3/31 | G77: Dallas Mavericks at Oklahoma City Thunder - 3:30PM CST

[SecondTake]

One of the worst season as a Thunder fan. We had 2 greats months of MVPG and sweeping the Jazz/Blazers. Rest was a nightmare.

The worst part is that except Roberson our team was healthy during all season (Westbrook missed some games and PG13 is a bit hurt but nothing really serious)

We still have a few games left to right the ship. Ideally we get GS in the first round. The team will be super motivated for GS and and our personnel is perfect against those guys. Once we beat them in 6 or 7 I think we'll have our groove back enough to make a run the rest of the way.

lol...yeah this team is showing so much motivation and confidence. We just need Burton in order to beat Gs.

Nah, GS is another thing. Can you imagine the number of techs Russ would rack up against GS? He'll be playing at rage mode 9000. The rest of the guys will feed off that energy. They'll PNR cousins to death. They got the guys to guard GS and Schroder matches up good against their bench. Even without Burton we'll get it done in 7. With him it's a wrap in 6.

[bondom34]

I wish I were so lucky.

Yeah this year was finally the breaking point. Gave up, started following other teams. It's the same story as every other season, it's not even interesting.

you need to persevere man. what are you going to do if they re-build? just not be a thunder fan anymore? i guess you're not from oak city so it makes a little bit more sense for you. but, jeez. losing can be character building.

I'm already not really. I legitimately would be in a terrible mood for a day after every loss. It became rather boring seeing the same issues with depth and shooting and coaching every year. I get stressed out even dealing with this board at times Lately I've been on DT, watching other teams and just hanging around BSing with those guys. I've actually enjoyed the NBA. Like, really had fun. For the first time in years.

[Dadouv47]

Meanwhile spurs are losing and we lost a very good chance to end up 7th

[ThunderBolt]

I watched zero minutes of this game, and zero of the last few weeks.

I wish I were so lucky.

Yeah this year was finally the breaking point. Gave up, started following other teams. It's the same story as every other season, it's not even interesting.

I did the same thing with Oklahoma state. Deep down I’m still a fan though.

[slick_watts]

Yeah this year was finally the breaking point. Gave up, started following other teams. It's the same story as every other season, it's not even interesting.

you need to persevere man. what are you going to do if they re-build? just not be a thunder fan anymore? i guess you're not from oak city so it makes a little bit more sense for you. but, jeez. losing can be character building.

I'm already not really. I legitimately would be in a terrible mood for a day after every loss. It became rather boring seeing the same issues with depth and shooting and coaching every year. I get stressed out even dealing with this board at times Lately I've been on DT, watching other teams and just hanging around BSing with those guys. I've actually enjoyed the NBA. Like, really had fun. For the first time in years.

by on dt do you mean discord? the discord channel isn't that much fun to me anymore. plus i think some of them are close to figuring out my identity. i've said too much there.

i only get in really bad moods after 49ers losses these days, and only certain ones. investing emotions into sports is a tricky thing.

[bondom34]

you need to persevere man. what are you going to do if they re-build? just not be a thunder fan anymore? i guess you're not from oak city so it makes a little bit more sense for you. but, jeez. losing can be character building.

I'm already not really. I legitimately would be in a terrible mood for a day after every loss. It became rather boring seeing the same issues with depth and shooting and coaching every year. I get stressed out even dealing with this board at times Lately I've been on DT, watching other teams and just hanging around BSing with those guys. I've actually enjoyed the NBA. Like, really had fun. For the first time in years.

by on dt do you mean discord? the discord channel isn't that much fun to me anymore. plus i think some of them are close to figuring out my identity. i've said too much there.

i only get in really bad moods after 49ers losses these days, and only certain ones. investing emotions into sports is a tricky thing.

Yeah discord. I've found it more enjoyable, the only reason I ever remained following the Thunder were a little bit of Russ and a lot of I like the fans. On DT I can just hang out and talk whatever and they're cool. Plus been following a bunch of teams now that's sort of brought new views, just to see something different.

[Dn4sty]

Combined salary of Mavs bench today...Just under 8 million for a total of 55 points, 20 rebounds, 13 assists

OKC bench was horrid. It’s been bad all year. Schroder was terrible yet again

[Anderson Silva]

At least the playoffs wont be a dick tease. We'll get swept and fast. Then onto the offseason.
I used to defend Donovan, but at this point it seems he MUST have lost the locker room. The guys don't come out to play. Every game its the same story - get smashed Q1 and Part of Q2 - make it competitive late Q3 and then return to being shi*t and lose.

