefully they could keep Ferguson) and hope that with the addition of Lee (who is definitely the player I want to trade for) it somehow clicks. I don’t think you can have it both ways at this point. If you had to give up Ferguson maybe you can get the Bulls 2018 2nd back.

I wonder what the Knicks would want for Lee

Push all your chips in for what? The 7th seed? Lee doesn’t help russ finish layups and make free throws. If we were the four seed, then yeah I might see it.

OKC is 1.5 games from the 4th seed. Let’s not act like they are done

[bondom34]

Cavs said they're not trading the pick (check sporting news). Don't want bad contracts back. Better letting him expire than taking bad money

Here's the best I can do Bondom: Brooklyn 1st, JR, & Shump for PG & Singler. JR's last year is only guaranteed for $3 million, and frankly, he's a pretty good fit next to Westbrook. Both teams buyout or stretch Shump & Singler next summer (unless OKC wants to hold onto Shump's expiring contract to see what offers come along).

I don't hate it honestly. I'd just rather non pick assets, I'm iffy on the Nets pick and right now OKC might be picking before them after a trade.

[JoJo21]

Would you trade PG?

[bondom34]

I'd rather not.

[InTheSabonus]

Tricky part is seeing if we can acquire a useful player without giving up any picks.

Abrines, even when down on form, is probably the most valuable trade chip we have, right? Could sell somebody on his potential. But just how valuable is that? I don't know. Is he valuable enough to bring in a player and offload Singler? Probably not. But that would be pretty handy.

Of course he'd play well somewhere else and we'd get shat on for it but that's tradition at this point.

Also Lee is my target because we're probably not going to be dealing with contending teams, we need a team that wants to trade out vets for young players (Like Abrines) and not care about taking on bad contracts (Like Singler). And as far as I can tell getting a two-way veteran guard, that can spot up, and is from a young team, leaves us with either Wesley Matthews or Courtney Lee. And if Lee's contract doesn't look appealing...

Of course there's the option of keeping Abrines, but it makes me too nervous to have our 5th crunch time player be Felton, Huestis, or Abrines/Roberson (having to worry about defensive/offensive substitutions that are too complicated for Billy). Just someone that we can plug in and not have to worry about being a liability on either end. I think that's a greater need than a backup center (who could just be a buyout vet, if it's Bogut, Chandler, whoever)

[Pillendreher]

I think you have to push all your chips in (hopefully they could keep Ferguson) and hope that with the addition of Lee (who is definitely the player I want to trade for) it somehow clicks. I don’t think you can have it both ways at this point. If you had to give up Ferguson maybe you can get the Bulls 2018 2nd back.

I wonder what the Knicks would want for Lee

Push all your chips in for what? The 7th seed? Lee doesn’t help russ finish layups and make free throws. If we were the four seed, then yeah I might see it.

OKC is 1.5 games from the 4th seed. Let’s not act like they are done

We've been a .500 team for weeks and soon it might be months. Let's not act like the rest of the West being bad makes us a better team.

[Pillendreher]

Courtney Lee remains my preferred possibly realistic target.

I don't want any part of that contract.

We're at a crossroad here where you either have to go for it or start selling. If George leaves in FA then we're out of shots at contention. I commend Presti for unloading his ammo this season even though it seems to have backfired horrendously, but we are to the point where we have to make a change. If Lee (or whoever) can help us this year then we make that move even if it screws us down the road, either that or it's about time to start selling. Either way we aren't contenders 3 years from now.

The probability of Lee suddenly making this team that much better offensively is very slim. I know we're not getting much offensively from the SG position, but that is not the problem. Courtney Lee would be a little bit better guarded than Roberson, but still nobody would give a **** about him with the other guys on the floor. The only way that could happen is if he could make 5+ 3s on a high % per game so that the opponent has to adjust. I doubt that. And given his age, I don't want any part of 36/3.



He's not gonna be able to push us past this.

