Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread

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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#181 » by jambalaya » Thu Jun 11, 2020 5:01 pm

September 25, 2017: a future 2018 2nd round draft pick by the Oklahoma City Thunder (became Mitchell Robinson) traded with Enes Kanter and Doug McDermott to the New York Knicks for Carmelo Anthony.

I know it helped get Russ extended but this was a bad trade overall. Mainly mentioned because didn't know that draft pick became Mitchell Robinson, the most valuable piece of the trade from the perspective of now & future. Ouch.
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#182 » by jambalaya » Thu Jun 11, 2020 5:14 pm

There are some names on Thor's list (previous page) I'd be ok with it they got (generally unlikely though). The name I would highlight would be RHJeff. As a 25-30 min / gm forward. Probably more PF, especially with 3 guards and running. Unclear how much he might get paid. Probably modest and good value.
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#183 » by getrichordie » Fri Jun 12, 2020 2:05 am

jambalaya wrote:September 25, 2017: a future 2018 2nd round draft pick by the Oklahoma City Thunder (became Mitchell Robinson) traded with Enes Kanter and Doug McDermott to the New York Knicks for Carmelo Anthony.

I know it helped get Russ extended but this was a bad trade overall. Mainly mentioned because didn't know that draft pick became Mitchell Robinson, the most valuable piece of the trade from the perspective of now & future. Ouch.


If this was a deal breaker for Westbrook signing his extension (and I'm not sure it was), you do this trade 99/100 times. We ended up trading Westbrook for Paul + a handful of picks. I think we did the right thing. Mitchell averages 23 MP per night on a bad Knicks team. Kanter is awful. McDermott is solid.
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#184 » by bondom34 » Fri Jun 12, 2020 4:40 am

getrichordie wrote:
jambalaya wrote:September 25, 2017: a future 2018 2nd round draft pick by the Oklahoma City Thunder (became Mitchell Robinson) traded with Enes Kanter and Doug McDermott to the New York Knicks for Carmelo Anthony.

I know it helped get Russ extended but this was a bad trade overall. Mainly mentioned because didn't know that draft pick became Mitchell Robinson, the most valuable piece of the trade from the perspective of now & future. Ouch.


If this was a deal breaker for Westbrook signing his extension (and I'm not sure it was), you do this trade 99/100 times. We ended up trading Westbrook for Paul + a handful of picks. I think we did the right thing. Mitchell averages 23 MP per night on a bad Knicks team. Kanter is awful. McDermott is solid.

I'd also add there's no evidence Robinson would have been the pick either way. But yeah, this was in a poll for Thunder fans on the Athletic and the basic consensus was the Melo trade was bad but it was good if it was a requirement for the extension. That led to that trade and PG and then the whole package there.
FoundANewSlant wrote:it's really fundamental defensive flaws exhibited here by Westbrook, PG, and Adams that put Melo into vulnerable positions here yet you can't recognize or explain it.

So Paul George is the reason Carmelo Anthony struggled on defense all these years...
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#185 » by jambalaya » Fri Jun 12, 2020 5:45 am

Could / should there have been a better deal out there than Melo on top of Paul George to satisfy Westbrook or at least not dissatisfy him greatly? I'd say probably yes. What was done didn't work and not anywhere close and eventually led to him asking out. Past is past. And also remembered.


To win a title, I once said you need to do at least 7 things right and probably only 2-3 things wrong within a window. At their early peak Presti had done at least 7 things right but he probably did a few too many things wrong, and over and over. Wrong coach, wrong back up point guards, not enough wing shooters, wrong team age profile. Over catering for superstars. Eventually the number of things done right declined as well.

In transition or early next era. Got to get more right and / or less wrong to win a title.
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#186 » by Galloisdaman » Fri Jun 12, 2020 10:09 pm

Admittedly I'm not a Melo guy but I have always liked my teams to go for it. I figure there are 29 losers a year. Might as well go for it. I think thats what OKC did with Melo. I think that is what LAC did with PG. Melo was still a 22ppg guy at that time.
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#187 » by ThunderBolt » Sun Jun 14, 2020 5:14 pm

Still hoping the Lauri Markkannen rumblings materialize in to something.
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#188 » by thor19 » Thu Jun 18, 2020 11:33 pm

[instagram][/instagram]
ThunderBolt wrote:Still hoping the Lauri Markkannen rumblings materialize in to something.

