Thunder Offseason Thread

thor19 · Post #3821 » by **thor19** » Mon Jul 15, 2019 10:27 pm

Guess what Brandon clarke win summer league mvp

Post #3822 » by **ThunderBolt** » Mon Jul 15, 2019 10:37 pm

thor19 wrote:Guess what Brandon clarke win summer league mvp

Clarke is 6'8" with a paltry 6"8 wingspan. Presti couldn't trade back quick enough.

Kizz Fastfists · Post #3823 » by **Kizz Fastfists** » Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:01 pm

Let me know when the undersized PF that can't stretch the floor does something in the NBA. He will be 23 before the season starts making him fairly old for a rookie. Even Oladipo, who played 3 years of college ball, was only 21 his rookie year.

Post #3824 » by **ThunderBolt** » Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:11 pm

Starting to feel like this CP3 thing may drag on for a while.

Read on Twitter

Thunder Up · Post #3825 » by **Thunder Up** » Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:19 pm

I don't know if you guys realize this yet, but Windhorst is a clown and has no actual inside intel

Atomic Punk · Post #3826 » by **Atomic Punk** » Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:24 pm

Thunder Up wrote:I don't know if you guys realize this yet, but Windhorst is a clown and has no actual inside intel

Perhaps, but this is the precise tactic OKC should be taking right now, urgency is not in the Thunders vocabulary for the near future.

Post #3827 » by **slick_watts** » Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:31 pm

this is good news. returning their picks is the baseline? nice. hope it's true. giving one pick back would be highway robbery.

RunOKC · Post #3828 » by **RunOKC** » Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:32 pm

Whens the earliest Miami can trade a pick? Their 2023 pick has protections that could extend until 2026 I believe. They'd have to wait until 2021 to trade their 2028 pick if I'm thinking this through correctly (if their 2026 is held up they can't trade 2027 due to stepien rule - and you can't trade picks until 7years out)

Seems like we have more leverage than they are letting on here. If we don't trade them CP3 their picks will end up lower most likely, which is obviously good for us. If we do trade them CP3 and either give them 2023 or they make that unprotected and take back their 2021 pick, that opens up 2-3 more picks for them to try and get another star to pair up with CP3/Butler should they so choose. Hold pat Presti. No rush to appease CP3/Pat Riley.

Kizz Fastfists · Post #3829 » by **Kizz Fastfists** » Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:33 pm

Thunder Up wrote:I don't know if you guys realize this yet, but Windhorst is a clown and has no actual inside intel

Unless I am mistaken his entire career is based off him being LeBron's mouth piece in Cleveland. He turned that into a career despite not ever actually reporting anything other than what LeBron wanted him to write.

Kizz Fastfists · Post #3830 » by **Kizz Fastfists** » Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:35 pm

RunOKC wrote:Whens the earliest Miami can trade a pick? Their 2023 pick has protections that forbid them to trade it until 2026 I believe. They'd have to wait until 2021 to trade their 2028 pick if I'm thinking this through correctly (if their 2026 is held up they can't trade 2027 due to stepien rule?)

Basically. We could return the 2021 in exchange for dropping protections on the 2023 and their 2025 unprotected or give back the 2023 and take their 2024 or 2025. Miami has no leverage. Presti is in no hurry and no matter how many times Miami sends an idiot out to spew the same garbage it doesn't chance anything.

oreojenkins · Post #3831 » by **oreojenkins** » Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:41 pm

I think it's hilarious a journalist is referring to trade discussions as hilarious. But even more hilarious was how he really knocked that Westbrook to Miami talk out of the park.

dshearn · Post #3832 » by **dshearn** » Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:53 pm

Kizz Fastfists wrote:
RunOKC wrote:Whens the earliest Miami can trade a pick? Their 2023 pick has protections that forbid them to trade it until 2026 I believe. They'd have to wait until 2021 to trade their 2028 pick if I'm thinking this through correctly (if their 2026 is held up they can't trade 2027 due to stepien rule?)

Basically. We could return the 2021 in exchange for dropping protections on the 2023 and their 2025 unprotected or give back the 2023 and take their 2024 or 2025. Miami has no leverage. Presti is in no hurry and no matter how many times Miami sends an idiot out to spew the same garbage it doesn't chance anything.

I hopped over to get an OKC perspective on the rumor.....

This is interesting because i don't think anyone really...realllllyyyy wants CP. He would be ok at best, and that... contract.... is a massive negative.

Wouldn't it just be best for OKC to keep him? Why pay out draft picks to get rid of him. OKC really does have all the leverage here. They don't need him, and they don't need to pay to get rid of him. If some one sees value in him, great they can trade for him, if not...just let the dude sit on the roster.

I say that as a Heat fan, I don't want CP at any cost. That contact kills future flexibility, and i see why Miami would want to be paid to take that contract on. But i get OKCs view of it too.

thekaoswithin · Post #3833 » by **thekaoswithin** » Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:58 pm

...So who else is totally ok with keeping him? I'd rather not give up value to move him, if it doesn't work out then sucks that he didn't get an NTC and/or an albatross contract

Post #3834 » by **slick_watts** » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:04 am

thekaoswithin wrote:...So who else is totally ok with keeping him? I'd rather not give up value to move him, if it doesn't work out then sucks that he didn't get an NTC and/or an albatross contract

i wouldn't want to keep him if he wanted out. getting off his contract is worth compensation.

