CAN play Kanter...LMAO

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Re: CAN play Kanter...LMAO 

Post#61 » by Andre Roberstan » Wed May 8, 2019 6:10 pm

hardenASG13 wrote:
slick_watts wrote:
hardenASG13 wrote:
Ok how bout this, per nbcsports.com

"In this series, Westbrook struggled to get to the rack and finish at a high level. He missed over half his layups, making just 48.8 percent of his shots at the rim (league average is about 60 percent). Westbrook finished with zero dunks in the series and his transition efficiency ranked dead-last among players with at least 20 transition plays, per NBA.com tracking. Normally, we could chalk that up to small sample size, but Westbrook ranked last in transition efficiency in the regular season among the 27 players with at least 250 transition plays. This is more than a blip."


yes, he had a bad series finishing at the rim against portland. so?


Ignoring the part about him being last in transition efficiency for the entire regular season, huh? Classic slick.


Justin's a big boy and can fight his own battles, but I am very interested to hear how we got from percentages at the rim to transition efficiency in the space of a single post. The goalposts just got launched into orbit.

FWIW I think Justin's a little numbers-obsessed sometimes, but I've checked the at-the-rim stuff on stats.nba.com both on efficiency and volume. There's literally no argument to be made there. It's open and shut. Russ was better at the rim.

Some of the pass and crash turnovers drove me nuts, though, and that's usually a function of the defense being free to help off non-shooters.
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Re: CAN play Kanter...LMAO 

Post#62 » by hardenASG13 » Wed May 8, 2019 6:19 pm

slick_watts wrote:
hardenASG13 wrote:You know exactly what I'm talking about. Name an NBA caliber 2 the thunder have tried to replace Roberson with, or who was backup him up all those years. Give a name. If you cant it means i haven't been "debunked " on anything re Roberson.


lol. what.

this actually made me laugh.



So you can't name anyone (because there haven't been any). Perfect
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Re: CAN play Kanter...LMAO 

Post#63 » by hardenASG13 » Wed May 8, 2019 6:26 pm

Andre Roberstan wrote:
hardenASG13 wrote:
slick_watts wrote:
yes, he had a bad series finishing at the rim against portland. so?


Ignoring the part about him being last in transition efficiency for the entire regular season, huh? Classic slick.


Justin's a big boy and can fight his own battles, but I am very interested to hear how we got from percentages at the rim to transition efficiency in the space of a single post. The goalposts just got launched into orbit.

FWIW I think Justin's a little numbers-obsessed sometimes, but I've checked the at-the-rim stuff on stats.nba.com both on efficiency and volume. There's literally no argument to be made there. It's open and shut. Russ was better at the rim.

Some of the pass and crash turnovers drove me nuts, though, and that's usually a function of the defense being free to help off non-shooters.


Westbrook historically has been a runaway train in transition, and effective in finishing at the rim there. It is suprising he ranked so poorly the last several years (not so much last season).

The percentages are what they are, but you guys seem to be ignoring the context in the stat. He wasn't able to finish over or through guys nearly as well. He could barely dunk! He went in turned it over or passed out to bums like Ferguson way too often, got blocked or missed the rim completely a ton. He wasn't the same offensive machine there as in years past, regardless of his fg %. I can't believe there are fans of this team who think otherwise tbh it was very clear in watching, which like it or not, is a big part of understanding when stats can be misleading or invalid, which is the case in a 5 person sport, all of the time.
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Re: CAN play Kanter...LMAO 

Post#64 » by slick_watts » Wed May 8, 2019 6:38 pm

hardenASG13 wrote:Westbrook historically has been a runaway train in transition, and effective in finishing at the rim there. It is suprising he ranked so poorly the last several years (not so much last season).


it's not surprising to people who pay attention to what actually happens. westbrook attempts a lot of jumpshots in transition and he's always been bad at those. this is why transition ppp that you cited from nbcsports is not even relevant to the discussion of him finishing at the rim. unless you find a way to separate out those attempts, which afaik there is no public tool available to do so.