[bondom34]

If the solution is "just play better", it's not gonna work. Might as well just sell off what they can.

[Pillendreher]

If the solution is "just play better", it's not gonna work. Might as well just sell off what they can.

Again with the hyperbole.

[bondom34]

If the solution is "just play better", it's not gonna work. Might as well just sell off what they can.

Again with the hyperbole.

So you have a plan then to improve without acquiring players

[Pillendreher]

If the solution is "just play better", it's not gonna work. Might as well just sell off what they can.

Again with the hyperbole.

So you have a plan then to improve without acquiring players

Yes, I do.

-Stop taking so many pull ups when our 'Big 3' are on the floor together. It's terrible shot selection.
-Get Anthony to operate behind the 3-pt line. Him always drifting back to the midrange area might hurt our spacing more than Robereson.
-Give Patterson way more run.
-Use more screening to free up guys. It is viable for a team that doesn't run a lot of stuff like us.
-Get rid of Grant and get a backup Center.
-Let Melo run the bench. That's better than with George.
-Stop freezing out George. There are way too many quarters with him not even being a part of the team's offense.
-Enough with the Felton-Westbrook lineups. There's no use whatsoever for them.
-Constantly look for Adams. He's the only guy who has been able to give us 15+ on 60+ TS% on a somewhat consistent basis.
-Push, push, push the pace! We take way too long to actually do something on offense. Sometimes Russ walks the ball up the floor and only reaches the opponent's 3pt line with 14-12 seconds to go. That's insane.
-Don't stop playing basketball once you think that you've got your opponent in a stranglehold.
-Russ has to stop hunting for TDs. I don't want to engange this narrative, but he plays differently once he gets close to it. Especially against Philly it looked like he thought 'OK, so now that I've got most of the rebounds and assists out of the way, I'm gonna get my points'.

That's out of the top of my head. We've certainly talked about (way) more over the last couple of weeks. So please don't give me the 'Without getting an SG upgrade, there's no chance we could get better' hyperbole nonsense. You know better than this.

[InTheSabonus]

Again with the hyperbole.

So you have a plan then to improve without acquiring players

Yes, I do.

-Stop taking so many pull ups when our 'Big 3' are on the floor together. It's terrible shot selection.
-Get Anthony to operate behind the 3-pt line. Him always drifting back to the midrange area might hurt our spacing more than Robereson.
-Give Patterson way more run.
-Use more screening to free up guys. It is viable for a team that doesn't run a lot of stuff like us.
-Get rid of Grant and get a backup Center.
-Let Melo run the bench. That's better than with George.
-Stop freezing out George. There are way too many quarters with him not even being a part of the team's offense.
-Enough with the Felton-Westbrook lineups. There's no use whatsoever for them.
-Constantly look for Adams. He's the only guy who has been able to give us 15+ on 60+ TS% on a somewhat consistent basis.
-Push, push, push the pace! We take way too long to actually do something on offense. Sometimes Russ walks the ball up the floor and only reaches the opponent's 3pt line with 14-12 seconds to go. That's insane.
-Don't stop playing basketball once you think that you've got your opponent in a stranglehold.
-Russ has to stop hunting for TDs. I don't want to engange this narrative, but he plays differently once he gets close to it. Especially against Philly it looked like he thought 'OK, so now that I've got most of the rebounds and assists out of the way, I'm gonna get my points'.

That's out of the top of my head. We've certainly talked about (way) more over the last couple of weeks. So please don't give me the 'Without getting an SG upgrade, there's no chance we could get better' hyperbole nonsense. You know better than this.

I definitely agree with all that. But at the moment our bench has two big holes that means we have to play Huestis at shooting guard and Grant at center. Even with reduced rotations in the playoffs we're two players short of a solid playoff rotation. Felton at PG is fine, Patterson at the 4 is fine, but we're missing that wing and a center. Fair enough about not wanting to take on big contracts for older players, but I just don't know who we can get that's cheap, obtainable, and reliable in crunch time.

