Around the NBA: 2017—2018

[slick_watts]

Agree on Boston, but Harden has played better than last year and he's not being led by a better bench unit like last year, how Irving is. His on off splits were a negative from December on last season. Now suddenly Irvings are a negative and they matter.

i'm not surprised by irving's splits since that team is a defensive team and he's the worst defensive player on it.

in general i don't see how on / off splits should be important to an individual performance award.

I would say in general they would show some indication of value to a team.

eh maybe but this seems subject to team and opponent rotations as well as reserve quality. maybe kyrie spends less time on the court against opponent benches? who knows.

i never bought this argument last year because our bench was so much weaker than houston's. and that shouldn't really have a bearing on whether or not harden or westbrook is more valuable imo. out of their control.

[bondom34]

i'm not surprised by irving's splits since that team is a defensive team and he's the worst defensive player on it.

in general i don't see how on / off splits should be important to an individual performance award.

I would say in general they would show some indication of value to a team.

eh maybe but this seems subject to team and opponent rotations as well as reserve quality. maybe kyrie spends less time on the court against opponent benches? who knows.

i never bought this argument last year because our bench was so much weaker than houston's. and that shouldn't really have a bearing on whether or not harden or westbrook is more valuable imo. out of their control.

Agree again. Bit Houston's bench, like Bosons this year, is why they had more wins which was a big part of Harden and now Kyries argument. Their team isn't winning more because of that player but depth.

[hardenASG13]

Millsap out 2-3 months. Denver just became a Grant destination.

Trading away the best contract on the team (under 1 million for a rotation forward), is not the answer......unless Roberson goes with him.

'Best contract on the team' - what? Him not making that much money does not matter this season. We won't keep him and we need to get rid of him before Donovan wants to start him and run ISOs for him as well.

Who could they trade him for where the salaries match that would be an upgrade? There is still 80 percent of the season left. Why give away a rotation player for nothing.

[bondom34]

Denver also has about 15 PFs on the roster already.

[slick_watts]

I would say in general they would show some indication of value to a team.

eh maybe but this seems subject to team and opponent rotations as well as reserve quality. maybe kyrie spends less time on the court against opponent benches? who knows.

i never bought this argument last year because our bench was so much weaker than houston's. and that shouldn't really have a bearing on whether or not harden or westbrook is more valuable imo. out of their control.

Agree again. Bit Houston's bench, like Bosons this year, is why they had more wins which was a big part of Harden and now Kyries argument. Their team isn't winning more because of that player but depth.

i think we agree in principle on this stuff. i don't even think team wins should be an important barometer for mvp choice.

[slick_watts]

Trading away the best contract on the team (under 1 million for a rotation forward), is not the answer......unless Roberson goes with him.

'Best contract on the team' - what? Him not making that much money does not matter this season. We won't keep him and we need to get rid of him before Donovan wants to start him and run ISOs for him as well.

Who could they trade him for where the salaries match that would be an upgrade? There is still 80 percent of the season left. Why give away a rotation player for nothing.

grant for bebe.

of all the players on the roster aside from paul george i'd say jerami grant has the highest chance of being traded by the deadline since he's UFA next year.

[bondom34]

eh maybe but this seems subject to team and opponent rotations as well as reserve quality. maybe kyrie spends less time on the court against opponent benches? who knows.

i never bought this argument last year because our bench was so much weaker than houston's. and that shouldn't really have a bearing on whether or not harden or westbrook is more valuable imo. out of their control.

Agree again. Bit Houston's bench, like Bosons this year, is why they had more wins which was a big part of Harden and now Kyries argument. Their team isn't winning more because of that player but depth.

i think we agree in principle on this stuff. i don't even think team wins should be an important barometer for mvp choice.

Yep we are. Its just interesting to me seeing Houston fans suddendly flip.

[Kizz Fastfists]

Who could they trade him for where the salaries match that would be an upgrade? There is still 80 percent of the season left. Why give away a rotation player for nothing.

LAL w/ a 2nd for Bogut. That would give OKC the backup big they need. It can't happen for another month, but that would be a good move for OKC.

[Kizz Fastfists]

grant for bebe.

Salaries don't work. Would require including Huestis, Dakari or some other small salary. I'd do Grant, Huestis and a 2nd for him, but I'm not sure Toronto would.

[hardenASG13]

Who could they trade him for where the salaries match that would be an upgrade? There is still 80 percent of the season left. Why give away a rotation player for nothing.