Atomic Punk · Post #3835 » by **Atomic Punk** » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:04 am

thekaoswithin wrote:...So who else is totally ok with keeping him? I'd rather not give up value to move him, if it doesn't work out then sucks that he didn't get an NTC and/or an albatross contract

The biggest problem I see with keeping him is that the guy seems unhappy when he is on a WINNING team. At this stage of his career he is going to be unbearable on a losing team getting limited minutes. However, if nothing makes sense on the trade front right now I would tell him to sit tight, chill out, play hard when he gets minutes, etc. Just be a solid pro and we will get you out of here eventually. Does CP have it in him? I’m not sure about that. If he could do that though, then yes, keep him for a while longer.

Kizz Fastfists · Post #3836 » by **Kizz Fastfists** » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:06 am

dshearn wrote:Wouldn't it just be best for OKC to keep him? Why pay out draft picks to get rid of him. OKC really does have all the leverage here. They don't need him, and they don't need to pay to get rid of him. If some one sees value in him, great they can trade for him, if not...just let the dude sit on the roster.

I say that as a Heat fan, I don't want CP at any cost. That contact kills future flexibility, and i see why Miami would want to be paid to take that contract on. But i get OKCs view of it too.

My only problem with keeping him for OKC is that he will add too many wins. He was a top 5 PG last season, when healthy. There is no rush to move him before the season when a team decides it wants to win more games they will make an offer appropriate for acquiring an all-star talent.

I don't see Miami as having any relevant flexibility as it is. After the Butler trade they are stuck on his 2-3 year window. CP3 fits that window. Giannias and other younger players aren't going to want to go play with a guy who is declining, by the time 2021 FA rolls around, and has never been able to get along in a locker room. I think Riley killed Miami's future by no keeping Richardson, who is entering his prime, while Butler is starting to drop off and Richardson is likely better and on a much cheaper contract when Miami needs the flexibility. I think Richardson, Winslow, Bam and Herro would have been a better group to stick with, although I only see Herro, Bam and Winslow as role players, given I think they would have had room for two max FAs in the 2021 off-season. Now they will have room for one, but that one will now have to want to join a declining Butler. I think CP3 gives Miami a chance at three more years in the playoffs. Right now I don't think they are any better, relative to the East, than they were last year and miss the playoffs the next several years while missing in FA because no one wants to go to a bad team. I'm not saying CP3 is an ideal fit for Miami, but this idea that they are going to build around Jimmy Butler, who will be 32 before Miami has any cap space doesn't make sense. I think Riley is done and needs to retire. He has had a GREAT career, but at 74 it is time for him to hang it up.

thor19 · Post #3837 » by **thor19** » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:34 am

The only two problems that I have cp3 here is one he give us more wins , two he can be a problem in the locker room
But Cp3 help Adams value if Presti want to trade Adams, maybe without a pg like westbrook, cp3 the defense focus more on Adams and make him look worst, also SGA can learn a trick or two from cp3 . I am ok with sending a pick with cp3 in a trade, at most two if we get back something good but , for a dieng, wiggins deal nooooo , two picks is too much

oreojenkins · Post #3838 » by **oreojenkins** » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:57 am

I know the max for waived and stretched money is 15% of the cap, is there a restriction on how much dead money in general a team can carry?

If there is no such restriction. Would CP3 decline his player option for immediate waiver? Next FA class sucks, he could probably get a 2 year 20 per deal to be made whole (or close enough), and he gets to pick where he wants to play. OKC is not going to use the cap space, they get $40 mil more off the books going forward, and their own picks get better in the short term. This is all assuming CP3 can't just be dumped for other salaries. If that's possible, seems better than sending out draft picks, and given the salary floor, not like we're actually spending $80 mil on those draft picks we aren't trading.

dshearn · Post #3839 » by **dshearn** » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:59 am

Kizz Fastfists wrote:
dshearn wrote:Wouldn't it just be best for OKC to keep him? Why pay out draft picks to get rid of him. OKC really does have all the leverage here. They don't need him, and they don't need to pay to get rid of him. If some one sees value in him, great they can trade for him, if not...just let the dude sit on the roster.

I say that as a Heat fan, I don't want CP at any cost. That contact kills future flexibility, and i see why Miami would want to be paid to take that contract on. But i get OKCs view of it too.

I don't see Miami as having any relevant flexibility as it is. After the Butler trade they are stuck on his 2-3 year window. CP3 fits that window. Giannias and other younger players aren't going to want to go play with a guy who is declining, by the time 2021 FA rolls around, and has never been able to get along in a locker room. I think Riley killed Miami's future by no keeping Richardson, who is entering his prime, while Butler is starting to drop off and Richardson is likely better and on a much cheaper contract when Miami needs the flexibility. I think Richardson, Winslow, Bam and Herro would have been a better group to stick with, although I only see Herro, Bam and Winslow as role players.

Thats a legit fear, but they didn't have any flexibility this year either...and added Butler. It's Miami, until its under water, it always stands a chance to attract free agents.

Cap space alone does has value. Who knows who could be disgruntled in the future. Who could be a sign an trade for expiring contracts. Moving a 40 million dollar Chris Paul i don't think will be easy today, i imagine it only gets much harder in the future. That becomes a huge cog to try and move. I would rather Mia not have to deal with that.

thor19 · Post #3840 » by **thor19** » Tue Jul 16, 2019 1:39 am

Other team think that cp3 is making that kind of money and averaging 4pts , 2 ast , 0.5 rbs , 5 tov and shooting .198 3p% . His number will improved now that he is not with harden