Diallo cold water thread

[Old Man Game]

Since Ferg or Diallo has become a thing around here I thought this might be worth sharing from around the time of the draft. Based on this short write up I think its fair to say that teams really REALLY don't think Diallo can shoot. Most of us knew that at the time but after some encouraging preseason games its a useful corrective to go back and remind ourselves. I mean when you're hoping he becomes Tony Allen, that says a lot about his offense.

https://thunderousintentions.com/2018/06/16/nba-draft-hamidou-diallo-rolled-the-dice-and-lost/3/

[ThunderBolt]

He’s shined in summer league and preseason. While it might be meaningless for the future, hes made the most out of the opportunities given. That’s all we can hope for to this point. If you’re a fan you can be hopeful but skeptical. Other than a few posts by those that are always sunshine pumpers, I think that’s how most feel. “Hey this guy might not suck and has some freakish athleticism.” Even though there are things about the franchise and FO I don’t agree with, I’m just not pissed with all things thunder. He could be a bright spot moving forward. If he only has ten or so games he plays well, I’ll still be happy with him as a prospect. Although he’s more aggressive than Ferguson, I like that he’s not too aggressive and trying to play hero ball right now.

[bondom34]

“Hey this guy might not suck and has some freakish athleticism.” Even though there are things about the franchise and FO I don’t agree with, I’m just not pissed with all things thunder. He could be a bright spot moving forward.

Pretty much.

Also if the Tony Allen comp is a bad sign, Ferguson's was Terrence Ross.

[Kizz Fastfists]

I mean when you're hoping he becomes Tony Allen, that says a lot about his offense.

LIES!!! Hami is going to be a complete stud! He's going to win ROY and is a future HOFer! OKC is going to the WCF and might even win a championship! Roberson is going to come back 100%! Schroder will be 6th man of the year and the best SG in the NBA! Donovan will be coach of the year after leading the team to 60 wins!

[Funcrusher]

I mean when you're hoping he becomes Tony Allen, that says a lot about his offense.

LIES!!! Hami is going to be a complete stud! He's going to win ROY and is a future HOFer! OKC is going to the WCF and might even win a championship! Roberson is going to come back 100%! Schroder will be 6th man of the year and the best SG in the NBA! Donovan will be coach of the year after leading the team to 60 wins!

[retrobro90]

Hami had a season of major ups and downs at Kentucky. He either looked awesome (second game of the tourney) or unplayable with hardly any in between. There's two things though that really benefit him in the NBA game as opposed to his time at UK.

1. He's no longer a focal point of his team's offense. He may one day be a self creator in OKC but those opportunities will be few and far between with most of his offense either being set up for him by his teammates or he's getting put backs off offensive rebounds.

2. NBA spacing. Even with our cavalcade of sub-par perimeter shooters there's still much more room for him to operate in the deep paint. Already we've seen how adept he can be kicking out to open shooters off penetration.

It's hard to imagine Diallo being a decent shooter at this level. His misses are bad misses. He's never been good from the FT line. With his wrist flick it's almost like a 3 motion shot. Ideally/hopefully at some point in his career he's above 70% at the line and above 33% from 3. I wouldn't expect that this season though.

Diallo's passing has impressed me thus far. That could turn quick if he has a few heavy turnover games against defenders who know how to get in his air space. I haven't seen him throw any pocket passes or play in pick and roll but like I said he's very adept finding shooters after he's collapsed the defense and he had a really nice dish under the basket to Hervey in SL.

Ferguson has almost 0 skill with the ball in his hands. Any nice pass he's made is to a slipping big man when two defenders decide to trap Ferg on the 3 point line. I've seen him make that pass at least twice in SL and once in preseason. His handle is rudimentary and tentative. High dribbles with no shake or change of speed/direction. As of now, our org has to be betting on him turning into a plus defender who shoots <38% from 3. Even then he's maxed out as Tony Snell with a 40 inch vert (which is still a very nice player, just a gamble if he ever garners that kind of acumen).

It's obviously very early for both of these guys. This is just what I see and what I think.

[getrichordie]

Hami had a season of major ups and downs at Kentucky. He either looked awesome (second game of the tourney) or unplayable with hardly any in between. There's two things though that really benefit him in the NBA game as opposed to his time at UK.

1. He's no longer a focal point of his team's offense. He may one day be a self creator in OKC but those opportunities will be few and far between with most of his offense either being set up for him by his teammates or he's getting put backs off offensive rebounds.

2. NBA spacing. Even with our cavalcade of sub-par perimeter shooters there's still much more room for him to operate in the deep paint. Already we've seen how adept he can be kicking out to open shooters off penetration.