Otherwise if we have to see Grant or Abrines in the playoffs, even if they just play 10-15 minutes a game...teams could do a lot of damage in that time. Particularly with how easy it is for players to score on Abrines (or just get fouled by him).

[Pillendreher]

So you have a plan then to improve without acquiring players

Yes, I do.

-Stop taking so many pull ups when our 'Big 3' are on the floor together. It's terrible shot selection.
-Get Anthony to operate behind the 3-pt line. Him always drifting back to the midrange area might hurt our spacing more than Robereson.
-Give Patterson way more run.
-Use more screening to free up guys. It is viable for a team that doesn't run a lot of stuff like us.
-Get rid of Grant and get a backup Center.
-Let Melo run the bench. That's better than with George.
-Stop freezing out George. There are way too many quarters with him not even being a part of the team's offense.
-Enough with the Felton-Westbrook lineups. There's no use whatsoever for them.
-Constantly look for Adams. He's the only guy who has been able to give us 15+ on 60+ TS% on a somewhat consistent basis.
-Push, push, push the pace! We take way too long to actually do something on offense. Sometimes Russ walks the ball up the floor and only reaches the opponent's 3pt line with 14-12 seconds to go. That's insane.
-Don't stop playing basketball once you think that you've got your opponent in a stranglehold.
-Russ has to stop hunting for TDs. I don't want to engange this narrative, but he plays differently once he gets close to it. Especially against Philly it looked like he thought 'OK, so now that I've got most of the rebounds and assists out of the way, I'm gonna get my points'.

That's out of the top of my head. We've certainly talked about (way) more over the last couple of weeks. So please don't give me the 'Without getting an SG upgrade, there's no chance we could get better' hyperbole nonsense. You know better than this.

I definitely agree with all that. But at the moment our bench has two big holes that means we have to play Huestis at shooting guard and Grant at center. Even with reduced rotations in the playoffs we're two players short of a solid playoff rotation. Felton at PG is fine, Patterson at the 4 is fine, but we're missing that wing and a center. Fair enough about not wanting to take on big contracts for older players, but I just don't know who we can get that's cheap, obtainable, and reliable in crunch time.

Otherwise if we have to see Grant or Abrines in the playoffs, even if they just play 10-15 minutes a game...teams could do a lot of damage in that time. Particularly with how easy it is for players to score on Abrines (or just get fouled by him).

Well you could think of Lou Williams, but I honestly don't know if he would work here. He's a great one man show, but we're already struggling with 3 one man shows at once...

As for an SG in general: These are the shooting guards who have played at least 15 games so far, average at least 2 Catch and Shoot 3PA per game and make at least 37 % of their catch and shoot 3s:



Abrines is already 15th best. Now of course his defense leaves a lot to be desired and his offensive game is very raw save for his jumper, yet I don't know if we can get some more complete guy without giving up too much.

Matthews would be interesting if we could match that kind of salary, but that's close to impossible without giving up either Patterson, Ferguson or Roberson.

Who's on that list that looks obtainable and is an upgrade over Abrines?

[ThunderBolt]

I’ve liked Caris Lavert for a while.

[InTheSabonus]

Yes, I do.