We give our denver pick 25 to bulls and our second to hornets, 51
Hornets give 32 pick get 51 and give 58 to bulls
Bulls give their second to okc and get 25
And make this player trade
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#189 » by thor19 » Thu Jun 18, 2020 11:33 pm

thor19 wrote:[instagram][/instagram]
ThunderBolt wrote:Still hoping the Lauri Markkannen rumblings materialize in to something.

We give our denver pick 25 to bulls and our second to hornets, 51
Hornets give 32 pick get 51 and give 58 to bulls
Bulls give their second to okc and get 25
And make this player trade :
http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yaxc2lg3
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#190 » by thor19 » Fri Jun 19, 2020 2:32 am

Maybe bulls dont give us their second and we send ferguson and hornets hernagomez
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#191 » by ThunderBolt » Fri Jun 19, 2020 11:46 am

That's pretty terrible for chicago.
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#192 » by thor19 » Fri Jun 19, 2020 5:45 pm

ThunderBolt wrote:That's pretty terrible for chicago.

Every time that I see it I think the same , think of sending ferguson, and hornets send hernagomez to bulls they dont send their second to us, and we send our denver pick and one of the worst pick from other teams we own . I like the main pieces and the reason, chicago get a leader , give the team to coby white and wendell , and their pick this year, their starting will be, cp3, coby white, otto, thad young, wendell, maybe try to get A Davis home ? Get out of Lavine that some bulls fans dont lika and dont lost Lauri for nothing. Hornets get some offense, can sign Graham, their starting five will be , graham, lavine, miles bridge, pj and zeller, also they keep their first so can keep getting better, and we get out of cp3 contract and lost one pick next year and change this year denver pick for the 32 from hornets , get lauri to pair with SGA, and rozier to be our 6 man and get felicio contract, our starting lineup will be dennis, SGA, (sf spot need to be fill ) lauri and adams and the 6 man rozier
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#193 » by jambalaya » Sat Jun 20, 2020 4:07 pm

That trade proposal is one of the least realistic I have seen. New GM unlikely to trade Markkanen period. If he does, he probably wants 2 firsts. Especially from the Thunder. Not saying they get that. It would be a long negotiation if it happens.
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#194 » by thor19 » Sat Jun 20, 2020 5:22 pm

jambalaya wrote:That trade proposal is one of the least realistic I have seen. New GM unlikely to trade Markkanen period. If he does, he probably wants 2 firsts. Especially from the Thunder. Not saying they get that. It would be a long negotiation if it happens.

To be honest lauri is that type of player that want to be traded but the team want a lot for him, if we trade paul our best option are nyk probably we get randle, dennis smith or knox , sixers if the hit panic buttom and we get hortford, a pick and zhaire smith or hortford and richarson, maybe we can put some picks and get simmonn( :lol: ) for cp3 , bucks if they want to upgrade bledsoe but dont think so, maybe denver for g harris, barton and filler but dont think we can trade cp3 so easily
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#195 » by skywalker33 » Sat Jun 20, 2020 8:49 pm

Saw this trade on the TnT board but I wanted to know if this was a punk or not:

Denver in: Chris Paul,
Denver out: Gary Harris, Jamal Murray
Denver goes for it. Gets rid of 2 questionable contracts and gets an All-nba player in return

OKC in: Gary Harris, Jamal Murray
OKC out: CP3
Gets 2 players that fit their timeline, while dumping a player that doesn't.


Here's a DEN perspective, I'd love to hear a OKC perspective to help me stop laughing.

First, you want to trade a 23yo and a 26yo for a 35yo to help with OKC's timeline. Funny thing about that is Murray and Harris fit perfectly into DEN's timeline, why screw it up ?