hardenASG13 wrote:percentages are what they are, but you guys seem to be ignoring the context in the stat. He wasn't able to finish over or through guys nearly as well.


says who?

hardenASG13 wrote:He went in turned it over


westbrook turned it over less often on drives than he has since kevin durant left. so this is false.

hardenASG13 wrote:got blocked


westbrook was blocked on 4.62% of his field goal attempts, the lowest of his career.

hardenASG13 wrote:or missed the rim completely a ton.


do airballs count differently from any other misses?

hardenASG13 wrote:He wasn't the same offensive machine there as in years past, regardless of his fg %


well, that's true. but it's primarily because he got worse shooting the ball and teams are a lot better exploiting it. has nothing to do with his performance at the rim. that's the only thing that kept him from achilles kobe status!

hardenASG13 wrote:I can't believe there are fans of this team who think otherwise tbh it was very clear in watching, which like it or not, is a big part of understanding when stats can be misleading or invalid, which is the case in a 5 person sport, all of the time.


not only do i watch every game, but i have a photographic memory. i can recall every possession.
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Re: CAN play Kanter...LMAO 

Post#65 » by Andre Roberstan » Wed May 8, 2019 7:10 pm

We literally have a stat that says he shot it more at the rim and the ball went in more when he did it. I'm not sure what else you want. You can keep insisting on something that has no basis in observable, verified, documented, ironclad fact, or you can listen.

You're free to believe what you want, though. It's a free country. Being wrong is your right.

I don't always agree with Justin but I'm 100% with him here.
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Re: CAN play Kanter...LMAO 

Post#66 » by slick_watts » Wed May 8, 2019 7:45 pm

Andre Roberstan wrote:I don't always agree with Justin but I'm 100% with him here.


i enjoy how you always phrase your agreement with me. like you're ashamed of it.
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Re: CAN play Kanter...LMAO 

Post#67 » by Andre Roberstan » Wed May 8, 2019 8:28 pm

slick_watts wrote:
Andre Roberstan wrote:I don't always agree with Justin but I'm 100% with him here.


i enjoy how you always phrase your agreement with me. like you're ashamed of it.


You're my more abrasive inverse
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Re: CAN play Kanter...LMAO 

Post#68 » by acheema0 » Wed May 15, 2019 3:17 am

Kanter is looking mighty unplayable tonight. Who could have possibly seen this coming? This kind of defense worked against us b/c Russ can't shoot off the dribble (or at all). It was pretty obvious all along that Kanter would still be horrible against any team who had guards that could shoot. They have to bench him or they'll lose by 30 every night.
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Re: CAN play Kanter...LMAO 

Post#69 » by CROklahoma » Wed May 15, 2019 9:16 am

acheema0 wrote:Kanter is looking mighty unplayable tonight. Who could have possibly seen this coming? This kind of defense worked against us b/c Russ can't shoot off the dribble (or at all). It was pretty obvious all along that Kanter would still be horrible against any team who had guards that could shoot. They have to bench him or they'll lose by 30 every night.
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Oh really ? How come he could play against Denver who had guards that can shot ?
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Re: CAN play Kanter...LMAO 

Post#70 » by slick_watts » Wed May 15, 2019 11:24 am

CROklahoma wrote:
acheema0 wrote:Kanter is looking mighty unplayable tonight. Who could have possibly seen this coming? This kind of defense worked against us b/c Russ can't shoot off the dribble (or at all). It was pretty obvious all along that Kanter would still be horrible against any team who had guards that could shoot. They have to bench him or they'll lose by 30 every night.
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Oh really ? How come he could play against Denver who had guards that can shot ?


portland was -12.2pp100 with kanter on the court v. when kanter was off the court in the series. their starters were crushed by denver.
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Re: CAN play Kanter...LMAO 

Post#71 » by ThunderBolt » Wed May 15, 2019 11:51 am

It’s fair to say that our switch everything defense didn’t do Kanter any favors. However there a couple of things that the “can play Kanter”are overlooking. When Kanter was in okc he was essentially okc’s sixth man under Dononvan. The bench frequently stood around and watched Kanter post up. Donovans comments were not made about a regular season long term strategy but during a playoff game against Harden. Billy Donovan did play Kanter and did so almost to a fault. He played the same minutes that he got with Portland in the regular season.

