Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt

Better athlete

Phelps
56
32%
Bolt
117
68%
 
Total votes: 173

Ball so hard
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,996
And1: 677
Joined: Jul 04, 2017
     

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#81 » by Ball so hard » Tue Jul 27, 2021 3:23 pm

shawngoat23 wrote:Usain Bolt, not even close

1. Sprinting is a more global endeavor, the crown jewel of the Olympic Games, and one that draws a larger competition pool. There is a reason the first thirteen Ancient Olympiads featured just sprinting, and never included swimming.

2. While swimming requires elite athleticism at such a level, sprinting is a better representation of one’s athletic ability. It’s no coincidence the rest of the English-speaking world refers to track and field as Athletics. If you had to traverse any distance by running or by swimming, you would naturally choose to run: it’s the most efficient method for humans.

3. Phelps has a much higher medal count, which is legendarily impressive within his discipline, but it is foolish to compare medal counts across different sports. Imagine swimming had only the freestyle and running had the current events labeled as a freestyle, plus for each distance, useless modifiers such as “running without swinging arms”, “running without a starting block”, and “running while showboating”. Bolt’s medal count would easily triple Phelps’s, while neither of their accomplishments would have increased or diminished in true magnitude.

4. Those who favor Phelps are probably either swimmers or American. Imagine Phelps were from a small island while Bolt were American. Or you don’t need to imagine; compare how celebrated Jesse Owens and Carl Lewis are in the United States compared to Mark Spitz, and the answer becomes abundantly obvious.


Excellent post!
Duke4life831
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 35,089
And1: 64,652
Joined: Jun 16, 2015
 

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#82 » by Duke4life831 » Tue Jul 27, 2021 3:25 pm

Anyone that says “it’s not close” probably doesn’t know what they’re talking about.

First I keep seeing people say swimming has so many events and that is shy Phelps won so much. If that is the case, why isn’t there any other swimmers in the top 10 most medals won? Why is it he has 23 golds and no one else has more than 9?

Also the swimming strokes are drastically different. A freestyle stroke is nothing like a backstroke. You have swimmers that focus heavily on just one stroke, there are specialists in swimming. So ya just because you’re good in a 400m freestyle, doesn’t mean you’re good at the 100m backstroke.

They’re both dominant and they’re both freaks. Two guys that dominated their sports unlike anyone else we’ve ever seen.
Wallace_Wallace
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,711
And1: 6,038
Joined: Jul 28, 2017
     

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#83 » by Wallace_Wallace » Tue Jul 27, 2021 4:41 pm

Running is such a natural task. To see a human running that fast and pounds his chest before the finish line is mind-blowing.
User avatar
UcanUwill
RealGM
Posts: 27,492
And1: 28,792
Joined: Aug 07, 2011
 

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#84 » by UcanUwill » Tue Jul 27, 2021 4:49 pm

Edrees wrote:Phelps. Half the human population can't even swim. it's an unreal talent to go that fast.


I am not sure about this argument. I mean I assume around 95% of people cant play tennis, does that make Tennis players more impressive?
SkyHookFTW
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,400
And1: 3,097
Joined: Jul 26, 2014
         

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#85 » by SkyHookFTW » Tue Jul 27, 2021 4:57 pm

This argument about the pool of competitors is a bit ridiculous.

Bolt's competition is not 90% of the human race. Bolt's competition is the pool of humans who train for his sport. It is the same for Phelps--his competition is the pool of humans who train for his sport. Bolt's pool is deeper for a few reasons, one of is that even among humans who have access to water (pool, lake, river, ocean), some can't swim or ever learn how. It's simply easier to run than swim.

It is the same for combat sports. The pool of challengers is not every human who can throw a punch--almost everyone can do that. But how many humans are willing to train their body to withstand the rigors of the ring? Very few.

Swimming or running...I always found it much easier to run than swim FWIW.
"It's scarier than Charles Barkley at an all you can eat buffet." --Shaq on Shark Week
"My secret to getting rebounds? It's called go get the damn ball." --Charles Barkley
CobraCommander
RealGM
Posts: 22,300
And1: 13,949
Joined: May 01, 2014
       

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#86 » by CobraCommander » Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:29 pm

Bolt..wait Phelps...wait it’s close. I can imagine Phelps records being broken but Bolt...we don’t even know his max because at his prime he was looking back at dudes because it was too easy-

This is like deciding which billionaires space ship is better....they GOT a SPACESHIP- so it’s a tie


Next on REALGM...Superman vs Goku vs one punch man vs hulk
TheNG
Rookie
Posts: 1,162
And1: 1,404
Joined: Feb 14, 2019

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#87 » by TheNG » Tue Jul 27, 2021 7:11 pm

TL;DR: Bolt > Phelps: Bolt is probably the winner of a competition between a few billion people, while Phelps is actually the winner of a competition between less than 100m people.