-Stop taking so many pull ups when our 'Big 3' are on the floor together. It's terrible shot selection.
-Get Anthony to operate behind the 3-pt line. Him always drifting back to the midrange area might hurt our spacing more than Robereson.
-Give Patterson way more run.
-Use more screening to free up guys. It is viable for a team that doesn't run a lot of stuff like us.
-Get rid of Grant and get a backup Center.
-Let Melo run the bench. That's better than with George.
-Stop freezing out George. There are way too many quarters with him not even being a part of the team's offense.
-Enough with the Felton-Westbrook lineups. There's no use whatsoever for them.
-Constantly look for Adams. He's the only guy who has been able to give us 15+ on 60+ TS% on a somewhat consistent basis.
-Push, push, push the pace! We take way too long to actually do something on offense. Sometimes Russ walks the ball up the floor and only reaches the opponent's 3pt line with 14-12 seconds to go. That's insane.
-Don't stop playing basketball once you think that you've got your opponent in a stranglehold.
-Russ has to stop hunting for TDs. I don't want to engange this narrative, but he plays differently once he gets close to it. Especially against Philly it looked like he thought 'OK, so now that I've got most of the rebounds and assists out of the way, I'm gonna get my points'.

That's out of the top of my head. We've certainly talked about (way) more over the last couple of weeks. So please don't give me the 'Without getting an SG upgrade, there's no chance we could get better' hyperbole nonsense. You know better than this.

I definitely agree with all that. But at the moment our bench has two big holes that means we have to play Huestis at shooting guard and Grant at center. Even with reduced rotations in the playoffs we're two players short of a solid playoff rotation. Felton at PG is fine, Patterson at the 4 is fine, but we're missing that wing and a center. Fair enough about not wanting to take on big contracts for older players, but I just don't know who we can get that's cheap, obtainable, and reliable in crunch time.

Otherwise if we have to see Grant or Abrines in the playoffs, even if they just play 10-15 minutes a game...teams could do a lot of damage in that time. Particularly with how easy it is for players to score on Abrines (or just get fouled by him).

Well you could think of Lou Williams, but I honestly don't know if he would work here. He's a great one man show, but we're already struggling with 3 one man shows at once...

As for an SG in general: These are the shooting guards who have played at least 15 games so far, average at least 2 Catch and Shoot 3PA per game and make at least 37 % of their catch and shoot 3s:



Abrines is already 15th best. Now of course his defense leaves a lot to be desired and his offensive game is very raw save for his jumper, yet I don't know if we can get some more complete guy without giving up too much.

Matthews would be interesting if we could match that kind of salary, but that's close to impossible without giving up either Patterson, Ferguson or Roberson.

Who's on that list that looks obtainable and is an upgrade over Abrines?

Jeremy Lamb 2: The un-benchoning

Problem is some of those guys are on teams that we'll be competing for a playoff spot with. Denver, New Orleans, maybe the Clippers (if they try to persist with this season), Utah and Portland probably aren't going to be making any trades that could make us better and them potentially worse.

That leaves me with two names I like the look of, from teams that aren't up to much: Wayne Ellington and Garrett Temple.

Ellington would be a one season rental, making under 7 mill this season but a free agent after it. Temple is making 8 mill this season and next, then a free agent. They're 30 and 31 respectively, so certainly fit the experience bill. Would it take much to get them? I don't know how those teams/fans value them, but you would think not. Could maybe go for Ellington without giving up Abrines, give Abrines a lesser role, tell him to have a massive offseason and come back with Ellington gone and a need for a shooting guard off the bench.

[Pillendreher]

I definitely agree with all that. But at the moment our bench has two big holes that means we have to play Huestis at shooting guard and Grant at center. Even with reduced rotations in the playoffs we're two players short of a solid playoff rotation. Felton at PG is fine, Patterson at the 4 is fine, but we're missing that wing and a center. Fair enough about not wanting to take on big contracts for older players, but I just don't know who we can get that's cheap, obtainable, and reliable in crunch time.

Otherwise if we have to see Grant or Abrines in the playoffs, even if they just play 10-15 minutes a game...teams could do a lot of damage in that time. Particularly with how easy it is for players to score on Abrines (or just get fouled by him).

Well you could think of Lou Williams, but I honestly don't know if he would work here. He's a great one man show, but we're already struggling with 3 one man shows at once...