Secondly, it was argued Paul is a MUCH better player, in his prime I'd have to agree with this. However, Paul has realistically 2-3 more good years, Murray probably has 7-12 and still hasn't reached his prime. And just checking his stats vs Pauls form last year, they're very comparable yet surely headed in different directions IMO. Harris has had two consecutive down years on offense but still is a defensive stalwart, check out 2019 PO series. He, at worst has 5-7 good defensive years and has an opportunity to rebound on the offensive end.

Third, Paul is a great player with the ball in his hands, much better (at this point in his career) than Murray is. HOWEVER, in Denver, Jokic is the player who excels with the ball in HIS hands, so if the trade were to happen, which players skills do you diminish, Joker's or CP3's ??? Murray on the other hand is a much better fit next to Jokic as he doesn't need the ball in his hands to be effective, chemistry between Murray and Joker is blossoming, it would end quickly with CP3 replacing Murray.

How about the money ?? Denver can't afford to add ONE player for two even if the amt's are comparable. Dividing CP3's salary into two more movable pieces is a stronger move for any small market team, how many #1's did HOU give up for you to TAKE Chris Pauls's salary ??...and then TheProfessor has the gall to say the Nuggets should be adding a #1...RIDICULOUS !!!!

Don't get me wrong, I have always been a fan of CP3 but the proposal of this trade is so lopsided IMO (when was the last time CP3 was All-NBA 5 seasons ago ?) I had to get an OKC different perspective. Only OKC fans and Texas Chuck, who I believe is a notorious Nuggets-detractor are the only ones who stood up for this trade on TnT, help me to take a 2nd look here Guys.
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#196 » by thor19 » Sat Jun 20, 2020 10:57 pm

skywalker33 wrote:Saw this trade on the TnT board but I wanted to know if this was a punk or not:

Denver in: Chris Paul,
Denver out: Gary Harris, Jamal Murray
Denver goes for it. Gets rid of 2 questionable contracts and gets an All-nba player in return

OKC in: Gary Harris, Jamal Murray
OKC out: CP3
Gets 2 players that fit their timeline, while dumping a player that doesn't.


Here's a DEN perspective, I'd love to hear a OKC perspective to help me stop laughing.

First, you want to trade a 23yo and a 26yo for a 35yo to help with OKC's timeline. Funny thing about that is Murray and Harris fit perfectly into DEN's timeline, why screw it up ?

Secondly, it was argued Paul is a MUCH better player, in his prime I'd have to agree with this. However, Paul has realistically 2-3 more good years, Murray probably has 7-12 and still hasn't reached his prime. And just checking his stats vs Pauls form last year, they're very comparable yet surely headed in different directions IMO. Harris has had two consecutive down years on offense but still is a defensive stalwart, check out 2019 PO series. He, at worst has 5-7 good defensive years and has an opportunity to rebound on the offensive end.

Third, Paul is a great player with the ball in his hands, much better (at this point in his career) than Murray is. HOWEVER, in Denver, Jokic is the player who excels with the ball in HIS hands, so if the trade were to happen, which players skills do you diminish, Joker's or CP3's ??? Murray on the other hand is a much better fit next to Jokic as he doesn't need the ball in his hands to be effective, chemistry between Murray and Joker is blossoming, it would end quickly with CP3 replacing Murray.

How about the money ?? Denver can't afford to add ONE player for two even if the amt's are comparable. Dividing CP3's salary into two more movable pieces is a stronger move for any small market team, how many #1's did HOU give up for you to TAKE Chris Pauls's salary ??...and then TheProfessor has the gall to say the Nuggets should be adding a #1...RIDICULOUS !!!!

Don't get me wrong, I have always been a fan of CP3 but the proposal of this trade is so lopsided IMO (when was the last time CP3 was All-NBA 5 seasons ago ?) I had to get an OKC different perspective. Only OKC fans and Texas Chuck, who I believe is a notorious Nuggets-detractor are the only ones who stood up for this trade on TnT, help me to take a 2nd look here Guys.