I love Russ - will always defend him, but this 'next question' bull in interviews is unacceptable. He needs to man up and answer the hard questions. He's the leader of this team and needs to start acting like it in the media. Also - how about some defense for more than 1-2 plays per game.

[Pillendreher]

Schroeder probably the only honest Thunder player right now by saying he doesn't know what is going wrong

I thought about that after the game: These guys have no idea why they're losing these games.

[slick_watts]

Schroeder probably the only honest Thunder player right now by saying he doesn't know what is going wrong

I thought about that after the game: These guys have no idea why they're losing these games.

fred katz said this about the 'OK3' last year.

[slick_watts]

I'm already not really. I legitimately would be in a terrible mood for a day after every loss. It became rather boring seeing the same issues with depth and shooting and coaching every year. I get stressed out even dealing with this board at times Lately I've been on DT, watching other teams and just hanging around BSing with those guys. I've actually enjoyed the NBA. Like, really had fun. For the first time in years.

by on dt do you mean discord? the discord channel isn't that much fun to me anymore. plus i think some of them are close to figuring out my identity. i've said too much there.

i only get in really bad moods after 49ers losses these days, and only certain ones. investing emotions into sports is a tricky thing.

Yeah discord. I've found it more enjoyable, the only reason I ever remained following the Thunder were a little bit of Russ and a lot of I like the fans. On DT I can just hang out and talk whatever and they're cool. Plus been following a bunch of teams now that's sort of brought new views, just to see something different.

your ronin-like fandom reminds me of a certain someone.

[Pillendreher]

Schroeder probably the only honest Thunder player right now by saying he doesn't know what is going wrong

I thought about that after the game: These guys have no idea why they're losing these games.

fred katz said this about the 'OK3' last year.

Erik Horne has been mentioning as well over the last couple of years. Which points towards a severe lack of coaching and severe lack of self awareness from our main guys.

[slick_watts]

I thought about that after the game: These guys have no idea why they're losing these games.

fred katz said this about the 'OK3' last year.

Erik Horne has been mentioning as well over the last couple of years. Which points towards a severe lack of coaching and severe lack of self awareness from our main guys.

iirc, katz's take was mostly centered around the players and the locker room. like a sense of disbelief that they were losing.

the thunder have for years been purported as one of the most data-driven teams in the nba. this characterization is at odds with a lot of what we end up seeing from player decision making, to lineup decision making, and even to front office decision making. i think that the thunder must know as an organization how they have to win games with this roster if they are going to win them. it's a question of where the disconnect happens. i thought that even though the offense was garbo the first few months of the year, that was probably the way the thunder had to play to win consistently.

[Pillendreher]

fred katz said this about the 'OK3' last year.

Erik Horne has been mentioning as well over the last couple of years. Which points towards a severe lack of coaching and severe lack of self awareness from our main guys.

iirc, katz's take was mostly centered around the players and the locker room. like a sense of disbelief that they were losing.

the thunder have for years been purported as one of the most data-driven teams in the nba. this characterization is at odds with a lot of what we end up seeing from player decision making, to lineup decision making, and even to front office decision making. i think that the thunder must know as an organization how they have to win games with this roster if they are going to win them. it's a question of where the disconnect happens. i thought that even though the offense was garbo the first few months of the year, that was probably the way the thunder had to play to win consistently.

It has to start with solid defensive effort all night long. But that has been quite rare these last 3 months:

[NetsWorld]

At least the playoffs wont be a dick tease. We'll get swept and fast. Then onto the offseason.
I used to defend Donovan, but at this point it seems he MUST have lost the locker room. The guys don't come out to play. Every game its the same story - get smashed Q1 and Part of Q2 - make it competitive late Q3 and then return to being shi*t and lose.

I love Russ - will always defend him, but this 'next question' bull in interviews is unacceptable. He needs to man up and answer the hard questions. He's the leader of this team and needs to start acting like it in the media. Also - how about some defense for more than 1-2 plays per game.

This is the reason why I brought up in another thread, is it time to move on from this roster completely and rebuild?

[slick_watts]

Erik Horne has been mentioning as well over the last couple of years. Which points towards a severe lack of coaching and severe lack of self awareness from our main guys.

iirc, katz's take was mostly centered around the players and the locker room. like a sense of disbelief that they were losing.

the thunder have for years been purported as one of the most data-driven teams in the nba. this characterization is at odds with a lot of what we end up seeing from player decision making, to lineup decision making, and even to front office decision making. i think that the thunder must know as an organization how they have to win games with this roster if they are going to win them. it's a question of where the disconnect happens. i thought that even though the offense was garbo the first few months of the year, that was probably the way the thunder had to play to win consistently.

