Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick

Moderators: Andre Roberstan, ThunderBolt

Greatest Okc THUNDER

Westbrook
12
67%
Durant
4
22%
Nick Collison
2
11%
 
Total votes: 18

User avatar
DaT WaVeY RiCaN
Starter
Posts: 2,304
And1: 2,831
Joined: Jan 23, 2013
Location: 860 CT
     

Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#1 » by DaT WaVeY RiCaN » Sat Jan 11, 2020 8:22 pm

Thread inspired by the gb

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1928661
User avatar
ThunderBolt
Forum Mod - Thunder
Forum Mod - Thunder
Posts: 13,148
And1: 10,820
Joined: Dec 29, 2016
Location: Bentonville, AR
   

Re: Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#2 » by ThunderBolt » Sat Jan 11, 2020 10:10 pm

It really depends on how you define "greatest" and how much off the court impact is factored in to that. I don't really see how Nick Collison has an argument for that. He's probably the least controversial of the first generation core players for the thunder. Everyone remembers him fondly but that's about the extent of it.
Dadouv47
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,661
And1: 2,557
Joined: Mar 22, 2015
   

Re: Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#3 » by Dadouv47 » Sat Jan 11, 2020 10:24 pm

Russ = greatest Thunder of all time
Durant = Greatest player wearing a Thunder uniform

Don't know why Nick is in the poll but whatever.
Kizz Fastfists
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,478
And1: 1,354
Joined: Jun 05, 2014
   

Re: Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#4 » by Kizz Fastfists » Sat Jan 11, 2020 10:57 pm

Durant is the best player to play for the Thunder. Russ was more dedicated to the franchise/city. However, I would make an argument for PG given that he resigned then allowed Presti to make one of the best trades in NBA history sending him to LAC. Now the PG argument is more of a joke, but the point is that without setting a definition for greatest you could make the case for what PG gave the franchise. You could also argue Ibaka since he was very good and a fan favorite while here and his trade led to the PG return. If Adams plays out his whole career in OKC I think he will be called the greatest, at least for now, because of his blend of on the court production and his personality.
"The biggest enemy of the negro is the white liberal." - Malcolm X
User avatar
spearsy23
RealGM
Posts: 18,790
And1: 7,226
Joined: Jan 27, 2012
   

Re: Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#5 » by spearsy23 » Sat Jan 11, 2020 11:21 pm

It's Westbrook. There's no legitimate argument for anyone else. Durant has done everything in his own power to distance himself from the franchise, and that matters.
“If you're getting stops and you're making threes and the other team's not scoring, that's when you're going to see a huge point difference there,” coach Billy Donovan said.
Dadouv47
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,661
And1: 2,557
Joined: Mar 22, 2015
   

Re: Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#6 » by Dadouv47 » Sun Jan 12, 2020 12:48 am

spearsy23 wrote:It's Westbrook. There's no legitimate argument for anyone else. Durant has done everything in his own power to distance himself from the franchise, and that matters.


Pretty much. Don't even know how cupcake has 2 votes (and Nick as well)
Dadouv47
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,661
And1: 2,557
Joined: Mar 22, 2015
   

Re: Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#7 » by Dadouv47 » Sun Jan 12, 2020 12:54 am

Kizz Fastfists wrote:Durant is the best player to play for the Thunder. Russ was more dedicated to the franchise/city. However, I would make an argument for PG given that he resigned then allowed Presti to make one of the best trades in NBA history sending him to LAC. Now the PG argument is more of a joke, but the point is that without setting a definition for greatest you could make the case for what PG gave the franchise. You could also argue Ibaka since he was very good and a fan favorite while here and his trade led to the PG return. If Adams plays out his whole career in OKC I think he will be called the greatest, at least for now, because of his blend of on the court production and his personality.


PG13 clearly not in the top 5 but I understand your point. He was the first star that we didn't draft to decide to stay in OKC. And if he walked after one season, we would have traded Oladipo and Sabonis for a rental. His first year in OKC wasn't good but MPVG was a lot of fun. Thanks to him we have SGA/Gallo and 5 FRP.