It's hard to imagine Diallo being a decent shooter at this level. His misses are bad misses. He's never been good from the FT line. With his wrist flick it's almost like a 3 motion shot. Ideally/hopefully at some point in his career he's above 70% at the line and above 33% from 3. I wouldn't expect that this season though.

Diallo's passing has impressed me thus far. That could turn quick if he has a few heavy turnover games against defenders who know how to get in his air space. I haven't seen him throw any pocket passes or play in pick and roll but like I said he's very adept finding shooters after he's collapsed the defense and he had a really nice dish under the basket to Hervey in SL.

Ferguson has almost 0 skill with the ball in his hands. Any nice pass he's made is to a slipping big man when two defenders decide to trap Ferg on the 3 point line. I've seen him make that pass at least twice in SL and once in preseason. His handle is rudimentary and tentative. High dribbles with no shake or change of speed/direction. As of now, our org has to be betting on him turning into a plus defender who shoots <38% from 3. Even then he's maxed out as Tony Snell with a 40 inch vert (which is still a very nice player, just a gamble if he ever garners that kind of acumen).

It's obviously very early for both of these guys. This is just what I see and what I think.

Yeah, I’m not sold on Ferguson. His size alone bothers me. He’s small for shooting guard. Athletic as hell, but small.

Maybe it’s just me, but Diallo just looks more focused and locked in on the floor than Ferguson does. I’d be willing to bet money that Diallo pans out better than Ferguson will.

P.S. Diallo‘ arms are huge for his size.

Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

[Old Man Game]

“Hey this guy might not suck and has some freakish athleticism.” Even though there are things about the franchise and FO I don’t agree with, I’m just not pissed with all things thunder. He could be a bright spot moving forward.

Pretty much.

Also if the Tony Allen comp is a bad sign, Ferguson's was Terrence Ross.

The point I was trying to make isn't that Tony Allen is a bad player. Heck yeah I'd take prime Tony Allen from a second round pick. That's a no brainer. The point I was making is that if you're draft comps (which are inherently optimistic in nature when discussing upside (i.e. not bust potential)) are guys who are known as being almost completely incompetent shooting the ball, then that's a pretty strong sign the draft community community generally doesn't think much of you as a shooter.

Now, whether or not a random writer on Thunderous Intentions knows enough to reflect internal thinking is a fair question but then again he went mid second round leading one to believe the author was mostly spot on.

[slick_watts]

hamidou diallo's camp and preseason have turned a 2nd round pick purchased for pittance into a somewhat better than negligible chance of turning out a rotation player. that's a good outcome.

but he's still a 2nd round pick whose development trajectory has been spiked by more or less meaningless summer league, 60 preseason minutes, and the typical offseason media drivel about surprising players. so, meh. it's shocking to me that there are people who want to start this guy or hand him a big role right off the bat. but i guess that sort of thing stands out within our wing group.

i haven't seen anything out of him that would compel me to give him anything more than 9th or 10th man to start the year, and prove he deserves more as the year progresses. it's just downright absurd to me that summer league and preseason have convinced anyone that this guy is worth flipping our rotation around.

[Osirus89]

He's looked more competent than Ferg has so far. Now that could mean that neither one of them is any good, but I remain hopeful for them both. If they both can become rotation players, that would be outstanding. It's fine if just one of them turns into a good player.

It would appear from recent drafting of TFerg, Diallo, and bringing in guys like TLC that the hope would be that one of them is Dre's successor down the line. If Andre isn't close to what he was before the injury, his shortcomings make him a lot less irreplaceable.

[Old Man Game]

hamidou diallo's camp and preseason have turned a 2nd round pick purchased for pittance into a somewhat better than negligible chance of turning out a rotation player. that's a good outcome.

but he's still a 2nd round pick whose development trajectory has been spiked by more or less meaningless summer league, 60 preseason minutes, and the typical offseason media drivel about surprising players. so, meh. it's shocking to me that there are people who want to start this guy or hand him a big role right off the bat. but i guess that sort of thing stands out within our wing group.

i haven't seen anything out of him that would compel me to give him anything more than 9th or 10th man to start the year, and prove he deserves more as the year progresses. it's just downright absurd to me that summer league and preseason have convinced anyone that this guy is worth flipping our rotation around.

It says as much or more about the relative lack of enthusiasm for Ferguson as it does Diallo. Everything's relative.

I think Abrines makes more sense than either one of them as a starter personally.

[retrobro90]

Hami had a season of major ups and downs at Kentucky. He either looked awesome (second game of the tourney) or unplayable with hardly any in between. There's two things though that really benefit him in the NBA game as opposed to his time at UK.