As for an SG in general: These are the shooting guards who have played at least 15 games so far, average at least 2 Catch and Shoot 3PA per game and make at least 37 % of their catch and shoot 3s:



Abrines is already 15th best. Now of course his defense leaves a lot to be desired and his offensive game is very raw save for his jumper, yet I don't know if we can get some more complete guy without giving up too much.

Matthews would be interesting if we could match that kind of salary, but that's close to impossible without giving up either Patterson, Ferguson or Roberson.

Who's on that list that looks obtainable and is an upgrade over Abrines?

Jeremy Lamb 2: The un-benchoning

Problem is some of those guys are on teams that we'll be competing for a playoff spot with. Denver, New Orleans, maybe the Clippers (if they try to persist with this season), Utah and Portland probably aren't going to be making any trades that could make us better and them potentially worse.

That leaves me with two names I like the look of, from teams that aren't up to much: Wayne Ellington and Garrett Temple.

Ellington would be a one season rental, making under 7 mill this season but a free agent after it. Temple is making 8 mill this season and next, then a free agent. They're 30 and 31 respectively, so certainly fit the experience bill. Would it take much to get them? I don't know how those teams/fans value them, but you would think not. Could maybe go for Ellington without giving up Abrines, give Abrines a lesser role, tell him to have a massive offseason and come back with Ellington gone and a need for a shooting guard off the bench.

Ellington is having a great year so far:

-44.1 % on catch and shoot 3s
-42.1 % on pull up 3s
-46.7 % on open 3s, 44.9 % on wide open 3s
-91st percentile in spot up situations
-7th in RPM for SGs; 8th in ORPM for SGs
-Career high eFG% (62.3 %), ORtG (122), PER (15.5), TS% (64.1 %), WS/48 (.144), OBPM (+3.6), BPM (+1.9)

A couple of things to consider tho:

-88.7 % of his shots are 3s. He doesn't do anything else. Not even 5 % of his FGA are right at the rim.
-I think it's unreasonable to assume that he will continue to have that kind of impact solely on 3s.
-He's doing this under Spoelstra. The two best seasons of his career have been with Spoelstra. Given Donovan's history with roleplayers and our general offensive output, it may be prudent to consider that he wouldn't give us the same kind of offensive output he has for the Heat.

[bondom34]

Again with the hyperbole.

So you have a plan then to improve without acquiring players

Yes, I do.

-Stop taking so many pull ups when our 'Big 3' are on the floor together. It's terrible shot selection.
-Get Anthony to operate behind the 3-pt line. Him always drifting back to the midrange area might hurt our spacing more than Robereson.
-Give Patterson way more run.
-Use more screening to free up guys. It is viable for a team that doesn't run a lot of stuff like us.
-Get rid of Grant and get a backup Center.
-Let Melo run the bench. That's better than with George.
-Stop freezing out George. There are way too many quarters with him not even being a part of the team's offense.
-Enough with the Felton-Westbrook lineups. There's no use whatsoever for them.
-Constantly look for Adams. He's the only guy who has been able to give us 15+ on 60+ TS% on a somewhat consistent basis.
-Push, push, push the pace! We take way too long to actually do something on offense. Sometimes Russ walks the ball up the floor and only reaches the opponent's 3pt line with 14-12 seconds to go. That's insane.
-Don't stop playing basketball once you think that you've got your opponent in a stranglehold.
-Russ has to stop hunting for TDs. I don't want to engange this narrative, but he plays differently once he gets close to it. Especially against Philly it looked like he thought 'OK, so now that I've got most of the rebounds and assists out of the way, I'm gonna get my points'.

That's out of the top of my head. We've certainly talked about (way) more over the last couple of weeks. So please don't give me the 'Without getting an SG upgrade, there's no chance we could get better' hyperbole nonsense. You know better than this.

Sure, that's great. But we're 30 games in and its not happening. Its about as likely Robes starts sitting his 3s at a 40 percent clip that this stuff happens. Like I said I'm indifferent on this team but expecting that to happen isnt realistic.