LAL w/ a 2nd for Bogut. That would give OKC the backup big they need. It can't happen for another month, but that would be a good move for OKC.

Upgrade dakari to bogut (he lasted 2 minutes last year, and has got hurt almost every year of his career) and remove the best bench forward on the team, who should be starting over roberson? I'd pass on that. They can wait for a big in the buyout market, or package Roberson for a better one than Bogut if anyone is dumb enough to take roberson.

[bondom34]

Just saw this on reddit but Embiid is awesome. Jalen Rose called it unprofessional when he said he was playing at 69 percent. Asked today, he said he was at 81 percent lol.

https://streamable.com/zdgpr

[jambalaya]

Oladipo dominating his counterpart match on scoring activity.
Team
level offense worse with him on vs. off but defense better by a little more. Sabonis crushed at PF, wins at center, modestly at matchup level, by a large amount at team defensive level.

On RPM Oladipo is estimated at about same impact as last season, Sabonis WA better but only a modest positive. PG's way better than those 2 combined. But Indiana probably likes the going forward value after this season vs. nothing.

[spearsy23]

Just saw this on reddit but Embiid is awesome. Jalen Rose called it unprofessional when he said he was playing at 69 percent. Asked today, he said he was at 81 percent lol.

https://streamable.com/zdgpr

Jalen Rose is a clown. Also, let it not be forgotten he was suspended from ESPN after his failing to inform them of his DUI arrest. Unprofessional.

[Pillendreher]

Damn, didn't know Beverley was out for the season. Tough luck for the Clippers. The injury problems continue.

Also: We laughed about the Cavs, but now they've won 7th in a row.

[Jstock12]

Damn, didn't know Beverley was out for the season. Tough luck for the Clippers. The injury problems continue.

Also: We laughed about the Cavs, but now they've won 7th in a row.

Cavs are rolling, but they aren't even playing close to their best yet.

[xxSnEaKyPxx]

Oladipo dominating his counterpart match on scoring activity.
Team
level offense worse with him on vs. off but defense better by a little more. Sabonis crushed at PF, wins at center, modestly at matchup level, by a large amount at team defensive level.

On RPM Oladipo is estimated at about same impact as last season, Sabonis WA better but only a modest positive. PG's way better than those 2 combined. But Indiana probably likes the going forward value after this season vs. nothing.

I will say, its not just about the talent level though.

Yes, PG is a superstar talent, but he just had absolutely no heart at all for the Pacers. Maybe that has changed for ya'll, I don't know, but for the Pacers, he didn't care. If the game wasn't on National TV, he would just half ass his way through it. He also cared more about himself than the team and was an absolutely horrid leader. The second part is not much his fault, some people just are not meant the be leaders and the Pacers tried to force him to become one anyway. The result was bad.

Oladipo and Sabonis on the other hand have given 110% effort every time they have stepped on the court. They are also committed to playing team ball and always look for the best shot available as oppose to only wanting them to take the shot. The Pacers play more of a team game now than we have with Paul George over the last two years. The team is fun to watch again. Indiana has also bought into them as the arena is louder than it has been in the regular season in a very long time.

Paul George is clearly the more talented player when he cares, but he just simply did not care in Indiana. Maybe it was because he didn't want to bust his ass for a team that had a ceiling of a first round exit, or maybe he just doesn't have that "it" factor, I'm not sure. But the Pacers are much better off with Oladipo/Sabonis than they were with Paul George.

In the same note, I think the trade was excellent for the Thunder as well. Most importantly, it helped get Westbrook signed to an extension. Regardless of ya'lls struggles now, you simply have too much talent to not figure it out. I know ya'll will put the pieces together and be a top 4 WC team by seasons end.

[pelifan]

apparently KD was a little sore during his game with Thunder. Nice retroactive excuse!

[Jstock12]

apparently KD was a little sore during his game with Thunder. Nice retroactive excuse!

So he was highly questionable with a sore ankle, and instead of putting him on a minute restriction, Kerr played him for 33 minutes. Makes perfect sense.

[Pillendreher]

apparently KD was a little sore during his game with Thunder. Nice retroactive excuse!

The Warriors' propaganda game is so strong. They get anything out there without people even questioning the narrative and motive behind it.

[ThunderBolt]

Oladipo 8-8 on fg with 18 points...at the half. Sabonis 2-3 with 7 points. We suck. No excuse for wasting these two guys last year.