1. He's no longer a focal point of his team's offense. He may one day be a self creator in OKC but those opportunities will be few and far between with most of his offense either being set up for him by his teammates or he's getting put backs off offensive rebounds.

2. NBA spacing. Even with our cavalcade of sub-par perimeter shooters there's still much more room for him to operate in the deep paint. Already we've seen how adept he can be kicking out to open shooters off penetration.

It's hard to imagine Diallo being a decent shooter at this level. His misses are bad misses. He's never been good from the FT line. With his wrist flick it's almost like a 3 motion shot. Ideally/hopefully at some point in his career he's above 70% at the line and above 33% from 3. I wouldn't expect that this season though.

Diallo's passing has impressed me thus far. That could turn quick if he has a few heavy turnover games against defenders who know how to get in his air space. I haven't seen him throw any pocket passes or play in pick and roll but like I said he's very adept finding shooters after he's collapsed the defense and he had a really nice dish under the basket to Hervey in SL.

Ferguson has almost 0 skill with the ball in his hands. Any nice pass he's made is to a slipping big man when two defenders decide to trap Ferg on the 3 point line. I've seen him make that pass at least twice in SL and once in preseason. His handle is rudimentary and tentative. High dribbles with no shake or change of speed/direction. As of now, our org has to be betting on him turning into a plus defender who shoots <38% from 3. Even then he's maxed out as Tony Snell with a 40 inch vert (which is still a very nice player, just a gamble if he ever garners that kind of acumen).

It's obviously very early for both of these guys. This is just what I see and what I think.

Yeah, I’m not sold on Ferguson. His size alone bothers me. He’s small for shooting guard. Athletic as hell, but small.

Maybe it’s just me, but Diallo just looks more focused and locked in on the floor than Ferguson does. I’d be willing to bet money that Diallo pans out better than Ferguson will.

P.S. Diallo‘ arms are huge for his size.

Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

Ferguson is a fine size for the two. Certainly wouldn't call him small. He's not heavy enough to guard most starting calibre 3s unless it's like a Will Barton/Terrance Ross type but guys like McCollum/Redick/Avery Bradley are the ones that are small at that position. SG's average out at 6'5" with a 6'8" wingspan. Ferguson is 6'7" with a 6'9" wingspan. Ferg's trouble is just that he isn't skilled enough (yet?). He needs more in his arsenal to attack closeouts and he needs reps with good sets to understand how to move without the ball. I'm not completely in or out on either prospect but Diallo showed a whole lot more in SL and preseason than Ferguson did. If there was a decision to start either I'd choose Diallo without hesitation.

[sleestak33]

He's got potential and so does Deonte Burton. Roberson's career most likely is over with that injury and I think Presti knows that and that's why he brought in all these new wing players hoping one of them pans out. I have no idea what they see in Ferguson. I don't know that he's even an NBA caliber player.

[spearsy23]

Lost in the awful performance by everyone else Hami was terrible on defense last night. A lot of tough matchups on the clippers, but he got abused.

[Old Man Game]

Lost in the awful performance by everyone else Hami was terrible on defense last night. A lot of tough matchups on the clippers, but he got abused.

Yes. He wasn't good. I'll say this for the kid, he's had two tough assignments to start the season. First Klay Thompson and then Lou Williams.

[ThunderBolt]

He seems to get in the right spot for a lot of put backs. Unfortunately he’s shooting about 50% on layups.

[Kizz Fastfists]

Yes. He wasn't good. I'll say this for the kid, he's had two tough assignments to start the season. First Klay Thompson and then Lou Williams.

I have almost no expectations from either of the 20 year olds on the roster. They both need to develop and hopefully become contributors for next year. As high as I am on Ferguson, long-term, I still don't expect much from him this year. Diallo is a nice energy guy and while I see why people were high on him in the preseason that was not NBA action. Hami is too raw for us to expect him to be a real contributor this season.

TLC and Abrines should probably be the primary wings, with PG, due to their experience. When you are playing short-handed you need veterans not kids when the current skill level is as close as it is with all of them.

[Old Man Game]

Not a good night for the Diallo cold water thread. He looked every part of an eventual impact rotation player tonight. Just 1 game but the guy appears to have some ball skills to go along with the athleticism and makes typically sound decisions offensively in terms of when to attack and when to swing the ball back around, without looking passive or timid.

[ThunderBolt]

These Kentucky guys should continue to be given extra consideration when drafting.

[Old Man Game]

These Kentucky guys should continue to be given extra consideration when drafting.

It was nuts watching the game tonight. It was like like the UK reunion. Diallow, Fox, Cauley Stein, Patterson, Noel. Even Skal Labissiere got a couple minutes.