The main thing is, every little child in every corner of the world runs 50m or 100m in school or somewhere, and the really fast ones usually have someone seeing them, so if they're good enough, eventually they have good chances to compete at the Olympics.
In swimming, it's maybe 1/100 of the world population. i.e. Do you really know if all the African children are good at swimming?
So while I'm 99.9% that Bolt was the best short distance runner in the world (or let's say at least one of the top 3), and in no other social circumstances this would have changed, I can not say the same about Phelps. Moreover, I can even pretty much be sure at 99.9% that if all the children in the world would have access to swimming pools and swimming classes and social circumstances as Phelps had, he wouldn't have been the best swimmer in the world.
If you have more "Posts" than "And1", don't feel bad if I didn't reply to you - I just don't like to speak with people who argue a lot :beer:
User avatar
Drakeem
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,656
And1: 2,040
Joined: Oct 25, 2009
     

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#88 » by Drakeem » Tue Jul 27, 2021 7:30 pm

DCasey91 wrote:
dygaction wrote:
DCasey91 wrote:Lol once again there’s really only five people in the world that can hang with either Phelps/Bolt. That’s it that’s the list.

80%? yeah no.

Not a competition or talent it really is against a clock.... it’s time based in the end.


I mean the competition base. Swimming is like golf, >80% of the population never had a chance to try it before it is too late.


I’ll say it again for the last time. Both are racing against the clock. Only five males give or take can hang with either that’s as rare as you’re going to get that’s in the world world. 80%? No my man

Five of the highest world class tier give or take athletes that’s it that’s the list.

Swimming is not like golf that’s an absurd and downright disrespectful statement to make.

I’ll say it to everyone jump in the pool. See if it is like Golf then. Wake up at 5 a.m on Saturday and Sundays.

My female mate whose a state swimmer would slap you right in the face right there and then lol.
You're not getting the point. Yes, you're racing against time. However, if every single person in the world was trained to swim and had access to pools and instructors, we might have found another Phelps as the current talent pool for swimming isn't as big as running. We may have missed a generational talent somewhere. Does LeBron become LeBron not growing up in the US and being part of a system that allows people to progress in that particular sport? Is Phelps Phelps today if he grew up without a pool nearby? It's a valid point to an extent.

Where as running, while you still may have wasted talent that just never had the chance, much more of the population gets involved meaning that you'll have a higher likelihood of finding more high end talent. Just how averages and stats works.
balleramil wrote:My Summer by Jarrett Jack

The one thing you don't know about our team is...
At practice we play freeze tag
gorz
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,934
And1: 1,603
Joined: Apr 03, 2018

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#89 » by gorz » Tue Jul 27, 2021 7:32 pm

Both are impressive athletes but for me if I have to to make somewhat an analogy it's like comparing the world record holder in max squat vs world record holder in overhead press. Everyone in the world can run(that is not physically handicapped/compromised) its the most fundamental athletic movement; half or even less the population cant swim therefore the feat of being the best at a task that everybody can do is more impressive. Likewise everybody can perform a barbell squat but quite a few ppl cant perform a barbell overhead press and being the best at the squat is more impressive despite the ohp being a more technically difficult movement.
PistolPeteJR
RealGM
Posts: 10,499
And1: 9,316
Joined: Jun 14, 2017
 

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#90 » by PistolPeteJR » Tue Jul 27, 2021 7:45 pm

Man a lot of y'all really don't know a thing about sports and athletics, let alone basketball.

This is Phelps, with all due respect to Bolt.
JN61
RealGM
Posts: 11,426
And1: 9,021
Joined: Jan 07, 2018
 

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#91 » by JN61 » Tue Jul 27, 2021 7:47 pm

Phelps in terms of success and Bolt in terms of physical dominance.
Pennebaker wrote:And Bird did it while being a defensive liability. But he also made All-Defensive teams, which was another controversial issue regarding Bird and votes.
Quattro
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,102
And1: 7,811
Joined: Jan 29, 2016
     

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#92 » by Quattro » Tue Jul 27, 2021 7:49 pm

PistolPeteJR wrote:Man a lot of y'all really don't know a thing about sports and athletics, let alone basketball.

This is Phelps, with all due respect to Bolt.


Always a strong argument to lead with “if your opinion differs from mine, you don’t know damned thing about X topic”.
PistolPeteJR
RealGM
Posts: 10,499
And1: 9,316
Joined: Jun 14, 2017
 

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#93 » by PistolPeteJR » Tue Jul 27, 2021 8:20 pm

Quattro wrote:
PistolPeteJR wrote:Man a lot of y'all really don't know a thing about sports and athletics, let alone basketball.

This is Phelps, with all due respect to Bolt.


Always a strong argument to lead with “if your opinion differs from mine, you don’t know damned thing about X topic”.


