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Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:25 pm
by Pillendreher
I like Billy Donovan now. He saved the Thunder from Sam Presti, at least in this regard.
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:26 pm
by jambalaya
Presumably not getting a long / lucrative extension offer last summer was likely considered an insult by Donovan and agent. Only getting a 2 yr offer (at unknown salary, likely a cut) now, even worse. Thunder public praise for Donovan did not match private words.
At same time, Donovan did look into 1-2 college jobs and never said he wanted to stay. Family input may have affected thinking.
Donovan is not guaranteed to get another NBA job right away, the following season or ever. On his terms or any terms. He might or might not. League probably transitioning to lower coaching salaries and maybe younger coaches.
Donovan and agent are likely pretty confident. Too confident? Will find out.
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:40 pm
by Old Man Game
spearsy23 wrote:Old Man Game wrote:Feel like Hammon needs a better situation than this. We'll be tanking. The last thing the first female coach needs is to walk into a situation where the losses pile up and have every mysoginist tool, already looking for an excuse to criticize her, get to point and laugh at her record.
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No team that thinks they're a head coach away from contention is going to hire the first woman in nba history. There's too much perceived risk.
Is Ollie still too disgraced? We know presti loves ties to the org.
Possibly. But she has her own interests to consider as well. I doubt she or any other female head coach wants to sign on to a deal where her win percentage is 20% or what have you. Luckily, there's quite a bit of space between contending and actively tanking so other opportunities may arise. Or shoot, who knows, maybe we deal Paul for something not terrible and our tank is more of a soft rebuild on the fly like Boston did, in which case she might be fine here.
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:42 pm
by Old Man Game
Pillendreher wrote:I like Billy Donovan now. He saved the Thunder from Sam Presti, at least in this regard.
Sam is such a little control freak, its going to be hard to find the right coach here. Another reason to suspect we may just promote and assistant if we're going for a hard landing on the tanking.
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:49 pm
by jambalaya
Many of the very top coaching candidates are probably not taking the job. They might interview and use it for leverage with someone else.
Presti's image with older established coaches has probably declined some. Not that many GMs are looked at very favorably by coaches and agents.
It is a significant factor in a quest for a title: will Presti hire someone with very top coaching talent and will a very top coaching talent take the job without more influence / power than they get with Presti. The best chance is probably a young guy who turns out better than good and actually uses success to push for more input. But that would take Bennett listening to them or someone else leading ownership.
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2020 6:04 pm
by ThunderBolt
I’ll admit that ideally I would like to fix every weakness with the thunder, from the front office down to the final rotation piece on the g league roster. The reality is that you can still be a contender with lots of flaws throughout an organization. Sam still does some things well.
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2020 6:05 pm
by ThunderBolt
getrichordie wrote:This is likely ownership/Presti wanting to remain flexible during rocky fiscal years for the foreseeable future, IMO.
It depends how much they offered him for those two years.
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2020 6:27 pm
by getrichordie
ThunderBolt wrote:getrichordie wrote:This is likely ownership/Presti wanting to remain flexible during rocky fiscal years for the foreseeable future, IMO.
It depends how much they offered him for those two years.
Probably offered him good money but that's why it was only 2 years and not longer. Billy likely wants a little more security...
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2020 1:15 am
by ThunderBolt
Sam’s press conference if anyone wants to watch. I hadn’t been able to find it until tonight.
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2020 8:47 am
by Pillendreher
ThunderBolt wrote:I’ll admit that ideally I would like to fix every weakness with the thunder, from the front office down to the final rotation piece on the g league roster. The reality is that you can still be a contender with lots of flaws throughout an organization. Sam still does some things well.
I think you need to take my course called "Why Sam Presti is horrible at his job - Soon to be a Lifetime movie".
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2020 11:42 am
by ThunderBolt
Pillendreher wrote:ThunderBolt wrote:I’ll admit that ideally I would like to fix every weakness with the thunder, from the front office down to the final rotation piece on the g league roster. The reality is that you can still be a contender with lots of flaws throughout an organization. Sam still does some things well.
I think you need to take my course called "Why Sam Presti is horrible at his job - Soon to be a Lifetime movie".
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2020 11:59 am
by slick_watts
i'd wager that our next HC is one of brian keefe, darko rajakovic, or rex kalamian. i wouldn't be too upset with any of them but i don't envision a big name coming here with what i view as the likely short / medium term competitiveness. perhaps a retread is possible in the vein of p.j. carlesimo circa 2007, but i hope they do not go that route.
i thought billy donovan did a good job. i'd be surprised if he isn't coaching in the nba next year, if that's what he wants. philly seems possible.
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2020 3:47 pm
by jambalaya
Is Presti better overall than most of his contemporaries? Yes. Is he a title winner? No. Is winning a title the goal? Yes. Measuring stick? Is for me. Is for him, I believe.
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2020 4:46 pm
by ThunderBolt
If someone says the Harden trade is the reason they want Sam gone, that's adequate grounds enough, I suppose. I don't think most of his mistakes are much different than a lot of other GM's that are/were considered elite. Morey, Myers, Riley have all had some pretty questionable decisions. The difference is even bad front offices can win in the right market. See the lakers. You have to go back to 1977 to find a small market that won a chamionship that wasn't SAS or Lebron in Cleveland.
I'm ok if Sam were to move on. If he leaves the question becomes how strongly do you trust ownership to get someone better and not get the next Ernie Grunfeld?
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2020 5:25 pm
by thor19
Some things about Presti, I think he want Donovan back because he never like when others people know what he is going to do, if we keep Donovan , others gm will think that he will keep Cp3 and run the team another year , he dont look desperate to trade CP3 and the team will not look like he is going to rebuild, but if he dont bring back Donovan everybody is thinking we are going tanking . Also with harden the problem was perkins , and not want to go small ball with ibaka at the 5, kd at the 4, sefolosha 3, harden and westbrook and reggie getting the six man . But he want to keep a traditional center in perkins and owners dont want to pay harden more.
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2020 6:45 pm
by Sea2003
Sam Presti is arguably the best GM in the league. Besides the harden trade, his resume is nearly spotless. Getting rid of Presti is the absolute worst thing this org can do.
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2020 6:59 pm
by mr570
There's no way we get rid of Presti with all of the draft capital he has at his fingertips. He struck gold in the lottery every time we were there and with this many chances again I don't see why that doesn't happen again.
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2020 7:08 pm
by ThunderBolt
The title of "Best GM" has always been pretty cyclical.
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Sat Sep 12, 2020 12:32 am
by getrichordie
mr570 wrote:There's no way we get rid of Presti with all of the draft capital he has at his fingertips. He struck gold in the lottery every time we were there and with this many chances again I don't see why that doesn't happen again.
Cam Payne and Cole Aldrich would like to have a word with you...
Re: Fall of 2020-21 OKC Thunder Offseason Thread- Rebuild or Maintain?
Posted: Sat Sep 12, 2020 8:34 am
by Pillendreher
mr570 wrote:There's no way we get rid of Presti with all of the draft capital he has at his fingertips. He struck gold in the lottery every time we were there and with this many chances again I don't see why that doesn't happen again.
He "struck gold" three times more than a decade ago and has not drafted anything of value since Steven Adams in 2013.
It truly is amazing how ancient successes tend to define a person's reputation when it comes to the Thunder, regardless of what has happened since then. It's the equivalent of going back to Billy Donovan being up 3-1 on the 73 wins Warriors four seasons ago.