To be honest I will not make that trade if I am denver Murray is a good player for me is underrated, I suggest a trade that send gary harris, barton and fillers something like this , http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=y7ts49or denver made a win now move and can keep murray, joker and porter jr, their murray can play the sg and you will have one of the best passing and playmaking team in the league, cp3, murray and joker can make plays and have porter jr , bates diop and grant in the sf/pf spot , okc can make that trade to get out of cp3 contract and have more pieces to move if they finally dont like harris or barton , okc will NOT give any picks in this team, maybe nuggets can give a second but to be honest if we dont change cp3 for a bad contract I think we can ask for more picks , the only team I will ask for picks if we made a trade is 76ers and we take hortford contract and give them cp3 and wizard for walls contract
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#197 » by ThunderBolt » Sun Jun 21, 2020 1:36 am

Just some random attempted neutral thoughts about the trade. I think Paul is the best player in the deal but why would Denver go all in right now? It makes no sense. Murray didn’t take the jump I had hoped he would but Denver has plenty of time. Let suppose Denver was willing to do the trade. I would absolutely take Murray. I dont know that he turns in to an all star but he fits Shai’s time line. It’s worth a shot from okc’s perspective and I think Denver should hold off or look elsewhere.

For the record, the last time Cp3 made an all star game was four months ago. Four is also where cp3 ranks in usage in the okc roster. The idea that cp3 needs to have the ball in his hands to be effective and would take it away from Jokic is a fallacy. In fact his usage his lower than both Jokic and Murray. Swapping Murray for Cp3 would actually put the balk in Jokic’s hands more often which is what Denver fans seem to want. I understand why Denver fans wouldn’t want to do the trade but let’s make sure the reasons are accurate.
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#198 » by itzmrgigglez » Sun Jun 21, 2020 1:57 am

I don’t like this trade because I feel like Murray and SGA are at their best at point. They aren’t bad at SG and both shoot the the 3 decently but I would rather have shai at point and keep developing from there.

Murray is young but his contract just kills it for me. It would be worth a shot for us but it would eat up our cap space. Especially if we did the proposed trade of both Harris and Murray
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#199 » by thor19 » Sun Jun 21, 2020 2:21 am

ThunderBolt wrote:Just some random attempted neutral thoughts about the trade. I think Paul is the best player in the deal but why would Denver go all in right now? It makes no sense. Murray didn’t take the jump I had hoped he would but Denver has plenty of time. Let suppose Denver was willing to do the trade. I would absolutely take Murray. I dont know that he turns in to an all star but he fits Shai’s time line. It’s worth a shot from okc’s perspective and I think Denver should hold off or look elsewhere.

For the record, the last time Cp3 made an all star game was four months ago. Four is also where cp3 ranks in usage in the okc roster. The idea that cp3 needs to have the ball in his hands to be effective and would take it away from Jokic is a fallacy. In fact his usage his lower than both Jokic and Murray. Swapping Murray for Cp3 would actually put the balk in Jokic’s hands more often which is what Denver fans seem to want. I understand why Denver fans wouldn’t want to do the trade but let’s make sure the reasons are accurate.

You say my chicago trade is bad but denver will never make this trade unless they want to clean the house Murray contract is not the best one but is not cp3 contract also cp3 can be the best player this year but murray is only 23 years old and cp is 35 denver will never take cp3 and give us their second best player behind jokic, we can sell them cp3 next year if they dont get to the western confernce final, or the nba final, a team of cp3 , murray jokic, grant, porter jr is better that this year denver team, our best bet is to take harris , and barton or Plumlee with fillers, this way we can use harris we can use harris as six man or insurance if dennis is traded, barton can take the sf until bazley improved or we get someone better, and their contracts are smaller and more easy to move, I think the direction of the team will depend in gallinari, if we sign and traded him or he walk in free angency or if we sign him. For me that would be the first domino to fall
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Re: Trades, Transactions and Ideas Thread 

Post#200 » by bondom34 » Sun Jun 21, 2020 4:27 am

I think the issue with it is that Paul is the best player, and while I don't love it for Denver either, they're getting that while getting off some questionable money themselves. Reading the trade forum and the main argument seemed to be with people saying CP3 was washed, which he isn't. He was well better than either of Denver's guys. Does Denver want to win now or hope Murray is at a point where he's that good ever? Because if this year was an indicator it's very uncertain. Saying what I just posted there:

I think I like it a little better for OKC than Denver, only because it fits their direction better. But Paul is by far the best player, not washed, and would greatly improve Denver short term.