Except this is page 5, and there's been plenty of strong and logical argumentation for what I'm saying. Feel free to scroll through and read.
User avatar
The Laker Kid
General Manager
Posts: 9,157
And1: 6,505
Joined: Dec 16, 2006
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#94 » by The Laker Kid » Tue Jul 27, 2021 8:27 pm

Bolt for me. Imagine running that fast without getting your feet tangled and smashing your face on the ground?? Phelps has the water to catch him if he tangles his arms/feet, he can safely float away. Bolt has no such safety net. But Lebron beats both though.
MaxwellSmart wrote:I hate to say this, but Go Lakers....
User avatar
TheSuzerain
RealGM
Posts: 16,726
And1: 10,862
Joined: Mar 29, 2012

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#95 » by TheSuzerain » Tue Jul 27, 2021 8:48 pm

I think it's Bolt as I expect his records to last much longer than Phelps.
Quattro
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,102
And1: 7,811
Joined: Jan 29, 2016
     

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#96 » by Quattro » Tue Jul 27, 2021 8:51 pm

PistolPeteJR wrote:
Quattro wrote:
PistolPeteJR wrote:Man a lot of y'all really don't know a thing about sports and athletics, let alone basketball.

This is Phelps, with all due respect to Bolt.


Always a strong argument to lead with “if your opinion differs from mine, you don’t know damned thing about X topic”.


Except this is page 5, and there's been plenty of strong and logical argumentation for what I'm saying. Feel free to scroll through and read.


I have read. And there’s plenty of argument the other way too. The numbers do not lie. The level of dominance Bolt achieved in sprinting is completely unprecedented. It’s been over a decade and nobody has come even close to his time.
Quattro
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,102
And1: 7,811
Joined: Jan 29, 2016
     

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#97 » by Quattro » Tue Jul 27, 2021 8:55 pm

TheSuzerain wrote:I think it's Bolt as I expect his records to last much longer than Phelps.


I looked it up and Phelps still holds 4 world records, 3 of them are relay times. So he still owns one individual swimming record 4 years after retirement.
User avatar
TheSuzerain
RealGM
Posts: 16,726
And1: 10,862
Joined: Mar 29, 2012

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#98 » by TheSuzerain » Tue Jul 27, 2021 8:58 pm

Quattro wrote:
TheSuzerain wrote:I think it's Bolt as I expect his records to last much longer than Phelps.


I looked it up and Phelps still holds 4 world records, 3 of them are relay times. So he still owns one individual swimming record 4 years after retirement.

Right. Phelps has already lost a few.

Meanwhile Bolt's 100m completely broke the linear progression of that record. I'd expect it will be a long while until someone is flirting with 9.5.
Quattro
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,102
And1: 7,811
Joined: Jan 29, 2016
     

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#99 » by Quattro » Tue Jul 27, 2021 9:02 pm

TheSuzerain wrote:
Quattro wrote:
TheSuzerain wrote:I think it's Bolt as I expect his records to last much longer than Phelps.


I looked it up and Phelps still holds 4 world records, 3 of them are relay times. So he still owns one individual swimming record 4 years after retirement.

Right. Phelps has already lost a few.

Meanwhile Bolt's 100m completely broke the linear progression of that record. I'd expect it will be a long while until someone is flirting with 9.5.


Absolutely. I posted earlier that it’s been a decade and barely anyone has cracked 9.7 let alone 9.6. It’s going to be a long long time before that record falls.
Jabroni Lames
Analyst
Posts: 3,289
And1: 3,902
Joined: Apr 08, 2018

Re: Greather Athlete: Phelps or Bolt 

Post#100 » by Jabroni Lames » Tue Jul 27, 2021 9:03 pm

SkyHookFTW wrote:This argument about the pool of competitors is a bit ridiculous.

Bolt's competition is not 90% of the human race. Bolt's competition is the pool of humans who train for his sport. It is the same for Phelps--his competition is the pool of humans who train for his sport. Bolt's pool is deeper for a few reasons, one of is that even among humans who have access to water (pool, lake, river, ocean), some can't swim or ever learn how. It's simply easier to run than swim.

It is the same for combat sports. The pool of challengers is not every human who can throw a punch--almost everyone can do that. But how many humans are willing to train their body to withstand the rigors of the ring? Very few.

Swimming or running...I always found it much easier to run than swim FWIW.


I started my competitive track "career" in Grade 4 and never really "trained" until high school. Point being, you get selected for a track at a early age.... because why? Everybody runs. It's natural selection. Some would call that "streaming" and it happens before you start formally training for any sport. That is indeed 90% of the population, because everybody in gym class is made to run. Everybody. The teachers and coaches know who are the fastest guys/girls are because everybody is tested. Running is such a ubiquitous and widely participated sport, that you don't even realize you're in the pool of competition, because you already are. With running, you can "train" every single day, by simply running around the block.

Compare that to the fact that I only had the chance to regularly swim at a later age and even then it was only like once or twice a month. It was a privilege, which unfortunately I never had access to. To this day, I have literally no idea who can or can't swim out of my classmates (other than best friends) from grade school, high school or university... let alone who is the fastest.

Return to Olympics