So yeah in the end Russ and Paul George are the reason why we may a bright future instead of a very painful rebuild without any assets.
User avatar
Galloisdaman
Starter
Posts: 2,467
And1: 1,244
Joined: Mar 17, 2011

Re: Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#8 » by Galloisdaman » Sun Jan 12, 2020 8:08 pm

Dadouv47 wrote:Russ = greatest Thunder of all time
Durant = Greatest player wearing a Thunder uniform

Don't know why Nick is in the poll but whatever.


I think that sums it up very well. Obviously KD was the best player but because of other factors Russ is probably viewed as best by fans.
My eyes glaze over when reading alternative stat (not advanced stat) narratives that go many paragraphs long. If you can not make your point in 2 paragraphs it may not be a great point. :D
User avatar
Old Man Game
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,282
And1: 3,586
Joined: Jul 15, 2012

Re: Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#9 » by Old Man Game » Mon Jan 13, 2020 5:06 am

Durant for sure. He's a head case but he's easily the best player and reason this franchise matters.

Sent from my Pixel using RealGM mobile app
Drygon
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,891
And1: 3,400
Joined: Dec 18, 2018

Re: Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#10 » by Drygon » Mon Jan 13, 2020 5:13 am

I don't understand why people believes Westbrook as the greatest player ever for Thunder.

OKC never made it out from the 1st round with Westbrook as the clear-cut franchise player between 2016-2019.

Keep in mind that OKC got an MVP-level player in Paul George as KD's replacement.

OKC became the 1st team in NBA history to top $300m in salary & luxury tax

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2784460-thunder-to-become-1st-team-in-nba-history-to-top-300m-in-salary-and-luxury-tax

Dadouv47 wrote:Don't know why Nick is in the poll but whatever.


ThunderBolt wrote:It really depends on how you define "greatest" and how much off the court impact is factored in to that. I don't really see how Nick Collison has an argument for that. He's probably the least controversial of the first generation core players for the thunder. Everyone remembers him fondly but that's about the extent of it.


I don't think it's controversial to add Nick Collison in that poll.

Nick Collision has played more seasons for OKC and is significantly much more beloved than KD.

After all, those arguments is why some people justifies Westbrook ahead of KD in this subject.
User avatar
ThunderBolt
Forum Mod - Thunder
Forum Mod - Thunder
Posts: 13,148
And1: 10,820
Joined: Dec 29, 2016
Location: Bentonville, AR
   

Re: Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#11 » by ThunderBolt » Mon Jan 13, 2020 1:38 pm

Spoiler:
Drygon wrote:I don't understand why people believes Westbrook as the greatest player ever for Thunder.

OKC never made it out from the 1st round with Westbrook as the clear-cut franchise player between 2016-2019.

Keep in mind that OKC got an MVP-level player in Paul George as KD's replacement.

OKC became the 1st team in NBA history to top $300m in salary & luxury tax

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2784460-thunder-to-become-1st-team-in-nba-history-to-top-300m-in-salary-and-luxury-tax

Dadouv47 wrote:Don't know why Nick is in the poll but whatever.


ThunderBolt wrote:It really depends on how you define "greatest" and how much off the court impact is factored in to that. I don't really see how Nick Collison has an argument for that. He's probably the least controversial of the first generation core players for the thunder. Everyone remembers him fondly but that's about the extent of it.


I don't think it's controversial to add Nick Collison in that poll.

Nick Collision has played more seasons for OKC and is significantly much more beloved than KD.

After all, those arguments is why some people justifies Westbrook ahead of KD in this subject.


How far would Nick Collison have led his team being the best or even second best player? Like we said, it depends on you define "great". You are lessening Russ' value based on his on court performance and increasing Nick's because of longevity and popularity. You can't have if both ways.
User avatar
spearsy23
RealGM
Posts: 18,790
And1: 7,226
Joined: Jan 27, 2012
   

Re: Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#12 » by spearsy23 » Mon Jan 13, 2020 2:24 pm

Old Man Game wrote:Durant for sure. He's a head case but he's easily the best player and reason this franchise matters.