Basically does Denver want to be good now? Or try to be a little less good for longer? I understand both sides, OKC tried the latter way and ended up losing 3 MVPs. Also reading but generalizing posters like that while posting some rather unfair statements is a bit biased. To go one by one:

First, you want to trade a 23yo and a 26yo for a 35yo to help with OKC's timeline. Funny thing about that is Murray and Harris fit perfectly into DEN's timeline, why screw it up ?


Is Denver's timeline now or later? IDK, if its not while Jokic is an MVP candidate now, assuming he maintains this production forever isn't ideal. OKC lost a lot of seasons to injury and ended up with no titles due to this thinking.

Secondly, it was argued Paul is a MUCH better player, in his prime I'd have to agree with this. However, Paul has realistically 2-3 more good years, Murray probably has 7-12 and still hasn't reached his prime. And just checking his stats vs Pauls form last year, they're very comparable yet surely headed in different directions IMO. Harris has had two consecutive down years on offense but still is a defensive stalwart, check out 2019 PO series. He, at worst has 5-7 good defensive years and has an opportunity to rebound on the offensive end.


Paul is a much better player by pretty much any measure, prime or current. The timeline talk is dealt with above but after that this is words repeating the same point. Also Paul is still a well better defender than Murry.

Third, Paul is a great player with the ball in his hands, much better (at this point in his career) than Murray is. HOWEVER, in Denver, Jokic is the player who excels with the ball in HIS hands, so if the trade were to happen, which players skills do you diminish, Joker's or CP3's ??? Murray on the other hand is a much better fit next to Jokic as he doesn't need the ball in his hands to be effective, chemistry between Murray and Joker is blossoming, it would end quickly with CP3 replacing Murray.


Interesting because Paul has now played alongside Harden and currently plays alongside 2 other point guards...so I'm rather confused at the issue. OKC's offense is about 3 points per 100 better with Paul on court than Denver is with Jokic, and hes leading the league in single year ORAPM (oh and 5th in 5 year, both above Jokic). So if you'd want a player who's better and has fit with more ball dominant players in 2 stops, seems a good fit.

How about the money ?? Denver can't afford to add ONE player for two even if the amt's are comparable. Dividing CP3's salary into two more movable pieces is a stronger move for any small market team, how many #1's did HOU give up for you to TAKE Chris Pauls's salary ??...and then TheProfessor has the gall to say the Nuggets should be adding a #1...RIDICULOUS !!!!


Money is an issue. Don't use all caps. It's not really ridiculous for getting a better player though I lean toward it being better for OKC. Neither Murray or Harris are close to as good as Paul and I've been a fan of them. Also they're slated to make $47M next year. That's not good.

https://earlybirdrights.com/salary-cap/den/

Don't get me wrong, I have always been a fan of CP3 but the proposal of this trade is so lopsided IMO (when was the last time CP3 was All-NBA 5 seasons ago ?) I had to get an OKC different perspective. Only OKC fans and Texas Chuck, who I believe is a notorious Nuggets-detractor are the only ones who stood up for this trade on TnT, help me to take a 2nd look here Guys.


Well he only missed all NBA 2 seasons and was 3 ago in 2017 and might be all NBA this season, and the last time Murray and Harris were all NBA (or even all stars) was...?

So Denver is trading 2 OK players for one massively better one. I still like it better for OKC, but its interesting.
FoundANewSlant wrote:it's really fundamental defensive flaws exhibited here by Westbrook, PG, and Adams that put Melo into vulnerable positions here yet you can't recognize or explain it.

So Paul George is the reason Carmelo Anthony struggled on defense all these years...

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