4/9 - POSTGAME | Oklahoma City Thunder (115) - (93) Miami Heat

[hardenASG13]

Yes Westbrook is getting to the line less, because he doesn't have to attack the basket as much

westbrook leads the league in drives per game by a healthy margin, and is only slightly behind last year's number when you adjust for minutes and pace. stop pawning off your opinions as facts.

I'm not. Drives don't equal shots, my friend. He is kicking to shooters, and spoon feeding adams alot, on his drives. Learn how to interpret stats, just because he's driving a ton doesn't say what he's doing on the drives, which would impact him getting to the ft line. Driving doesn't mean he's attacking the basket (forcing up layups/forcing contact at the rim). He's trying to make the right play, whether it's a pass or a shot. If anything, at times, especially early in the year, he was overpassing.

[bondom34]

Hes also shooting substantially more from 0 to 3 feet from the rim.

[hardenASG13]

I think there needs to be a separate bought between "Westbrook hasn't been good" and "relative to his standard Westbrook hasn't been good".

How has he not been good relative to standard Westbrook? Can you explain, I'm genuinely curious....what isn't he doing well at, aside from free throws. If you want to say he hasn't been himself at the ft line, fine I agree. But that is reaching for the sake of nitpicking your teams best player, who is having a phenomenal year, even by his standards.

If you're looking for someone who's likely to stick up for Russ in most scenarios its me. But he's currently sub 30percent from 3, 2nd highest turnovers per game career, worst scoring efficiency since his sophomore season, worst OBPM since 2012 not counting his injured year, worst PER since the same, and all coming off an MVP year when he was fantastic in every regard. I'm missing things too but that's a start

Last year was incredible, and was in all likelihood his peak season individually. That was the outlier. He is at 29.9 percent from 3, and 48% from 2. His career 3pt percentage is 31.1. He's right there. He started the year terribly, and had difficulties trying too hard to please everyone. He wasn't himself, and his season numbers were in fact affected by that early stretch. Would you argue that?

[Reign23]

who do you guys wanna play in round 1?

[hardenASG13]

Hes also shooting substantially more from 0 to 3 feet from the rim.

That's good.

[slick_watts]

I'm not. Drives don't equal shots, my friend. He is kicking to shooters, and spoon feeding adams alot, on his drives

he's passing 36% of the time on his drives this year compared to 39% of the time last year.

you're literally making things up.

[bondom34]

Hes also shooting substantially more from 0 to 3 feet from the rim.

That's good.

And refutes this.

Yes Westbrook is getting to the line less, because he doesn't have to attack the basket as much

westbrook leads the league in drives per game by a healthy margin, and is only slightly behind last year's number when you adjust for minutes and pace. stop pawning off your opinions as facts.

I'm not. Drives don't equal shots, my friend. He is kicking to shooters, and spoon feeding adams alot, on his drives. Learn how to interpret stats, just because he's driving a ton doesn't say what he's doing on the drives, which would impact him getting to the ft line. Driving doesn't mean he's attacking the basket (forcing up layups/forcing contact at the rim). He's trying to make the right play, whether it's a pass or a shot. If anything, at times, especially early in the year, he was overpassing.

And those numbers weren't down from last year. They were down from every year outside those noted. Hes a great player. Top 5 in the league (maybe not this year but in general). Hes having a down year. It happens

[slick_watts]

Top 5 in the league (maybe not this year but in general).

i want to do this so badly but i know it won't end nicely.

[bondom34]

Top 5 in the league (maybe not this year but in general).

i want to do this so badly but i know it won't end nicely.

I have the parenthetical there for a reason.

Not this year possibly. And some would still take him there.

See forum: Player Comparisons. POY Thread

[hardenASG13]

I'm not. Drives don't equal shots, my friend. He is kicking to shooters, and spoon feeding adams alot, on his drives

he's passing 36% of the time on his drives this year compared to 39% of the time last year.

you're literally making things up.

Fair enough, your sidetracking the main argument and point pretty heavily (he's had a great season, and is an elite superstar). What percentage of drives is he shooting on, compared to last year out of curiosity? Also, what is the definition of drive that your stats go by?

[hardenASG13]

Hes also shooting substantially more from 0 to 3 feet from the rim.

That's good.

And refutes this.

westbrook leads the league in drives per game by a healthy margin, and is only slightly behind last year's number when you adjust for minutes and pace. stop pawning off your opinions as facts.

I'm not. Drives don't equal shots, my friend. He is kicking to shooters, and spoon feeding adams alot, on his drives. Learn how to interpret stats, just because he's driving a ton doesn't say what he's doing on the drives, which would impact him getting to the ft line. Driving doesn't mean he's attacking the basket (forcing up layups/forcing contact at the rim). He's trying to make the right play, whether it's a pass or a shot. If anything, at times, especially early in the year, he was overpassing.