Sent from my Pixel using RealGM mobile app

How is Kevin Durant more responsible for our relevance than Westbrook? If anything Westbrook is far more important. If he doesn't re-sign we never get PG, and we end up losing shai plus those 10 picks we acquired.

Was he the best basketball player? Sure, but by how much? Certainly nowhere near enough to overcome the way he left, or the shots he took on the way out. everything that Durant accomplished in okc russ matched.
“If you're getting stops and you're making threes and the other team's not scoring, that's when you're going to see a huge point difference there,” coach Billy Donovan said.
Anderson Silva
Ballboy
Posts: 36
And1: 20
Joined: Dec 17, 2012

Re: Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#13 » by Anderson Silva » Tue Jan 14, 2020 6:19 am

Drygon wrote:I don't understand why people believes Westbrook as the greatest player ever for Thunder.

OKC never made it out from the 1st round with Westbrook as the clear-cut franchise player between 2016-2019.

Keep in mind that OKC got an MVP-level player in Paul George as KD's replacement.

OKC became the 1st team in NBA history to top $300m in salary & luxury tax

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2784460-thunder-to-become-1st-team-in-nba-history-to-top-300m-in-salary-and-luxury-tax

Dadouv47 wrote:Don't know why Nick is in the poll but whatever.


ThunderBolt wrote:It really depends on how you define "greatest" and how much off the court impact is factored in to that. I don't really see how Nick Collison has an argument for that. He's probably the least controversial of the first generation core players for the thunder. Everyone remembers him fondly but that's about the extent of it.


I don't think it's controversial to add Nick Collison in that poll.

Nick Collision has played more seasons for OKC and is significantly much more beloved than KD.

After all, those arguments is why some people justifies Westbrook ahead of KD in this subject.


Best does not equal greatest to me.
Greatness is not just skills. Its personality, never give up, win at all costs, loyalty, its what it meant to the team, city and franchise. Sure Skill for Skill KD is better, but he is not Greater than Russ
User avatar
Old Man Game
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,282
And1: 3,586
Joined: Jul 15, 2012

Re: Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#14 » by Old Man Game » Tue Jan 14, 2020 12:22 pm

spearsy23 wrote:
Old Man Game wrote:Durant for sure. He's a head case but he's easily the best player and reason this franchise matters.

Sent from my Pixel using RealGM mobile app

How is Kevin Durant more responsible for our relevance than Westbrook? If anything Westbrook is far more important. If he doesn't re-sign we never get PG, and we end up losing shai plus those 10 picks we acquired.

Was he the best basketball player? Sure, but by how much? Certainly nowhere near enough to overcome the way he left, or the shots he took on the way out. everything that Durant accomplished in okc russ matched.


Durant's greatness allowed the team to build a culture wherein Westbrook could ever even become what he has. If Greg Oden falls to 2 in that draft I doubt Westbrook ever accomplishes a third of what he has. Sorry if that take is too hot to handle.
User avatar
spearsy23
RealGM
Posts: 18,790
And1: 7,226
Joined: Jan 27, 2012
   

Re: Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#15 » by spearsy23 » Tue Jan 14, 2020 1:33 pm

Old Man Game wrote:
spearsy23 wrote:
Old Man Game wrote:Durant for sure. He's a head case but he's easily the best player and reason this franchise matters.

Sent from my Pixel using RealGM mobile app

How is Kevin Durant more responsible for our relevance than Westbrook? If anything Westbrook is far more important. If he doesn't re-sign we never get PG, and we end up losing shai plus those 10 picks we acquired.

Was he the best basketball player? Sure, but by how much? Certainly nowhere near enough to overcome the way he left, or the shots he took on the way out. everything that Durant accomplished in okc russ matched.