It has to start with solid defensive effort all night long. But that has been quite rare these last 3 months:

i think focus is a more appropriate word than effort. there are times in the last couple months everyone is running around a lot and putting in a lot of 'effort' but we're getting scored on. relying so much on opponent tov% seems unsustainable, perhaps.

[Pillendreher]

On the Russ interview:

Read on Twitter

I didn't know the Tramel hate was going that far.

[Pillendreher]

iirc, katz's take was mostly centered around the players and the locker room. like a sense of disbelief that they were losing.

the thunder have for years been purported as one of the most data-driven teams in the nba. this characterization is at odds with a lot of what we end up seeing from player decision making, to lineup decision making, and even to front office decision making. i think that the thunder must know as an organization how they have to win games with this roster if they are going to win them. it's a question of where the disconnect happens. i thought that even though the offense was garbo the first few months of the year, that was probably the way the thunder had to play to win consistently.

It has to start with solid defensive effort all night long. But that has been quite rare these last 3 months:

i think focus is a more appropriate word than effort. there are times in the last couple months everyone is running around a lot and putting in a lot of 'effort' but we're getting scored on. relying so much on opponent tov% seems unsustainable, perhaps.

I guess it's both. Our style requires a lot of effort, but it's also useless without focus.

Regarding opp TOV%: Heading into January 6, the Thunder's four factor stats would rank as following on the whole season:

opp eFG%: 50.6 - 2nd
opp FTr: 0.263 - 18th
opp TOV%: 17.7 - 1st
opp ORB%: 26.1 - 8th

So I'd disagree with the notion that they were just relying on opp TOV%. But since January 6, everything has gone to ****:

opp eFG%: 53.6 - 24th
opp FTr: 0.281 - 26th
opp TOV%: 14.6 - 10th
opp ORB%: 27.0 - 12th

If you don't defend shots and send teams to the line all the time, you're going to struggle defending well.

Contest 2P%: 72.9 | 73.5
Contest 3P%: 80.7 | 79.6

In the "contest" data it's not as apparent though. Interestingly enough, pbpstats' data points toward luck being a factor:

Whereas opponents shot worse than expected against us based on their shot quality metric in the first 38 games (0.53 expected, .51 real), teams have outperformed expectations after game 38 (.053 expected, .536 real). And in both instances, we were in the bottom 10 in expected opposing eFG%, ie we gave up better shots than other teams.

[slick_watts]

It has to start with solid defensive effort all night long. But that has been quite rare these last 3 months:

i think focus is a more appropriate word than effort. there are times in the last couple months everyone is running around a lot and putting in a lot of 'effort' but we're getting scored on. relying so much on opponent tov% seems unsustainable, perhaps.

I guess it's both. Our style requires a lot of effort, but it's also useless without focus.

Regarding opp TOV%: Heading into January 6, the Thunder's four factor stats would rank as following on the whole season:

opp eFG%: 50.6 - 2nd
opp FTr: 0.263 - 18th
opp TOV%: 17.7 - 1st
opp ORB%: 26.1 - 8th

So I'd disagree with the notion that they were just relying on opp TOV%. But since January 6, everything has gone to ****:

opp eFG%: 53.6 - 24th
opp FTr: 0.281 - 26th
opp TOV%: 14.6 - 10th
opp ORB%: 27.0 - 12th

If you don't defend shots and send teams to the line all the time, you're going to struggle defending well.

Contest 2P%: 72.9 | 73.5
Contest 3P%: 80.7 | 79.6

In the "contest" data it's not as apparent though. Interestingly enough, pbpstats' data points toward luck being a factor:

Whereas opponents shot worse than expected against us based on their shot quality metric in the first 38 games (0.53 expected, .51 real), teams have outperformed expectations after game 38 (.053 expected, .536 real). And in both instances, we were in the bottom 10 in expected opposing eFG%, ie we gave up better shots than other teams.

opp efg% was good too yes but opp tov% was astronomical and our tov% differential was essentially the driving force of our team.

the split is pretty crazy. i can't find another example of a defense being that good for that long then dropoff that much without an injury.

[bondom34]

by on dt do you mean discord? the discord channel isn't that much fun to me anymore. plus i think some of them are close to figuring out my identity. i've said too much there.

i only get in really bad moods after 49ers losses these days, and only certain ones. investing emotions into sports is a tricky thing.

Yeah discord. I've found it more enjoyable, the only reason I ever remained following the Thunder were a little bit of Russ and a lot of I like the fans. On DT I can just hang out and talk whatever and they're cool. Plus been following a bunch of teams now that's sort of brought new views, just to see something different.

your ronin-like fandom reminds me of a certain someone.

Not sure what this means but ok. Maybe I'll see you on discord if you're ever there.