The second thing is that Kanter is a buyout player for Portland. Okc was paying him $20 million a year. Big difference.
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Re: CAN play Kanter...LMAO 

Post#72 » by CROklahoma » Wed May 15, 2019 12:19 pm

slick_watts wrote:
CROklahoma wrote:
acheema0 wrote:Kanter is looking mighty unplayable tonight. Who could have possibly seen this coming? This kind of defense worked against us b/c Russ can't shoot off the dribble (or at all). It was pretty obvious all along that Kanter would still be horrible against any team who had guards that could shoot. They have to bench him or they'll lose by 30 every night.
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Oh really ? How come he could play against Denver who had guards that can shot ?


portland was -12.2pp100 with kanter on the court v. when kanter was off the court in the series. their starters were crushed by denver.


Their starters were trash because of Mo Harkless in the first place, and then Aminu.
You clearly aint watching games, why are you even discussing stuff ? Whats your purpose, are you following sports or mathematics ?

There are science forums where someone will gladly take all your lamenting about advanced stats and analytics ...
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Re: CAN play Kanter...LMAO 

Post#73 » by Old Man Game » Wed May 15, 2019 10:16 pm

And now Steph does what Steph does and Enes, if he hasn't already, had better be planning his summer vacation.

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Re: CAN play Kanter...LMAO 

Post#74 » by Thunder Up » Sun May 19, 2019 1:47 pm

lol
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Re: CAN play Kanter...LMAO 

Post#75 » by slick_watts » Sun May 19, 2019 5:41 pm

this thread isn't aging well.
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Re: CAN play Kanter...LMAO 

Post#76 » by hardenASG13 » Sun May 19, 2019 10:34 pm

slick_watts wrote:this thread isn't aging well.


How many traditional centers wouldn't be getting exploited in the pnr against them? Adams would get torched, he couldn't stay on the floor vs. Portland. Capella couldn't stay on the floor vs. them. Nobody is saying kanter is an all star. The warriors are a nightmare for most centers, especially with the style they are playing without kd.
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Re: CAN play Kanter...LMAO 

Post#77 » by slick_watts » Sun May 19, 2019 10:50 pm

hardenASG13 wrote:
slick_watts wrote:this thread isn't aging well.


How many traditional centers wouldn't be getting exploited in the pnr against them? Adams would get torched, he couldn't stay on the floor vs. Portland. Capella couldn't stay on the floor vs. them. Nobody is saying kanter is an all star. The warriors are a nightmare for most centers, especially with the style they are playing without kd.


kanter sucks, dude. what did i tell you early in this thread? you claim your victories way too early.

do you recall us taking the 72 win warriors to seven games with adams playing and kanter riding the bench? kanter can't even stay on the court against these warriors. womp womp.
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Re: CAN play Kanter...LMAO 

Post#78 » by hardenASG13 » Mon May 20, 2019 12:16 am

slick_watts wrote:
hardenASG13 wrote:
slick_watts wrote:this thread isn't aging well.


How many traditional centers wouldn't be getting exploited in the pnr against them? Adams would get torched, he couldn't stay on the floor vs. Portland. Capella couldn't stay on the floor vs. them. Nobody is saying kanter is an all star. The warriors are a nightmare for most centers, especially with the style they are playing without kd.


kanter sucks, dude. what did i tell you early in this thread? you claim your victories way too early.

do you recall us taking the 72 win warriors to seven games with adams playing and kanter riding the bench? kanter can't even stay on the court against these warriors. womp womp.


Yea, I think Kevin Durant and Westbrook had alot to do with it. Kanter could've played with adams on the bench too, that team was really good. That was also 3 years ago. Adams had only gotten slower and more overpaid. These warriors have looked extremely good the last few. There's no place for a slow footed center against them. This thread was a shot to what He did against the thunder. It was never suggested he'd be amazing vs. The warriors, who are on a completely different level than the rest of the West....and almost any team, ever.

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