And those numbers weren't down from last year. They were down from every year outside those noted. Hes a great player. Top 5 in the league (maybe not this year but in general). Hes having a down year. It happens

Guess I don't really see it as much of a down year, those stats considered. Also think he's top 5, in a must win playoff game, there aren't many of trade him for, despite how many may be more efficient than him during the regular season.

[bondom34]

That's good.

And refutes this.

I'm not. Drives don't equal shots, my friend. He is kicking to shooters, and spoon feeding adams alot, on his drives. Learn how to interpret stats, just because he's driving a ton doesn't say what he's doing on the drives, which would impact him getting to the ft line. Driving doesn't mean he's attacking the basket (forcing up layups/forcing contact at the rim). He's trying to make the right play, whether it's a pass or a shot. If anything, at times, especially early in the year, he was overpassing.

And those numbers weren't down from last year. They were down from every year outside those noted. Hes a great player. Top 5 in the league (maybe not this year but in general). Hes having a down year. It happens

Guess I don't really see it as much of a down year, those stats considered. Also think he's top 5, in a must win playoff game, there aren't many of trade him for, despite how many may be more efficient than him during the regular season.

I'd agree with you on that point and he's still debatable top 5 even in a down year. But he was much better last year and probably closer to top 10 This season

[slick_watts]

Fair enough, your sidetracking the main argument and point pretty heavily (he's had a great season, and is an elite superstar)

first off, that's not the argument. the argument is whether he's had a down season. which he has.

i post these things in response to you because i want you to know there is tracking data on stuff that you feel has to be true. that westbrook is getting fewer FT attempts because he's passing more on drives or whatever is provably false.

I'd agree with you on that point and he's still debatable top 5 even in a down year. But he was much better last year and probably closer to top 10 This season

curry, paul, harden, a. davis, butler, embiid, giannis, lebron, lowry, lillard, oladipo

where does westbrook fit in there, this season? top 5 seems out of the question to me, unless we're not talking about rate and focusing on volume since westbrook hasn't' missed games and plays a lot of minutes. that'd possibly sneak him ahead of some of these guys.

[hardenASG13]

Fair enough, your sidetracking the main argument and point pretty heavily (he's had a great season, and is an elite superstar)

first off, that's not the argument. the argument is whether he's had a down season. which he has.

i post these things in response to you because i want you to know there is tracking data on stuff that you feel has to be true. that westbrook is getting fewer FT attempts because he's passing more on drives or whatever is provably false.

I'd agree with you on that point and he's still debatable top 5 even in a down year. But he was much better last year and probably closer to top 10 This season

curry, paul, harden, a. davis, butler, embiid, giannis, lebron, lowry, lillard, oladipo

where does westbrook fit in there, this season? top 5 seems out of the question to me, unless we're not talking about rate and focusing on volume since westbrook hasn't' missed games and plays a lot of minutes. that'd possibly sneak him ahead of some of these guys.

My whole point was that a second straight triple double season would be incredible, and should be celebrated. Seriously, take a look. I shouldn't have let it get this sidetracked. I hope he gets it and am looking forward to this team making you look ridiculous in the playoffs

[slick_watts]

My whole point was that a second straight triple double season would be incredible, and should be celebrated. Seriously, take a look. I shouldn't have let it get this sidetracked. I hope he gets it and am looking forward to this team making you look ridiculous in the playoffs

and it's ok for people not to be ecstatic about getting triple doubles. i'd rather westbrook get to the line and make his free throws than average a triple double. or play better defense. it just doesn't seem like an important achievement to me after the team spend most of last year openly gunning for it.

making me look ridiculous? buddy, if the thunder win a series or two i will be pleasantly surprised and delighted with that outcome (given that they've committed to a playoffs run in the first place). i don't consider it out of the question. but i'm not going to assign those expectations to a team that has clearly not demonstrated that they've earned them.

if we want to talk about looking ridiculous, we should talk about you and your friend and andre roberson.

[bondom34]

Fair enough, your sidetracking the main argument and point pretty heavily (he's had a great season, and is an elite superstar)

first off, that's not the argument. the argument is whether he's had a down season. which he has.

i post these things in response to you because i want you to know there is tracking data on stuff that you feel has to be true. that westbrook is getting fewer FT attempts because he's passing more on drives or whatever is provably false.

I'd agree with you on that point and he's still debatable top 5 even in a down year. But he was much better last year and probably closer to top 10 This season

curry, paul, harden, a. davis, butler, embiid, giannis, lebron, lowry, lillard, oladipo

where does westbrook fit in there, this season? top 5 seems out of the question to me, unless we're not talking about rate and focusing on volume since westbrook hasn't' missed games and plays a lot of minutes. that'd possibly sneak him ahead of some of these guys.

I'm accounting for time .missed. Curry Harden Lebron I see as clearly better. Hes similar to Lillard. And I still take him over Vic Embiid Lowry and Giannis. Paul and Butler missed time.

And that's in a way down year. The last 3 or 4 he was a clear top 5 possibly higher.