Durant's greatness allowed the team to build a culture wherein Westbrook could ever even become what he has. If Greg Oden falls to 2 in that draft I doubt Westbrook ever accomplishes a third of what he has. Sorry if that take is too hot to handle.

...durant was with the franchise one year longer than Westbrook. Westbrook made the all star game one year after Durant made his first. Somehow attributing Westbrook's growth as a player to durant building a culture when they literally arrived in okc at the same time makes no sense.

I just filtered by rookie seasons where guys averaged at least 15/5, and 2/3 of them are hall of famers, and they're almost all all stars. Russell Westbrook became Russell Westbrook because he was supremely talented. How is it that even after he's gone for years Kevin Durant is still attributed all successes for his years here and Westbrook continues to be his human shield?
“If you're getting stops and you're making threes and the other team's not scoring, that's when you're going to see a huge point difference there,” coach Billy Donovan said.
User avatar
Old Man Game
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,282
And1: 3,586
Joined: Jul 15, 2012

Re: Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#16 » by Old Man Game » Wed Jan 15, 2020 4:05 am

spearsy23 wrote:
Old Man Game wrote:
spearsy23 wrote:How is Kevin Durant more responsible for our relevance than Westbrook? If anything Westbrook is far more important. If he doesn't re-sign we never get PG, and we end up losing shai plus those 10 picks we acquired.

Was he the best basketball player? Sure, but by how much? Certainly nowhere near enough to overcome the way he left, or the shots he took on the way out. everything that Durant accomplished in okc russ matched.


Durant's greatness allowed the team to build a culture wherein Westbrook could ever even become what he has. If Greg Oden falls to 2 in that draft I doubt Westbrook ever accomplishes a third of what he has. Sorry if that take is too hot to handle.

...durant was with the franchise one year longer than Westbrook. Westbrook made the all star game one year after Durant made his first. Somehow attributing Westbrook's growth as a player to durant building a culture when they literally arrived in okc at the same time makes no sense.

I just filtered by rookie seasons where guys averaged at least 15/5, and 2/3 of them are hall of famers, and they're almost all all stars. Russell Westbrook became Russell Westbrook because he was supremely talented. How is it that even after he's gone for years Kevin Durant is still attributed all successes for his years here and Westbrook continues to be his human shield?


Setting aside the sufficiency of the timing of Durant's tenure to establish culture (of which we could argue in circles to no end) I'll just say it this way, I believe Durant's presence was a necessary condition to Westbrook's development and success. If Russ is drafted to this franchise without a supreme talent like that on hand to bear most the spotlight and scoring burden I think he ends up like a PG Boogies Cousins or something similar. A good player ultimately spinning his wheels in an NBA backwater.
Balkman32
Assistant Coach
Posts: 3,997
And1: 591
Joined: Jul 19, 2007
 

Re: Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#17 » by Balkman32 » Thu Jan 16, 2020 4:16 pm

Its not the cupcake. I don't care how good he was for the Thunder, he left us to go to the best regular season team ever. I think he will forever be frustrated with the fact that he left the way he did to go to the team he went to to be outcast with the Warriors is comical.

For being one of the top 20 (probably 10) players to ever play this game he just does not have that killer instinct.
Drygon
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,891
And1: 3,400
Joined: Dec 18, 2018

Re: Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#18 » by Drygon » Tue Jan 28, 2020 4:24 pm

Balkman32 wrote:Its not the cupcake. I don't care how good he was for the Thunder, he left us to go to the best regular season team ever. I think he will forever be frustrated with the fact that he left the way he did to go to the team he went to to be outcast with the Warriors is comical.

For being one of the top 20 (probably 10) players to ever play this game he just does not have that killer instinct.


:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

;t
User avatar
prophet_of_rage
RealGM
Posts: 10,425
And1: 2,803
Joined: Jan 06, 2005

Re: Greatest Thunder of all time: Russ vs KD vs Nick 

Post#19 » by prophet_of_rage » Thu Mar 26, 2020 11:20 pm

Russ

Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk

Return to Oklahoma City Thunder